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Anonymous No.719768643 >>719769160 >>719770329 >>719770458 >>719771138 >>719771206 >>719771845 >>719779429 >>719780358 >>719784741 >>719784865 >>719793598 >>719793976 >>719795554 >>719800819 >>719804319
holy shit, this old fuck is the biggest piece of shit in the entire series
truly deserved a worse death than what he got in 4
Anonymous No.719768771 >>719769160 >>719800841
he's an allegory for boomers
Anonymous No.719769087 >>719769160 >>719771564
>ACTUALLY HE DIDN'T JUST GET OLD HE GOT INFECTED WITH MAGIC BUGS IN THE MAIL
Fuck kojima and fuck phantom pain.
Anonymous No.719769160 >>719769248 >>719770481 >>719771207 >>719773942 >>719780935 >>719781534 >>719790770 >>719795091 >>719800841 >>719801471 >>719805954
>>719768643 (OP)
>>719768771
>>719769087
Anonymous No.719769248
>>719769160
Kek
Anonymous No.719770045 >>719770363 >>719770378 >>719780571 >>719789808 >>719803401
90% of MGS4 was just explaining shit that happened in previous games.
Anonymous No.719770329 >>719770692 >>719770813 >>719773001 >>719773128 >>719796151
>>719768643 (OP)
Zero was completely irrelevant, and a humongous asspull. He was made to be a massive villain in 4, whereas he never even appeared beyond codecs and was never implied to be evil in 3.
Anonymous No.719770363
>>719770045
It did close all of the plot holes, by means of info dump, which is incredibly lame.
Anonymous No.719770378
>>719770045
Unnecessarily.
Anonymous No.719770458 >>719770692 >>719770997 >>719771704 >>719771910 >>719772826 >>719773001 >>719780154 >>719781950 >>719783979 >>719796052
>>719768643 (OP)
Zero is such a nothing character in 3, no clue why Kojima wanted to hinge the entire franchise on him
Anonymous No.719770481
>>719769160
gets me every time
Anonymous No.719770606
One became zero became one hundred back to one back to zero BACK TO ONE, BACK TO ONE HUNDRED, TOUUCHDOOOOWN
Anonymous No.719770692 >>719773001 >>719787809 >>719789624
>>719770329
>>719770458
If you play 5 you realize that Zero isn't responsible for most of the bullshit that happens in 1 and 2 and 4. It's an AI, dude was made comatose by skull face
Anonymous No.719770813 >>719771364
>>719770329
None of them started evil. The events of Operation Snake Eater simply changed them. Look at Naked Snake. Did he seem like someone who would do the things he did in MG1 and 2 in the future?
Anonymous No.719770997 >>719771391
>>719770458
No matter who the mastermind of the Patriots was, they'd all be nothing characters in the end. MGS2 already established that, regardless of their original intentions, they were totally usurped by a rogue AI.
Anonymous No.719771138 >>719771191 >>719771319 >>719772574 >>719772787 >>719779368 >>719789939
>>719768643 (OP)
You can really tell how Kojima planned none of these stories in advance. Snake's team in MGS3 are clearly just regular military officers and employees with average joe personalities and then in 4 Kojima decides they were all actually psychotic Machiavellian political extremists despite none of that ever being hinted at in the previous game
Anonymous No.719771191
>>719771138
because Kojima has written every MGS game since 2 to be his last
Anonymous No.719771206
>>719768643 (OP)
He did nothing wrong
Anonymous No.719771207
>>719769160
>using Big Boss' face model for Solid Snake
Cringe
Anonymous No.719771319 >>719771428 >>719771913 >>719772787 >>719790140 >>719799267
>>719771138
I don't think that's the point. I think the idea behind MGS3 was to show that even a bunch of goofballs can become monsters with the right catalyst. That's why he made Big Boss into an awkward, autistic weirdo who thinks crocodile hats are funny and is obsessed with eating every animal he comes across. Everyone always criticizes the idea of the charming weirdos that make up Snake's team becoming the Patriots, but no one ever questions Big Boss himself being one of those charming weirdos.
Anonymous No.719771364 >>719771756
>>719770813
It's not believable that their personalities would all be warped so dramatically. Big Boss' heel turn isn't believable written either.
Anonymous No.719771391
>>719770997
I thought I understood the background of this franchise, but I was wrong.
Anonymous No.719771428 >>719771493 >>719772861 >>719779364 >>719789728
>>719771319
Big Boss was never a villian. It's the propaganda from the Patriots that made the world believe that he was an evil dictator. Solid Snake ends up killing him the way Big Boss killed his mentor.
Anonymous No.719771493 >>719772828 >>719796069
>>719771428
No. Both Big Boss and the Patriots were villains. Same with Solidus. Same with Liquid. They're all villains. The enemy of your enemy isn't your friend here. They're ALL enemies, every last one. This is why everything could only end with every single one of them dead. Not just the Patriots, but Big Boss, Solidus, Liquid and Ocelot all had to be purged. They were ALL cancers who made the world worse with every action they took.
Anonymous No.719771564 >>719771698 >>719789545
>>719769087
Is that any stupider than him being the founder of the Patriots in the first place?
Anonymous No.719771698 >>719774763
>>719771564
They were all founders. Big Boss, Zero, Paramedic, SIGINT, EVA and Ocelot were the original founders of the Patriots. They had good intentions, but power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Big Boss was getting sick of being a figurehead, and then Zero went and start the LET project and killed their friendship for good.

Eventually, Big Boss became an extremist himself, both in order to give soldiers a place they can always belong, as well as to destroy Zero. He didn't care who got caught in the crossfire. Big Boss never cared about people outside the battlefield. Civilians didn't exist in his eyes.
Anonymous No.719771704 >>719771962 >>719772108
>>719770458
I don't think he did. I think the reveal in 4 is intentionally upsetting and stupid. A lot of 4 is like that, Kojima didn't want to make it and didn't want the mysteries all answered but when forced to do it he made a whole story about how old and tired and shitty everything is with many anticlimactic and unsatisfying answers and reveals. You can tell he didn't give a shit about Zero and the rest because he didn't bring them back to expand or develop them as characters at all in future games.
Anonymous No.719771756 >>719771920 >>719771953
>>719771364
BB's turn could have been believable if they did not have him worshiping and pining for the Boss. If instead he recognized her hypocrisy of just following orders despite her preaching world unity and peace, and combined that with his disgust at the self-serving bureaucrats and politicians just looking to enrich themselves, it would have made sense he would become disillusioned and want to tear it all down. The Boss wank really ruined everything in the series.
Anonymous No.719771845
>>719768643 (OP)
Zero was not actually evil though.
Anonymous No.719771910
>>719770458
Making Zero the big bad is the one thing I don't care for when it comes to all of the MGS games simply because it had absolutely no foreshadowing and pulled right out of Kojima's ass. Its nice MGSV expands on it but its after the fact.
Anonymous No.719771913 >>719772964
>>719771319
That's because Big Boss got a whole game explaining how a charming weirdo would became a monster, and then more games adding to that. These minor characters just revealed in cut scenes to have become the most evil group in the series and then no game ever actually explores or develops them the way the series does Big Boss. Besides that, having the Patriots be a specific group of people or explaining really anything at all about their origin in detail sort of ruins them regardless.
Anonymous No.719771920 >>719781604 >>719781649
>>719771756
It doesn't matter, he'd be a retard either way. Of course a soldier doesn't get to decide who he fights and what he fights for. The very concept of a nation of soldiers is inherently misguided. PMCs are just mercenaries who fight for money. They're not actually fighting for a cause they believe in, they're just fighting for the highest bidder. Big Boss is still sending soldiers to die in fights they had nothing to do with.
Anonymous No.719771953
>>719771756
Isn't that the lesson he learns at the end of PW, that the Boss was wrong and betrayed him or something
Anonymous No.719771962 >>719772069
>>719771704
>You can tell he didn't give a shit about Zero and the rest because he didn't bring them back to expand or develop them as characters at all in future games.
Ummm... mgs5?
Anonymous No.719772069
>>719771962
You mean cassette tapes? That's nothing. That doesn't give Zero a full arc or add enough depth and complexity to his character to make him work in this role, doesn't do it for the other losers either.
Anonymous No.719772108 >>719772460 >>719780908
>>719771704
Metal Gear games don't really focus on the antagonists that much. Most of them are kinda shallow and dumb. The only reason Ocelot became so prominent was because he just happened to be the only survivor and connecting thread between MGS1 and 2. Since he was the mastermind in both those games, they made him a major entity in 1 as well. If he hadn't been the double agent in MGS1, if he hadn't survived that game, then that'd be the end of it.

Liquid didn't exist prior to MGS1. Solidus didn't exist prior to MGS2. Skull Face didn't exist prior to MGSV.
Anonymous No.719772460
>>719772108
Liquid and Solidus are both better developed characters and villains than Zero however despite that. Skull Face isn't but he's got a better motivation and presence at least.
Anonymous No.719772574 >>719773316
>>719771138
There's a bit of foreshadowing with Para-medic's comments on cloning and not wanting Snake's genes to go to waste
But... that's about it
Anonymous No.719772697 >>719791782
Seriously discussing mgs lore is retarded. Enjoy the games for what they are and appreciate the themes that are presented. But trying to dissect the story like it's the lord of the rings is giving Kojima way too much credit. As a writer he is a hack fraud on the level of George Lucas, lower even.
Every time you find yourself thinking about the patriots/cipher or wherever the fuck, just consider if you would spend as much time thinking about how Jedis went from doing ninja flips in the prequels to doing none of that in the original trilogy.
Anonymous No.719772787
>>719771319
>>719771138
Just to be clear here, BB did nothing wrong. He revolted against a corrupt government. Anybody telling you what he did was wrong is just Them wanting you to be submissive
Anonymous No.719772826
>>719770458
The idea that the goofy support characters actually created the ultra illuminati that basically created a system for infinite industrialized human suffering will never stop being funny.
It's like a prank that went wrong.
Anonymous No.719772828 >>719773304
>>719771493
And the rogue governments that BB was rising up against werent in the wrong? Dumbass
Anonymous No.719772861 >>719773067
>>719771428
This. People tend to easily overlook this fact.
Anonymous No.719772964
>>719771913
It was also just really fucking dumb for the shadowy cabal controlling the world to just be 1 team of aggrieved American military vets instead of colluding world governments and corporations or anything that could believable achieve the power and resources they had
Anonymous No.719773001 >>719773103
>>719770329
>>719770458
>>719770692
What makes Kojima do this? To take the plot reveals of the prior game and make them "WELL ACTUALLY" plot twists in the next game? Surely they're not preconceived and he's just pulling them out of his ass, but why? Is it just to seem intelligent, like he had actually been dragging us along this whole time?
Anonymous No.719773067 >>719773098 >>719773146
>>719772861
Big Boss never consented to the Les Enfantes Terribles project and he was even upset at them creating Venom as his double. He really didn't have a say in the matter.
Anonymous No.719773091 >>719773135 >>719806372
Neither BB nor Venom were charismatic or intelligent enough to form a cult
Anonymous No.719773098
>>719773067
Yeah, he wasnt a bad guy.
Anonymous No.719773103
>>719773001
Because people keep asking for answers and more games, more stories and more explanation. You make that many games at some point you are going to have to answer all your questions and mysteries. That was basically the whole point of 4, giving your finality in every way and making you feel like shit the whole time for it.
Anonymous No.719773128
>>719770329
>was never implied to be evil in 3.
He was. 3 was set up as the origin of the Patriots. And then you meet a group of covert people that end up with power. Did you think all the people that show up in the Patriots set up had nothing to do with anything?
Anonymous No.719773135
>>719773091
the main ingredient to being a good cult leader is being incredibly horny.
Anonymous No.719773146 >>719773291 >>719785127
>>719773067
He could have easily helped Venom after finding out, he went along with it and used him as a tool anyway.
Anonymous No.719773291 >>719773385 >>719799612
>>719773146
The deed was already done and he couldn't do much about it anyway. He's also the one that reveals the truth to Venom at the end of MGS5 anyway.
Anonymous No.719773304 >>719773454
>>719772828
Outer Heaven and Zanzibarland WERE rogue governments.
Anonymous No.719773316 >>719773648 >>719773714
>>719772574
The most obvious hint is the DARPA Chief from 1 being a team member. The Chief was shady in 1 and seeing him again in 3 is the big hint
Anonymous No.719773385 >>719785410
>>719773291
It's already done, guess I have to use him and Miller and the rest of DD as decoys to protect myself. Certainly can't make any attempt to help reclaim his identity at all or help them in their battles in any way.
Anonymous No.719773454 >>719773534
>>719773304
Yeah but he was making an effort to keep the big corrupt governments of the world at bay. You bought the propaganda
Anonymous No.719773507 >>719773648
>MG1
Codec contact Big Boss is actually the villain
>MGS1
Codec team member is actually the villain Liquid
>MGS2
Codec team is actually evil AI villains
>MGS3
Wow I can't believe he would make the Codec team badguys

This is why you play games in release order. Playing MGS3 makes you think dumb ideas.
Anonymous No.719773534 >>719779364
>>719773454
He wanted to create an endless war and indoctrinated countless child soldiers. What happens to the people caught in the crossfire?
Anonymous No.719773648 >>719773715
>>719773316
They weren't revealed to be the same person until 4.
>>719773507
The Boss is the codec member who betrays you in that game. Notice how in all the other examples the codec betrayal is revealed in the same game as part of that games plot, not in another with a totally different main character and story.
Anonymous No.719773714
>>719773316
Yeah, the fact that they set up that whole angle and had the whole Decoy Octopus character specifically for that proves that they had something planned.
Anonymous No.719773715 >>719774112
>>719773648
>They weren't revealed to be the same person until 4.
This is outright wrong. MGS3 timeline at the end says it
Anonymous No.719773735
A lot can change in ten years.
Anonymous No.719773942 >>719806548
>>719769160
>And get this... this guy's NAME IS ZERO.
Anonymous No.719774112 >>719774163
>>719773715
Just says he joins ARPA. Not necessarily he was the same black guy from MGS1, just like it doesn't say Paramedic became the Clark that experimented on Gray Fox, or that any of them were the Patriots.
Anonymous No.719774163 >>719804673
>>719774112
Yes it does. It even mentions his death
Anonymous No.719774763 >>719804459
>>719771698
>as well as to destroy Zero.
Wut? He worked for Foxhound and figured out that Zero was a vegetable by Phantom Pain's ending, no?
Anonymous No.719775000 >>719776732
I think Kojimbo is actually okay as a writer for a singular game, it's SEQUELS he seems to have trouble with. He will endlessly retcon stories, make plot twists for the sake of it, and treat past games like they don't matter. His lack of consistentcy is wild.

I think he also threw a hissy fit about making MGS2, so he vented in the storyline by making it post-modern and a commentary on "sequels" in general. That was successful, so when he was even pissier about MGS4, he threw an even bigger hissy fit and got rewarded AGAIN.

MGSOnline 2 really saved MGS4, especially in latin america and third world. Third worlders LOVED that game.
Anonymous No.719776419
metal gear shit
Anonymous No.719776497 >>719804859
woah... mind blown.
Anonymous No.719776732 >>719776948
>>719775000
It's insane how many people can't fit into their minds the series went downhill with 2 and 3 is a giant mixed bag of good ideas and trying to justify shitty ones
Anonymous No.719776948 >>719778510
>>719776732
The retcons have been going on since the first sequel. Master Miller is a very asian looking man in MG2, and he's described only as Foxhound's drill seargant. Holy shit his role gets progressively bigger with each games, until he's Big Boss' litera right hand man.

To make Liquid's impersonation work, Miller's whole design is turned into a Liquid clone and his full name is given as McDonell Benedict Miller in Metal Gear Solid. Then LATER he's given the full name Kazuhira Miller with ZERO explanation why he's given two completely different names.

Simply put, these might as well be separate characters at this point.
Anonymous No.719776986 >>719777249 >>719777436 >>719778771
Anonymous No.719777249
>>719776986
Venom snake making the most sense and being the most morally correct character as usual.
Anonymous No.719777436 >>719777594 >>719779895
>>719776986
That's not what Solid Snake is at all. Snake doesn't like the Patriots, but he concludes that it's not his place to decide the fate of the world. Instead, he places his faith on those like Otacon. At the end of the day, Snake is just a soldier. His skillsets are only good for killing and he's not someone who can change how the world works. He can only try and put his skills to good use by placing in trust on those he believes in. Philanthropy was almost certainly Otacon's idea. Snake probably just went "Alright. Your idea sounds good so I'll fight for it."
Anonymous No.719777594
>>719777436
snake left meryl to man-chase otacon, who is canonically the most desired man in the serie after big boss
Anonymous No.719778510
>>719776948
>Then LATER he's given the full name Kazuhira Miller with ZERO explanation why he's given two completely different names
https://youtu.be/28CbH2EiwAc
Anonymous No.719778771 >>719779646 >>719779823 >>719779964 >>719787435 >>719791259
>>719776986
what does Raiden say?
Anonymous No.719779364
>>719773534
He wanted to keep corrupt people at bay forever, and recruited children and took them in as his own and fed them, housed them, etc.
See >>719771428
Anonymous No.719779368
>>719771138
I find it brilliant frankly.
You never know what lies behind a smile. We're all people, in darkness and light.
Anonymous No.719779429
>>719768643 (OP)
>snake's crew from virtuos mission gets retconned into le big bad masterminds
4 was so ass and kojima is a hack, I hope nukojipro goes bankrupt
Anonymous No.719779646
>>719778771
Rose...
Anonymous No.719779729 >>719780031
>Sokolov is alive in portable ops... for reasons.

Can't any god damn character just DIE already?
Anonymous No.719779823
>>719778771
>killing is fun actually! If you kill enough people nobody can stop you!
Anonymous No.719779895
>>719777436
>places his faith on those like Otacon
That motherfucker?
Anonymous No.719779964
>>719778771
>what does Raiden say?
Dead on!
Bullseye!
Anonymous No.719780031 >>719780070
>>719779729
raikov is alive too and can be recruited
Anonymous No.719780070
>>719780031
His death is optional in 3. They should jsut leave these characters fates vague and up to the player.

I like to think he's Raiden's uncle or something.
Anonymous No.719780154 >>719780247
>>719770458
Because MGS1 and MGS2 talk about a shadow government and he needed to tell the origin
Anonymous No.719780247 >>719780517 >>719783452
>>719780154
He had teh entire game to tell us this in MGS4... he tacks on the entire origin of the Patriots in the alst 45 minute post-credits scene.
Anonymous No.719780358
>>719768643 (OP)
Can he really be blamed for the retarded decisions of the AI that he and many others entrusted to run things?
Anonymous No.719780474 >>719780608
>i guess i'm going to die dramatically now, what should i name the virus i made with sunny's help to trick otacon and snake into putting in the patriots
>oh i know
>FOXALIVE, get it, i'm so smart
>god this suppressant for my super cancer is gonna suck
Anonymous No.719780517
>>719780247
No, that was the Act 3's church cutscene. The one so insane that dumped so much information and explanation and retcons into a single cutscene that the game unironically stops and asks you if you want to save and take a break after it to even attempt to process that the wacky and goofy radio team from 3 are the big bads of the series.
Anonymous No.719780571
>>719770045
It even explained the non-existent plot of Portable Ops
Anonymous No.719780608
>>719780474
fuck Naomi
MGS1 Naomi (with the British/Rhodesian accent) is a great and complex character who you genuinely have to decide on your own if you forgive her or hate her for what she did, since she was merely trying to get "revenge" against the one man who killed her only "family."
MGS4 Naomi is just some manipulative bitch who cares about no one but herself. Otacon didn't deserve to be played like that.
Anonymous No.719780676 >>719781069
I think most MGS games don't really make sense narratively speaking although there's some meta stuff in MGS 2 that is really interesting... but MGS4 is hands off the worst game in the serie when it comes to writing. Nothing makes sense and it felt like Kojimbo didn't want to do it so he fucked it up good so that he won't be called again for another MGS
Anonymous No.719780908
>>719772108
Solidus was revealed in the canon ending of 1 you stupid secondary nigger
Anonymous No.719780935
>>719769160
Snake dies?
also, wasn't that the patriot gun from The Boss that he laid on the gravestone?
Anonymous No.719781051
>half the franchise is just a remake of MG2 including a remake of the remake of MG2
Anonymous No.719781069 >>719781138
>>719780676
The thing about Metal Gear plots is that tangibly speaking, every piece is there in-game prior to 4 to make each plot internally consistent with itself, it's just the Kojima diatribes and weird bits or long monologues tend to convolute and obfuscate a lot of things, muddy the waters. MGS2 technically makes sense, the characters themselves even point out that shit like GW going postal is thanks to Emma's virus and all and it's really just the ending revelation of the Patriots being "long dead" that was clearly an unplanned spook, but you don't need MGS4 to retroactively make sense of its plot points otherwise.

It's really just 4 excessively stitching and duct taping everything together like a Cronenberg abomination of a plot, retconning things liberally in ways that don't make sense without its own internal logic, having random shit pop up without explanation like the Dr. Madnar survival, Ocelot replacing his Liquid arm off-screen to fake being possessed, and various other bullshit, that fucks everything up. It retroactively makes everything that came before it worse, and insists on itself in ways I don't think I've ever seen any other video game accomplish, even arrogant and retarded ones thinking they were gonna be the hottest shit around. MGS4 genuinely just holds itself as some cornucopia of cinematic brilliance when it may as well be Kojima getting high as fuck off his own mental flatulence.

You can see that with Peace Walker and V, too. Dude just spun his wheels dancing around a lot of arbitrary bullshit to make Big Boss / Venom Snake extra mad, and just made two separate finalizations of his villainy because he couldn't come up with anything else to do.
Anonymous No.719781138
>>719781069
It's because his "co-writer" left. Gooks always pull this shit
Anonymous No.719781201 >>719781252 >>719781806 >>719791921
How MGS3 Could've Had the Greatest Story
>The Boss is a man who never went to space, so he makes some sense
>His defection is real because the US was planning to give the Cobra Unit a suicide mission
>Jack was left out because he didn't want him involved
>Jack is sent on an actual suicide mission to kill his master and his apprentices and succeeds in contrary to everyone's expectations
>The US feared a Caesar-like figure in the US military after the whole loss of faith and humanity after both world wars, which is why the aforementioned suicide mission was planned
>Jack becomes that figure in Big Boss except even worse
>the philosophers/patriots don't exist because they made no fucking sense to begin with
Anonymous No.719781252 >>719781403
>>719781201
are you really going to copy paste this across the several threads that are up? Take your pity (you) I guess
Anonymous No.719781403 >>719781462
>>719781252
you know i'm right, faggot
Anonymous No.719781462
>>719781403
no no let me help you ESL-kun you meant to say
>you know I'm a faggot, right?
Anonymous No.719781534 >>719781583 >>719781874 >>719781958 >>719790676 >>719804987
>>719769160
I hate this image because it implies MGS4 was good before the epilogue
Anonymous No.719781583 >>719781673 >>719781794
>>719781534
kojima obviously has a pissing and shitting fetish
Anonymous No.719781604 >>719781649
>>719771920
>The very concept of a nation of soldiers is inherently misguided
That is the point
Anonymous No.719781649
>>719771920
>>719781604
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OO9t-iH6kE
Anonymous No.719781673 >>719805237
>>719781583
is this the thread
Anonymous No.719781794
>>719781583
It was always funny to me because of my personnal experience with nuclear diarrhea
Anonymous No.719781806
>>719781201
fag
Anonymous No.719781874
>>719781534
Yeah but the epilogue was still another giant leap in stupidity beyond anything that came before.
Anonymous No.719781950 >>719782117 >>719792520
>>719770458
Because Zero and the rest of the radio squad were the only plausible characters for the reveal. It can't be new characters since the game would have to spend a lot of time introducing them. It can't be anyone from MGS1/MGS2 since the Patriots were supposed to be a very old conspiracy. Therefore Zero was the best choice since he is a pre-established character that has history with both Big Boss and his mentor.
Anonymous No.719781958
>>719781534
>humorless shadow the cuckhog needs to let everyone know his humor is MATURE and how above everyone he is
tell me perchance, when was the last time you saw your penis without a mirror or picture?
Anonymous No.719782112 >>719801556
I came up the idea called β€œvideo essay”
Anonymous No.719782117 >>719782197 >>719782271 >>719788437
>>719781950
this isn't good writing
Anonymous No.719782197 >>719782271
>>719782117
careful, now he's going to start making baboon noises and start saying phrases like "but kojima didn't even wanna make metal geaaaaruh" and "well what would you dooouh" and other things these silverbacks beat their chest about
Anonymous No.719782271 >>719782314 >>719782328
>>719782117
I didn't say it was, its still forced by introduing last minute villains out of nowhere would be even worse hence why Kojima did what he did. He also wanted to tie MGS3 much closer to the rest of the games since prior to MGS4, it was an isolated entry with little narrative connection to the rest of the plot.
>>719782197
(You)
Anonymous No.719782314
>>719782271
*but introducing last minute villains
Anonymous No.719782328
>>719782271
it should've stayed that way
Anonymous No.719782430
>vol. 2 never coming because they're afraid of the nonexistent "audience" companies seek will be forever turned off Konami after playing 4
Anonymous No.719783452
>>719780247
Revengence was the only good Metal Gear game.
Anonymous No.719783780
From someone who just played all those games and never touched them before, this was the most unnecessary complicated nonsensical clusterfuck of idiotic ideas paired with dogshit gameplay which somehow produced a lot of amazing and memorable moments which I will remember fondly. This Kojumbo guy needs to make a game together with Yoko Taro, they are on the same level of storytelling "mastery".
Anonymous No.719783979
>>719770458
thats not the same Zero as from 3
Anonymous No.719784741 >>719788860 >>719800173
>>719768643 (OP)
Here's your big bad bro
Anonymous No.719784865 >>719784979
>>719768643 (OP)
reminder that MGSV retconned him into a dindu
Anonymous No.719784979
>>719784865
kojima needs to make up his fucking mind
and to stop being stupid
there is no way the team behind snake eater could do any of this shit
Anonymous No.719785127
>>719773146
Part of Big Boss’s fall was to show he was willing to use his soldiers as tools like the US government did to The Boss.
Anonymous No.719785410
>>719773385
As far as he's concerned MSF is dead and DD is just a bunch of randos that Miller rallied up. And that rat Miller got exactly what was coming to him.
>"teehee sorry Snake I was working with Cipher all along but it was nothing personnel Boss"
>gets to be on the receiving end
>intense seething and screeching
Anonymous No.719787435
>>719778771
i need oil my jaw is rusty
Anonymous No.719787809
>>719770692
not really, he already did a shit ton before that, and the AI was already in development by that point. He getting comatose by Skull Face was just karma getting back to him, he never was able to see the fruit of his labor and every single living person had to pay the price.
Anonymous No.719788437 >>719788597
>>719782117
Were you ever under the impression that MGS was renowned for it's excellent writing and cohesive plot?
Anonymous No.719788597
>>719788437
that is the propaganda being spread
Anonymous No.719788860 >>719789157
>>719784741
This character feels so detached from everything she does after MGS3 to an almost comical degree.
Anonymous No.719789157
>>719788860
That's actually Zero saying the line in the background while Para-Medic and Snake was having a conversation
Anonymous No.719789545
>>719771564
What did you want the patriots to be? Old guys that inherited money and power from their parents? Instead its old guys that stole it. I don't see the difference.
Anonymous No.719789624
>>719770692
I'm so tired of the next game just undoing everything that was developed in the previous game.
Anonymous No.719789728 >>719789847
>>719771428
>Big Boss was never a villian

Theres these old games called metal gear and metal gear 2
Anonymous No.719789808
>>719770045
You mean retconed shit in previous games
Anonymous No.719789847 >>719790418
>>719789728
and what exactly did he do wrong in those that's not already in Peace Walker and V? the only difference is that The Patriots sent in Solid Snake to take him down
Anonymous No.719789897 >>719790871
When I played this game when it was new, I honestly thought the game ended with Old Snake killing himself. Then I talked to someone else and they told me the cutscene keeps going for sometime after that.

In my head-cannon I am perfectly fine with this being the end (of the entire MGS series)
Anonymous No.719789939 >>719804537
>>719771138
>Snake's team in MGS3 are clearly just regular military officers and employees with average joe personalities and then in 4 Kojima decides they were all actually psychotic Machiavellian political extremists despite none of that ever being hinted at in the previous game

That's not the problem. The problem is you need snake eater 2 to show their transformation, instead MGS4 just drops this on you as dialogue exposition.

If you make these nice normal people disgusted or angry with the world because of events, and also powerful with the philospher's legacy, them becoming the patriots is completely believable. But you have to show that story, not tell it. But kojima was being forced to make one game and it would've taken 2 at least.
Anonymous No.719790140
>>719771319
>I think the idea behind MGS3 was to show that even a bunch of goofballs can become monsters with the right catalyst.

Not only are you right but this has been a series theme that's at least as old as metal gear 2. Every time you kill a villain/boss they give you their sob story about how they were a good boy. Kojima just showed you their past first in MGS3, that's the only difference.
Anonymous No.719790418 >>719790921
>>719789847
In metal gear 2 he just loves war and is addicted to it, he starts wars just to create victims and recruit them for the next war, including children, He is a complete mustache twirling psychopath in the first games. He's basically solidus without the appeal of speaking against a larger villain.
Anonymous No.719790676
>>719781534
Johnny is MGS-core, tourist
Anonymous No.719790770
>>719769160
>somehow, Para-Medic is also Dr. Clark who knows how to make cyborg ninja exoskeletons.
Anonymous No.719790871
>>719789897
Dude the credits after that scene up until the Big Boss reveal is like 2 minutes.
Did you shut the game off immediately? What about your stats and rank?!
Anonymous No.719790921
>>719790418
what wars? he didn't start shit. he's only saying that to goad Snake into killing him, the same way The Boss didn't give him a choice during Snake Eater. all the kids running around in Zanzibar were having the time of their life. Naomi and Sniper Wolf had nothing but praises to sing for Big Boss. the child soldiers in DD are all disarmed and given proper care and education by Kazuhira "I hate kids" Miller.
Anonymous No.719791259
>>719778771
RULES OF NATURE
Anonymous No.719791782
>>719772697
best post in the thread

Kojima is fucken retarded and so is the story. There is no redeeming it. Enjoy it for how fucken dumb it is and have fun with the game. There is no depth to it
Anonymous No.719791921 >>719792089
>>719781201
it doesn't work because big boss lives at the end

also some people are willing to die for their country on suicide missions like D-Day for example
Anonymous No.719792089
>>719791921
what
Anonymous No.719792520 >>719796383
>>719781950
We were already introduced to the Philosophers and that Ocelot was working with their remnants in 3. MGS4 could have gone with that angle
Anonymous No.719793598 >>719793924
>>719768643 (OP)
MGR being the last game in the timeline feels like a weird note for the series to end on, the world post MGS4 is pretty much a cybernetic warzone, not much better than when the Patriots were still around
Anonymous No.719793924 >>719794103
>>719793598
That's the entire point of the game, no? Armstrong outright says he's bringing back the war economy in style. It's a bit of a somber note but that's just humanity for ya.
Anonymous No.719793976 >>719796741
>>719768643 (OP)
I don't count him as a valid bad guy for the simple fact that he's fucking nowhere to be seen in all of the games where is supposed to have a bad guy role.

Zero is by far the weakest shit Kojimer has ever done. He might as well picked Paramedic to be the Big Series' Villain and it would've had the exact same effect.
Anonymous No.719794103 >>719794443
>>719793924
it sucks that nothing Snake did amounted to anything. His genes and memes died with him.
Anonymous No.719794443
>>719794103
Not necessarily, the war economy was just one aspect of The Patriots' control. Everyone else is free to do whatever they please now, while guys like Raiden and Sam have to be the vanguards to keep bad apples like Armstrong and Desperado from acting out.
Anonymous No.719795091 >>719795254 >>719798054
>>719769160
Yeah, the entire point of MGS4 was to END the series right then and there. They literally killed or written off every major character that could be the protagonist so the story couldn't continue (MGR dont count), while also tying up every loose end. It's just that Kojima had to pull shit out of everyone's ass to do it.

Peace Walker was just a vita spin off and MGSV is literally him saying to move on from the series
Anonymous No.719795254 >>719795837
>>719795091
>that tweet
literally what the fuck is this moron saying
Anonymous No.719795554
>>719768643 (OP)
Just look at the nose and you'll understand why he did it
Anonymous No.719795837 >>719801794
>>719795254
V is the game. Snake is bound by fate meaning Konami and the gans want more MGS games. The player bound by Snake is Venom Snake who the player creates at the start. Taking up the baton is the player being the protagonist of the last MGS game completing the cycle.
Anonymous No.719796052
>>719770458
I don't know which is worse: making the cast of MGS3 the sole responsibles for the shit that transpired since pretty much MG1, or introduce a whole new cast in MGSV that are never mentioned in the franchise but somehow still played a significant role and conveniently just fucked off.
Anonymous No.719796069 >>719797425
>>719771493
>Solidus was a villain
Wrong
Anonymous No.719796151 >>719796384
>>719770329
Mgs 4 is just trying to end the series, gotta have a central villian that big boss knew so uhhhhhhhhhh that random guy who talked about movies i guess
Kojima had no plan and was just writing shit on the spot.
You can see his actual regret in killing off the liquid snake off in mgs1. Half of the series became dedicated to just finding ways of putting him back into the game from possession to random appearance as a child
Anonymous No.719796383 >>719798045 >>719804412
>>719792520
We were introduced to their legacy. The philosophers are already dead or not important by the time MGS3 starts. Ocelot was a CIA triple agent
Anonymous No.719796384 >>719796836
>>719796151
In reality mgs1 could have been a one and done game and it would have worked fine with some callbacks to older works in kojimas career
Mgs2 kind of works but adds so many more questions that now need to be answered
3 is when it gets messy
Anonymous No.719796741
>>719793976
He's not a bad guy, just someone who fucked up and made a mess. Same with bb and whoever else was influenced by the boss' will.
Anonymous No.719796836
>>719796384
MGS2 was meant to be an ending as well. Snake's entire monologue confirms it. That's why MGS3 is a prequel. I think Kojima just intended for Snake to be always fighting against metal gears. That's all he does anyway.
Anonymous No.719797425
>>719796069
Yeah he was just a fucking idiot who got played by the patriots from the moment he was pulled out of a test tube till his dying breath.
Anonymous No.719798045 >>719798279
>>719796383
Its heavily implied Ocelot was working with existing remnant Philosophers in the United States to establish their eventual hegemony as the Patriots. The Chinese branch of philosophers is active in some way as they both raised and sent Eva to intercept the Legacy.
Anonymous No.719798054
>>719795091
If I ever see him irl, I will murder him
Anonymous No.719798279
>>719798045
The Philosophers as a group dont exist by MGS3 since they're supposed to be the elite of the US, USSR and China. By MGS3 there's a cold war going on so they're all at odds. They're done by that point. And Zero starts the Patriots right after MGS3 anyway.
Anonymous No.719798542
Reading after the events of mgs3 para-medic became power hungry is way too funny. The stupid cutesy bitch that just wants to talk about godzilla
You fags take this shit serious?
Theirs a part here that says the virus that affected humans in mgs1 killing them foxdie infected the fucking computer ai computer in mgs2 and thats why it was acting weird
The actual bio virus affected the computer
Kojima was writing shit literally on a fucking whim and you fags actually go β€œyes kojima of course”
Lol
Lmao
Anonymous No.719799267
>>719771319
BB has never done a fucking thing evil
Anonymous No.719799545 >>719799653 >>719800521
the philosophers shouldn't have "died" but lived on through the patriots with the AI
their identity kept a secret and never ever revealed.
Anonymous No.719799612
>>719773291
>He's also the one that reveals the truth to Venom at the end of MGS5 anyway
thats the end of metal gear nigga
Anonymous No.719799653
>>719799545
the patriots are the player
Anonymous No.719799794 >>719799912 >>719800650
What the fuck was Rose's problem?

Imagine going through hell and saving the world then coming back home to have to deal with this shit.
Anonymous No.719799912
>>719799794
erm he forgot their anniversary so he deserves everything he fucking got
Anonymous No.719800173 >>719800452 >>719800819
>>719784741
the AI is the big bad not fucking zero his a old man pissing on himself, they tell you this in 2 the game everyone sucks off
Anonymous No.719800452 >>719800623 >>719800964 >>719805235 >>719806225
>>719800173
3 is the game people suck off, cmon now nigga lets not rewrite history
Why do you think it was the game chosen for a remake when obviously 1 would make the most sense.
Because every faggot on the planet calls 3 a masterpiece probably because they never played it and realized half of the game is 3 tiny ass levels the game forces you to run though 3 times each.
Its crazy that the shitty little brick house at the start which isn’t even a good level is used 3 times back to back
Actually 2 gets the most undeserved hate from little boys upset about raiden
Anonymous No.719800521 >>719800606 >>719801623
>>719799545
yes the men that was 30+ in ww2 should of been fist fighting old snake in 2015
Anonymous No.719800606 >>719801073
>>719800521
>brownoid reading comprehension
Anonymous No.719800623 >>719800809
>>719800452
2 is the premiere essaybait along with silent hill 2
the reason 3 got remade instead of 2 is because it can stand on its own as a prequel and 1 was already remade once
Anonymous No.719800650 >>719800754
>>719799794
his son is going to be a snake or raise one
Anonymous No.719800754 >>719800839 >>719800990 >>719801178
>>719800650
wtf can a soldier like snake do against someone like monsoon
Anonymous No.719800809
>>719800623
Cope, you know 3 is the game every retard says is their favorite.
Yeah 2 gets more essays but what kind of metric is that. And thats usually just people talking about the ai breaking down in the last hour because its interesting
Anonymous No.719800819 >>719801482
>>719800173
Not according to 4 >>719768643 (OP). Imagine how much better that game would be if the AI continued being a smug chucklefuck like they were at the end of 2, but no they're suddenly just machines in a cylinder.
Anonymous No.719800839 >>719801014
>>719800754
probably shoot him like 40 times in the head with a tranq pistol if he wants max rank
Anonymous No.719800841
>>719768771
Ooh, fpbp.
>>719769160
I did rike it, yeah. It's not my favorite game in the series, but I actually liked how it ended the story. The final scene may or may not be a suicide-induced hallucination.
Anonymous No.719800964 >>719801389
>>719800452
no they suck 2/3 off nearly the same
2 gets the memes and AI bullshit but the big shell is the most boring fucking playground to play in, it also gets the watch me shoot this bottle and water comes out
and 3 is just omg koijma game hahah cat man meow'd, he grabbed his dick, 3 is a game for mentally challenged ppl, that act like its shit story is good and the rest of mgs story is bad
Anonymous No.719800990 >>719801113
>>719800754
you think hes going to fight fair?
Anonymous No.719801014 >>719801097
>>719800839
everyone's a robot
Anonymous No.719801073 >>719801508 >>719801623
>>719800606
how do you know there not the AI?
you dont know who they are so they are the AI
Anonymous No.719801097 >>719801196
>>719801014
shoot him directly in the brainstem with a tranq piercing round
Anonymous No.719801113 >>719801359
>>719800990
what's he gonna do? call his dady to actually do the fight?
Anonymous No.719801178 >>719801424
>>719800754
samething he did vs vamp in 4 shoot him and stab him till the nanos dont work
Anonymous No.719801196 >>719801273
>>719801097
nanomachines counter tranqs
Anonymous No.719801273 >>719801335
>>719801196
sunny devised nanomachine hack that puts robot to sleep
Anonymous No.719801335 >>719801446
>>719801273
he's gonna hack him to sleep? snake never hacked
Anonymous No.719801359
>>719801113
learn about monsoon's power and tactics
use his weaknesses against him like drawing his bodyparts in isolated areas so they cant fuse
or draw his electro magnetism from him
or use it to drop junk on his head
Anonymous No.719801389 >>719802023
>>719800964
Maybe but im telling you most mgs3 fans have not finished mgs3, i refuse to believe that. They just like watch cutscenes on youtube or some shit. Mgs3 is so fucking obnoxious, broken ai more than usual, boring as fuck in between those cutscenes with some of the worse designed stealth areas in the genre that reuses the same shitty areas multiple times because the actual game time is short just like mgs4.
Its like how every retard online talks about the survival mechanics as if they matter, if you ever played the game tou know you have so many bandages you will never run out and its just wasted time messing around in the menu
Mgs2 play space is a boring setting, true. but its more fun to actually stealth around in and has more fun bosses and goofier mgs moments.
Anonymous No.719801424
>>719801178
raiden did that shit
Anonymous No.719801446 >>719801631
>>719801335
she put it in a form factor he understands
a fucking gun
Anonymous No.719801471
>>719769160
Holy kek
Anonymous No.719801482 >>719802072
>>719800819
have you played 4?
its big boss killing him to send the world back to zero, all that gay metafore shit saying the Metal Gear games are over
the AI dies with that foxalive shit
ppl are here chatting shit but most likly just played delta
Anonymous No.719801508
>>719801073
Anonymous No.719801556 >>719801687
>>719782112
Who actually watches these?
Anonymous No.719801623
>>719800521
The men that were 30. Should have.
>>719801073
They're.
Anonymous No.719801631 >>719802138
>>719801446
a gun that shoots a hack that would put monsoon to sleep for a couple of hours? Yeah little john is cooked
Anonymous No.719801687
>>719801556
Stoners and retards.
Anonymous No.719801794
>>719795837
Exactly what I was thinking lol
Anonymous No.719802023 >>719802345
>>719801389
https://psnprofiles.com/trophies/1164-metal-gear-solid-3-snake-eater
only 50% beat the boss more ppl have beaten the last of us 2 at 75%
https://psnprofiles.com/trophies/10960-the-last-of-us-part-ii

the last of us 2 has a worst story is 3 times longer and has filler out the arse
Anonymous No.719802072 >>719802456
>>719801482
Yes, he said everything that happened was because of the guy in the wheelchair. The AI and all the other stuff originated from him, and then he started going on about 100s and 0s. He said he was confused about what the fuck he wanted and pitied him. Then he killed him.

In 4 the AIs stopped being a character or an entity like they were in 2. It's just there. Liquid Ocelot takes mainstage. From Act 3 onwards, Zero is established as the big bad.
Anonymous No.719802138
>>719801631
its a problem solver
Anonymous No.719802345 >>719802880 >>719804449
>>719802023
whats even more funny
https://psnprofiles.com/trophies/3827-metal-gear-solid-v-the-phantom-pain
only 10% of 750k ppl have beaten that dogshit game
Anonymous No.719802456 >>719803297
>>719802072
ocelot takes over the AI in part 3
Anonymous No.719802880
>>719802345
https://steamcommunity.com/stats/287700/achievements
7.5% has beaten it on steam
this game that gets shilled here like crazy, no one has fucking beat it
Anonymous No.719803297 >>719804559
>>719802456
And the AI is still not the big bad, whoever has the keys to it was. When I said Zero is established as the big bad, I meant that the game (EVA) indicated that all the bad shit the AI did was on behalf of Zero's will.
Anonymous No.719803401
>>719770045
>90% of MGS4 was just retconning shit that happened in previous games.
Fixed
Anonymous No.719804319
>>719768643 (OP)
Also paramedic but she had a sexy voice so she gets a pass
Anonymous No.719804412
>>719796383
And their "legacy" is just fucking money LMAO
As if the governments can't print that on demand WHAT THE FUCK KOJIMAN?
Anonymous No.719804449
>>719802345
I have replayed the game twice, but once you start repeating missions but with modifiers, I stop playing. I really like the game that is there, but it's unfinished so there is nothing to "finish" so I lose motivation there.
Anonymous No.719804459
>>719774763
That was decades later, what the other anon was talking about was the overall war happening behind the scenes with BB's actions. That was what was motivating him.
Anonymous No.719804537 >>719804841
>>719789939
This guy gets it.
Show, don't tell.
The audience should see the transformation, it makes a better story.
Anonymous No.719804559 >>719804990
>>719803297
the AI is not the big bad?
Anonymous No.719804673 >>719805275
>>719774163
NTA but I do not remember the game ever mentioning SIGINT or Paramedic were those people, which part was this in?
Anonymous No.719804841
>>719804537
but thats not metal gear fans they want to be told everything
Anonymous No.719804859
>>719776497
That is correct by the way, while Japanese combines the L and R sound into one phonetic there is no hard L sound. I actually liked some of where they were going with Phantom Pain, I think if a better director got ahold of it or the drama behind the scenes were somehow managed the plot could have been much better, because it dovetails very nicely with the mechanism by which the Patriots use to hide their names.
Anonymous No.719804987
>>719781534
Yeah, but the ending on its own was really well delivered until Big Boss shows up.
Reminds me of Death Stranding where you're sent to incinerate that kid that's been helping you because it died or something (I don't really remember the details by now) and at first it's a really quiet somber moment really fitting the scene but few seconds later loud as fuck shitty music starts blasting making sure you can't take it seriously.

If Kojima didn't like the smell of his own farts so much, I'd assume he's just a massive troll who accidentally made it big and now just tries to clown on anyone who enjoys his shitty writing. But due to his enormous ego the sole conclusion left is that he's simply a dogshit writer that got big by accident that even if he somehow by pure accident makes a decent scene he will immediately find a way to fuck it up with some tone deaf bullshit.
Anonymous No.719804990 >>719805752
>>719804559
No. It's a machine. It's no more a villain than a Metal Gear is. Whoever's piloting it is the bad guy.
Anonymous No.719805161
It's hard to take any story, characterization or lore from MGS seriously when every subsequent game retcons the shit out of the one that came before it.
It's like comics, nothing means anything. Not death, not motives, not history
Anonymous No.719805235
>>719800452
I have played every single MGS including the Acid games on PSP and the GBC Metal Gear, MGS3 is the best in the series by far and is indeed a masterpiece.
Anonymous No.719805237
>>719781673
I wish there was more horse stuff from a first person perspective.
Anonymous No.719805275 >>719805598 >>719805710 >>719806493
>>719804673
SIGINT is introduced as Donald Anderson in MGS3
So anyone who played MGS1 knew
Para-medic being Dr. Clark is explained by Eva in MGS4
Anonymous No.719805372 >>719805625 >>719805848 >>719806569 >>719807217 >>719807612 >>719808164
I can’t believe barely any games use the trope of the boss fights being an organized collective of freaks. Even Kojima dropped it with the Phantom Pain and Death Stranding. Such an easy way to make the story more engaging.
Anonymous No.719805598 >>719806662
>>719805275
the fuck are you talking about? SIGINT and Paramedic's real identity wasn't revealed until MGS4
Anonymous No.719805625
>>719805372
It's just Sentai influence. You see it with the Ginyu Force in DBZ, for example. It's very Japanese.
Anonymous No.719805710 >>719805818 >>719806363 >>719806437 >>719806662 >>719806758
>>719805275
>SIGINT is introduced as Donald Anderson in MGS3
not true
at no point did he ever reveal his real name nor does his codec profile show that
he was retconned to be the same character the same time as Para-Medic was by that bitch EVA and she ruined the whole fucking franchise with that crap
Anonymous No.719805752 >>719806174
>>719804990
but who's piloting the AI's
Anonymous No.719805818
>>719805710
>Hobby:Basketball
Shhhheeeeeeiiiiiiit
Anonymous No.719805848 >>719805942 >>719806051 >>719806354 >>719806553
>>719805372
tne bosses in 3 baring the end fucking suck
Anonymous No.719805942
>>719805848
Ben was cool
Anonymous No.719805954
>>719769160
I forgive everything that happened in 4 because they let solid snake live in peace for a few months so he could chill with otacon for a bit
Anonymous No.719805997 >>719806246 >>719806250
>guy who spends the third game gleefully chatting about James Bond movies and The Great Escape, while seeming to have no real opinions on your mission to kill the Boss was actually the biggest Boss fanboy of them all
This is the worst retcon in the entire series.
Anonymous No.719806051
>>719805848
Fear and Fury were good, too. I like how you can poison Fear.
Anonymous No.719806174 >>719806385
>>719805752
Zero trained the AIs so Zero
Anonymous No.719806225
>>719800452
Yup, pretty much more people watched Big Saru play the game rather than them actually playing it. That guy used to be spammed here 15 years ago daily, he was basically the face of MGS3.
I think every genre has this shit. Like donguri with LE CUHRAZY Combo MAD and now everyone thinks action games just have to be exactly that or jarpig shit of "You don't have to play the video game to be a fan of it".
Anonymous No.719806246
>>719805997
He had more of a reaction towards Sokolov's death than whatever The Boss did lol
Anonymous No.719806250
>>719805997
Nah.
The fact that the og MSX Metal Gear wasn't the first metal gear is way worse
Anonymous No.719806354
>>719805848
The Fear was the only boss I didn't like desu.
Sorrow, Fury, the End and Boss were all good.
Anonymous No.719806363 >>719806437 >>719806523 >>719808525
>>719805710
anon....
Anonymous No.719806372
>>719773091
Is Miller to blame for Outer Heaven? He was the guy running the accounts and doing PR. Big Boss is just a giant manchild who doesn't know what's happening half of the time.
Anonymous No.719806385 >>719806676
>>719806174
zero?but His bed ridden?
Anonymous No.719806437
>>719805710
>>719806363
Fake fucking fan spotted.
Anonymous No.719806493
>>719805275
>SIGINT is introduced as Donald Anderson in MGS3
I admit I was only 15 when I first played it, but I must not have been paying attention when he first says it. That's cool, I would have had a completely different view of him when I played if I'd known at the time.
Anonymous No.719806523
>>719806363
doesn't say Donald Anderson so
Anonymous No.719806548
>>719773942
>realising upon playing the game again his code name is "zero" because his codec number has a zero in it
>Kojima tried to make a whole thing out of this in the following game
Can he just not?
Can't his real name have been Steve or something?
Anonymous No.719806553
>>719805848
>Ocelot is a fun first boss fight with cool hidden secrets
>The Pain is not difficult, just annoying
>The Fear just heals himself ad infinitum if you don't constantly hound him, you're supposed to know in advance that you can use the death pill trick or poisoned food
>The End is a great sniper fight, easily the best I've seen in vidya
>The Fury is fun but way too short and easy
>The Sorrow is a cutscene
>Volgin is tedious as fuck and not even difficult
>Shagohod is piss easy unless you're mentally retarded
>The Boss is only challenging if you want to do it non-lethal but not very much
6/10, MGS1 and MGS2 had better bosses overall
Anonymous No.719806569
>>719805372
It lend itself well to video games, for this reason it's too "video gamey" for movie games!
Anonymous No.719806662 >>719806830 >>719807319
>>719805598
>>719805710
Para-Medic talks about Snake's genes becoming a hot commodity in the future. Sigint talks about how technology is going to advance and in the future everyone will be the same. The signs were already there
Anonymous No.719806676 >>719806739
>>719806385
He gave the AIs the instructions that led to what they did before he went to sleep and at no point was there ever any outside influence between that time until Ocelot hijacked it so the anus is still on him
Anonymous No.719806739
>>719806676
anus?
Anonymous No.719806758 >>719807251
>>719805710
Para-Medic got into medicine from watching Frankenstein. What happened to Grey Fox? Think about it carefully.
Anonymous No.719806830 >>719807167 >>719807474 >>719809049 >>719809259
>>719806662
Still, it's a retcon from MGS3, because 2's implication was that the Patriots were some type of Illuminati secret movers of the world.
Anonymous No.719807167 >>719807402 >>719807828
>>719806830
>MGS2
>Characters talk about GW - an AI made to filter out information
>Colonel turns out to be AI the entire time
>Rose probably too
>The Wisemen's Committee consists of people that have been dead for a hundred years
Come on
Anonymous No.719807217 >>719807394
>>719805372
This is the one thing Metal Gear Rising has over the likes of Devil May Cry/Ninja Gaiden/Bayonetta. It’s fun to hear the crazy bullshit each member of Desperado spews
Anonymous No.719807251
>>719806758
it's all coming together now
Anonymous No.719807319 >>719808154
>>719806662
He does, but he speaks about it as a bystander, not an active participant instrumental in the groundwork of the new world. Him and Paramedic, not to mention Zero, do not lend themselves well to being the founders of a shadowy organization that controls the world. Everything they later do offscreen is just totally out of character from what we actually see.
Anonymous No.719807394 >>719807560
>>719807217
For sure. I was shocked by how many codec calls they recorded for that game, too. The whole cast of that game was fun to listen to.
Anonymous No.719807402
>>719807167
Indeed, they weren't a couple of young people from the 60s.
Anonymous No.719807474 >>719807665
>>719806830
yeah, they used to be.
The AI is just following the instructions and will of people that are long gone.
The president and many others thought it was a group of people thanks to the wise men's committee misinfo spread by the AI, it was nothing but a coverup of the real patriots. The whole game ends with the reveal of this "group" being dead for over 100 years, come on now
Anonymous No.719807560 >>719807691 >>719807838
>>719807394
They really fleshed out the post-MGS4 world with that, it's completely baffling. MGR was a better sequel to MGS2 than MGS4 ever was.
Anonymous No.719807612
>>719805372
That's kind of Megaman's entire deal. Admittedly, they don't flesh out the characters nearly as well.
Also Final Fight. Capcom in general are very good at this. Probably comes with being heavily involved in fighting games. Designing characters with a personality becomes second nature at that point.
Anonymous No.719807665
>>719807474
I like that the only acknowledgement of that in MGS4 was Snake complaining "yeah that was a load of bullshit" and then they moved on
Anonymous No.719807691 >>719808493
>>719807560
mgr did nothing you disingenuous cock sucker
Anonymous No.719807828 >>719808025 >>719808478
>>719807167
I loved the implication in 2 that the Patriots just kind of "took form". Like they're some egragore formed by notions of American patriotism and power.
Anonymous No.719807838
>>719807560
MGR was a good game but hell no it did not flesh out the world of MGS better than 4 did.
Anonymous No.719808025 >>719808264
>>719807828
wheres the gameplay in this game? it would be less then 4 is
Anonymous No.719808154 >>719809394
>>719807319
I actually don't remember if Snake's crew was kept in the dark about The Boss's mission just as him or not. Because if it's the former then you can reasonably assume they all got too upset about it just as Snake himself
Anonymous No.719808164
>>719805372
Ironically enough Bioshock 1 was good about this with Dr. Steinman and Sander Cohen.
Anonymous No.719808264
>>719808025
I don't know what you even mean by that.
Anonymous No.719808478
>>719807828
The patriots were working as intended, it only started spazzing out and became the monstrosity that it was in MGS4 when Emma uploaded the virus into GW
Anonymous No.719808493 >>719808661
>>719807691
What do you mean? Armstrong and Desperado and even Maverick themselves demonstrated that they needed The Patriots' war economy to survive. All the suppressed info and tech hoarded by The Patriots was immediately commoditized in the form of cyborg technology and MGs and UGs quickly became obsolete. Metal Gear literally became a marketing term in-universe with Excelsus. All of these were elements introduced in past games, they just elaborated and built on top of them.

In comparison, MGS4 just introduced a bunch of stuff like SOP and emotions and spent a lot of time exploring those, and if it's not that then you get retcons. The aftermath of MGS2 was not touched upon at all aside from Snake saying "Solidus was right all along". Then there's the whole can of worms with MGS3 being retrofitted into the lore.
Anonymous No.719808525 >>719810262
>>719806363
This reveals he joins ARPA, not that he and Donald Anderson from MGS1 are the same person
Anonymous No.719808661 >>719809320
>>719808493
you are so stupid no wonder you like mgr
Anonymous No.719809049 >>719809340
>>719806830
If you read the script for MGS2 it's got a bit about multiple AI and calls the one talking to Raiden at the end of the game JFK. That said that retard talking about all the "signs" that the 3 cast were going to be the Patriot is retard.
Anonymous No.719809259
>>719806830
you keep talking about the philosophers there the illuminati movers
Anonymous No.719809320 >>719809694
>>719808661
Convincing argument retardbro, next you're going to make fun of me for using an MGSV image
Anonymous No.719809340
>>719809049
>the "signs" that the 3 cast were going to be the Patriot
I never said that. I said that there are signs Para-Medic is Dr. Clark and Sigint is Donald Anderson
Anonymous No.719809394 >>719810079
>>719808154
Yeah, I can understand them being upset. I'm upset all the time, if I saw some grave injustice I might be moved to action. But that wouldn't make me uniquely talented enough to lay the groundwork for a clandestine organization that eventually controls the planet. I could foresee them becoming political ideologues in a position of leadership, but they needed to do a lot more exposition to show how these people eventually became absolute tyrants and how.

Basically, what I mean to say is that while BB's eventual heel turn is not as fleshed out as it should be, his later position as it relates to the others is more believable. He eventually becomes a petty warlord intent on rebelling against the new world order of the fractured Patriots. But the others don't end up in positions that really suit where we saw them as of MGS3's ending.
Anonymous No.719809694 >>719810109
>>719809320
I dont need to make fun of anyone no one here other then you gives a flying fuck about mgr's shit story but ofc you like it cause its a stagnation side move where nothing really happens thats why you post V
it just shows me your one of these new PC players that started at R or V and wants to flap his gums about nothing
Anonymous No.719810079 >>719810296 >>719810937
>>719809394
Big Boss has three games to show us how exactly he became the villain. Zero is a pretty clear case too: The Boss was his comrade, the operation gave him a lot of money, perhaps some power and a thirst for revenge against the government that orchestrated the whole thing. Para-Medic and Sigint aren't that well explained so you just have to assume they experienced the same level of grief and hatred which corrupted them. At any rate all I want to say is that it's not as implausible as it might seem
Anonymous No.719810109 >>719810416
>>719809694
Anon you can just say "I didn't play Metal Gear Rising and I am mad that it's popular", you don't need to trip over all that seething and sharting. Be rest assured that I played it before it got popular back when it first came out, along with the rest of the series so I can talk about the games objectively instead of just being angry for no reason, and in fact I've been doing just that for half of this thread.
Anonymous No.719810262
>>719808525
You have no media literacy anon
Anonymous No.719810296
>>719810079
Zero is not a clear case, the games do not sell the relationship between him and the Boss enough to make that work. Likewise even if it did it doesn't show him or develop him in later games as the type of person who would be driven that far. It may not be completely implausible, but it is completely retarded which is why it doesn't work.
Anonymous No.719810416 >>719811473
>>719810109
oh wow look
Anonymous No.719810937 >>719811064 >>719811439
>>719810079
By all appearances Zero was a by-the-book military commander. He didn't show any acumen in organizational awareness or know-how as it relates to building a network of clandestine operatives and technology. He exists in a hierarchy with clear rules and commitments. It's just not believable that a random commander, disillusioned with his participation in espionage, would lay the groundwork for a new world order. It's believable that he would adopt a similar role as relates to his skillset, e.g. serving as a commander in further operations, but certainly not as an Illuminati member pulling strings. He just doesn't lend himself well to that archetype.

The same is true of both SIGINT and Paramedic. By all rights they seem to be intelligent and adept in their own fields, but certainly they do not show the capability to direct efforts in such a way to put together a shadowy organization behind the scenes. I could see them being INVOLVED in the process, but the leaders? It stretches disbelief, that's all I'm saying.
Anonymous No.719811064 >>719811318
>>719810937
they stole like 10tril dolla they can do fucking anything in game
Anonymous No.719811294
Imagine paying attention to the plot instead of playing the Japanese game, kek
Anonymous No.719811318 >>719811441
>>719811064
It was 50 billion dollars. And money doesn't give you skills. It can help you acquire people that do have skills, but it doesn't give you the capability to direct them in such a way that you set up a new world order. Do you seriously believe that if someone gave you a trillion dollars right now that you would be adept enough to direct it in such a way to set up an Illuminati? Would you want to, even if you had that money? It's not believable anon.
Anonymous No.719811439 >>719811749
>>719810937
>He didn't show any acumen in organizational awareness or know-how as it relates to building a network of clandestine operatives and technology
He created the FOX unit and personally hired everyone there, including Para-Medic and Sigint
>I could see them being INVOLVED in the process, but the leaders?
I always assumed the Patriots were basically "Zero and friends". Specifically because we don't know what their roles were in that organisation. Well, at least Sigint became a DARPA chief with his expertise in computers
Anonymous No.719811441 >>719811749
>>719811318
50bil after ww2 I am sure they could put there stamp on everything
Anonymous No.719811473
>>719810416
>opera
xister...
Anonymous No.719811749 >>719811890
>>719811439
>He created the FOX unit and personally hired everyone there, including Para-Medic and Sigint
As a member of a military organization yes. I have personally created teams in my company and hand-picked people to work in roles, that doesn't qualify me to lead the Illuminati. If I had 50 billion dollars I would not be able to do that.

>I always assumed the Patriots were basically "Zero and friends". Specifically because we don't know what their roles were in that organisation. Well, at least Sigint became a DARPA chief with his expertise in computers
I believe that is how it started, but eventually they drifted to be leaders themselves, rather like the Philosophers that preceded them.

>>719811441
US GDP in 1964 was $684 billion. They're not going to be setting up a secret organization to control the entire planet with just money.
Anonymous No.719811890 >>719812213
>>719811749
>If I had 50 billion dollars I would not be able to do that
Well, that's just a (You) problem honestly. I bet you don't get to meet the President ever while Zero did that at least once
Anonymous No.719812213
>>719811890
No, but if I talked to LBJ I wouldn't consider that an accomplishment