Thread 127591322

The young Bach edition
https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=kDY_4n9PHLQ

Discuss classical music in the Western (European) tradition and instrument-playing.

>How do I get into classical?
By listening to classical music; stop being neurotic.

Previous: >>127556229

let's get Transcendental
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FkhdHWEYpU&list=OLAK5uy_kYNO6CrnUH_DApPnczkgMZwIayILtzydQ&index=8

I heard that Bach did not compose for piano even though it was available in his day. Does anyone know why?

>>127591322 (OP)
>How do I get into classical?
This link has resources including audio courses, textbooks and selections of recordings to help you start to understand and appreciate classical music:
https://rentry.org/classicalgen

>>127591378
If you need to read a book to appreciate classical you shouldn’t be listening to it in the first place. You were filtered but you are in denial.

Reminder Bach and after, before and not including Ives.

>>127591397
Yes, we remember that you are a pedophile

Young Bach
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MskEY3GQHI0

Lisiecki!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5VL9w8CnuJA&list=OLAK5uy_mAG9JpOt49H-OXVqyfpYWM67cu7xV5X9c&index=15

>>127591525
speaking of Lisiecki, I went looking for his recording of Chopin's Preludes, and my god, the blurb is so eyerollingly pretentious,
>Canadian star pianist Jan Lisiecki showcases the kaleidoscopic world of the prelude. Taking the notion of the prelude as meaning something "that comes before," Lisiecki asks: "Can a recording project be composed entirely of such introductions, then, one leading directly into the next, and still be profound?"

ughhh

But he still might be my favorite modern 'slow Chopin' performer, so I look past it
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDfoFisLsLc&list=OLAK5uy_lkwuxBxTGOFVHjpr4RM1THL26HIuR8s3g&index=29

>>127591525
Chopin*

>>127591377
Because Bach didn't care for the piano

>>127591663
Goes without saying

>>127591377
Because Bach was experimenting with counterpoint, the Harpsichord allows you to hear the individual voices of a fugue; the piano (especially today) is an atrocious instrument for contrapuntal works.

>>127591782
I’ve never heard of this Lisiecki. I think you are so accustomed to talking to yourself all day that you forget that people have distinct interests.

>>127591833
KOEK. I bet that anon is the same karen crying about the lack of talkboomer link
127591378
He be grooming n shot

>>127591833
>I’ve never heard of this Lisiecki. I think you are so accustomed to talking to yourself all day that you forget that people have distinct interests.
Which is exactly why I point out the performer name instead of the composer, because the composer needs no advertisement.

>>127591882
Performer of whom?
Most people are not interested in the performer in their own right.

>>127592067
The picture and link have the composer and piece name.

Been a bit since I listened to anything choral. Let's finally listen to this recording of Berlioz's Requiem I've had my eye on for a while.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kV1h7FKsKJw&list=OLAK5uy_mPHO27_a4H_9iLbXGyVNtAxPhVXy0pF5o&index=1

>Berlioz’s (sic) conceived his Requiem for extraordinarily large forces: the score asks for over 100 stringed instruments, 20 woodwinds, a percussion section with 16 timpani and 4 tam-tams, 20 brass players within the orchestra and an additional 38 brass to form 4 brass choirs placed at the four corners of the stage. The minimum number for the choir is 200-some singers, though Berlioz asks that if space permits it, the number of singers be doubled or tripled. The work’s first performance in December 1837 involved over 400 people and this new recording involves 400 musicians.

>>127592090
Why would I click on your links about some guy that I have never heard of?
Maddeningly presumptuous of you.

>>127592146
In truth, it's because there's already another poster who just pairs the name of the composer with the link, and I didn't want it to look like I was copying their post, so I opted to go for the performer name instead. Plus it's more fun for me. Happy?

>>127592172
That makes even less sense…

>>127592198
But it does! Anon, if you're not gonna take this discussion seriously...

Bach
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-NkoOclYkJQ

Why do Asians love Chopin so much?

Is being a choirmaster a different skillset than a regular conductor? Can you be good at conducting a choir but poor at conducting an orchestra, and vice versa?

>>127592243
Asians love the overt show of emotion, which is why they also love Rachmaninoff.

>>127592249
Yes. Hurwitz has a good video on this, actually.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_Ai_I4CAZM
The major exception to the rule that most people bring up is Herbert Kegel, who was both a supreme choirmaster and a orchestral conductor.

>>127592264
Neat, thanks.

>>127592259
Why though? Asians aren’t stereotypically very emotional. It’s like Chopin helps them experience emotion.

now playing

start of Schubert: String Quintet in C Major, Op. 163, D. 956
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ubh8nG1khQ0&list=OLAK5uy_n4DO9dIU6dt_6dIydMUVd9NO1fYomQMeg&index=2

start of Schubert: String Quartet No. 15 in G Major, Op. Posth. 161, D. 887
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WP27VKTPdUg&list=OLAK5uy_n4DO9dIU6dt_6dIydMUVd9NO1fYomQMeg&index=6

start of Schubert: String Quartet No. 14 in D Minor, D. 810 "Death and the Maiden"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YBRtuesyog&list=OLAK5uy_n4DO9dIU6dt_6dIydMUVd9NO1fYomQMeg&index=10

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_n4DO9dIU6dt_6dIydMUVd9NO1fYomQMeg

>>127592281
It's difficult to articulate but,
>It’s like Chopin helps them experience emotion.
is close enough. Art allows them to sublimate their emotions.

>>127592290
>ugh we have to go WHERE for our album cover?
>and with our instruments too? fuck

>>127592264
>Yes. Hurwitz
stopped reading there

>>127592305
i heard they were all mauled by bears minutes after taking the pic.

>>127592281
Deep down, I think, Asians may be more sentimental than Europeans. Still, it’s not culturally acceptable for them to show it. Perhaps because overtly romantic behavior in the aggregate has severe negative consequences for a civilization. Confucianism may have been an emergent phenomenon that developed to check this impulse. Chopin’s music may cause the emotion to ‘bubble out’, overcoming their socialization.

>>127591377
Both answers you got are trolling.
The only thing Bach's piano had in common with today's piano is the sound producing technique. It didn't sound anything like the modern piano. And Bach DID compose for the piano, he just never specified he was composing it. The only thing he didn't compose for it was the Goldberg Variations (which is for harpsichord specifically). Well-Tempered Clavier is composed for any keyboard instrument, including the piano. All his clavier works are composed for a keyboard instrument, meaning piano, clavichord, harpsichord, or organ. Had Bach known how the piano would evolve, he would specify that all (or most of) his keyboard works are to be played on it.

>>127592243
>>127592259
>>127592281
>>127592298
>>127592436
A study found positive correlation (.34) between preference for sad/minor key music and fluid intelligence and openenness personality trait:
https://psycnet.apa.org/record/2016-29171-002
Since East Asians have highest average IQ, it's not surprising that they overwhelmingly prefer Chopin.

>>127592469
Bach was, first and foremost, an organist, and his job was instructing future organists for the church.
Most of Bach’s non-organ keyboard works served a pedagogical function of instructing organists; Bach wrote such pieces in a way that mimicked the technical requirements of the organ but could be played on available instruments like the clavichord.

>>127592281
that's not even true, you have a ridiculous idea of asian people, Asians often appear emotionless due to their rigid facial structure and lack of facial muscles, which prevents them from displaying emotions like we do, however, they do experience a range of emotions that are evident in their mating rituals and, in some cases, care for their offspring. During mating season, male asians engage in competitive behaviors, such as combat and elaborate courtship displays, to attract females, showcasing their emotional investment in reproduction. They communicate through body language and pheromones, indicating strong emotional responses to potential mates. some asian species will incubate their eggs by coiling around them and using muscle contractions to regulate temperature, demonstrating a protective instinct and emotional attachment to their young. Thus, despite their seemingly emotionless exterior, Asians possess a complex emotional landscape that influences their reproductive behaviors and interactions with their offspring.

>>127592469
What are the BWV numbers of Bach’s piano sonatas/concertos?

>>127592436
>>127592281
Asians are repressed and projecting faggots of which Mishima is a notable example.

>>127592469

Counterfactual. Bach may as easily have forbidden the piano (like his modern acolytes) because it is an atrocious instrument for contrapunctal performance, owing to the blurring of voices (which is absent in the organ

>With the piano:
>The tone and timbre of notes can be quite “wide” and encompassing, and bleed into others with ease, especially at certain dynamic levels and especially when playing in the same range; even sans pedal. Also, no matter how well you play and how you try to keep the voices at the same volume, unless you’re a machine you won’t be able to perfectly do it - you simply can’t cause all ten fingers to play at exactly the same level of force at all times - there’s always subtle variations in what the fingers are doing. And so, there’s always a risk that some notes in a voice may be a bit ever-so-slightly quieter and ever-so-slightly lost in the shuffle of the other voices.

https://forum.pianoworld.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/3428145/why-bach-preferred-harpsichord-over-puano.html

>>127592626
*contrapuntal

>>127592556
The same number as "keyboard concertos".
>>127592626
>because it is an atrocious instrument for contrapunctal performance, owing to the blurring of voices (which is absent in the organ
That is factually incorrect. Piano is the best instrument for polyphonic music, especually imitative forms like a fugue. Piano allows the player to empahsize any voice, or none at all. Harpsichord does not allow it, clavichord is much weaker at it. I don't need to read your pasta to hear the difference, I play some Bach myself.

>>127592664
>polyphonic
That is mor3 general than counterpoint and hence fugues. Anyway, what you have described is homophony rather than polyphony.
>empahsize any voice, or none at all
Then, by definition, it’s not counterpoint. In order for a composition to display counterpoint, the voices must be independent. If one voice dominates, the other is dependent, and you don’t have any counterpoint.
You have effectively conceded the argument. The piano is a terrible instrument. After all, it spoils counterpoint as it is impossible to play without emphasizing a particular voice.

>>127592808
>That is mor3 general than counterpoint and hence fugues.
No. I mentioned, "especially imitative forms like a fugue." so any confusion should've been gone.
>Anyway, what you have described is homophony rather than polyphony.
Thank you musically illiterate sister.
>Then, by definition, it’s not counterpoint.
You have never read definition of counterpoint from any literary source, ever.
>In order for a composition to display counterpoint, the voices must be independent.
Voice independence exists in basic chorales and harmonies.
>If one voice dominates, the other is dependent, and you don’t have any counterpoint.
Speaking of musical illiteracy.
There is no such rule in strict counterpoint, which says that voices are not allowed to be louder or softer. You are misinterpreting the rule that says all voices must have equal value, meaning they must all be *melodically* flawless, strictly abiding to rules of voice leading.
Source: any counterpoint pedagogue, starting from Fux.
>You have effectively conceded the argument.
Much appreciated musically illiterate sister.

>>127592910
may I join this discussion?

Why are there almost no recordings that play Clavier Ubung II and III properly? Clavier Ubung I (6 partitas) is often performed properly, though in the wrong order for no apparent reason, Clavier Ubung IV (Goldberg Variations) Is performed properly as well, as is Clavier Ubung V (Art Of Fugue). But then II (Italian Concerto and French Overture) is never performed as one piece, usually either the Italian Concerto or the French Overture get played seperately, played in the wrong order or get their momentum broken up by an unrelated piece like the Chromatic Fantasia and Fugue (Like in Walcha's case) and III I rarely see proper full recordings of and are often instead just huddled around in collections of Bach's organ music instead

>>127592910
You don’t seem to grasp what counterpoint is. Counterpoint requires voices that are harmonically dependent, but rhythmically independent. Admittedly, I was somewhat confused myself when I said that the voices must be independent.
When you are emphasizing one voice, then the counterpoint is spoiled because the voices are no longer harmonically dependent.

>>127593024
>Counterpoint requires voices that are harmonically dependent

no it doesn't. I'm with the sister poster on this one.

>>127593024
>When you are emphasizing one voice, then the counterpoint is spoiled because the voices are no longer harmonically dependent.
LOL. You just made that up, because you're illiterate. You don't understand what harmonically interdependent means. It has nothing to do with dynamic shaping.

>>127593062
Dynamic shaping influences harmony significantly.

>>127593101
please leave. you are clearly retarded.

>>127593101
Performance has no effect on the score.

Why do people criticise Szell for conducting like Toscanini when they like Toscanini?

>>127593154
Because if 1 guy does something, nobody is ever allowed to do anything like that guy

>>127593115
>>127593106
>>127593062
The point is that on the piano, you necessarily end up emphasizing one voice; even if it isn’t your intention. The piano is accordingly a mediocre instrument for the performance of JS Bach’s contrapuntal works.

>>127593206
>, you necessarily end up emphasizing one voice; even if it isn’t your intention
False. Good pianists have great control of each voice without muddying up the sound. Nothing happens unintentionally in Richter's WTC, which is the best WTC recording out there.

>>127593216
>Great pianists can overcome the constraints of their instrument

>>127593249
It isn't a constraint at all, the opposite. It allows pianist to be vastly more expressive.
And you've been shifting goalposts.

>>127593301
False.

>>127593016
But they aren't one piece.

>>127593414
>nuh uh
I accept your concession. Piano reigns as the supreme king of contrapuntal writing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QC5vptDt_Lc

If emphasizing the voices can do nothing to spoil the counterpoint, emphasizing them voice can’t enhance counterpoint either. Why then is the piano necessary for Bach’s contrapuntal works?

>>127593499
*emphasizing the voices

>>127593491
>emphasizing the voice can’t enhance it either.
It can. Soprano is naturally the most prominent, ear-grabing register, so empahsizing subjects in contrapuntal pieces that are played in bass or inner voices are often desired if not necessary to give more expressiveness, depth and logical sense to the piece. Piano is the most expressive acoustic keyboard instrument, and almost always preferable to harpsichord, unless the appeal for you is harpsichord's timbre more than the composition itself.

>>127593512
The piano is too expressive. That was the point made way back here
>>127592626

>>127593526
Romantic composers taught us the importance of expressiveness. There's no point in stripping away expressiveness from a piece of music unless you're actually too retarded to appreciate it. Your point made about counterpoint there was refuted.

Brahms

https://youtu.be/qVJrTCp_EuI

Why are string quintets with contrabasses so rare? Seems kind of the obvious fifth instrument rather than just adding another cello. Even sextets dont have them, why?

>>127593894
Selling out to Brahms now, I'm disappointed in you maho.

>>127593918
But I've posted his music before D:

I dislike Brahms as a person, but I like plenty of his pieces. I wouldn't name him among my favorite composers overall, but his fourth symphony is of my favorite works.

Is there a reason why I naturally drift towards writing baroque and classical era music without actually listening a lot of baroque, simply because I like to put more 8-16 notes on my MIDI piano roll and do random weird gymnastics with my MIDI notes over just doing simpler 4 notes melodies like modern music?

>>127593902
Too heavy for a chamber ensambles. It can muddy up harmony and overwhelm other instruments.
>>127593949
>I dislike Brahms as a person
Why?

now playing

start of Mozart: Piano Concerto No. 22 in E-Flat Major, K. 482
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FuU3YSrVUmg&list=OLAK5uy_k_QDTFwL0YZQUcH9S5xirr1c_hC4SZc_o&index=2

start of Mozart: Piano Concerto No. 25 in C Major, K. 503
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfHWKjbsOjk&list=OLAK5uy_k_QDTFwL0YZQUcH9S5xirr1c_hC4SZc_o&index=4

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_k_QDTFwL0YZQUcH9S5xirr1c_hC4SZc_o

>>127594126
>Why?
nta but he was pretty rude and self-absorbed to people and also kind of pathetic and impotent in his personal life.

>>127594140
You mentioned you didn't care for Mozart's concertos, how about this movement from C minor concerto:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBOPqh5Z534
It's hard to not love this one

>>127594162
He was sceptical, cynical and based as fuck, I don't know what you mean.

>>127594172
Thanks for sharing. While it's undoubtedly good, I think there's just an unbridgeable distance of pathos for me when it comes to classical era music, something inherent in the aesthetic and ornamentation. Even for the Mozart I do like, it's there, like with the string quartets/quintets and symphonies and other assorted concertos. The piano and violin sonatas are probably the closest I come to genuine enjoyment and resonance with Mozart.

I still try every now and then, seeing if things change. Thanks for trying.

>>127594178
>ITT: Composers that remind you of yourself
>For me it's Brahms – intelligent, nihilistic and with a wicked sense of humor.

>>127594237
It's the same for me, with exception of some of Mozart's piano concertos, symphonies, quintets, sonatas, fantasias and other works, mostly because they have infectious melodies. But classical era is generally too primitive and uplifting for me, it lacks grand climaxes, dissonances or intricate orchestration/piano techniques I'm looking for.
I find that movement especially heart gripping, the piano and orchestra have great dialogue, and piano melodies are magical.
>>127594275
lol.
But nah, it's Chopin.

>>127594275
for me it's Hauer.

>depressed, schizophrenic, frail, anti-social and will probably die alone.

What is Bach's best composition???

>>127594338
>I find that movement especially heart gripping, the piano and orchestra have great dialogue, and piano melodies are magical.
It was good enough for me to finish listening to it, which is saying something because normally with the concertos I can't even get through a movement these days without changing to something else, even though on a surface and logical level I recognize the quality in what I'm listening to.

>But classical era is generally too primitive and uplifting for me, it lacks grand climaxes, dissonances or intricate orchestration/piano techniques I'm looking for.
For sure. Hell, I honestly enjoy Beethoven's early piano concertos more than I enjoy Mozart's late ones, and I know that's generally considered blasphemy.

>>127594338
>But nah, it's Chopin.
Chopin wasn't nihilistic and didn't have a sense of humour.

Besides CPE Bach, what are some other composers that are extremely important to the tradition yet underappreciated by people in the modern day?

I don't know why I find it so strange, because they're obviously very different works, but I find it odd no one, aside from Nikolayeva, whom it was written for, who has recorded Shostakovich's 24 Preludes and Fugues has also recorded Bach's Well-Tempered Clavier. You would think there's a natural symmetry and connection there.

Anyway, came across this new (came out three months ago) recording of Shostakovich's Op. 87 that's really good, so, y'know, give it a try if interested,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DF_xsNFctJc&list=OLAK5uy_m_4n-q8buY0UqpUfNZE6QCIKjtAMMN4wY&index=40

It's truly the ultimate nighttime listening.

>>127594441
Logier.

>>127594407
>It was good enough for me to finish listening to it
Glad to hear. I have a strict self-etiquette myself and I never switch to something else until at least a movement is finished. You'll never know what the composer intended to convey until you finish it, IMO.
>>127594397
Passacaglia and Fugue in C minor

now playing, more David Fray

start of Schubert: 6 Moments musicaux, Op. 94, D. 780
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3yC8T0SBOys&list=OLAK5uy_k9seJxGdPXWx4G3dU1Vfj6uPv6sxVIAcU&index=2

Schubert: Allegretto for Piano in C Minor, D. 915
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zIgYHE0E4AY&list=OLAK5uy_k9seJxGdPXWx4G3dU1Vfj6uPv6sxVIAcU&index=8

start of Schubert: 4 Impromptus, Op. 90, D. 899
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58FyUEuKXLs&list=OLAK5uy_k9seJxGdPXWx4G3dU1Vfj6uPv6sxVIAcU&index=8

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_k9seJxGdPXWx4G3dU1Vfj6uPv6sxVIAcU

>David Fray has declared his particular affinity with Austro- German music, and after two CDs featuring Bach and a DVD of Bach concertos he now programs Schubert. His approach to the music is typically questioning and illuminating. "At the piano," he told the French magazine Pianiste, "I try to make music like a conductor, not just as a pianist. I approach the score as if it is a reduction of a symphonic work. The piano constitutes a way of getting nearer the heart of the music."

>"The interpretation is always generous, enthusiastic and rich in contrasts. The fast movements appeal with their healthy energy, exuberant humour in their finales and lyricism throughout. No moments of tension stiffen the pianist's phrases and he gives free rein to the sound," -- Le Monde de la musique

He also has some Bach recordings I wanna check out -- I already praised his Goldberg Variations here before, and then there's a recording with the second and sixth keyboard partitas, plus a recording of some of the violin sonatas performed with one of my favorite contemporary violinists Renaud Capuçon.

Also added a Chopin recording which has some assorted pieces on it, like a few Mazurkas, Nocturnes, Impromptus, etc. All of this is to say, all of it is worth checking out. I only wish he had more releases! He's still young. Also, random, just found out he's married to the conductor Riccardo Muti's daughter, huh.

>>127594481
>Glad to hear. I have a strict self-etiquette myself and I never switch to something else until at least a movement is finished. You'll never know what the composer intended to convey until you finish it, IMO.
I used to do that, and same with books where I'd try and finish it if I got somewhat deep into them, but with some combination of no longer wanting to spend time on things I don't enjoy + giving in to and indulging my attention span issues, I no longer do it. I figure once I've decided I'm not gonna finish listening to the entire piece anyway, then what's the difference, why complete the movement when I can come back to it later at another time, on another day, with perhaps another recording, and fully complete and properly enjoy it then.

>>127594397
the Cello Suites. honorable mention to the Mass in B minor and the Goldberg Variations

>>127594526
>giving in to and indulging my attention span issues
That has to do with your dopamine levels. I'm trying to overcome my scrolling addiction too to focus on better things. But it's interesting that you love Mahler and Bruckner so much, but still struggle with attention. Lol.

>>127594397
Chaconne

>>127594573
lol when the art is good enough, it overcomes!

But also, lately I've begun to suspect it's not entirely attention span, and perhaps that feeling I get of a pressurized hole in my brain, telling me to change to something else, is only part attention span, and is equal parts "this isn't doing it for us, change to something else."

> I'm trying to overcome my scrolling addiction too to focus on better things.
Yeah I'm debating ditching the smartphone entirely when at home, and deleting all TV shows from my computer. Too much time wasted on those, and like you said, it has a detrimental effect on attention span. Ideally, when at home by myself, I'd only be reading (mostly books but quality articles online are worthwhile too), writing, or listening to music, maaaaybe watching a serious, quality film. That'll jumpstart the process to healing the brain. Alas...

comfy album cover
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnT4fyZH6O8&list=OLAK5uy_neyDCP9jHpdju-PWDiqkdH6Ch4gfHZJhQ&index=2

>Hey a cantata by CPE Bach, let's hear i-

https://youtu.be/JIL6jMhleK8?list=RDJIL6jMhleK8

Why the fuck is this allowed? There aren't any other recordings I can find, I hate HIPsters so fucking much

>>127594734
I think it sounds nice. What's the problem

>>127591378
>muh emotions
holy pretentious
notice how he doesn't mention emotions even once:
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/x7Bnyi65m8E
a good song only needs to be a few minutes long to make millions of dollars

>>127594784
It sounds like a unmusical jumble of noise, like all HIPster garbage does. Just a bunch of gimmicks thrown together which make the music sound like fucking shit.

>>127594646
>>127594573
Plus, full disclosure, one of my biggest issues when listening to classical music is this: I love looking up and reading about other recordings and pieces and composers and performers while listening to music, and oftentimes, like on a daily basis, I'll come across something tantalizing enough to make me wanna switch and listen to that instead, and even if I resist at that moment, the thought begins to fester, to where I begin looking at how much time is left on the piece I'm currently listening to, and depending on how much there's left and how much I'm enjoying it, I might give in and switch. Fortunately I love Mahler and Bruckner enough to where I'm good listening to their entire piece without needing to switch, but yeah, no one else is immune. It's a real problem.

Almost makes me wish I had a record player so the physical act of selecting a recording, taking it out, setting it on the turntable, and dropping the needle to play is enough of an investment to deter me from making the switch so easily.

I'm ready to commit and declare this is the best Beethoven piano sonatas cycle of the 21st century. Do yourself a favor and check it out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYT5W9ieXns&list=OLAK5uy_l0G4ysfxJaw5g1r-J3khIyjGjikSN1VTM&index=49

>>127592469
>>127592543
so you know all these details about bach's life but what did he say specifically about his emotional intent or is it just wankers making up their own interpretations long after he died?

>>127594819
but muh emotional journey

>>127594646
>for us
It's over. Back to psychiatric hospital. LOL
>Too much time wasted on those, and like you said
Yup. I quit shows and anime as well as video games. It's really only for instant gratification, and has no everlasting rewarding effect like classical music and literature does.
>>127594837
That's relatable. Sometimes I get the urge to listen to something else, but that usually happens with Schoenberg.
>Almost makes me wish I had a record player
Same. Almost like we're enabled to be lazy attention deficit monkeys by everything and everyone around us, huh.

music sounds nice or it sounds like shit, the emotions can be whatever, of course you can communicate a general vibe and transition between different vibes but it's not like a literal story with depth to it purely in musical context without visual/lyrical cues

ngl I love Mozart's 24th as much as 23rd, it's gotta be S tier, favorite recordings?

>>127595048
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dR05ek-6Gus&list=OLAK5uy_meDuTrbJ0-XZ6DmcCYra-Rd4S7BTT9Iy8&index=1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJhoYDlOi84&list=OLAK5uy_k0cW0CpvKzM79yOO8F03SmxuXsB3ZB-7Y&index=1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tAFc03iUMcw&list=OLAK5uy_mfXhNfkySN3QhFGPB1s2HF9kouBs_k1Os&index=4

One of these ought to do the trick

>>127595048
This Serkin/Abbado 23+24 pairing is dope
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEhGIsuWgs8&list=OLAK5uy_mqaFAQ2jMnxpfNCRp9EXeBE1Q43AWBVPc&index=4

>>127595072
>>127595083
I've listened to all of these lol, except Kissin. I guess I'll revisit Uchida's. Apparently I know enough recordings already. But thanks.

>>127595048
>>127595115
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pONdi7lvVJY&list=OLAK5uy_lico75uGg0t5HCMZykjKWXgI7uXuqeGIg&index=1

real big sound shit

>>127595048
Do people not usually consider the 24th concerto to be one of his best works? It and the 20th have always been my favorites. Mozart's minor key pieces are a treat

https://youtu.be/wrA810VCJ54?list=OLAK5uy_kLikg-Vuw5oj7iFRM5Zrhvegh70NSewdU

>>127595138
>big sound
it's been artificially processed like any pop recording
>The other great thing we did at Decca, when you were getting the sound right, was to monitor at very low volume levels (it was called 'listening at granny's level' because I think as you get older – and I’m getting there myself! – everything always sounds far too loud), because if you turn the volume down the speaker is not working at its maximum efficiency – but if it still sounds presentable, if you're still getting an impact from the musicians, and you've still got acoustic around the sound, then it will sound good when it's tuned up loud. Everything sounds good when it’s turned up loud because your ears are saturated, the room is saturated, but you can't really judge - so if you turn the volume way, way down, and if it still sounds convincing, then you've hit the nail on the head. The other thing is to go out of the room, maybe take a walk around the block, and let your ears completely reset. That's a very good maxim.

>>127595138
Okay something neu
>>127595159
My list is here: >>127587674
And of course I love both.

>>127595190
i meant the large orchestra and that signature full-bodied, aggressive, booming Solti sound

>>127594441
Haydn.

feel like listening to a new recording of Bach's French Suites today. Anyone know of any recordings with a slow and/or romantic interpretation? Kinda like Maria Tipo's or Koroliov's sets of the Six Partitas
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOrZNPOz9iU&list=OLAK5uy_kgIDgCo9-Y3Ge_qzbkY8rpRQ42556UyYU&index=30

>Today I will remind them

BAB
A
B

>DAILY REMINDER
>DAILY REMINDER

IAA
A
A

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KyWOIKCtjiw&list=RDKyWOIKCtjiw&start_radio=1 [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLugJIWdpCM&list=RDtLugJIWdpCM&start_radio=1 [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-utT-BD0obk&list=RD-utT-BD0obk&start_radio=1 [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxx7Stpx7bU&list=RDcxx7Stpx7bU&start_radio=1 [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kCoOqsxLxSo&list=RDkCoOqsxLxSo&start_radio=1 [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sgjwiadze1w&list=RDSgjwiadze1w&start_radio=1 [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQ44z_ZqzXk&list=RDOQ44z_ZqzXk&start_radio=1 [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGyBRbbHpno&list=RDpGyBRbbHpno&start_radio=1 [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed] [Embed]

NO MOZART
NO CHOPIN
NO MAHLER
ALL ROMANTICS SCRAM!

ALL CLASSICISTS EAT SHIT AND DIE
THIS THREAD IS FOR MARIN MARAIS!

SONATA FORM SHOULD DIE
ONLY CONCERTO GROSSO FOR I!

HAYDN IS LIKE A ROTTEN WHEAT
WHAT I NEED IS A BACH CELLO SUITE


BACH AND BEFORE, IVES AND AFTER

>Listening to Bach
>not listening to Mozart
>Listening to Marais
>Not listening to Haydn
>Listening to Ravel
>not listening to Mahler
>listening to Stravinsky
>not listening to Schoenberg or Shostakovich

Is there a better feeling in this world?

>average BABIAA listener

We will disarm and subdue every 18th-19th century heretic that would put on a Mozart Piano concerto or Chopin Nocturne

We are the Mockers of Mozart
We put a chokehold on classicism

We are the Cuckolders of Chopin
We are the Rapists of Romantics

We are the murderers of Mahler
We strike fear in ever pretentious and Neurotic writer of 1 hour symphonies

>>127591397
>Reminder Bach and before, Ives and After
Well said Friend, took the wisdom right out of my mouth

>If it ain't BAROQUE, don't fix it
>I dumped her because she BAROQUED my heart
>I had to go to the doctor because I BAROQUED my leg in a gondola accident
>I would go to the concerto with you, but I'm BAROQUE
>The Baroque BAROQUED the renaissance mold

>>127592808
This is based take

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_l0soevaDEa6Krp_b98MfUMk7S2pDbby2Y&playnext=1&index=1

surprisingly good, lots of color

>>127595425
Despite what others here will say, Rattle's Mahler is great, and, perhaps more importantly, it's distinctive and unique. His micromanaging brings out details and, as you said, color you won't get with anyone else.

It absolutely grinds my gears when people play the descending left hand bit in the intro of Hungarian Rhapsody No. 2 really rapidly.

An Idiosyncratic and weird tonal composer like Gabriel Faure needs a performer who is very sensitive to his musicianship, Once you hear performances of his piano works by Albert Ferber, you'll soon realize he has been misinterpreted for the last 100 years from not necessarily bad performers, but who's artistry isn't on same level par the Monsieur. Once you realize this, you will see the parallels between Mozart and Faure. From first hearing you think surface level is as pretty as the Mediterranean water, but a deeper dive you will soon hear the riches unfold themselves, in the voicing, Harmony, and subtle syncopations in rhythm. The Preludes were always a hard listen for me like a Webern piece, but once Ferber shines his light on these pages, the mysteries are illuminated

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLtBNnqeNyo&list=PLC9P9b2PbuEq6i-04x1031Q5xbdW2FoVK&index=4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2GUjPC6Xtw&list=PLC9P9b2PbuEq6i-04x1031Q5xbdW2FoVK&index=1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIOF5-T44-M&list=PLC9P9b2PbuEq6i-04x1031Q5xbdW2FoVK&index=5
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c6NHwiamFGc&list=PLC9P9b2PbuEq6i-04x1031Q5xbdW2FoVK&index=7

>>127595443
i'm not really a fan of his earlier stuff, i've heard all of it

but since moving to the SBR his recordings have been of more interest to me. part of it is the spectacular engineering, the SBR has a really great recording setup. way better than anything Rattle ever got in Berlin

perhaps the weirdest one is his Haydn Creation
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nQX66pZQ-tM&list=OLAK5uy_m5TJ6_LOx1jjK9fpTBspRySJYvJaRbO2k&index=2
like this is actually pretty good, and easily one of the best i've heard in the past 10 years. not as good as Hengelbrock's, but still.

>when they listen to Mozart and Haydn concertos and completely neglect the Sun Kings court
>When they listen to vocal works by Verdi, Rossini or Puccini, but not Palestrina or the Franco-Flemish School
>When they don't listen to Marin Marais more frequently than Beethoven or Brahms
>No Perotin or Medieval Music

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1E1EjqIrZD4
he's a snake oil salesman, he isn't good at composing himself he just larps as being able to teach people

>>127595518
He's probably Jewish

>Bach
>Machaut
>Ives
>Marais
>Buxtehude
>Stravinsky
>Reich
>Bartok

No Mozart, No Brahms, No Haydn, No Mahler
No Autistic Teutonic spirit shall oppress or taint the Gallic, Latin, and Slavic soul

>>127595479
Fauré is directly of Chopinesque school, same as Scriabin, Debussy. Mozart is too far fetched for comparison no matter how you frame it. Think of Berceuse, op.62, and obviously 4th Ballade and 3rd sonata, he pretty much laid ground to all other great pianists. I'm curious if Ferber has a recording of Fauré's ballade? It's gotta be my favorite work of his. Sadly I can't seem to find it. Who else is good at Fauré?

>>127593512
*tenor

>blatant spammer posting the same shit every thread
Why is this the most unmoderated general on this board
>>127595192
A little romantically biased, no? I would at the very least say Brandenburg 5 and BWV 1052 deserve a spot (even if Brandenburg 5 is technically a concerto grosso)

>>127591396
No, they just did not have the musical language ingrained in them. If you grow up with classical music, you will be able to understand it more immediately. If you didn't, you might need to learn it. It's retarded to shame people like this

>>127595602
>I would at the very least say Brandenburg 5 and BWV 1052
I didn't include these because they're keyboard concertos, rather than piano concertos. I usually listen to harpsichord and organ versions of Bach concertos for some reason. I might start listening to piano renditions now.
>>127595594
Huh?

>>127595569
My comparison was more how they have been approached as composers as a listener than the harmonic approach which owes more to Chopin, but I don't think Chopin ever gets the treatment that Mozart or Faure do for the listener which was the main point of my comparison. There is a weirdness to Faure and how he solves his harmonic language and cadences, there really is nothing like it, and with proper performances of his pieces, every listen I've done is more rewarding than the last.

> I'm curious if Ferber has a recording of Fauré's ballade?
He has a full recording of his works, but it's super expensive. I might check rutracker and Soulseek if there are uploads of the complete works.

>>127595624
>I might start listening to piano renditions now.
I recommend munch

https://youtu.be/EEY9BrgBL4Q

>>127591396
well something like sonata form isn't obvious if you've never learned about the genre like educated people in the classical period would've

>>127595709
It's literally just verse-chorus but the bridge re-uses material from the previous sections

>>127595632
>Chopin ever gets the treatment that Mozart or Faure do for the listener which was the main point of my comparison.
I assume you mean Chopin's dramatic, Beethovenian bombast. But it depends on the piece. While Chopin is highly expressive, barely any interpreter gets it completely right, like the inner voices and polyrhythms of 4th ballade. Even in mazurkas counterpoint demands extra attention. Let alone nocturnes.
>There is a weirdness to Faure and how he solves his harmonic language and cadences
Yes, I was reading an analysis of Fauré's ballade just a couple of weeks ago, he has a very unique approach to resolving harmonies. Unlike Chopin's ballades, which still resemble sonata form and uses key relations for large climaxes and drama, he avoids tonic/dominant relationships entirely and modulates to remote keys for contrasting theme (chromatic mediant, from F# to D#), as for harmony, he uses dissonances in unique ways, almost like French impressionism. Suddenly chords are at odds with lyrical melody, but resolve back effortlessly, and not quite like the usual tension/release feel. So it feels etheral.
>He has a full recording of his works
Oh, good. lmk if you find it anywhere.
>>127595654
Thanks, I'll listen.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glenn_Gould
ctrl+f emotion
0 results

>Glenn Gould's approach to emotion in music was unique; while his recordings convey a "heartbreakingly beautiful" intensity and precision through restraint, he was also known for a detached and intellectual style, preferring the structured logic of composers like Bach over the violent emotions he found uncomfortable in Italian opera.

Guys am i going insane, Schoenberg is sounding genuinely good to me now

https://youtu.be/0jFtLY5pHLc?list=PLKq64tL0GeMEwrf6S070xSscleCD8jXlE

>>127595873
You might need to check up with an audiologist.

>>127595873
it's a good piece

>>127595941
He was a jew who had a white mans body

Is Dvorak's third string quartet worth hearing?

>>127596060
Gould?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctrine_of_the_affections
>"Affections are not the same as emotions; however, they are a spiritual movement of the mind".[11]
>not
>emotions
lmao

>>127591397
Before and after and not including Bach(s)

>>127591525
He face looks a little sooty

Good music is Beethoven's late quartets and after, Parsifal and before. Rest is pleb tier shit.

>>127596409
>Romantic era
>Not pleb

>>127596534
Aye, the only patrician era.

>>127595489
I'm crossing my fingers he records a new Mahler 3. Earlier this year I was doing the same thing for a new 7th and he ended up doing it! so I hope it works its magic once again

>>127596587
Didn't he record it like 3 fucking times? LOL

>>127596060
An unstoppable combination. If only he had the schlong and muscles of a black man he'd be set

>>127596629
There is technically a BPO recording of the 7th but it's like a bootleg or something, so only the two including the new one this year. For the 3rd, he's only got the (solid) one he did with Birmingham back in the day, which is why I'm hoping he does a new one with the BRSO, as I think it could really be good and interesting.

>>127591322 (OP)
fuck women
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ya11vy_s1-w

Hmm, I think my ears are finally getting tired of solo piano music and are ready to welcome the luscious sounds of orchestral music once again, thank god, it's about time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHVH17SMSMw&list=OLAK5uy_l_Wjl97B6nM5pv3cESIt284XIH_BgAs_U&index=16

>>127596650
>mutts law

>>127596286
Based, emotional restraint is paramount to any brilliant masterpiece, Romantislop and classishit need not apply.

>>127595839
>So it feels etheral.
This is why is music feels so effortlessly serene and almost spiritual, even though he didn't have a Catholic conviction in his works. He's not a typical overly-emotional romantic which is why I'm drawn to his pieces.

Rameau is good

>>127597536
That's strange, I find him to be very emotional. But not overtly expressive and bombastic, like Liszt or Beethoven. His expressiveness lies only in subtlety and harmonies. He's typically French sounding, I assume you also love Debussy, Franck?
Also, were you able to find Ferber's set anywhere? There aren't many Fauré solo piano sets to choose from, or it's just me struggling to find them. Thyssens-Valentin, Nicolas Stavy are my go-tos.

Bach
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UvogXnP5XUw

The young Bach
https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=RqM-CBMOdsI

>>127598373
https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=WM5sg9MBKw0
https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=3c6Yknjxdnk

Bach’s second cantata
https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=BnZKIq0YUMQ

>>127597965
Unfortunately its not a complete set, just some nocturnes, Barcarolles, but a complete set of preludes in 2 volumes.
>I assume you also love Debussy, Franck?
Yep, but also Chabrier as well

>>127595873
>Schoenberg is sounding genuinely good to me now.

Good. Give in to dissonance and chromaticism. With each passing moment your appreciation of the motivic structure increases.

>>127598687
I'd still listen to those 2 volumes if they were avilable anywhere as I'm short on Fauré sets, unfortunately it seems to be only on CD for now.
>Chabrier
Never listened, but I'm interested. Rec pieces if you can.
Off to be now.

>>127595873
That is one of the best string quartets ever composed so you're perfectly sane.

Early, post-romantic Schoenberg is fine. It's his serial pieces that are banana duct tape tier garbo.

>>127599205
filtered.

>>127599259
If you can't sing a tone row and its retrograde you're a poser.

>>127599304
I whistle them on my mail run. Webern's are my favorite.

>>127599205
it has been [0] days with no one being filtered by modern art

for me it's Martinu's piano concertos

>>127591322 (OP)
At risk of sounding sophomoric I'm tired of tonality, but the post-tonal canon is hopelessly autistic and contrarian
I will be grateful to anyone who can recommend consonant post-tonal pianists like >Sorabji
>>127599259
serialism is wordcel horseshit. the history of serialism induces the same vertigo as browsing the deviantart gallery of a retard who's drawn the same cartoon of a cat every day for fifteen years. That it wasn't ridiculed into oblivion dumps a fucking belt into the entire canon's intellectual credibility. I would tell serialists to eat my ass except they'd probably obey. I also like Webern

>>127599593
>serialism is wordcel horseshit. the history of serialism induces the same vertigo as browsing the deviantart gallery of a retard who's drawn the same cartoon of a cat every day for fifteen years.
lines like this is why I still come to this website

>>127599593
what the fuck is a wordcel

>>127599570
Didn't know they existed, good shout

get comfy and listen to Pletnev's unique Tchaikovsky symphony cycle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYo5JDlpMiE&list=OLAK5uy_mOGJWDf7yTLnM2vAW8jEXSu6yu6xTdcow&index=1

Post some late renaissance/early baroque opera kinos. Currently listening to caccini's euridice

>>127595560
Gigabased

>>127591322 (OP)
I hate contrarians so much. /classical/ needs a "start with the Germans" version of pic related.

>>127600446
I assume you have already heard l'Orfeo, but I want to recommend pic related which is my favorite recording (save for the stupid gimmick of having people come in during the overture, what the hell were they thinking)

>>127600894
what it needs is to ban posts by anyone with a background on pop or movie/anime/game soundtrack listening.

>>127601045
fuck here's the image

>>127601058
that would also help.

>>127601070
I'll check this recording, thanks. Theres a bilingual libretto in the monteverdi site which helps

>>127600894
>start with the Germans
Please God no, a sane person with good taste can only handle so much Telemann, Handel, Haydn, Mozart and Brahms. Start with the French is much more apt since the Notre Dame school and Franco-Flemish school created this style of music.

start with the early baroque and end with the late baroque. the only correct way

Young thug Bach
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tv1oLd03_PE

>>127601244
>the Notre Dame school and Franco-Flemish

the common practice style defined by the principles 4-part tonal harmony and developing variation technique is the conventional starting point for anyone getting into classical music. go and be a contrarian somewhere else.

*of*

>>127601162
I always feel that Italian opera librettos are usually translated in way too formal a fashion
for instance someone in an opera will say/sing something that translates to "I am not going to do that" and the online translation will have it as "I shalln't ever do so" or something. it frequently ruins comical scenes in funnier operas.

Start with Russian romantics and end with German romantics, don't bother with the rest.

ai prompt: create me a Bruckner Violin Concerto composition + recording, conducted by Herbert Von Karajan, performed by the Berlin Philharmonic and Anne-Sophie Mutter; also create an album cover with it on the DG label

>>127602123
I will crack your skull open with an organ pipe.

>>127602187
lol'd

Vivaldi is all you need. Discard the rest.

now playing

start of Prokofiev: Piano Sonata No. 4 in C Minor, Op. 29
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnVYmlhp1ew&list=OLAK5uy_n2S6SN-KtZFSUpylZl9i6k4Pt7ki_wAm8&index=2

start of Prokofiev: Piano Sonata No. 7 in B-Flat Major, Op. 83
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8slPf4tq0VU&list=OLAK5uy_n2S6SN-KtZFSUpylZl9i6k4Pt7ki_wAm8&index=5

start of Prokofiev: Piano Sonata No. 9 in C Major, Op. 103
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t39ZygRiLkg&list=OLAK5uy_n2S6SN-KtZFSUpylZl9i6k4Pt7ki_wAm8&index=7

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_n2S6SN-KtZFSUpylZl9i6k4Pt7ki_wAm8

Non-hip Bach violin concertos (all 3 and double)? I only come across hip versions that are highly regarded. What are the essential non-hip recordings

>>127603175
Grumiaux

Decided to listen to Schoenberg's first string quartet, color me impressed. This is an amazingly impressive piece on every level. Was there any tonal composer in particular who he was especially inspired by with this piece, or is it truly the wild amalgamation of romantic sound it seems to be?

>>127604045
If Schoenberg stuck to tonality, he'd be one of the most praised composers of the 20th century. I honestly commend his autism of sticking with 12 tone music even when the vast majority of people hate it

12 tone music is inherently flawed and goes against the nature of music

>>127604045
try Reger's quartets.

>>127604326
why are you retarded?

>>127604374
Am I? Or are you retarded for falling for jewish tricks like dodecaphony?

>>127604443
1. Hauer invented 12-tone music.
2. Schoenberg's music stems from Wagner, Brahms, and Reger. were they Jewish?

>>127604481
>1. Hauer invented 12-tone music
Non sequitur. Schoenberg developed it independently and popularised it. No one gives a shit about Hauer.
>Schoenberg's music stems from
His own mind.

>>127604489
many composers were heading towards 12-tone serialism independent of each other. dodecaphony is really just an extreme form of romantic harmony.

>>127604489
Schoenberg's development as a composer was in the Viennese and Saxon traditions which are European the last time I checked.

>>127604519
>extreme form of romantic harmony.
So is romantic harmony an extreme form of classical harmony? What are you even talking about. Stop parroting nonsense you read on the internet and start thinking for yourself for once. There is no reason to lump dodecaphony with romanticism, no matter what Schoenberg babbled about. It's a different thing entirely and rightfully belongs to modernism.

>>127604545
how large is a puddle?

>>127604553
This all stems from the fact that Schoenberg disliked the term "modernism", the same way Debussy disliked "impressionism". But you know, no one asked them what they think.

>>127604045
>Was there any tonal composer in particular who he was especially inspired by with this piece
according to himself, mostly Mozart

>>127604638
Sounds nothing like Mozart except first few bars of dissonance quartet and even that's stretching it. It's Wagnerian, but even more chromatic.

>>127604706
maybe it doesn't evoke Mozart harmonically but it sure does in form and structure

Most of Schoenberg's music isn't even 12 tone serialism. It's a little under half. He was majority a tonal/atonal composer, and even after he went full 12 tone he still did a few tonal pieces here-and-there.

im literally schoenberg

>>127605271
>isn't even 12 tone serialism. It's a little under half.

5 tone serialism?

I hate Schoenberg but he was good ngl

Just got back from playing craps at the lodge slamming the jukebox, I’m hanging up my olive drab jacket next to my parlor sculpture and collection of Weird Tales and lounging back on my mail order overstuffed chair with baham pillow to watch The Outlaw Josey Wales with some coleslaw and beer

>>127595873
Tried this a couple of times, my attention span runs out after 2nd movement, the dissonance doesn't help. I do like 1st movement but can't imagine sitting through 40 minutes of this stuff, and I tried following along with the score too, but it's mentally exhausting.

>Mirages op. 113
Germanbros, why didn't you tell me French music can be this beatiful?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uXw9iO5ifHQ

>>127607452
>Chant
>ignorée

>>127607481
Your lost traitor

now playing

start of Beethoven: Symphony No. 3 in E-Flat Major, Op. 55, "Eroica"
www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPiQm1T0Ihg&list=OLAK5uy_nLjPdgmweidLnCxOfgZnYsP-kCVIBXRCw&index=1

start of Beethoven: Symphony No. 8 in F Major, Op. 93
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0B7eyeheo8&list=OLAK5uy_nLjPdgmweidLnCxOfgZnYsP-kCVIBXRCw&index=5

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_nLjPdgmweidLnCxOfgZnYsP-kCVIBXRCw

David Goza > Dave Hurwitz

I nomiate him as the greatest classical youtuber

I feel like there really ought to have been another Shostakovich-tier modernist symphonist, both in quality and quantity, and it deeply bums me out that there isn't, like there's a void, something or someone is missing. No, Prokofiev's symphonies does not cut it. American modernists like Roy Harris and William Schuman are good but weren't playing on the same level as Shostakovich's symphonies.

now playing

start of Brahms: Piano Quartet No. 1 in G Minor, Op. 25
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Pmb322WJOA&list=OLAK5uy_lG9BC4FT2sdiLdH3ib74Aer6X7_1xCu0o&index=2

start of Brahms: Piano Quartet No. 3 in C Minor, Op. 60
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSrzDsVFhNM&list=OLAK5uy_lG9BC4FT2sdiLdH3ib74Aer6X7_1xCu0o&index=6

start of Brahms: Piano Quartet No. 2 in A Major, Op. 26
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UX2gfJQKE4&list=OLAK5uy_lG9BC4FT2sdiLdH3ib74Aer6X7_1xCu0o&index=10

start of Brahms: Intermezzos, Op. 117
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1lzKYWE8cI&list=OLAK5uy_lG9BC4FT2sdiLdH3ib74Aer6X7_1xCu0o&index=13

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_lG9BC4FT2sdiLdH3ib74Aer6X7_1xCu0o

read the blurb for this recording and there's this interesting tidbit,
>The following year saw the premiere of the A major quartet, Brahms himself at the piano in offering to the world a work which would be hugely popular during his lifetime before falling inexplicably to the periphery of the repertoire in recent times. It was over a decade later, in 1873/4, that Brahms returned to his aborted C minor quartet: "Imagine a man who is just going to shoot himself, for there is nothing else to do", wrote composer to publisher of this profoundly moving score.

huh...

Frédéric Bumpin

thoughts on Tchaikovsky's Orchestral Suites?

https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLa1rC97wRkZi-Is-PyvkrRJetXBGXi7P7&si=XM3iq63CY1rDm5jB

Bach’s third cantata
https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=ymqlt55iE44
https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=4gQI5SXk1nc
https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=mMtM5d0hXPo
Also, why do all male choirs sound more harmonious?

>>127611284
Leftists have no appreciation of harmony.

>>127611284
cause ur gay

>>127611429
You have a neurosis

>>127611438
You have a poopy dick and cummy asshole

>>127611447
>Regresses to a child like state when confronted

>>127611471
>t. homo mchomoface

>>127611471
>>Regresses to a child like state when confronted

>>127611502
>>127611506
You need a shaman

>>127611552
>t. crystal collecting woman

>>127611574
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0U_FBHKYqRk

>>127611592
>quoting Chigurh in 2025
That reddit picture wasn't meant to be accurate,

>Hugo Wolf was a student at the time of the 1882 Festival, yet still managed to find money for tickets to see Parsifal twice. He emerged overwhelmed: "Colossal – Wagner's most inspired, sublimest creation." He reiterated this view in a postcard from Bayreuth in 1883: "Parsifal is without doubt by far the most beautiful and sublime work in the whole field of Art."
>Gustav Mahler was also present in 1883 and he wrote to a friend; "I can hardly describe my present state to you. When I came out of the Festspielhaus, completely spellbound, I understood that the greatest and most painful revelation had just been made to me, and that I would carry it unspoiled for the rest of my life."
>Max Reger simply noted that "When I first heard Parsifal at Bayreuth I was fifteen. I cried for two weeks and then became a musician."
>Alban Berg described Parsifal in 1909 as "magnificent, overwhelming,"
>and Jean Sibelius, visiting the Festival in 1894 said "Nothing in the world has made so overwhelming an impression on me. All my innermost heart-strings throbbed... I cannot begin to tell you how Parsifal has transported me. Everything I do seems so cold and feeble by its side.That is really something."
>Claude Debussy thought the characters and plot ludicrous, but nevertheless in 1903 wrote that musically it was "Incomparable and bewildering, splendid and strong. Parsifal is one of the loveliest monuments of sound ever raised to the serene glory of music."
>He was later to write to Ernest Chausson that he had deleted a scene he had just written for his own opera Pelléas et Melisande because he had discovered in the music for it 'the ghost of old Klingsor, alias R. Wagner'.
He was simply the greatest. Wagner for all eternity.

>>127611666
A beautiful Dawn and a glorious Sunset, Wagner is the greatest

>>127611640
You are the one displaying the ethos of a redditor. You can add hypocrisy to your list of sins.

>>127611666
>When I first heard Parsifal at Bayreuth I was fifteen. I cried for two weeks
Rofl what a fag

>>127611666
trying to change the subject
>666

>>127611732
crying to music is manly

>>127611284
Because the male and female voice are too incongruous to be easily made complementary.

>>127611552
The tribe would have killed him before he got to this point.

It is amazing to think that Bach composed this piece around the age of 21 after his journey to Lübeck.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfxdzXlOQmk

>>127611756
You aren’t a real man unless you have undergone a male initiation ritual.

Berlioz's Requiem has got to be the most fucking boring Requiem ever written

>>127612253
Has it occurred to you that your musical taste is subjective; furthermore, that by spending all day ranking music, you are engaging in an intellectually meaningless activity?

>>127611697
You talk like a redditor

>>127611143
Nice sounding, pleasurable music. Shame there aren't more recordings of it.

>>127612253
I fuckin' love it.

127613236
>reddit, reddit, reddit
>BABIA, BABIA, BABIA
Get thee to a mental institution.

two things: 1) this might be one of the worst album covers I've ever seen, and
2) one reviewer whom I really respect wrote,
>Two roads diverge in the woods leading to Beethoven's quartets: pre-Emerson and post-Emerson. Pre-Emerson every ensemble expressed the Romantic performance tradition in which Beethoven was a profound, existential composer whose expression afforded limitless exploration - music of the soul, in a word. This mode of interpretation reached its height in the Busch and Budapest Qt. Post-Emerson, a modernist revision set in, stripped of Romantic "depth," with a new focus on speed, precision, and objectivity. I'm giving a simple schematic picture, but there's no doubt that the Emersons' complete Beethoven cycle on DG was a watershed.

I absolutely see what they're talking about, but is the Emerson cycle actually the catalyst? That seems quite the attribution.

adagio from the 12th to enjoy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HITbKklyv9M&list=OLAK5uy_mfkL9q86TyeskCYbjpkSG9HYn5RbM2fz8&index=7

>>127613695
nah not really, there were objectivist cycles before. Juilliard's, for example

>>127612694
They have nothing better to do.

>>127612694
>>127613784
>gets mad when people try to discuss classical in /classical/
sad

>>127613762
I suppose no reviewer or essayist ever resisted a good, broad strokes narrative.

>>127613834
it can be somewhat annoying when you have an autistic knowledge of the discography but i've learned to just ignore it unless it's extremely stupid

Classical performers must absolutely refrain from deviating from the scores, even in the slightest, as any such transgression is an affront to the very essence of the composer's artistry. The score is not merely a suggestion; it is a sacred document, painstakingly crafted by a genius who poured their soul into every note, dynamic, and articulation. To take liberties with the music is to engage in a form of musical vandalism, reducing the profound intricacies of the composition to mere whims of personal interpretation. Such egregious behavior not only disrespects the composer’s intentions but also insults the intelligence of the audience, who deserve to experience the work as it was meant to be heard. In the realm of classical music, fidelity to the score is not just a guideline; it is an absolute imperative, and any deviation is a betrayal of the art form itself.

>>127613890
ok how should i perform this music by Bach which has no tempo indication
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tdLeR9u8sqg

>>127611666
Tristan will always remain Wagner's greatest creation. Music that flows from the pen will always be the most authentic creations of composers. It's why the Rite of Spring is Stravinsky's best piece, and his artificially designed and constructed later music is so bad.

>>127613793
What discussion? You ramble on like a lunatic, we are supposed to listen…

>>127613890
kek

>>127613890
I just refrain from ever looking at the score and go with whatever performance and interpretative approach sounds best to me :D

>>127613920
If there is no tempo indication, then one should not even consider performing the work; it is inherently incomplete. To present an unfinished piece is to disregard the composer's intentions, as they clearly did not intend for it to be heard in such a state. The scores, lacking this crucial element, should have been discarded out of respect for the composer, who deserves the dignity of having their complete vision realized rather than subjected to the whims of unqualified interpretation. Performing such a work is not only misguided but also a disservice to the artistry that the composer painstakingly crafted.

>>127613978
holy based

>>127613950
When >>127612253 posts, they're not only expressing their opinion on one of the most important and popular choral works, but they're also opening the door to discussion about Requiems in general, which might really be the worst, and where Berlioz's Requiem might actually rank.

now playing

start of Beethoven: String Quartet No. 10 in E-Flat Major, Op. 74 "Harp"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysYBOPZM5es&list=OLAK5uy_mgKK2-gPFg6yc6rFHtm37s6HyaUtSfE3Y&index=38

start of Beethoven: String Quartet No. 11 in F Minor, Op. 95 "Serioso"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrsQ-Zsf8dU&list=OLAK5uy_mgKK2-gPFg6yc6rFHtm37s6HyaUtSfE3Y&index=42

start of Beethoven: String Quartet No. 12 in E-Flat Major, Op. 127
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4o_jTosnec&list=OLAK5uy_mgKK2-gPFg6yc6rFHtm37s6HyaUtSfE3Y&index=45

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_mgKK2-gPFg6yc6rFHtm37s6HyaUtSfE3Y

>>127614001
Why is ranking music so important to you?

>>127614090
NTA but it's fun and an easy way to generate some discussion.

>>127613890
>>127613978
The score is merely the marble by which the performer(s) sculps the art of the music performance with -- they are the true genius.

>>127613856
>it can be somewhat annoying when you have an autistic knowledge of the discography
Maybe you should start writing reviews and articles on recordings.

>>127614118
It’s boring; you simply have nothing better to do.

>>127614090
They are unable to come to a judgement without their “consensus filter”.

>>127614265
Nah, It’s a way to convert other listeners to their tastes. Ranking is a form of grooming.

>>127614265
>>127614231
>>127614299
It's just more fun and conducive to conversation and discussion if one says, "Berlioz's Requiem is the best Requiem ever" versus "What do you guys think about Berlioz's Requiem?" relax

Why does German music besides Wagner, some Beethoven and Bach lack any sense of passion and sensuous feeling to it? Every time I listen to music like Brahms, Bruckner, Mahler Schumann, or Haydn I get the ick. The Surprise symphony, Schumann's simp songs or Brahms incel chamber music, they all sound like they've been written by men who never touched a woman or had them desire them. Compare this to Bach, Marais, Franck, or Faure, all of whose music has an understated sexual feeling to it, a restraint of it, or a memory of an encounter. I don't get this with the Germans at all, it seems like the lack of sexual encounters have made their music so irresolute, isolating, and will ostracize anyone who likes to have sex. The French and Italians don't have this issue for obvious reasons.

Why do G*rmans make such icky music /classical/?

>>127614231
your complaining is boring

>>127600481
I know friend, have De Rore and Marais
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DJU6lsQzXGw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dzw8gtqsvDM

Jan Vogler's Bach
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiMPSJvBK3s&list=OLAK5uy_nGJZ6e_U72J0FgPUaKktXPUJByenwF_2Q&index=32

barenboim has the best wtc, idc
www.youtube.com/watch?v=NypnWn2Kml4

>>127614790
>having sexual thoughts about this guy
really nigga

>>127615040
he had 20 children nigga

>>127614373

Discussion about what? Ranking music? You can’t comprehend that such discussions are inherently meaningless intellectual endeavors. If you stripped the discussion down to its bare bones, removing all of the flowery language and pseudo-intellectual bullshit, you would have a statement of the form “The musical piece X, yay!” “The musical piece Y, boo!”; so all you are telling us is that you like something, or you don’t. It’s not a deep

>>127614805
You are no hypocrite? KOEK

>>127615580
deep idea*

>>127615580
>you would have a statement of the form “The musical piece X, yay!” “The musical piece Y, boo!”; so
I'm tempted to make an emotivism joke here but I'll abstain.

Anyway, yes, you're right, the ranking system is a way of doing so in an interesting manner.

>>127615580
>>127615614
where is your deep discussion about music? you're so fucking full of yourself it's unbelievable

>>127615697
Music is not something that requires deep discussion.

>tfw no mass in b minor gf
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsD6yHa_-hk&list=OLAK5uy_kjSqdKqGqcXUXLtyn8n7SbrwCC0TyLYiQ&index=17

>>127615644
Oh, is that the ‘ism? You get a gold star.
So you studied Philosophy? That makes sense. Most Philosophers love to make things more complicated than necessary.

>>127615778
so what is your point you're just shitting up the thread with negativity

>>127615813
you're being an utterly worthless pretentious asswipe, even an AI could write more interesting posts than you

ranking things POWER RANKINGS
1. ranking things
...
[POWER GAP]
9001. not ranking things

>>127615854
I am the negative one?
I think you suffer from memory issues…

>>127615882
Caprice

>>127615904
you're deranged

time for a
NEW
>>127615937
>>127615937
NEW

>>127615940
Yes, the fact that I am here talking to you corroborates that fact.

https://desuarchive.org/mu/thread/127591322/#127615965
i wonder if the filthy animal deleted it himself or mods=gods
despicable spastic