>>18156718
In John 8:58 it says, "Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am."
In John 17:5 it also says, "And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was."
Seems pretty clear to me.
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>>18156830
>you are engaging in the dumbest of all "intellectual" activities, religious minutae.
It really isn't, anon.
"Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord:"
(Philippians 3:8)
>you are engaging in the dumbest of all "intellectual" activities, religious minutae.
It really isn't, anon.
"Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord:"
(Philippians 3:8)
>>18100190
>Jews reject Jesus because he fulfills none of the criteria of the messiah.
Those who identify as Jews today have nothing to do with the ancient Jews anyway. I don't see why you accept their claims that they are connected.
>>18100198
>That's why they created Talmud jew religion, which is not old covenant Judaism
The people who made the Talmud is a separate, unrelated group that existed centuries later. The Talmud is largely influenced by gnostic heresies that were around during that time.
>Evil, truely evil and sick people is what jews are.
They aren't even Jews. They only claim to be. It's similar to how the synagogue of Satan is described in the book of Revelation.
"I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan."
- Revelation 2:9
>Jews reject Jesus because he fulfills none of the criteria of the messiah.
Those who identify as Jews today have nothing to do with the ancient Jews anyway. I don't see why you accept their claims that they are connected.
>>18100198
>That's why they created Talmud jew religion, which is not old covenant Judaism
The people who made the Talmud is a separate, unrelated group that existed centuries later. The Talmud is largely influenced by gnostic heresies that were around during that time.
>Evil, truely evil and sick people is what jews are.
They aren't even Jews. They only claim to be. It's similar to how the synagogue of Satan is described in the book of Revelation.
"I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan."
- Revelation 2:9
>>18087096
Civilization is unjust but in the final balance at the end God's justice will be perfect.
"Therefore hearken unto me, ye men of understanding: far be it from God, that he should do wickedness; and from the Almighty, that he should commit iniquity.
For the work of a man shall he render unto him, and cause every man to find according to his ways.
Yea, surely God will not do wickedly, neither will the Almighty pervert judgment."
(Job 34:10-12)
"Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.
For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil."
(Ecclesiastes 12:13-14)
Civilization is unjust but in the final balance at the end God's justice will be perfect.
"Therefore hearken unto me, ye men of understanding: far be it from God, that he should do wickedness; and from the Almighty, that he should commit iniquity.
For the work of a man shall he render unto him, and cause every man to find according to his ways.
Yea, surely God will not do wickedly, neither will the Almighty pervert judgment."
(Job 34:10-12)
"Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.
For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil."
(Ecclesiastes 12:13-14)
>>18085500
Well, according to what the Bible says, they always were.
"Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,"
(2 Timothy 1:9)
"And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed."
(Acts 13:48)
"But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy."
(1 Peter 2:9-10) [this passage is quoting Exodus 19:6 and Hosea 2:23]
"A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.
They shall come, and shall declare his righteousness unto a people that shall be born, that he hath done this."
(Psalm 22:30-31)
So yes, these are the people who God had foreknowledge of from the beginning. Christians are His one true people. The Bible predicts all of this.
With regards to the ancient Jews who chose to reject Christ, they will be cast into outer darkness. See the following:
"And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven.
But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth."
(Matthew 8:11-12)
"For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you.
And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people."
(Acts 3:22-23)
That's what the Bible says. Anyone who says otherwise is going against scripture.
Well, according to what the Bible says, they always were.
"Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,"
(2 Timothy 1:9)
"And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed."
(Acts 13:48)
"But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy."
(1 Peter 2:9-10) [this passage is quoting Exodus 19:6 and Hosea 2:23]
"A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.
They shall come, and shall declare his righteousness unto a people that shall be born, that he hath done this."
(Psalm 22:30-31)
So yes, these are the people who God had foreknowledge of from the beginning. Christians are His one true people. The Bible predicts all of this.
With regards to the ancient Jews who chose to reject Christ, they will be cast into outer darkness. See the following:
"And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven.
But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth."
(Matthew 8:11-12)
"For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you.
And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people."
(Acts 3:22-23)
That's what the Bible says. Anyone who says otherwise is going against scripture.
>>18083986
>They are the ones actually following the faith
Unfortunately no, Anglicanism was unbiblical from the very inception, as was other forms of state church catholicism. None of them practiced authentic congregational church polity, and they placed manmade traditions higher than God's word.
>They are the ones actually following the faith
Unfortunately no, Anglicanism was unbiblical from the very inception, as was other forms of state church catholicism. None of them practiced authentic congregational church polity, and they placed manmade traditions higher than God's word.
>>18064034
>If you think you're not because you believe the "right" things that's itself a sin.
According to the Bible, the wrath of God is against all unrighteousness without exception, including all of us. I've accepted the forgiveness given to me. Try telling me what verse in the Bible says that is a sin?
>these actions were motivated and informed by being made in the image of God.
I would disagree. I don't think you can show us where the Bible says that. I however can show you right away where it says the opposite about the image of God. Notice the second verse below:
"Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;
And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:
Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all."
(Colossians 3:9-11)
>There's no excuse for creating sapient ensouled life with the express purpose of having it obey you forever
I would counter that the purpose of creating the world was actually to glorify God. Glorifying God is possible even by those who choose to rebel, as it says: every knee shall bow, and every tongue shall confess that Jesus is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
"Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father."
(Philippians 2:5-11)
>If you think you're not because you believe the "right" things that's itself a sin.
According to the Bible, the wrath of God is against all unrighteousness without exception, including all of us. I've accepted the forgiveness given to me. Try telling me what verse in the Bible says that is a sin?
>these actions were motivated and informed by being made in the image of God.
I would disagree. I don't think you can show us where the Bible says that. I however can show you right away where it says the opposite about the image of God. Notice the second verse below:
"Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;
And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:
Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all."
(Colossians 3:9-11)
>There's no excuse for creating sapient ensouled life with the express purpose of having it obey you forever
I would counter that the purpose of creating the world was actually to glorify God. Glorifying God is possible even by those who choose to rebel, as it says: every knee shall bow, and every tongue shall confess that Jesus is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
"Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father."
(Philippians 2:5-11)
>>17947534
In Matthew it says the following:
"And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen."
(Matthew 28:18-20)
In Matthew it says the following:
"And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen."
(Matthew 28:18-20)
>>17835923
>God allows for evil because he thinks it's funny to let people be evil and then punish them for it.
That's not what the Bible says though.
"For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth."
(1 Timothy 2:3-4)
"The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance."
(2 Peter 3:9)
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."
(John 3:16)
"But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us."
(Romans 5:8)
>God allows for evil because he thinks it's funny to let people be evil and then punish them for it.
That's not what the Bible says though.
"For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth."
(1 Timothy 2:3-4)
"The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance."
(2 Peter 3:9)
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."
(John 3:16)
"But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us."
(Romans 5:8)
>>24529888
>No Holy Trinity, turns out that's just made up.
Your picture says King James Version. You didn't read 1 John 5:7 or John 10:30? What about Matthew 28:19? Or Colossians 2:8-9? What about Revelation 1:11 where Jesus says He is the Alpha and the Omega? John 1:1-2? John 17:5, Luke 18:19, Luke 24:51-52?
"For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one."
- 1 John 5:7
"I and my Father are one."
- John 10:30
"Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:"
- Matthew 28:19
You lie very poorly, anon. I bet you were hoping nobody would come to correct you.
>No Holy Trinity, turns out that's just made up.
Your picture says King James Version. You didn't read 1 John 5:7 or John 10:30? What about Matthew 28:19? Or Colossians 2:8-9? What about Revelation 1:11 where Jesus says He is the Alpha and the Omega? John 1:1-2? John 17:5, Luke 18:19, Luke 24:51-52?
"For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one."
- 1 John 5:7
"I and my Father are one."
- John 10:30
"Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:"
- Matthew 28:19
You lie very poorly, anon. I bet you were hoping nobody would come to correct you.
>>17808475
Christ died for everyone's sins according to the Bible.
Christ died for everyone's sins according to the Bible.
>>24510677
>No, I'm suggesting to use the one that's the closest to the original sources.
The received text ARE the original sources.
Not something close to them, THE original language sources, completely uncorrupted. As it says in Luke, "And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail."
- Luke 16:17
And in the Gospel of Mark, Jesus said: "Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away." Mark 13:31
If you don't believe that, anon, then why are you even studying the Bible? Why not do something else if you don't believe the words of Jesus?
>No, I'm suggesting to use the one that's the closest to the original sources.
The received text ARE the original sources.
Not something close to them, THE original language sources, completely uncorrupted. As it says in Luke, "And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail."
- Luke 16:17
And in the Gospel of Mark, Jesus said: "Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away." Mark 13:31
If you don't believe that, anon, then why are you even studying the Bible? Why not do something else if you don't believe the words of Jesus?
>>17805247
>Also with God all things are possible, and we are gods.
You're mixing two different quotes and getting the context wrong here. It is true that Jesus Christ did say, in Matthew 19:26, that with God all things are possible. But notice what else He said right before that: "But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible."
So with men being saved is impossible, and only with God are all things possible. You don't want to forget the first part of what Jesus said. So as Paul said, "I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me." (Philippians 4:13).
Your other quote, "and we are gods," comes from a completely different context. See the source, Psalm 82:6-8.
"I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.
But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.
Arise, O God, judge the earth: for thou shalt inherit all nations." (Psalm 82)
>Also with God all things are possible, and we are gods.
You're mixing two different quotes and getting the context wrong here. It is true that Jesus Christ did say, in Matthew 19:26, that with God all things are possible. But notice what else He said right before that: "But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible."
So with men being saved is impossible, and only with God are all things possible. You don't want to forget the first part of what Jesus said. So as Paul said, "I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me." (Philippians 4:13).
Your other quote, "and we are gods," comes from a completely different context. See the source, Psalm 82:6-8.
"I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.
But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.
Arise, O God, judge the earth: for thou shalt inherit all nations." (Psalm 82)
>>17785813
>how is he lower than angels if he supposed to be king over angels?
He is fully God and fully man. See Colossians 2:9 for example.
>So you're just taking any verse that talks about a special person and saying the person is Jesus?
Jesus is the Just One referred to frequently throughout the Bible. Not just in Psalm 8 but in many places.
"But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings."
(Hebrews 2:9-10)
>But nowhere does it says the son of man is God himself in the flesh or that he would be killed and come back to life.
Psalm 16:10, as I already mentioned. See the following:
"Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:
Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
Whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it.
For David speaketh concerning him, I foresaw the Lord always before my face, for he is on my right hand, that I should not be moved:
Therefore did my heart rejoice, and my tongue was glad; moreover also my flesh shall rest in hope:
Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
Thou hast made known to me the ways of life; thou shalt make me full of joy with thy countenance."
(Acts 2:22-28)
>Neither of them mentioned the son of man was God incarnate and would die for people's sins
Isaiah 9:6, Isaiah 53:5-12.
>There is no evidence that Jesus is the son of man
Psalm 110:1, Acts 2:34-35, Acts 7:56.
>how is he lower than angels if he supposed to be king over angels?
He is fully God and fully man. See Colossians 2:9 for example.
>So you're just taking any verse that talks about a special person and saying the person is Jesus?
Jesus is the Just One referred to frequently throughout the Bible. Not just in Psalm 8 but in many places.
"But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings."
(Hebrews 2:9-10)
>But nowhere does it says the son of man is God himself in the flesh or that he would be killed and come back to life.
Psalm 16:10, as I already mentioned. See the following:
"Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:
Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
Whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it.
For David speaketh concerning him, I foresaw the Lord always before my face, for he is on my right hand, that I should not be moved:
Therefore did my heart rejoice, and my tongue was glad; moreover also my flesh shall rest in hope:
Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
Thou hast made known to me the ways of life; thou shalt make me full of joy with thy countenance."
(Acts 2:22-28)
>Neither of them mentioned the son of man was God incarnate and would die for people's sins
Isaiah 9:6, Isaiah 53:5-12.
>There is no evidence that Jesus is the son of man
Psalm 110:1, Acts 2:34-35, Acts 7:56.
>>17777134
>So why doesn't God just kill Moloch and Baal?
See the following:
"For all the gods of the nations are idols: but the LORD made the heavens."
- Psalm 96:5
>So why doesn't God just kill Moloch and Baal?
See the following:
"For all the gods of the nations are idols: but the LORD made the heavens."
- Psalm 96:5
>>17764488
None of that is true.
"Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting."
- Galatians 6:7-8
None of that is true.
"Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting."
- Galatians 6:7-8