Thread 2134387

Vic 3:
>Boot up game
>Play Cambodia
>Click on research
>Choose Stock exchange tech
>Takes 38 months to research
>Congrats, Cambodia has a stock exchange by 1840
>End serfdom by the 1850s
>Surpass European GDP per capita by the 1880s

Vic 2:
>Boot up game
>Play Cambodia
>Click on research
>Realize you can't research yet because you need to modernise first
>Cambodia has low literacy so it takes until about the 1870s to modernise
>Now you can start researching stock exchange

>>2134387 (OP)
Vic 2 is clearly implying some nations are better than other because they are less ignorant, that is problematic nowadays sweety.

Shut up niggo, niggie

>>2134387 (OP)
'Westernising' is eurocentric mechanic chud. It never happened.

>>2134510
Why didn't all of Africa and Asia migrate to Europe in Victoria 2 like in Victoria 3 and real life?

>>2134510
Where in the OP is "westernising" mentioned?

>>2134387 (OP)
Vic 2:
>Stock Exchange
>Tax Efficiency: +5%
>Tax Efficiency: +1% x3 in Inventions
Vic 3:
>Stock Exchange
>+10% Market access price impact

>>2134564
What's wrong with that?

>>2135410
Nothing. OP's complain is ridiculous, because tech research isn't a building, but an abstraction.

>>2135481
OP's complaint is that Cambodia shouldn't be equal to the western so quickly due to it
s historic position in the 19th century

>>2135483
OP is a dumb faggot. In Victoria 2, technology costs 1,890,000 points, spread across 150 techs, while each country can generate 2,874,375 points max.

Victoria 3 has 198, with most countries starting with 20-30. Era I are all pre-1836 techs. Stock Exchange is an Era I tech. 2,135,000 Total points of research are needed. Era I costs 285,000, so you can exclude them, for European countries, anyway. With 100% literacy the universities will provide you with 1,040,000 points throughout the game.

Are you starting to see the difference between research approaches here? Why Victoria 2 might need staggering, but 3 simply doesn't? No "westernization" research points to abuse making a backwards shithole into a super-pooper here, buddy. Allegations of Victoria 3 non-Europeans being able to catch up quickly are straight up fucking lies. Try launching a game as Madagascar, which starts with only 3 techs researched. Then shut your stupid fucking mouth.

>>2135508
Now guess which game allows you to easily surpass the gdp per capita of the US in 1855 as fucking Cambodia.

>>2135483
This argument starts and ends with Eurocentric racism.

Why should Cambodia not even have access to the tech tree? Culture is not linear.

Cambodia was a long existing highly developed and complex society. Explicitly making it inferior to Western nations is nothing more than racism.

>>2134387 (OP)
Vic2 was glazing western nations.
Vic3 is more realistic.

>>2135668
turd world cope

>>2135667
Because brown people are inferior to Europeans.

>>2135709
But Japanese would beat white people at their own game.

>>2135717
>only country on earth to be nuked, not once but twice
>american vassal state for almost a century
>buckbroken by america in the 1850s. forced to open its doors.
>highest suicide rates in the world
>degenerate anime culture
they are inferior. they are certainly the best in asia, but inferior to whites.

>>2135726
>>degenerate anime culture
have you seen what white nations have been producing for the last decades?

>>2135726
>only country on earth to be nuked, not once but twice
Because a) the US feared the proper invasion would be too costly; b) they really didn't want the USSR to get inside Japan; c) they needed to scare Soviets in case they would get any ideas in Western Europe.
>american vassal state for almost a century
>buckbroken by america in the 1850s. forced to open its doors.
The U.S. themselves were a mere colony for more than a century.
>highest suicide rates in the world
Not according to the data, I believe it is only 17th or so, with the U.S. actually not so far behind. Interestingly, it is Koreans who are among the leaders. Are you sure you didn't mix things up?
>degenerate anime culture
Well, for me Japan is a country of Akutagawa and Abe, of Kurosawa and Kobayashi. If you primarily associate Japan with anime it speaks not about Japanese culture, but about your taste and knowledge.

>>2135747
>Are you sure you didn't mix things up?
they all look the same to me

>>2134387 (OP)
Oh wow, being an undeveloped stone age shithole until Europeans came along to unfuck the non-existent civilization takes some time to deal with? Wow, what a story, anon!

>>2134555
I don't think you have reading comprehension.

>>2134387 (OP)
And how it was in Vic1?

>>2134387 (OP)
Westernization is such a good concept in this game. The nations that are "uncivilized" do not have any of the prior institutions to make the basic pillars of a modern society of that time. Uncivilized is not a good term since it incorporates both tribal africa (which would be correct on its own) but also japan, china, siam, ect. The actual mechanic itself though represents their progress towards being able to even start progressing as a modern nation.

HOI4
>Boot up game
>Play Ethiopia
>Have two research slots
>Pick early plane and tank
>in 120 days a subsaharian country in 1938 can domestically produce airplanes and tanks

>>2136033
if you can produce a motor then you can produce a plane or tank

>>2136034
Not really, because you have to produce a motor powerful enough.

>>2136045
Not necessary to produce them yourself.
You can wait for Italian invasion and repurpose the engines of Moto Guzzi and Benelli bikes that they brought along.

EU3 did it right.

>>2134387 (OP)
So vic 3 is an arcade game?

>>2135668
1/10

>>2135717
In what timeline? They were backwards until forceably enlightened in 1860 by americans.

Is there any downside to letting GB, France etc. invest in my country? Seems like an easy way to build up your GDP.

>>2135667
Cambodians ARE inferior thoughbeit

>>2136152
I wouldn't give it to GB since you will have a really difficult time getting those buildings back but if you can force nationalize them later through war sure, it lets you get more jobs faster at the cost of your capitalists/industrialist IG and your reinvestment pool

>>2136112
Yes.

>>2134387 (OP)
>boot up vicky2
>load save
>bandjarese south borneo defaults!

>>2136033
I just did this and I was producing 1 tank a month
that's not unrealistic

Victoria 3 is to strategy games what sissy hypno is to sleep. It's a psyop designed to destroy the minds of white men.

>>2147270
>draw a girl
>call it a man

>>2134387 (OP)
The gameplay is more fun when it is not set in reality :)

>>2136008
I agree that unrecognised is a good concept, but there needs to be a way to properly represent uncivilized countries. Especially since all unrecognised countries are tiny, dense, autocratic shitholes with authority up the ass, they can bruteforce their way into sapience with decrees

>>2135541
>>2135736
The US is not very good in Vic 2 or 3 like you seem to think. In Vic2 they are barely a GP. In Vic 3 they are again barely a GP and if it wasnt for certain bonuses they get they would be underwhelming.
That being said GDP per capita isnt a super important metric in the game. Its a signal of growth and nothing more. Vic 3 is Polandball Sims. The more happy your sims are in your country the more money you make. Vic 2 doesnt have the same pop mechanics or market. The two games end in similarity almost immediately after you begin. Might as well call Vic 2 Crusader Kings Victoria and Vic 3 Anno Sims Victoria.

>>2152626
>yea its true that the game's simulation is shit, is closer to being pure fantasy than historical and not even mods can fix it but that's not important for a game being advertised as being in a historical setting
?

>>2135736
In my opinion, the problem is the ridiculously low GDP these countries have by 1868.
No wonder you have higher GDP per capita, a small country that performs reasonably well (Which is easy in the hands of a mediocre player) would surpass most superpowers (See real Luxembourg).
I played as Ethopia recently and I didn't catch up in tech but I was able to get a GDP bigger than some European powers. GDP per capita was a bit shite because I had tons of Africans breeding.

>>2159415
The problem is that techs don't boost subsistence farms which makes no sense since having access to better tools and mechanization should boost the output of the average farmer too by a lot.

>>2134387 (OP)
>Modify vic 2 files so a reactionary party can genocide at the beginning of the game
>Modify the genocide event so it triggers each month
Nice
No more undesirable pops

>>2134387 (OP)
In VIc 2 you can tech up way faster though because research bonus from conquering is so OP. Have any of you faggots even played the game?

>>2135736
Yeah it's way easier to raise GDP per capita as a small country than a huge one. Why is that surprising?

>random abbo tribe has tens of thousands of people with a literacy rate in the double digits
>in real life its less than ten thousand and they're all illiterate because everyone decided it was rude for the government to educate them

>>2161402
vic3 HAD mods for that, but they kept getting deleted.
Best we have now is modifying homelands, which isn't really necessary anymore as you can force assimilate in homelands now.
Takes fucking long though, took me the like 50 years to make posen 86% german.

>>2135736
anon... duh hur?

>>2134439
Actually Victoria 3 is implying that by making it so easy to surpass industrial & technological powerhouses (because then it must be an inherent quality of the populations that don't simply chose to progress, unlike Victoria 2 in which it is purely due to socioeconomic factors).

>boot up stellaris
>Don-Gon vlorians have 2 habitable planets in their system
>they unlock FTL drives in a decade
>mfw squig shits are depicted on the same level as haldonians

>Vic 2:
>Boot up game
>I'm really gonna get it going this time, here we go
>Get frustrated with not knowing anything, lose interest and quit almost immediately
I've done this at least 6 times now, on average once a year. Next year is the one, I can feel it.

>>2166192
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AkfbxC68EVk

>>2135667
Because Victoria 2 is part of the period of history where white people proved they had the best culture on earth.

>>2168071
yeah, HAD.

>>2164237
>>2167587
This.

lol memegame2 buffoons be like
>in the year 1836, nestled between the marshy bogs of brandenburg and the potato fields of poznań, a forgotten people stirred. the snerbs of cootbus, long mocked by german officials for speaking in suspiciously bird-like consonant clusters, decided it was time to reassert their ancient glory. led by the charismatic poet-statesman vladko błźźć, they proclaimed the free wendish republic of lusato-gorska. their national focus was immediately set to encourage intellectuals, despite having a literacy rate of 4% and half the population thinking books were a prussian trick.
>while the prussians laughed, the snerbs quietly began mobilizing. tuchel's kooshbeans sent grain and ink (grain becomes a +1% pop growth modifier in cootbus), while the coastal kosliners of kolbork trained a ragtag navy composed entirely of fishing boats and angry grandmothers (irregulars with naval transport tech 0). with militancy rising from constant german assimilation policies (+0.05 militancy/month for non-accepted culture), consciousness hit 8.5 and a liberal revolution event chain fired.
>when the revolts of 1848 erupted, the wends launched operation harsh whisper, a lightning-fast raid on a poorly defended postal depot in berlin. using their single artillery unit and four brigades of farmer rebels with -30% organization penalty, they managed to occupy a single state before attrition kicked in. still, the ai prussia, distracted by a danish incursion into schleswig, accepted the white peace. miraculously, the treaty of snerbawitz was signed: the snerbs gained semi-autonomy (prussia loses core on cootbus), control of their alphabet and exclusive rights to export pickled cabbage (local cootbus RGOs shift to fruit and grain, +20% export value).
> by 1865, the snerbs had two techs researched, a literacy rate of 9%, and one diplomat stuck in naples. glorious.

>>2134387 (OP)
> nooo, knowing the outcome of a battle in ck3 is le bad!!!
>meanwhile in memegame2:
>hmm yes, my 15 brigades of irregulars with zero org, no general, and 70% supply penalty will surely win against the enemy’s fortified stack of guards, hussars, artillery, and a literal god-tier general with 6 attack, in mountains, during winter. initiate charge.
>“you have won the battle of shneerbkrogg.”
>...what??
>“enemy general got event: horse steps on musket, suffers -50% combat ability”
>“your army got +10 dig-in bonus from standing still for 5 days in a potato field”
>“militant farmers from cootbus joined the battle out of spite”
>“enemy diverted 3 divisions to suppress a newspaper in danzig mid-fight”
>glorbo-slavia prevails.

>>2134387 (OP)
>nooo, eu4 development is le bad!!!
>meanwhile in memegame2:
>hmm yes, i will click this "encourage clergymen" button for 40 consecutive years until 2% of my goat-herding population in the tatras decides education is real
>literacy rises from 4.2% to 4.3%
>"you can now research "Freedom of Trade'"
>taxes increase by 0.02%
>factory still bankrupt
>polish rebels rise up anyway
>cootbus now has 20% intellectuals, 0 factories, 3% unemployment, and a cement shortage
>but hey, at least i can build a railroad through a swamp for prestige
>development? no thanks, i prefer waiting 8 years for bureaucrats to invent punctuation

>>2134387 (OP)
>nooo, game with no pops is le bad!!!
>meanwhile in memegame2: ah yes, my 4,297 glorbo-slavic animist reactionary clerks in lower cootbus are demanding access to state-subsidized shoelaces
>meanwhile, 1,003 liberal kooshbean craftsmen in upper tuchel are refusing to work until the government enacts acceptable minimum kneepad standards
>13 unemployed göralski labourers in kolbork convert to atheism, then die of starvation, then respawn as jacobin rebels
>one aristocrat in eastern glorbograd becomes a socialist after reading a pamphlet about hats
>a group of 2,279 militant pacifists in cootbus organize a violent uprising because they oppose violence too hard
>the national sport of cootbus is now “pop promotion watching”
>everyone claps when a farmer becomes a clerk, only to demote again due to alcohol shortage
>prestige +5 for surviving the event chain: “glorbo-slavic shoelace riots of 1863”
>event choice:
>fund domestic lace industry (-5000£, +0.01 militancy in all lace-producing pops)
>import foreign shoes (+10 infamy, -2 prestige)
>ignore them (instantly spawns 18k glorbo reactionaries led by general snorbislav with 1 attack, 9 maneuver)
>what a glorious simulation

>>2177222
>>2177224
>>2177225
>>2177229
Actual mental illness, ywnbaw

>>2177222
>the snerbs of cootbus

ok that one got me

>>2177225
>play EU4
>Prussia never forms
>Russia always gets conquered (mostly by poles and swedes)
>PLC is always strong, centralized, and manages to expand in every direction
>HRE almost always ends up being way more centralized than it could plausably have been
>the HRE's borders tend to expand despite not really ever doing that irl during the game's time frame, since the AI or the player can just add provinces to the HRE through a single button click
>HRE never gets dissolved
>reformation never makes any sense
>French revolution never happens
>colonies almost never break free
>India never gets colonized
>Africa fully colonized by 1700s
>Japan always unifies by the mid 1600s
>the enlightenment and the renaissance spreads to all parts of the world despite these being eruopean institutions that NEVER reached asia, especially not the far east
>manpower makes no sense, you can magically just pop out an army anywhere you own a province using your magical quantum manpower that is at every place at the same time until you raise them
>no concept of strategic resources
>trade is a circular wash trading scheme
what a wonderful historical game

>>2177229
>>the national sport of cootbus is now “pop promotion watching”
>>everyone claps when a farmer becomes a clerk, only to demote again due to alcohol shortage
okay I lol'd

>play vic 2
> today is going to be different, am going to seek strength in numb---
>Whoops I genocided da jus and all other non-european again

youtube.com/watch?v=SYCP71qcYZw

>>2134510
Why does everyone dress like us? They didn't even have to do it. It was completely unrelated.

Vic 1: What if population affected a country's ability to perform diplomacy and warfare?
Vic 2: What if the focus was more on diplomacy and warfare than population and economy?
Vic 3: What if population and economy was the primary factor enabling diplomacy and warfare?

Vic 2 and 3 experiments on the formula of 1 with automating different mechanics and expanding opposite mechanics. Its rather understandable that Vic 3 would be worse than 1 and 2 when the focus is not on warfare. Vic 1 was pretty bad with pops also because of the manual promotion. Vic 2 struck the perfect balance. They just need to update Vic 2.

Does anyone have hopes for Gilded Destiny?

>>2134387 (OP)
does byzantium being salvagable in 1444 in EU4 also offend you? Or 1399 in EU3 3?

>>2181628
https://youtu.be/-6Wu0Q7x5D0
Here's a historically accurate game for you to play, railroadtard

>>2134387 (OP)
>Realize you can't research yet because you need to modernise first
>Said "modernization" is just you beating up other ooga boogas for research points

>>2185374
I do but they're way down after they announced that they'll be delaying it till sometime next year

>>2134387 (OP)
>>Cambodia has low literacy so it takes until about the 1870s to modernise
Then he got 40 or so years to play before the economy melts down

>>2136033
HOI4's industry system feels so gamey because it's balanced around attrition losses simply evaporating all materiel in low-supply/rough terrain, when most of the time things could be unusable in combat but likely to be repaired unless genuinely destroyed or lost behind enemy lines. The green factories produce brand-new weapons out of mined raw materials because they can't balance the attrition mechanic to represent two wildly different scenarios:
>Ethiopia: buys 100,000 1870s-era rifles in 1890, they're the backbone of the army through several major wars and guerrilla insurgencies until the 70,000 surviving examples are sold as surplus in 1990
>Germany: makes 100,000 1930s-era rifles a month, loses 125,000 a month in combat

Even as mid-tier nations, the attrition mechanic is so punishing that it makes little sense to use the existing international market (more of a faction-sharing system introduced as a DLC afterthought), rather than at least control the supply of materiel with your own factories to have some ability to maintain specialty units. Realistically there'd be different kinds of industrial factories, and a huge part would be put into smaller-scale industry like maintenance and ammunition.

>>2134387 (OP)
>nooo, trade in eu4 is le bad!!!
>meanwhile in memegame2:
>ah yes, 12 kooshbean capitalists in kolbork have invested 4,000£ into a canned air factory that requires sulphur, tin, and dignity.. none of which exist within 2,000km
>prussia signs a trade agreement with austria and now your liquor factory shuts down due to "indirect tariff aura"
>meanwhile the local capitalists in cootbus have opened a luxury hat factory, but the hats require silk, which requires dye, which requires opium wars, which requires prestige, which requires romanticism
>but now i can’t import coffee because france has 100 prestige and i only have 97, so now 16,000 pops in cootbus are alcoholic again
>thankfully, i signed a trade agreement with brazil for rubber, but i can’t use it until 1890, when someone invents "thinking about tires"
>ffd the national economy is in total collapse because cootbus can’t import enough whale oil to keep the wiendiszt lightbulb factory running, and now 12,000 snerb reactionary craftsmen are demanding the annexation of iceland.
>meanwhile the price of tea drops by 0.4%, so the snerb middle class collapses into a frenzy and the monarchy falls in a crisis over spice access
>a boat full of clippers filled with precious metals sinks off the coast of west africa, causing the kolbork fart canning industry to shut down and 9,000 pops to instantly migrate to paraguay

>>2134387 (OP)
>nooo, gov types in ck2 are le the same!!!
>meanwhile in memegame2:
>ah yes, every government in the world from absolute monarchies to anarcho-liberal postal co-ops functions entirely through upper house percentage bar politics, where the fate of nations hinges on whether 12% of snerb clerks in lower cootbus suddenly feel like supporting the wiendiszt anarcho-syndicalist hat tax bill.
>meanwhile, every four months, a bureaucratic revolution replaces your government with a carbon copy of itself, except now it has -10% farming efficiency due to ideological disillusionment.
>glorious general snurbek of the snerbs stages a coup, overthrows the monarchy, installs a military junta... and immediately has to debate upper house reform percentages again because the fascists in cootbus want free shoelaces for soldiers.
>every ideology is represented, but the only one that matters is whatever lets me pass “good school act” so the góralskis finally stop dying of illiteracy in peace.
>event fires: “wiendiszt constitutional crisis”
>king becomes a president
>resident becomes a king
>nothing changes
>snerbs still angry
>+2 consciousness in all pops named stanislav

>>2134387 (OP)
memegame2 niggas be like:
>global event triggered: “mildly apocalyptic winter breeze”
>effect: -55% crop yield, -10% militancy due to snowfall blocking newspapers
>usa’s economy collapsed after kansas froze and all yankee farmers became unemployed poets
>china responded by building five opium tea houses in tibet, hoping to westernize
>meanwhile global pop militancy rose by +1.4 after frozen beer supplies triggered a world depression in all provinces producing hops. the uk responded by blockading iceland for not exporting warm air
>sorbian reactionary rebels demanded the sun to return
>unhappy kashubian pops attempted to “migrate to somewhere less cold” and all died in denmark
>artisans in tuchel invented gloves. prestige +2
>event fired: “the long chill of 1856”
>event choice:
>1. subsidize hot soup (requires tin, coal, and a little bit of manure)
>2. encourage cultural hibernation (-50% consciousness in all pops named slawomir)
>3. do nothing (demote all pops to fuel)
>ai russia chose the third option

>>2134387 (OP)
memegame2 niggas be like:
>why yes, i did start as liechtenstein and spent 11 in-game years justifying a casus belli on switzerland so i could puppet them and get access to 0.3 coal per day, which i then used to fund a single luxury furniture factory in bolzano staffed entirely by unemployed austrian clergymen who i first converted to artisans through six separate national focuses and an educational campaign called “chairs for christ.”
>next, i personally mapped out every pop's consciousness threshold using excel, then created a pop oscillation loop where the same 5,000 tyrolean farmers bounced between clerks and craftsmen depending on the moon phase and unemployment rate in galicia-lodomeria. every week, i’d hold a parliamentary event just to lower their militancy by 0.02 so the artisan pipeline wouldn’t snap.
>i then triggered the “social unrest over mahogany varnish” event chain, which let me manually spark a rebellion, lose to it on purpose, and install a reactionary monarchy just to unlock the +0.1 furniture efficiency modifier tied to a secret prestige threshold only known to 5 inactive german victubers
>did it collapse my economy and turn 86% of my population into catatonic opium addicts who only speak in upholstery terminology? yes. did my silesian craftsmen migrate to guatemala and build a rococo cement cathedral shaped like a chaise longue? also yes.
>ut now i make 4.7 luxury chairs a day. the british offered me a defensive alliance to protect the flow of rococo goods into canada
>event fired: “european admiration of tasteful seating” prestige +15, pop attraction to jingoism +7%
>after a bit of consolidating, i formed großgermaniums in the year 1837 using a totally legitimate decision unlocked by having:
>prestige mana over 800
>control of vienna, zurich, and a single parisian boutique
>vgh, my vicky2 campaign is now eligible for academic citation and i’m submitting it to /v2g/ for smoothies to glaze over

>>2134387 (OP)
rimworld simulates pops and logistics far more detailed than memegame2 could ever hope to
and no, it's not even close.
in rimworld, your cook can’t make lavish meals because the hauler pawn got food poisoning and didn’t bring rice from the fields, construction stalls because the only builder lost a leg over your own booby trap, beer production booms after a good harvest and boosts colony mood and a single solar flare can wipe out your freezer stockpile, forcing an emergency butchering and cooking marathon before everything rots. every resource has to move through pops and workstations in the right order. cotton from the fields to the loom to make cloth, then to the tailor bench for jackets before winter and any break in that chain, whether from a blight, a tantrum, or a cougar eating your farmer, cascades through the entire economy.

meanwhile in memegame2... your 200k "pops" can only cultivate a single resource per an entire province, 200,000 coal miners in yorkshire can instantly supply a furniture factory in egypt without a single ship leaving the port, grain from siberia teleports into paris bakeries without passing through a single market, railways instantly boost every industry’s output without requiring an ounce of coal or steel to maintain them, because trains (if they exist at all) in memegame2 apparently run on black voodoo. your artillery factory in the sahara will run fine forever despite no local iron or coal because the magic world market fairy™ teleports in infinite inputs as long as you’ve got cash and unemployed irish laborers will happily sit in dublin starving instead of migrating to your bustling, empty farms just in the next province. the economy isn’t a living system, it’s a giant invisible vending machine in the sky where all goods appear and vanish without transport, storage, or decay, making your whole PhD in Economics shtick more of a spreadsheet LARP rather than a functioning simulation.

>>2136008
>ncivilized is not a good term since it incorporates both tribal africa (which would be correct on its own) but also japan, china, siam, ect.
That's why Japan and China start with most of their westernization bar filled up

>>2134387 (OP)
ah yes, the beautiful world of memegame2 logistics and population system where pops don’t actually need housing, sanitation, or even fresh water, you can cram ten million people into Faiyum oasis with no slums, no epidemics, no infrastructure stress, and the only thing they complain about is that they can’t buy enough fancy hats off the sky vending machine. 100,000 italian farmers will happily migrate to the Yukon to work as lumberjacks in -40°C because there is "trinket pensions” while railroads happily work without coal, steel, maintenance crews, or spare parts, as if locomotives were perpetual motion machines. meanwhile, food is infinite, famine is impossible, and nobody ever cares about seasons, harvests, or distribution.. a wheat farmer in Kiev produces the same daily trickle of grain in winter as in summer, and all of it vanishes into a global stockpile that’s shared between Peru and Prussia like some kind of planetary fridge. And of course, your nation’s army can keep fighting world wars forever as long as you have canned food and small arms in the global ether, because apparently soldiers don’t need horses, coal, or boots.. they're built like ikea flat-packs. just eat your tinned spam, grab a rifle, and march across Siberia.

it's a game about running a 19th-century empire powered by ghost trains, ikea regiments, and astral pops summoning grain from pocket dimensions

>>2152626
>In Vic2 they are barely a GP.
and if left alone by late game they have some of the strongest industry

>>2134387 (OP)
meanwhile politics are just as deranged as the economy, instead of grubby backroom deals, patronage, or riots in the streets, political life is reduced to pops rolling dice in the background and “voting” into existence massive ideological swings overnight. one week, your peasants are docile monarchists tending fields, the next, half the country has spontaneously become Jacobin revolutionaries. whole swathes of the population flip-flop ideology overnight, as if every farmer in Prussia read the same newspaper and collectively decided, “ja, socialism time”. Political parties themselves are cartoon caricatures, the conservatives forbid your factories from expanding because “muh interventionism” even if unemployment is sky-high, while laissez-faire liberals somehow prevent you from subsidizing a rifle factory during wartime, because the sacred invisible hand must decide whether your army gets bullets.

reforms are equally absurd. you can’t just pass laws through parliament or a monarch’s decree, no, you must wait until your pops reach exactly 7.8% “consciousness” and demand healthcare, at which point you press a single button and magically every doctor in your country agrees to invent socialized medicine overnight. political movements don’t march, strike, or riot. they just add modifiers to your reform chance. a revolutionary communist uprising doesn’t seize factories or rally discontent workers. instead, thousands of rebel brigades spawn out of thin air across your provinces like angry pokemon, completely ignoring supply, politics, or local leadership. your monarch or parliament can be “reactionary” but they never actually react, they just sit in a tooltip until you click “pass reform"

politics in memegame2 isn’t about factions, patronage, or institutions, no, it’s basically a slot machine where pops spit out ideologies, and you pray the numbers line up so you can pass “good health care” before your empire explodes.

>>2198629
>meanwhile in memegame2... your 200k "pops" can only cultivate a single resource per an entire province
Okay and how does that compare to EU4 where resources don't even exist?

ah yes, the wonderful world of memegame2 “simulation” where pops don’t need roofs, streets, or sewers, because apparently every italian peasant is a self-sustaining hologram who can live in the Sahara without drinking water, and their only concern in life is whether they still have access to luxury toothpicks. Farmers don’t even farm they’re just wheat-shaped fountains, producing the same trickle of grain every single day, year-round, like some kind of eternal bread sprinkler, and every kernel vanishes into the great planetary food depot. Railroads spring from the ground fully formed like mushrooms, never breaking down, never needing engineers, fuel, or repairs, just click "build railroad" and congratulations you’ve just created an everlasting ghost train network that will boost the productivity of the work-from-home factory workers without burning a single lump of coal. You can even run a steel industry in an inland state far from coal and iron mining province because the Sky Vending Machine™ can simply just beam the inputs straight to the factory doorstep. And then there’s the military where armies don’t need horses, fodder, or logistics trains, just 0.15 worth of small arms and 0.10 canned food and voilà, instant Napoleonic Lego Brigade ready to fight through Siberian winters indefinitely as long as the global fridge doesn’t run out of sardines and the HQ doesn't stop teleporting reinforcements to the Front lines through Quantum Entanglement

in conclusion, memegame2 is less a 19th-century simulator and more a steampunk themepark where pops are quantum homunculi who require no shelter or sanitation, railways are perpetual-motion hyperspace conduits immune to entropy, grain fields behave like hydrogen fusion reactors, producing caloric output in perfect disregard for planetary axial tilt or seasonal variation, all glued together by the Cosmic Vending Machine™ that hurls all goods from the Sky to the consumers below without thermodynamic loss

>>2134387 (OP)
Behold, the wondrous realm of memegame2 where the nations of the earth were governed not by bread, nor by water, nor by habitation, but by the holy balance of fancy clothes and tinned meat. verily, ten millions dwelleth in the desert, and ten millions more in the icy wastes, and yet there is neither famine, nor plague, nor the cry of the homeless.
And lo, the harvest cometh not by season, nor by the sweat of the plowman’s brow, but is conjured daily, winter and summer alike, into the great celestial storehouse, which is shared betwixt Persia and Prussia as though it were a single pantry. and famine was no more, neither was scarcity known among them, for their wheat was eternal and their larders without rot.
And behold, the chariots of iron, which men call railroads, moved swiftly across the land, and they consumed no coal, nor steel, nor the labor of repairmen, but did run forever as unto Leviathan, whose strength faileth not. and their engines were not bound by rust nor time, but were perpetual as the sun and the moon.
And the armies of the nations were fashioned as if from the dust of the earth, for whosoever did gather small arms and canned fish, the lord of memegame2 did breathe upon them, and they arose as regiments, full and mighty, needing neither boots nor horses, nor powder, nor wagons, but only the sacred sardines and the rifles and they march through the wilderness even unto the frozen wastes, and they perished not, for their feet were of iron and their bellies were of tin.
And the pops of the earth cared not for housing, nor for sewers, nor for the pestilence that walketh in darkness, for these things were not known unto them. their only lamentation was that the supply of top hats and fine wardrobes was made scarce, and great was their mourning.

Thus was the world of memegame2 upheld, not by reason, nor by labor, but by ghostly chariots of steel, celestial granaries, and the endless desire of men for fancy garments.

>>2134387 (OP)
>memegame2 buffoons be like:
>global event triggered: “great cabbage blight of 1872”
effect: -30% food supply in all provinces producing cabbage, +20% militancy among pops with “diet: cabbage” trait
>ai austria immediately banned sauerkraut, prestige -5, militancy +6
>ottomans responded by importing 400,000 barrels of greek yogurt, causing global dairy prices to collapse
>event fired in central europe: “hungry slavs”
>effect:
>sorbian pops in cootbus formed the cabbage restoration movement, demanding +100% cabbage rations
>kashubians rioted in gdansk after cabbage soup was replaced with herring broth
>rusyn peasants declared independence under the banner “holy fermented leaf of mukachevo” but were immediately conquered by hungary
>event choice:
>1. subsidize cabbage festivals (costs 50000 grain and 1 prestige)
>2. blame slawomir (all pops named slawomir become reactionary)
>3. do nothing (demote all pops to livestock)
>ai prussia picked option 3
>result: 24,000 sorbs demoted overnight into “strategic sauerkraut reserves”

>>2134387 (OP)
ah yes, the wonderful world of memegame2 “trade system,” where you don’t actually trade with a country, no, you’re trading with the Sky Vending Machine™, a magical entity that will buy everything you throw at it at a price dictated by a simple dingus-proof supply and demand system with minimum and maximum hard-coded thresholds. You don’t set customs duties, you don’t need a port, you don't need inland infrastructures, you don’t need ships or crews or even warehouses, hell, you don’t even get to choose what gets sold. everything is instantly vaporized into profit and recreated elsewhere through quantum cloning. forget global supply chains, factories can thrive in the most remote of places given sufficient amount of literacy and ranking in the memegameAny% leaderboard, operating at the exact same efficiency as the ones in the heart of London itself

trade in memegame2 is less a global network of merchants, supply chains, and logistics and more a steampunk Walmart powered by the house of gryffindor where every individual on the planet just inserts a decimal amount of British pounds, presses a button that says "i am an idiot sandwich" and behold, a matching decimal amount of goods arrives to their doorstep in the next instant

>>2134387 (OP)
>memegame2 buffoons be like:
>global event triggered: “the great trousers shortage of 1861”
>effect: -50% clothing supply, +100% consciousness for all pops wearing pants
>britain panicked first, london gentlemen were forced to attend parliament in union jack themed undershirts and socks, causing +2 militancy among aristocrats but also gives +10% jingoism.
>meanwhile in cootbus, "wendehosen" artisans suddenly became the wealthiest class on earth.
>austria responded by banning trousers imports, issuing instead “imperial skirts decree”. consciousness rose by +4 among hungarians, who immediately demanded national trousers autonomy while croats asked if they could just wear curtains instead
>in tuchel, the kaszubs made a bizarre innovation of fish-skin pants. prestige +3, but life rating -10% in affected provinces due to smell
>meanwhile, wiendiszts in galicia demanded cultural trousers autonomy. when ignored, they staged the great trouser secession of 1862, forming the short-lived state of “trousaria” instantly crushed by austria, but the memory lingers as +10% revolt risk in kraków
>ottoman janissaries tried to revive shalwar trousers as national identity, only to discover all cotton had been rerouted to sorbian wendehosen monopoly. the sultan personally wore an onion sack to save face
>meanwhile in copenhagen, danish pops invented “trouserless democracy” giving universal suffrage but requiring all voters to show up without pants. +2.0 migration attraction
>event choice:
>1. subsidize emergency trousers (requires cotton, wool, and coal and costs 10,000£)
>2. normalize wearing skirts (+4 consciousness in all pops named sławomir)
>3. do nothing (demote all pops to “human skin input”)
>ai russia picked option 3
>historians later described this as “a bold modernization policy.”

>>2134387 (OP)
ah yes, nothing screams memegame like 20,000 sorbian artisans in cootbus churning out artisanal clipper ships in the marshy floodplains of lower lusatia, 300 kilometers from the nearest ocean. every morning jan and sławomir roll out of their shoelace hovels, sit by the spree river, and handcraft three-deck ocean-going vessels with nothing but twine and leftover manure, which are then instantly teleported to liverpool’s docks because the sky vending machine decreed britain needed them yesterday...
the game cheerfully ignores the fact that not a single tree in the area is large enough for a mast, and that the local carpentry guilds have never seen a ship longer than a bathtub. logistics, literacy, material shortages, and physics? irrelevant. every clipper magically arrives fully crewed, fully provisioned, and with a navigation system that somehow knows the wind patterns of the atlantic decades in advance. even better, cootbus pops continue their normal daily lives of tending tiny vegetable gardens behind cramped brick hovels, mending worn-out shoes for the local aristocrats, grumbling about the latest prussian tax edicts and composing minor poetry about the floods of sprjewja while simultaneously fueling the global trade economy with zero infrastructure investment, because memegame2 firmly believes that a dozen shoelace-mending blokes arguing by the spree all morning is all a nation needs to dominate global commerce, not a book that's called "how to build a sailboat 101"

>>2134387 (OP)
>nooo hundreds of thousands of artisans can’t exist in a single province
>meanwhile in memegame2:
>ah yes, 1862, the bustling global hub of… cootbus
>248,000 sorbian artisans rise at dawn to hammer shoelaces into full-rigged clippers
>daily output: 37 dreadnoughts, 500 violins and 9,000 experimental trousers with extra buttons
>"all input goods made available by our sponsor CloudMart™, a one-stop solution for your artisanal clipper workshops in lower lusatia, your steel mills in the Arctic, and your cannon foundries in the middle of the Amazon rainforest. No roads? No ports? No problem! CloudMart™ beams goods directly to your doorstep, because logistics are for manlet corsican."
>spree river now clogged with 800 unfinished man-o-wars, which immediately despawn and reappear in london because they are part of british bureaucrats’ luxury diet
>prussia’s prestige +100 for “world’s largest inland navy”
>austrian spies report that cootbus GDP has surpassed vienna’s entire economy through artisanal button exports alone
>british investors describe it as “the venice of mud” and open a stock exchange entirely for shoelace futures
>cootbus artisans also diversify: half of them secretly produce grand pianos, the other half make porcelain thrones, all sold directly to parisian salons via teleport wagon
>by 1870, every european monarch sits on a sorbian toilet, prestige modifier “comfort of lusatia” +25

>>2134387 (OP)
ah yes, the legendary “economy management” of memegame2 where managing an economy means watching farmers stand in a field that behaves less like soil and more like a Minecraft dispenser system. your farmers don’t plow, sow or pray for rain, they just stand there, eternally radiating the same number of wheat units every day without fail. no input tools, no seasons, no droughts, no soil exhaustion, no pest swarms. Coal mines never collapse, flood or run out, they just cough up the same tonnage forever, no shafts, no danger, no capital investment. Lumber camps never need replanting or clear land, entire forests regenerate daily like disney’s enchanted forest singing “be our guest”. and then at the end of the day, every unit of raw material is sold (without your consent) to the global market also known as CloudMart™, where it becomes pure numerical essence awaiting redistribution.

and then here comes the fabled "Factories" that actually don’t even exist as physical buildings. you don’t zone land, lay bricks, or hire contractors. you just click a button in the production menu and poof, you’ve summoned a phantom textile mill that spans the entire administrative state where workers can just casually warp from every corner of its province straight into this platonic ideal of a workplace. these astral industries don’t even require inputs to arrive by road or rail, CloudMart™ simply beams everything in and out like Star trek replicators and there’s no such thing as scaling inefficiency, machinery fatigue or storage overflow.

in practice, the so-called industrial revolution in memegame2 isn’t the story of urbanization, labor migration, and capital investment, it’s just an abstract spreadsheet minigame where factories are invisible portals that suck in infinite ghost labor and burp out infinite ghost products, all funneled through a trade system that acts less like a world economy and more like a cosmic communism on down syndrome

>>2168071
It was the period Europe put up a lot of air about their culture and accomplishments, only to undo it in 1914 in such a spectacular manner that it became self evident to everybody that their culture had not advanced one bit from the mindless barbarians the Romans described inhabiting Germania and all of their accomplishments were faded to die out.

go back to /gsg/ nobody cares about your vlog

looks like someones been assblasted enough to spam the thread
Vic 3s economy is ripped from hoi4 and bloated beyond belief
reminder: goods do not exist in victoria 3 because there is no economy in victoria 3, its just hoi4 abstractions
victoria 2 is the better game by default by the simple fact its economy actually exists

>>2199539
watch it, you're gonna cause another meltie

My problem with tech research in strategy games like Vic2 is that inventions tend to be the work of individuals and not the collective societies. Tech shouldn't be "researchable", but instead, discovered in the years, in the locations, and by the people who discovered it irl. Instead, there should be a mechanic call "tech adoption" like in CK2 where the technology is actually not immediately avaible throughout an entire nation but limited to specific provinces and other provinces have to "adopt" it.

>>2187210
>Ethiopia: buys 100,000 1870s-era rifles in 1890, they're the backbone of the army through several major wars and guerrilla insurgencies until the 70,000 surviving examples are sold as surplus in 1990
>Germany: makes 100,000 1930s-era rifles a month, loses 125,000 a month in combat
Is this real? I can kind of understand the issue with simulating equipment wear/attrition when you have such wildly differing cases like this.

>>2134439
This.
Abandoning this key tenet completely collapses Victoria into a generic "history themed politics simulator".

>>2134439
It's fine for nations which historically got conquered to be hard mode, but I don't like how vic2 modernization is basically "crush rebels and wait 50 years", that's boring

>>2134387 (OP)
>Vic 2:
>>Boot up game
>>Play Cambodia
>>Click on research
>>Realize you can't research yet because you need to modernise first
>>Cambodia has low literacy so it takes until about the 1870s to modernise
>>Now you can start researching stock exchange
Sounds like a skill issue.
If you aren't a modern nation by 1870 with tier 2 techs, you either started as some desolate area or tiny-bitch state OR you can't play the game.

>>2134387 (OP)
Vic 2
>Boot up game
>Play Cambodia
>Conquer rest of SEA Monkeys
>You are modern nation by 1840
>Used to gain all starting techs, but they thankfully nerfed it to the ones you pick via westernisation window
>Cambodia is still the powerhorse and becomes Great Nation the second it westernizes
>Dominate Asia by 1860
>Dominate world by 1880
Ftfy

>>2200877
do it

>>2200359
too bad, apart from Japan they were not even that interesting in the era anyway.