Thread 712923746

Which is harder?

Deltarune if you include secret bosses
otherwise, Undertale if you include genocide
otherwise, probably Undertale for not having a party and grazing

>>712923746 (OP)
Deltarune. Undertale is piss easy.

>>712923746 (OP)
Undertale Sans fight is still the hardest but Deltarune has way more challenging content in general.

>>712924058
Gerson makes Sans look like King Dodongo.

do both games share a timeline or are they unrelated? if so why are there characters in Deltarune from UT?

>>712924501
It's an alternate universe but its strongly implied to be a prequel set in another world

>>712923746 (OP)
My cock when I see Toriel.

>>712924568
Sequel*
Canonically the soul recognizes Sans and it's implied recognizes Neos

>>712924568
Don't think prequel, myself, I go with Tobert's say that it's more of an alternate universe or "different setting and history, same characters"

>>712924501
It's funny because people like you loose your shit for characters existing in two games at once and you desperately try to find some justification

>>712924815
>>712924920
The events are chronologically before undertale because the ost confirms that "the place where it rained" is deltarune meaning sans came from that world.
However it is an AU meaning all those characters have their own history. The soul (being the player) recognises the characters from undertale which takes place in its own pocket but the events in deltarune happen before it, the soul only knows because we the player know about hit game undertale

>>712924058
Sans was just a long fight. Much more forgiving than Jevil or Knight. Spamton is easier and I'd put Gerson at the same level of difficulty.

All right, what about someone who hasn't played either? Guessing you play Undertale first? The question is how to play it in terms of conduct etc. by now at least in a very general sense I know some of the major conceits were spoiled but is it worth to try and do a perfect / pacifist playthrough the first time or does it really matter?

>>712923746 (OP)
i dare you to play the sans fight right now after playing deltarune and telling me it's hard. it's laughable in comparison and completely scripted.
https://jcw87.github.io/c2-sans-fight/

>>712927813
real, the only truly hard part is the first attack before you learn it which is a big gimmick anyway.
the precise jumps between bones is probably the hardest regular attack imo.

>>712923746 (OP)
Deltarune, by a lot (not the main game but the extra optional bosses, the main game is not hard at all).
>>712924501
It's an alternate story. It has a lot of the same characters, but the setting is different.
>>712927665
>Guessing you play Undertale first?
Yes, Deltarune is explicitly intended for people who already played Undertale.
It is absolutely worth playing even if you were spoiled. I played it multiple times and it's still fun.
The pacifist run is required to get the true ending. The neutral run is the same except for some dialog toward the end, and it is also cut short compared to pacifist which continues for longer. But the entire game is not very long at all.
After pacifist, you should do a genocide run, which is a lot shorter than the main game.

>>712927813
>try this
>my left arrow key literally falls off my keyboard
he's too powerful...
i was suprised by how easy the bone hallway attack was compared to the sword hallway. but the bone attacks while menuing still fuck me up to this day.

>>712923746 (OP)
Undertale.
>>712924095
Gerson is super easy, easier than Undying.
>>712925242
The Knight is Undying tier.
>>712927813
This simulator is way easier than the actual in game fight because of the framerate.

>>712924501
People will try to give you a definitive answer, but the reality is that it's unclear at this point.

>>712923746 (OP)
There are still only a couple fights in each that actually matter
Undyne and sans are only a challenge when you don't know what's coming, Undyne is piss easy afterwards and sans is simple especially if you stock up on the best healing items, which isn't hard because nothing else in the game is even a threat. Omega flowey/Asriel would be much harder if he didn't start doing less damage when you're low health, combined with the huge health pickups you can't die unless you're retarded.
Deltarune has more fights but only the secret ones will give you trouble. Jevil is moderately tough, Spamton is easy as fuck (even the snowgrave route one), roaring knight is actually challenging until you learn the patterns, but I would have liked to see another couple attack patterns and for the fight to last longer. Gerson is piss easy. All of the storyline fights are easy as well, but they do have unique mechanics which make them fun.

Am I just bad if I get filtered by Knight even with Mantle? I just can't do the sword hallways

>>712929498
Nearly everyone has trouble with the sword hallway so don't feel too bad

>>712929498
you'll get fucked in the sword hallway regardless because the visuals are really fucked up, but it's practically made to be used with the Focus function.

>>712925213
That doesn't imply a prequel at all. If anything it's implying they're happening at the same time

>>712927813
God damn I wish there was a simulator for this but for the knight.
It is very hard when you do it for the first time, but you will get better.

>>712929498
Knight is a hard fight
Having the mantle just makes it doable

>>712929498
Those are among the easier attacks. You have to look at the right side of the screen and not the soul.

>>712929498
For the horizontal sword hallway, focus more on the GAP as it comes in rather than the swords. The spiral swords always follow the same pattern so you can just memorize where to move during it, it's actually much easier after you do it 4-5 times.

>>712929093
doesn't that mean simulator sans deals x2 damage? since he does damage per frame?

that knight is hard as shit without the shadow mantle (got B rank in 1st Tenna game)

>>712924645
Fuck you sans

>>712930609
I'm fucked yet again.

>>712930742
You survive that and you win

>>712931239
well, I didn't.

>>712925213
anon the undertale song title is literally "it's raining somewhere else", present tense

>>712929498
relax your eyes
look at the path, not the swords

>>712923746 (OP)
Toby made ch.3 and 4 way too hard. I get that he's some kind of bullet hell autist but this game isn't for genre enthusiasts. At least put in an easy mode.

>>712932097
git gud

>>712932097
Bait

>>712932097
Zoom zoom

>>712930442
No. That's why it's so easy.

>>712924095
If you're comparing individual attack patterns against each other in a vacuum, Gerson and Knight's are harder than Sans'
As complete fights, Sans's endurance match is longer, does the karma and UI attack stuff, and doesn't progress when you spend a turn healing instead of attacking. While Gerson's damage scales down as you're at lower health, and progresses from you healing. And the Knight you have 2 party members as back up health bars and item users for Susie.

>>712924982
wtf are you talking about

>>712929498
You can try going into the config menu and turning on simplified VFX. it reduces screen shake and after images, which makes the sword hallway a bit easier to read where the path is.

>>712924058
Sans is just long, not challenging.

>>712932523
Gerson and The Knight are also only 4/7 (or 4/8 depending on how shit goes) chapters into the game. The fact that they're comparable is enough to know that Deltrarune is gonna blow Undertake out of the water, difficulty wise.

>>712923746 (OP)
Knight > Undying > Jevil > Sans > the rest is not even worth mentioning

>>712923746 (OP)
Left isn't finished. So far UT but the Dark Knight comes really fucking close.

>>712927665
Since you already know it's a thing you might as well do pacifist from the get-go.

>>712924501
Its an alternate universe.

>>712924095
Gerson isn't hard, he just has one difficult attack - that axe throw shit.

Honestly the hardest parts of Deltarune have all been like that. Bosses where you can nohit everything easily except for one attack thats just way too hard and mostly RNG, and you push through those with healing items.

Jesus that was a lot of Deer in the last thread.

>>712932856
>that axe throw shit.
The fuck are you on about? That's his easiest attack by far and acts as a free TP boost since it's really easy to graze on. The later spear/hammer/shell combo attacks are way harder.

>>712933013
Nah those were fucking easy. You're bad

>>712925213
>the place where it rained
Assuming that it is meant to show chronology and not just draw a connection in the player's mind for thematic purposes, that could still imply just as easily they're taking place at the same time. Remember the original song is named "Its Raining Somewhere Else" which is written in present tense.

>>712932856
>he just has one difficult attack - that axe throw shit.
any time i see posts like these i wonder if theyre just a shitter who cant dodge the easiest attack, or a god that btfos every other attack and somehow gets fucked by only one

>>712933031
>guys it's okay, you're not longer deflowering her, now you're just planting your "seed" inside her!
>actually nevermind, I changed it again, you're not planting your seed anymore, you're just violently breaking her hymen!
what did Toby "don't call me Radiation" "Radiation" Fox mean by this?

>>712924501
It's like Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask. Except the player's character doesn't have knowledge of the previous game like Link does.

>>712924568
>>712925213
How is it a prequel if Sans's store is literally just Grillby's from Undertale. That implies that Sans already knew about Grillby's and might have even brought the whole store with him. Which would make Deltarune take place after Undertale.

>>712924815
It's a sequel for The Player, and a ??? for Sans

>>712927665
You are meant to play Undertale first, Toby said so himself, which is just about the only thing he has stated about the games. Pacifist is easier and generally more fun, but you can play in whatever order you want, or not even play all the routes. All that really matters is that you play the way you want.

>>712933031
>mindfucking a monster is how human SOULs reproduce
>the tiny red dot is your offspring

>>712927665
When you start up Deltarune it says it's strongly suggested to play Undertale first.
If you plan on only 1 playthrough go ahead and just do Pacifist. If you think you'll want to mess around with seeing different outcomes to things in multiple playthroughs(a "neutral" run can be finished in like 4 hours), I would personally recommend saving pacifist for after having fucked around.

>>712932097
He should. Undertale was already easy, and even it had the Temmie Armor in case you really sucked. Deltarune needs something equivelent to the Temmie Armor. It could also use a hard mode for all those sadists who said The Knight was too easy.
>>712932124
>>712932130
>>712932179
You guys do know about the Temmie armor don't you?

>>712933817
>Deltarune needs something equivelent to the Temmie Armor
It's called the ____git gud___
Also the shadow mantle

>>712933749
kinky

>>712933895
This is not the game for git gud. I'm not here for the bullet hell mechanics (and neither are most players), I'm here for the rpg mechanics and story.

>>712934142
Good news
The knight fight is entirely optional and you can always just go watch it and every other optional story beat on youtube, pussy

>>712933817
>You guys do know about the Temmie armor don't you?
I completely forgot about it... Because I never needed it.

I see people theorize that Noelle is projecting her missing her sister on to Susie. I've seen the evidence (guitar, her obsessing over her sister and similiarites of personality) and while I don't necessarily believe it, it would be funny to think that Toby inserted pseudo incest into the game he put his life's time and effort into making.

I think it's more likely it's a combination of Noelle missing her sister AND Kris.

>>712934210
>The knight fight is entirely optional
That shit's going to be mandatory for half the game's content later. You just know.
>you can always just go watch it and every other optional story beat on youtube, pussy
The entire point of the game is that its an interactive narrative. I just save edited to do all that stuff, but the point is I shouldn't have to.

>>712934471
Maybe go play Gone Home then. Or Dear Esther.

If you can't beat the knight with mantle you are unironically shit at video games. She's completely fair

>>712933749
>proceed
>pro-seed

>>712934471
Then earn it, fagotron

>>712934545
But those don't have flashing lights, snes music, and cute furries in them.

>>712934589
>pro-chuck

>>712934570
the sword hallways is really annoying

>>712934570
I'm shit at 2d action games.

>>712934570
>struggle with The Knight for hours in my first run
>when doing Weird Route I get nobody at all killed
its just really a matter of getting used to it

>>712934570
The random damage variation is annoying

>>712924501
See >>712934837

>>712934914
What if the Sans in the game is Sans Undertale, but at the end of the game Sans Deltarune shows up and gets sent to Undertale?

>>712934570
True.
I feel bad honestly. Being that bad borders on a disability. You just know these anons have trouble with real world tasks as well.

>>712935065
>We finally get to hangout with Sans' brother
>It's a second Sans

>>712930609
>>712930742
I'm pretty sure you'll finish faster if you replay the entire chapter.

>>712929498
yes
t. beat the knight mantleless in under an hour

>>712924501
Just pretend it's a "what if" where monsters and humans never got into a war.

>>712934662
Move to the left and watch the wave on the right side of the screen

>>712935114
>You just know these anons have trouble with real world tasks as well.
I know you're shitposting, but I can't drive irl because I can't keep track of everything at once. I can't keep track of the others cars and focus on operating my own car at the same time, only one or the other. Probably something to do with ADHD.

Its the same thing with the bullets in those really hard boss fights, I just can't keep track of them and the soul. So I usually just lean on healing items and spells to make up for it.

>>712933013
>The later spear/hammer/shell combo attacks are way harder
This. I also find those hard and the axe throw attacks easy.

>>712934570
>you are unironically shit at video games
Tell me something I don't know already

Some art I stole from Twitter dont mind me

Where'd everybody go?

>>712936414
Isekai'd to the world of Deltarune. Try not to feel too bad. I got left behind too.

>>712936414
there are at least three threads up right now

>>712927813
The Knight is the hardest fight in Deltarune and also scripted. I'd say Sans is harder just because his last attack is more difficult than any of The Knight's attacks individually.

>>712923746 (OP)
How do I reset a chapter 3 save file without losing progress?

>>712937124
load an empty file, or press one of the menu buttons (i forget what it's called) to load a chapter 2 save, then just save in a new slot after loading

and last one

>>712934471
It's not gonna matter. Nothing you do is going to matter by the end. The game told you that at the start.

>>712937124
I'm not sure what you mean by "reset without losing progress" exactly, but select "ch2 save files" and start a new chapter 3 game from the same chapter 2 save you did before and save into a different slot?

>>712937463
do I have to delete the original save file I used for ch3?

>>712937198
So did she swing her sword backwards in this picture? Both her hand and the blade are facing the wrong way.

>>712937457
I would be so mad if after all that Toby just ends it with "lmao, jk, still only one ending. *laughs*"

>>712937541
No. but also if you've already started chapter 4, deleting the chapter 3 save it continued from won't affect the chapter 4 one.

One thing i find kind of neat is how Undertale's fanbase clearly didn't care for other RPGs or bullet hells and it seems like Toby knows that and is adding more and more of it to Deltarune so it's becoming more of a real game and introducing Undertale fans to actual games. I hope the Knight is a sign for things to come and that becomes the base enemy difficulty by the end

>>712937457
Undertale told you "It's kill or be killed" at the start.

>>712937750
I play other RPGs, I just don't play bullet hells because I don't like them. I like Undertale despite its gameplay, not because of it. The Knight is a step in the wrong direction, which sucks because previously all the changes in Deltarune, like multiple party members or the TP meter were improvements. I also don't like how hard he nerfed TP in chapter 4.

>>712932712
Deltarune doesn't scale like that, though. Jevil was harder than Spamton and the Knight is harder than Gerson.

>>712924501
>unrelated
Heh.

>>712937457
The character that tells you your choices don't matter and threatens to eat your face is currently seeking to the break the prophecy.

>>712937941
retarded take, deltarune and undertale are bullet hells. they shouldn't change just because you don't like it.

>>712937941
I hope the locked TP gimmick is just chapter specific.
He could be a hack and keep doing that because it gives him perfect control over how a fight progresses, best exemplified in the jackenstein fight, but its way too railroaded to keep going for the remainder of the game.

>>712937750
Knight was as hard as it was because it was optional. Just like Gerson's hardest attacks are optional. Just like how Jevil is optional.
There will be more Knight-tier fights, but they will be optional. Secret bosses, or rape route bosses.

wish i had a father/grandpa like gerson

Holy shit I browsed Deltarune on Tiktok and I didn't expect to see so many animations for chapter 3 and 4

It's either Tenna shitposting or rape

>>712938370
is it like, hot rape, or gay tumblr rape?

>>712937457
your choices don't matter. but susie's do

>>712938486
probably both

>>712938253
Even the main fights are gradually getting a little bit tougher. I saw a lot of casual UT fans say they struggled on the Titan

>>712937941
I like both and think the bullet-hell aspect of The Knight is perfectly fine, but I think the RPG aspect of it was still at its best with Jevil. I feel like each party member served a purpose in that fight and while the strategy wasn't particularly deep, there still is strategy in whether you're deciding to Pirouette or save for Hypnosis, which also requires all party members so there's that extra layer to the decision too, and then you need Ralsei to actually finish the fight too which is another interesting aspect to it. The Knight just feels like it's all about your skills at dodging.

>>712938227
They're not bullet hells. Or at least Undertale isn't, and Deltarune wasn't until the Knight. The bullet patterns are really easy to deal with compared to your average shmup and the RPG mechanics make it super forgiving. The change here is suddenly turning it from a relatively easy rpg with shmup mechanics to a brutally hard bullet hell half way through. I'm not asking Toby to make the game easier, I'm asking him to stop making it harder.

>>712938370
>I browsed Deltarune on Tiktok
why

>>712938732
Nigga this is a deltarune thread, we are all zoomers let's not pretend otherwise

>>712938253
I genuinely could not beat the titan without cheating and I really struggled with Tenna.
>>712938537
this

>>712938804
some of us have taste

>>712938667
You know the genocide route in undertale exists right? Sans is still the hardest boss in either of the games. And you are supposed to deliberately ignore the RPG mechanics to get the best ending. Undertale is a bullet hell, or I guess you could call it a shmup despite the lack of shooting, pretending to be an RPG.

>>712924815
>>712924568
It's both a sequel and a prequel and an alternate universe happening at the same time. Stop thinking linearly and start thinking weird time bullshit.

>>712933031
>>712933749
Wonder if theres gonna be any character switching fuckery, assuming that dot is a gestating PlayerCharacter soul. would recontextualize a certain mechanic in DR:Y for the worse, too

>>712938541
>The Knight just feels like it's all about your skills at dodging.
Which is exactly why if the game keeps going this direction I won't be able to play it any more. Toby seems to be moving away from the rpg aspects to go all in on genocide route style railroaded bullet hell fights.

>>712938812
You're a pathetic disgrace to all gamerkind

>>712924501
We very honestly do not know

>>712938370
My 9 year old female cousin is obsessed with Kris/Noelle now.....

>>712934570
This but its Gerson. There's no way people struggled with that piss easy fight

>>712924501
Personally, I like to think they're parallel stories, where, they don't outright relate or connect to each other, would have substantive answers and ideas for the other story. But in truth, I don't know.

>>712938804
>we are all zoomers let's not pretend otherwise
R-right... haha...

>>712938812
I can buy getting fucked by Tenna's final attack due to the quick switching, but how the hell do you struggle with the Titan when half of its attacks are "just let the bullets approach and gently move away from them"?

>>712939089
oh no-elle

>>712923746 (OP)
undertale only is hard on genocide, it's fucking impossible to die in any battle besides vs sans/undying

>Irony, that's what poisons your story
Reminds me of Homestuck...

>>712938812
I thought I was a shitter for taking an hour to beat The Knight, holy shit anon git gud

The average skill level in this thread is frankly embarrassing.

>>712939327
im going to kick your fucking ass

I had a bit of trouble with Tenna but I think that was mostly just being forced to wake up when the rest of chapter 3 was so easy it got me bored. Toby really needs to make trash fights a bit more challenging i m o

>>712939327
I was dropped as a baby and I almost drowned as a kid, please understand.

>>712939256
I died to Mettaton EX once

>>712939274
Years later, Toby is not through seethin'

>>712939357
nyehehehehe

>>712938958
>You know the genocide route in undertale exists right?
And its meant to be frustrating and unpleasant. The whole point of that route is to make you want to quit and go back to the pacifist route. With Sans being the penultimate punishment before it just bricks your game.
>And you are supposed to deliberately ignore the RPG mechanics to get the best ending
You still use the RPG mechanics in the pacifist route, you just use the novel and inventive ACT system rather than the old FIGHT option that literally every RPG has. I didn't have to git gud (tm) to beat Asgore, I just had to stockpile my items, get good gear, and figure out which acts make the battle the easiest.

>>712939256
>>712939414
Oh yeah, and Asgore, I died to Asgore a bunch

>>712939089
I don't think Toby Fox games are good for children

I don't mean this in a pearl clutching way. But most of the humour and story are derived from meta commentary and playing on your expectations of a normal game.

You can't enjoy any of that if you don't have a solid grounding in other games. Like imagine if Undertale was your first adventure game. It'd be way less interesting and it would poison you going forward

>>712939327
I mean, atleast they're playing the game? Better to have skillets than secondaries, imo

>>712933749
Yep, impregnation is canon.

>>712939538
Yeah, I'm just busting balls

everyone who struggles against the knight should attempt it mantleless for at least an hour before trying it with the mantle
provided you don't suck ass, you should be pretty decent at no hitting the first two attacks and have a good grasp on the third
the rest pretty manageable from there with the mantle

is there a 100% walkthrough?

>>712939256
I died a couple of times to Undyne in the pacifist route, but that's mostly because it took me way too long to realize I could just run away.
>>712939509
I fear Undertale might be too rooted in then internet culture to be attractive to kids. We might see a "Seinfeld Effect" sort of thing where much of pop culture has now ascended beyond Undertale and so it's not as impressive now as it once was.

>>712939538
Very true

>>712927813
this is at 60 fps and is noticably easier
i'd still say undertale is harder but only because you only have 1 party member and no additional mechanics

>>712939057
I don't play games to dick measure, anon. I play them for fun. Nobody finds you spending four hours memorizing attack patterns to be impressive.
>>712939202
I did that and still got hit . I'd get cornered and still take damage, and the other half of the attacks really fucked me. That combined with its massive health pool at the tp nerf meant the fight dragged on until I ran out of healing items then died.
>>712939301
Why would I want to? I don't like bullet hells and I especially don't like doing the same fight over and over again. That's not fun that's just frustrating.

>>712939462
A lot of people did struggle with Asgore though. Should the fight be made piss easy because not everyone could beat him first try? Also can you tell me what RPG mechanics you use in the pacifist route? Healing and armor are not exclusive to RPGs

>>712939870
No undertale is harder BECAUSE THERE'S NO FUCKING RUN BUTTON

>>712938994
(you)r control over the DRY characters is a lot more subtle than it is in DR. You don't even replace Cole's soul, you just influence his. So even if Kanako is SOUL'D, its not like the ego death that happens in DR.

I struggled a bit with mettaton, asgore, undyne originally, found geno undyne to be harder than sans but both hard. But knight was pretty easy for me tho I do think I might just be a better gamer now these days, actually focus and learn from mistakes better so who knows.

why did she do it anons?
why did dess molest a innocent young human girl like kris?

>>712939538
I wonder if the Knight fight would indicate the rest of the game will become much harder. I might actually get into Touhou just so I can better prepare for it. I'm pretty bad at the games, but I always managed through persistence and relying on items. The Knight is the only one I gave up on because even all of items and my usual strategies didn't work, even with the mantle, which sucks, especially if all those video game guys that I've killed were also "real".

>>712924095
This dude cannot handle head on fights a and it shows. Gerson is a joke. Water cooler is more difficult and the dude has only two attacks.

>>712940229
reindeer puberty is brutal

>>712940229
I imagine she gotten tired of doing it to Noelle all of the time.

>>712940229
>girl

>>712940229
you wouldn't understand...

>>712939256
I died to Asgore and Mettatton a few times. The rest I may I have died to once or twice because I did something stupid or got greedy with my healing items.

>>712940285
did people struggle at all with water cooler? I was kind of disappointed with that one with the set up involved kinda hoped for a hard mini boss

>>712939327
Undertale is literally the only shmup I have played to completion. I usually play 3d shooters, which I actually am decent at.

>>712938076
You're supposed to fight Spamton first. There's no reason to go back into the elevator, so you shouldn't be discovering Jevil in the first place. The first natural hint to his existence should be when you show NEO's Shadow Crystal to Seam.

>>712940229
Dess is not a lesbian and is for Asriel.

>>712940464
It has one stupid attack my brain struggles to put two and two together with. I never died to it but I had to heal an embarrassing amount of times

Kris is EXCLUSIVELY for monster girl cock

>>712940229
Because she's a mean one.

OH KRIS
KRIS, KRIS,
YOU'VE BEEN A GOOD VEHICLE, AND I'VE ENJOYED THE RIDE, BUT NOW HE'S WEAK AND FULL OF HOLES
IT'S ALMOST NEARLY TIME TO SHUFFLE OFF TO BUFFALO!

AH, KRIS IS A BABE IN THE WOODS
WITH A LARGE HOLE WHERE HIS CONSCIENCE USED TO BE
AND WHEN I GO, CHILDREN, I WILL PULL THAT RIPCORD!
AND YOU WATCH KRIS, REMEMBER, WATCH HIM!
BUT NOT FOR LONG...

>>712940640
Women don't have cocks.

>>712940464
the fact it has one attack and then the fight gets recycled not once but twice is disgusting

>>712940518
>There's no reason to go back into the elevator, so you shouldn't be discovering Jevil in the first place.
I like backtracking. When I first played DR I forgot how Jevil was found since it was years after his initial reveal and happened to stumble upon that weird elevator floor

>>712940518
>It is unnatural to go into a door in a castle
what

What’s their endgame?

>>712940376
God Swaine is so based.

saw something at the store today called 'rapeseed oil' and thought about noelle

>>712940320
i need the og artist

>>712939976
>Should the fight be made piss easy because not everyone could beat him first try?
I think the fight is easy enough as is. The vast majority of players can beat him without it getting annoying, and for the few that can't they can buy the temmie armor.
>Healing and armor are not exclusive to RPGs
But they are rpg mechanics. Undertale's heavy reliance on those, and its emphasis on story make it an rpg. There's also the act system which leans heavily on role playing, which adds to it being a role playing game.

>>712940885
total family reconstruction

>>712940229
Why do you want to cuck your brother, anon?

>>712940885
They're trying to bring Dess via following the prophecy, but bending it in such a way where they benefit most from it without getting too much of the drawbacks.

>>712940518
The first hint to Jevil's existence is the card suit puzzle that says "the order of the rooms in the castle. You can't solve this now, come back after you've been there." and then you do that and it gives a 1/3rd of a broken key

>>712940885
Save dess from (you)

SNNNNNIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIFFFFFFFFF

>>712940685
at least we can agree that gaster is the fireman right

>>712927665
1st playthrough: Make the choices you want to make. There are no wrong answers, as long as you see the credits then that counts as beating the game. If you're satisfied with your ending, stop here.

2nd playthrough: Challenge yourself to finish the game without killing anyone. If you're satisfied with the ending, stop here.

3rd+ playthrough: Explore possibilities that you didn't see in your first two runs. Kill someone you didn't kill. Spare someone you didn't spare. Invent little challenges for yourself like bringing an item all the way through to the end without using it, or keeping the base equipment. Keep playing over and over until you are satisfied. And if you are not...

?th playthrough: Push the game to its limits. Eradicate every last enemy in your path until none remain. They're just code, after all. Slaughtering them for the thrill of seeing your level and stats rise higher and higher, what's so wrong with that?

??th playthrough: If you still aren't satisfied, keep playing.

???th playthrough: If you still aren't satisfied, keep playing.

>>712941039
yes. Friend is the arm.

kris's sexual awakening was dess spanking him with a wiffleball bat

>>712940406
cant say because its unfinished, if all the stories pay off and conclude in a satisfying manner then i'd be happy to say it's as good
if snowgrave ends up being a half-baked story that concludes prematurely then im going to riot

>>712940464
I can not for the life of me figure out how to dodge its bullet patter, and it takes a lot of ACTs to spare.

>>712930609
>(got B rank in 1st Tenna game)
If you go all the way South from the Green Room you can find a Pippin that sells one S rank for 1500 points.
Alternatively, consider being real shit and getting a Z rank, which also gives you backstage access.
Also, ERAM is the hardest fight in the game bar none, fuck that asshole, stupid fucking rng fight. Took me 20 tries to just beat him but oneshot Knight after.

>>712940109
Undertale is the game WITH the run button. You can't flee any fights in Deltarune except for in Chapter 3's Egg quest.

>>712941194
God I wish that were me

>>712941039
Yeah, Gaster is 100% an equivalent to an agent of the White Lodge.
>>712941180
Would fit really well if it's Kris's cut off hand as some people have been theorizing.

>>712940885
I don't think Asgore is fully in on it, he's just being used.

Kris's sexual awakening was Dess showing them Cake Farts on the librarby laptop

>>712941194
It would be funny if Dess was a normal teenager but made Noelle and Kris into complete weirdo by making them sexually fixated on her. Like Noelle isn't a masochist because Dess did stuff to her, she did that all on her own, Dess was just the catalyst.

>>712940518
I always check everything in Toby games so I can read all the funny dialogue and find all the secret items, so it was really easy to find Jevil. I imagine most people play this way too.

>>712941283
there is a character without an arm close to bob... and he also has a ring???

>>712940787
You haven't played the game. It's the elevator you already came out of, with zero indication that there's another floor besides the prison you already explored.

>>712940974
>But they are rpg mechanics. Undertale's heavy reliance on those, and its emphasis on story make it an rpg. There's also the act system which leans heavily on role playing, which adds to it being a role playing game.
This is so fucking retarded that I'm not even going to bother arguing with you anymore. You were obviously lying when you said you played other RPGs because you don't even know what they are.

>>712941295
I didn't really consider that before but that does sound right.

>>712941274
No I mean actual running around I can only walk and that makes me miserable

>>712941298
AND THE MOM IS KISS GOODNIGHT

>>712939274
Gerson's entire character was surprisingly sincere and even kinda heartfelt for the guy who made Under"LOVE stands for Level Of ViolencE"Tale, you can tell he's grown as a writer a lot

>>712940885
Carol is addicted to human cock.

>>712934662
it's fine, at most toby should make it a bit easier to see visually. i think it's funny that people i sometimes see people whine about the hitboxes to cope about that attack.

>>712941520
This, Deltarune is the best Toby's writing has ever been. I don't know why people point to Undertale and to shit like Alphys and Undyne and expect that everything will be the same.

Despite taking surface level inspiration from Touhou, Toby has failed even the most basic fundamentals of good bullet hell game design. Players just don't notice the friction because most encounters are easy and repetitive, the health bar makes the game incredibly forgiving, and boss fights usually pivot away from the bullet hell style into some gimmick or minigame.
A lot of people fighting the knight will have their complaints dismissed with "get good" "skill issue". But they are saying the same things I said the first time I fought the little froggies in the ruins. It's not the casuals fault for not noticing the 30fps framerate and terrible hitboxes until the game really put pressure on them.

>>712941295
he's fully in, but more to try and save his marriage

>>712940268
>the Knight fight would indicate the rest of the game will become much harder.
Probably not. As Chapter 4's fights aren't particularly tough.
Jackenstein's probably the defacto "toughest" simply due to his fight taking the longest. Gerson's not too bad either, to even get some hard patterns you'd have to block the entire fight but most people obviously aren't going to do that.
The Titan while cool unfortunately gets fucked over HARD by optional content. You can CLEAVE through its HP immediately into the Gerson phase with how powerful your gear is and that makes future fights very concerning

>>712940885
>Carol
Revive Dess
>Asgore
Win back his family
>Kris
Probably also bring back Dess
>Gaster
Lol
Lmao

>chapter 1 and 2 eggs
>haha weird side rooms, lmao egg and toby hits you with a car
>chapter 3 egg
>getting the ticket to nowhere from a bibliox (toriel's book of hymns that disappears) in a game version of a house that isn't the dreemurrs to go to mancountry where the photocopied rudinns have weird things to say about kris and the egg man tells you where to find him in the other chapters
>chapter 4 egg
kris's art therapy "where we don't kill each other", being unable to draw something he's seen and more fuel for the kris is missing one of his hands theory
honestly this egg stuff has grown into the most captivating mystery in the game
"not too important, not too unimportant" my ass, this feels really important

i think thats supposed to be susie in the prophesy

>>712940685
Who would a Cooper equivalent be
I think it's us until we go weird route and then it's Susie

>>712941572
BASED.

>>712941616
just learn the patterns

>>712941606
Probably because whenever Susie and Noelle start interacting the game's writing takes an unnatural drop in quality that puts it on par with Undertale during Undyne and Alphys' hookup

>>712941685
Susie.
Susie is the one.

>>712940885
Gaster is INNOCENT.

I'm too retarded to learn Deltarune's bullet patterns so I use cheat engine.
I did Undertale genocide easy though.
Could just be that I'm old now and my reaction time has gone to shit after almost 10 years

>>712941408
Are you that autist that calls every jrpg a walking sim? Sure it might not be as complex as Fallout or Deus Ex, but its still substantially more stat oriented than something like Doom, and has a very interactive narrative. If I can customize the player's stats granularly enough to be weighing the benefits of higher defense over higher i-frames and the game has more than way to end basically every encounter, its an rpg.

>>712941616
touhou fucking sucks though

>>712941616
Did he ever give a reason for the game being 30 fps? Was it just a thing where he started work on the game like that and it'd be a lot of effort to change it at this point?

>>712941764
I don't know, I thought making Frisk and Alphys roleplay as Alphys and Undyne respectively was pretty funny.

>>712941684
It's very clearly Susie, no one has a face like that

>>712941764
I think you just don't like lesbians. You wouldn't hate their relationship if it was straight.

>>712941685
sans

>>712941673
>more fuel for the kris is missing one of his hands theory
the gumball machine is a strong indication of that

>>712941572
so true

>>712941616
Touhou sucks, most shmups suck, bullet hells that are actually bullet challenges are infinitely more interesting. Cope seethe mald.

>>712940885
I like to think that whatever they're planning it will all horrendously backfire to nobody's benefit.

>>712941832
It would be even worse if it was straight, it's written like absolute fucking dogshit and your fetish just makes you unable to admit it
On the other hand Kris and Susie's interactions would be even better if Kris was also a chick instead of a guy who pretends to be sexually confused cause Dess molested him

>>712927665
Play Undertale. Do what you want but spare the final boss. Then decide if you want to listen to him.

>>712941796
>than something like Doom

Speaking of...

https://forum.zdoom.org/viewtopic.php?t=49857

>>712941832
Yes

>>712923746 (OP)
Sans and undyne the undying are harder than anything in deltarune
Outside of those everything in deltarune is harder than undertale

>>712941684
I also thought so while playing the game.
It's the same illustration but with a heart for the love prophecy.
God I hope it's true, I want her to be with Kris

>>712941685
>>712941767
I don't think there's a direct equivalent but Susie is the closest one.
>>712941841
He's a worse Albert at best.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Csk4DzGqFQ

>>712941895
Toby is trying to court a new audience with chapter 4

>>712941616
Not every game should be Tohou, anon. In fact I'd say its better if most games aren't. Most people view Tohou as "that absurdly hard bullet hell game" and nothing precisely because its too hard for them to enjoy.

>>712941684
>>712941831
it could also be a large hood as part of a big cloak
idk what to interpret the hair part as in that case though

>>712941939
You can think Kris is just a chick with they pronouns. Kris isn't really particularly masculine or feminine, they're like a stick figure in that way.

>>712940640
>skin tight pants
He's asking for it

How many of you shameless thieves stole from asriel?

>>712941831
hood

>>712942079
He would understand, I needed to buy Susie something to eat.

>>712941657
I didn't beat the knight so I can't say how hard it was with the mantle and black shard, all I know is it was a slog without them.

>>712942079
Not me. If you took the $5 you're gonna have a way harder time with the omega asriel fight.

>>712942079
I've "borrowed" 10 dollars from the nigger and regret nothing.

>>712942045
Kris looks like a weirdo emo 13 year old boy, there is absolutely nothing feminine or androgynous about his looks

>>712942079
no other way to have the diner scene I assume

>>712942016
>They fall in love
>THEN the reveal and crashout happens
Ooh the fallout for that is gonna be legendary

>>712941654
We WILL get the six souls (flowers) absorbed Asgore fight we were promised in Undertale.

>>712941886
>small, dark, triangle
>hard, like lacquer

...a guitar pick? Only thing that remotely comes close that has anything to do with Dess. She has an acoustic guitar, but I can't think of what else it could be.

>>712942079
Susie said it best, if he really needed the money he would have brought it to college with him

>>712940697
kris doesn't exist

>>712942079
Not my fault my drunken fucking whore of a mother didin't give me any money to bring Susie to the diner

>>712942079
>"steal" 5 dollars from a man who's far off in college
>don't pay the restaurant
>don't go to the diner with susie
it's obvious which is the best option

>>712942178
Gaster watching the player repeatedly fight the knight in chapter 3 and win

>>712942158
I don't know man, that sweater can hide a lot.

what does glass smell like?
what does rotten glass smell like?

>>712942158
not to mention in dark world his ego self is stronger bigger coolguy, very masculine.

>Useless Analysis
It's true but Kris doesn't have to put it like that

>>712942091
To somehow get a hood shape like that the girl in the prophecy would have to be fucking Queen cause only an extended alien head like hers could deform the hood in such a way
Besides it doesn't explain the part down her back

>>712942170
you can still do it without 5 dollars but that's way worse since the diner lady is really nice

>>712923746 (OP)
Will you be able to suffer Snowgrave to reach the true end?

>>712942079
Asriel of all people will understand their freaky sibling getting into a lunch date with the autistic dinosaur.

>>712941832
I would. Noelle becomes a simp and a bitch whenever Susie is on screen. I'd be mad if one of my irl friends started acting like that because of a girl.

>>712942278
I still hit check on every enemy I see to see if there's a funny joke in it.

>>712942079
Its all for a good cause

>>712942079
I moneymaxxed and it was worth for the dinner scene.

>>712942079
If Asriel doesn't treat Kris and Susie to the diner meal they die from pancake induced malnourishment and diabetes later in the game.

>>712942270
Not sure, but I think it grew from the bitter waters.

>>712942316
suffer?

>>712942278
Check should have been what unlocks an enemy's Mercy bar. Once you check an event for the first time, the Mercy bar will always be displayed. Similar to HP bars after you Tattle in Paper Mario.

>>712941572
What would Noelle think of her mom wanting to fuck Kris?

>>712942213
people suspect it's either a dark shard or a guitar pick
the ARG had a /guitar webpage that plays lost_girl.bgm so there's something significant about the guitar that we've yet been told besides belonging to dess

>>712942297
or maybe have big hair and horns

>>712941684
Gerson states Susie is the dragon, not the girl. Shes not part of some legend, neither was Lord of the Hammer himself. Thats the whole point of it.

>>712941832
No. Watching them together is like watching Mordecai and Margaret again.

>>712941616
Touhou is a fine series but I'm glad Toby isn't just copying it, the variety in patterns are way more creative and not only breaks up gameplay more but also lends more personality for the specific enemy/NPC making them more memorable. I really appreciate Toby experimenting as much as he can, even beyond combat the mini-game stuff in chapter 3 was really appreciated and even the climbing mechanic is a nice addition to the core overworld exploration. I await to see what he will do next in future chapters.

>>712942278
You guys think adding more information to the battle acts ruined the fun of experimenting? I'm a bit confliced on it.

>>712942241
As much as i love the idea of Kris somehow hiding an absolute bombshell body and two massive tits under her sweater i severly doubt it
It's not even comparable to Frisk cause they were a little chubby toddler and could genuinely be either a boy or a girl, here they tried to pull the same shit but literally everyone just sees Kris as a male, even the fucking name leaves little to the imagination

>>712942446
It's a reference to Kung Fu Panda.

>>712942416
She would probably think it's really weird and immoral. That would probably sour her opinion of her mom and might actually provoke her into actually speaking out against her.

>>712941820
I think GM 8 was locked to 30 fps and then when he updated to newer versions the number just stuck.

>>712942316
>suffer
im interested in seeing how messed up the story goes

>that one Zapper turning to stone in ch3 instead of the Pippin next to him
WHAT DOES IT MEAN
WHAT IS RALSEI NOT TELLING US ABOUT """WORLD COMPATIBILITY"""

>>712942316
Suffer? We're enjoying every single moment here anon

>>712942316
I've been thoroughly enjoying Snowgrave Anon, I don't know what you're on about.

>>712942079
I didn't, and I fucking hate myself for it. I assumed the diner would just be a normal store interface like it was in previous chapters. I'm genuinely pissed off because of this.

>>712941684
Where's that susie dialogue from, on the left?

Sex with this puppy

>>712942458
no because schizo scholars know checking provides incredibly insightful lines

>>712942446
the dragon in the game could just be the girl in the prophecy, it is called dragon blazers after all

>>712942567
>the diner would just be a normal store interface like it was in previous chapters
Huh?

>>712942458
I don't mind it, but I don't think they should be giving exact numbers to me.

>>712942536
you niggers never read the pippins next to him literally says that kris stole that remote from catti's house

>read guides on whether to kill or spare Jevil
>multiple guides recommend sparing him for the armor piece
>mfw Devil's Knife is best in slot for Susie even after getting the Hammer of Justice, and greatly trivializes Knight, Neo and Gerson fights
>mfw best armor setup barely has room for Jevilstail in the first place, and that you can just run an extra Royal Pin with your TP Gain, TP Graze, TP Time, Money Up and Fluffiness Up boosts
Why they lie to me man

>>712942536
It was a remote from Noelle's house. It literally didn't belong in Kris's. Same with the plug adapter.

>>712942536
That Zapper was from Catti's house.

>>712942458
It's always been clear to me from the titles what the correct options are
outside of stuff like clover where it's basically just "did you pay attention to that random NPC's dialogue that doesn't get repeated"

Why was Dragon Blazers a ripoff of Zelda instead of Dragon Quest? Does Toby just assume Deltarune fans suck at real RPGs?

>>712942316
No one cried for him

>>712941684
it could fit noelle using her dark world hood and maybe with angel wings
noelle can equip swords according to datamines

>>712942079
only in ch4 and only when i learned i needed cash for the diner
man would understand, he'd probably give it to kris anyways if he said that she needed it to take the purple dino out for lunch

>>712942536
That specific Zapper was stolen from Catti's house, and the pippins "fit in" under Tenna's command. They might've turned to stone eventually too, but they at least lasted longer than Ramb/Lancer/Rouxls

>>712942580
thats my fanfiction writer brain predicting what will happen
she just straight up refuses to equip bows when ralsai says she should so her using a sword isint much of a leap honestly

>>712942316
i didn't touch it.
>>712942589
what a bitch(male) tasqu manager should permanently keep him

>>712923746 (OP)
Deltarune, but that's not really saying much.
For both games really the gameplay is just a means to an end vehicle for the story to thrive. The actual challenges are too sparse and honestly it's just a stupid difficulty spike for the sake of fluffing up the importance of some story elements. I get games having difficulty spikes but it's obscene here because the only hard basic enemy in the entire game is a fucking water cooler, and they're nowhere as crazy as Jevil. And I wouldn't mind Jevil if everything surrounding him was tight and engaging but there are so many opportunities just to brute force everything else that it does suck the fun for me.

>>712942640
People at the time just didnt know fighting Jevil was actually the BETTER option because the knife is HIM.

>>712942458
i ended up getting pacified-pilled in chapter 4
slapping enemies and pacifying them when they are under 50% HP is pretty satisfying

>>712942705
The chapter 3 game isn't Dragon Blazers

>>712942079
fuck em, I'll take what I want

>>712942608
Wasn't there a point in chapter 2 or something where you could just buy something in the diner?

>town gets named after your soul
genuinely what the fuck did toby mean by this?

>>712942707
If you're a /v/ user and don't like/understand Ramb, you need to LEAVE

>>712942770
But this doesn't matter since Jevil will never get a cameo in a future chapter. Spamton only got one because he was so popular.

>>712942869
He was too loving and selfless for any of us to understand him

>>712942705
That wasn't Dragon Blazers, it was Mantle.

>>712942818
Shit's going to go down in the coming chapters.

>>712942871
>But this doesn't matter since Jevil will never get a cameo in a future chapter.
He has dialogue in Tenna's fight, you get "Bet 30" as an option and you can hear Jevil's laugh as he bets it away.

>>712942871
>>712942770
Jevilstail changes Susie's act in the Tenna fight

>>712942794
Kris's title changes to Blazer after you play it.
>>712942802
She gives you a free Hot Chocolate in Chapter 1, but there's definitely no interface for it.

>>712942079
i did because its not like hes gonna come back and go
>HOLY MACIRONI KRIS HAVE YOU SEEN MY PRECIOUS 5 DOLLARS THAT I SPECIFICALLY LEFT THERE LIKE 6 MONTHS AGO TO BUY DESS (hes fucking her knight form) SOME FLOWERS

>>712932097
The Knight was the only truly difficult battle, everything else is about the same level of difficulty as it’s always been in UT/DR.

>>712942802
The waitress gives you a free cup of hot chocolate in the first chapter. It's never a store, you must be having mixed up memories with Swatch's cafe

>>712942705
Noelle plays Dragon Blazers and it's hinted pretty heavily that it's turn based

>>712942709
Wait hold on, you think in later chapters the red heart or us is going to become black?

>>712942079
I'm getting the impression from these replies that this board is filled with a lot of degenerate younger siblings

>>712942942
>>712942975
Then I remembered incorrectly. Even more reason for me to be pissed off.

>>712942923
>>712942926
Damn it now I gotta replay the chapter again

>>712942589
there is a severe lack of puppy girl femkris

>>712942871
Spamton got one because chapter 3 was where he came from, there were an absolute shit ton of references to him since Tenna was his old associate

>>712942970
>The Knight was the only truly difficult battle

>>712942373
So it’s black ice?

>>712943036
the prophecies are colorless anon
but I do believe kris' soul will slowly get darker as the one we plant in noelle grows in the weird route until we get full control of her

>>712942770
i dont think that matters since the jevil version of the bet act in the tenna fight can be done with either the tail or the knife
>>712942640
you can chain rude busters every round once you get going even without it in the knight fight, so you're not missing much and the hammer of justice still has that ??? ability so who knows what it will do in chapter 5.

>>712943090
I was drunk as shit when I first got to him and I needed my brother to beat him for me.

>>712943090
tboichads tank this bitch

>>712942079
Asriel would call Kris a retard if he missed out on a date rather than take 5 bucks he left behind long ago.

>>712942989
>Susie is uncomfortable with anyone knowing about her tail except Kris since he immediately breaks down that barrier by just choping onto it
Kino

>>712943090
I get that the mantle's bratty laugh is arousing enough to distract you from the battle but that doesn't mean it's difficult

>>712942461
People seem to see Kris as a male more often than not is because it's the same effect a stick figure provokes. Despite a stick figure not really being particularly masculine, people will think it's probably a guy because it lacks any outright feminine aspects. Frisk tends to be more even because actual toddlers in real life are usually pretty androgynous. Plus I like to think Kris has huge tits and that makes me hard so that's enough to make it think Kris is a girl.
>>712943064
I guess it's because dogs tend to be more associated with masculinity. Maybe if Kris had more of a cat thing than a dog one, we might see more cat girl Kris more often.

>>712942640
Devilsknife fucking carried me against the knight thanks to the reduced rude buster cost, never regretted beating him in the face instead of lulling him back to sleep

>>712942458
Stats should be added back.

>>712942716
>he'd probably give it to kris anyways if he said that she needed it to take the purple dino out for lunch

>>712943090
Nah she's an easy facefuck if you stop trying to challenge the fire burst.

Toriel deserves to be killed

>>712943090
This thing was harder than Jevil for me

How mad would you be if chapter 7 wipes your snowgrave saves on normal route completion as a part of Kris's and Ralsei's plan

>>712942587
>"Unf (you're the punk Kris was telling me about)!"
>IDDQD

>>712943248
>she's an easy facefuck
don't say that about her

>>712942461
>>712942241
>>712942158
I always thought this could've been avoided if Kris had long hair, that could've helped make it feasible for him to be a girl but instead Toby gave him the Varik haircut

>>712943296
How would you feel if you didn't eat breakfast today

>>712943223
If said that Kris is adopted in front of him their friendship would probably end on the spot

>>712943321
But I didn't have breakfast today?

>>712943321
I did though?

>>712943090
I, as a REAL gamer, did NOT job to the Shadow Mantle!!!

>>712943090
I oneshot Knight and Gerson on my last playthroughs, but this fucker ruins me for 10+ attempts every time
I just get no candies and some of those random patterns are so goddamn rough. Feel like there's something I'm missing with how to manipulate the flame charge or w/e

>>712942705
That was Mantle, not Dragon Blazers.

>>712943321
Sans ate my breakfast though

>>712943314
She just laughed and opened wide when I told her.

>>712943090
this thing is easy as fuck
massive skill issue

>>712942640
The Jevilstail is great, and while I haven't used the Devilsknife, you can defeat the Knight without it. You can use RudeBuster on almost every turn even when you heal sometimes. Also you literally get the JusticeAxe, which is powerful and thematically suits Susie.
>>712942770
It was a few days ago that I first heard about this, but I'm pretty sure the Jevilstail is also him. He transforms on screen.

>>712943090
Little cunt genuinely feels like a nes era boss with how much of a dickhead it is, loved it

>>712943090
i struggled until i stopped being overly aggressive. though there are some parts where you can get really greedy to do lots of damage.

>>712943090
It's really the final attack patterns that are difficult. Just keep control of the smile guys and continually chip away at her as you dodge her attacks.
>>712943317
That might actually tip it too much on the other end. I feel like a midway haircut between current Kris and this fan sprite might be more ideal.

>>712943090
>gives you infinite candy in one battle and none in another
What in the absolute fuck did Toby mean by this?

If you toss your manual does it not appear in your room in chapter 2 lmao?

>>712943557
this is my only problem with the fight
heals are too rng-heavy

>>712943490
Just you wait until we get the Baker from chapter 5 Dark World, cure blacksmith's gluten intolerance, and he'll be able to fuse Devilsknife and JusticeAxe into Susie's Ultimate Weapon

When did you guys realize that Berdly is the best Lightner by far?

>>712943090
FUCK this fight

>>712942278
I actually really like how it changes to
>Consider Strategy
when it has useful information to impart

>>712941924
>>712941804
Touhou succeeds at being what it is, and it also runs at 60fps. I just bring it up because that's what Toby is a fan of. You should name the games you're talking about

>>712941820
The game speed is tied to the framerate, so yeah.

>>712942040
I think that's kind of weird and unfortunate because Touhou especially 8 on easy mode is a great way to learn. Smarter design with the bullet patterns could have made UT/DR great games for training casuals too. Like does the player know that if there are directed attacks they should try to make tiny taps to the side? Teach them about that somewhere (humorously), check if they can do it during a boss, and then put it all together for the final boss fights. Undertale doesn't even tell the player they have a focused movement option

>>712943650
When I realize that he immediately realize what was happening in the weird route and locked in.

>>712943650
chapter 1

>game where you get the shadow mantle
>it's called Mantle
K I N O
I
N
O

>>712942079
Asriel would want Kris to get laid.

>>712943490
>but I'm pretty sure the Jevilstail is also him. He transforms on screen.
He transforms into the Devilsknife in both outcomes but he says:
Pacifist, Jevilstail
>TAKE THIS AND DO YOUR STRONGEST
Fight, Devilsknife
TAKE ME AND DO YOUR STRONGEST

>>712943626
Yeah, though instead it's replaced with a trashcan. You can avoid that though by just dropping it when Ralsei isn't in the party

Knight had me malding for a bit but I clutched the fuck up and beat him with only Susie left standing with 30 health. I used up a lot of good items, but fuck it, surely that won't ever come back to bite me in the ass haha.

>>712943650
From day one, krisrdly OTP btw

>>712943712
KINO, too, is an acronym.

>>712942316
>suffer
I only have one save file and it's for a Snowgrave route.

>>712943090
I feel like this boss wouldn't be so bad if the NES game didn't feel like some shitty LJN abomination than a classic Nintendo NES game.
I swear I kept getting snagged into corners and just seeing that was allowed (intentional or not) sent me seething.

>>712942524
>>712942557
>>712942563
I don't want to hurt the doe

>>712943765
You can embezzle Revive Mints from the Mizzles in Chapter 4.

>>712943765
you can't replace your spincake anymore either btw

I had a real hard time with Ch3 but I was pretty drunk at the time
Snowgrave Spamton's mine attack beat my ass

>>712943851
You have to hurt the doe in chapter 2 to get the true ending in chapter 4

>>712943735
i think toby decided to retcon the schizobosses only being one of the items in the later chapters.
you also get the spamton pippis scene in chapter 3 with either of the items.

>>712943851
Nah fuck her, she sucks. I only refrain from doing it so my man Kris doesn't suffer for it.

>>712943852
Missed opportunity to call it Embizzlement

>>712943819
it would be harder if it had actual zelda 1 movement, and easier if it had Link's Awakening sword arc

>>712943650
Honestly if he was with us and not fucking around, I feel things would be resolved faster. He picked up when things were serious very quickly.
Kris probably doesn't want somebody like that around though.

>>712943851
You need a worthy rival after all anon join us

>>712943786
it stands for
K I N O
I
N
O
which, too, is an acronym

Toby is my uncle and he told me that papyrus will be the chapter 6 secret boss

>>712943851
She's enjoying it.

>>712943650
I always knew
But didnt wanted to accept the truth until CH2 hit me in the face

>>712943917
What does he look like in the Puppet Scarf version of the scene?

Aww :')

>>712941684
i interpreted it as a girl with giant fluffy bangs facing straight ahead (right) instead of a girl with a snout looking up (left). i don't know if anyone else sees it but temmie used to draw hair like this

>>712944021
Edit of them kissing when

>>712943934
>Kris probably doesn't want somebody like that around though.
Of course, Berdly would solve everything and mess Kris' hidden plot with the Knight

>>712943650
Chapter 2 when I saw his stats and then got my ass kicked. He's way stronger than Susie.

>>712943851
same, this thread is full of CREEPS. imagine wanting to hurt this autistic weirdo.

>Final boss of 1 is a King
>Of 2 is a Queen
>Of 3 is a Knight
>Of 4 is a Rook (the titan forms from a big tower)
Chapter 5 will have a bishop (the priest) as the final boss, with chapter 6 having a pawn

>>712944087
What the hell is this?

>>712944006
it's the same afaik

>>712943851
I know, but (She) does

>>712941684
Yeah it's definitely Susie
She has the exact same pose in The Legend
Anons are retarded though so expect Woody-tier subversion theories all the way until ch7

>>712944050
example of temmie bangs

>>712943786
It stands for Killing Innocuous Nigger Obstacles

>>712943862
>boot up DR again to see if I still have mine
>it's still there
Phew

>>712944118
>Of 4 is a Rook (the titan forms from a big tower)
wrong, it's the knight again

Asgore bullet pattern that turns into a game of frogger but every vehicle is him driving in it

>>712944006
see for yourself, it's not the same actually
https://youtu.be/9hb5JIUAc1M

>>712944087
Not the same without the music

>>712941021
Me when I just brute force all the possible combinations til I get it right:

why does Tenna look at his arm and clutch it to the point of shaking every 3 seconds?

>>712943934
>>712944071
It might be that Berdly is a lot harder to control than the other two. Ralsei is a doormat and will do whatever he says, and Susie is too stupid to catch on to anything with out it being directly spelled out. Berdly is smart enough to know when something's up, wilful enough to tell people no, and strong enough to take a sucker punch from Kris so he can't even do that cheap shot x slash trick.

>>712943650
When i learned he was a TRVE GAMER and is now going for the harem route end (canon)

>>712943650
When he shows you his actual personality in snowgrave, drops all of the bullshit and gets ready to beat your face in for doing that to his friend

>>712944289
he's actually looking at (YOU)

>>712942589
Sex with human dressed as animals.

Man, what hundred of generations breeding with humans did to deer monsters

>>712943917
The text actually says that Spamton transforms into either, it doesn't say it about Jevil.
You're saying Toby Fox retconned it without actually showing Toby Fox retconning it.
Jevil still tells you he's going to sleep for 100 years and then flies off as the Devilsknife if you pacify him.
Which is something he doesn't say when you fight him because he becomes Susie's strongest weapon for the first 3 and a half chapters.

wait toby fox made the undertale demo when he was 20 years old...?
i'm a fucking talentless loser

>>712944118
>with chapter 6 having a pawn

Kris is the pawn.

I know he was lying but this bit was really peak, I can only hope deltarune hits notes as high
it reminds me of the ihnmaims game where AM or a part of him gets kinda sad or defeated by showing him compassion

>>712943650
Dude showed his true colors when I went to freeze his ass

I thought for a minute that ralsei could have been your phone, but then you keep that as a phone in the dark world for some retarded reason

>>712944440
Oh, it shows

>>712944021
>"noelle luv, make sure you DON'T TALK TO ME ABOUT THIS tomorrow"
>proceeds to talk to him about it
>repeatedly
>against his protests
dumb doe got what she fucking deserved

>>712933031
I actually like the change better since its a better indication of her mind getting fucked up. Im actually surprised Toby didnt change the scene itself like other modern devs would.
Toby is UNKEKED.

>>712943650
When he SINGLEHANDEDLY made it possible for us to beat Giga-Queen by rounding up ALL the Darkners to build the funny robot to beat the shit out of her with.

>>712943851
But I'm doing it for her own sake...

>>712923746 (OP)
Deltarune is. Its also the better game, play undertale first though, give chapter one its atmosphere.

>>712943685
>Teach them about that somewhere (humorously), check if they can do it during a boss, and then put it all together for the final boss fights
It would be better if it had done that, but it really didn't need to. Pacifist is easy enough to not need it, and genocide is supposed to be unfun. Deltarune really could use a more gradual difficulty curve if it really wants to be this hard.

>>712943921
>>712944114
Suselle annihilated this character, huh?
I hope he nukes it from orbit but I'm not optimistic it's a major mar on the story and characters

>>712944440
ill start trying next year :^)

>>712944142
>sword and not axe
>in the very same chapter Susie is called the DRAGON another different part of the prophecy

>>712944207
You don't fight it at all in that chapter dingus

Can we talk about how cool doom board is

>>712944289
he's making sure the audience is still watching

>>712943851
If it makes you feel any better, if (You) hurt the doe she'll hurt (You)

>>712944505
oh yeah that too. dude's clowned on for being cringe but he really does help where it counts

>>712944135
Who's [[Hyperlink Blocked]] do i have to [$!$!] to see her drain Kris' balls while smugly cackling?

>>712944417
why is it blue

What if Ralsei topped

>>712944289
Looking at the audience

>>712944654
its his blue attack

>>712944523
>the way his lips curl up into a smile
Toby is so fucking cringe for making Suselle canon. I don't think I'll ever forgive him

I did knight without the mantle because I got A rank in the second board, is it worth replaying to do the true game still?

>>712943862
Why did Toby do this?

>>712944556
he throws his swords at you while you're progressing and then susie throws some rude busters at him, I'd count that as fighting

>>712944423
sure but i'm saying he made them functionally identical in chapter 3+4
something that is interesting is that you don't get this >>712944223 spamton scene in the weird route even though you do get the puppet scarf because he is fucking dead.

>>712944021
we saved kris from getting smooched all over

thrash machine mecha could beat a titan

>>712943090
This sits right between Jevil and Snowgrave Neo in difficulty.

>>712944614
So far nothing like that is happening, you think it will really happen?

>>712944586
He saved that whole sequence from becoming below MID

>>712943650
Since chapter 1.

>>712943862
Fucking rip
>>712943852
This sounds nice though

>>712943650
when he became tsundere for susie after realising she was a gamer

>>712944731
Fucking Spamton could beat a titan, chapter 4 shows they're super weak and the roaring doesn't matter
Guess Toby needed more space for his retarded lesbians

>>712944692
He would somehow fumble and end up bottoming anyways

>>712944828
>jpg
very cool

>>712944440
It's over

>>712944496
>luv
>ramb got his mannerisms from kris
that's weirdly kinda cute though probably not accurate since he supposedly talks in a low monotone mumble and says shit like "unknown" instead of "i don't know"

>>712944758
I'm not sure, but imagine if in ch5 onwards you can't back out of Snowgrave anymore because SHE's keeping (You) on the route.

>>712944087
>"Kris, comma exclamation point! Everything has gone awry! Don't you wish there was a drug, some sort of extreme antidepressant to get through the day?"
>"Oh, heavens, what's this?"

>>712944118
Nah, Jackstein map shows 4 was the bishop. Rook got skipped, next is the flowers.

>>712944860
he was like 10 minutes old at most i don't think that was a full strength titan

>>712944440
It's never too late. Ever.

>>712943185
puppy girl femkris and bunny boy mkris
simple as

>>712944927
Why is he British

>>712944692
He always was the top in my fucked up homo faggot mind.

>>712943650
When this masterpiece graced my screen I knew a hero was in our midst.

>>712944731
>if you open too many fountains you'll cause the roating!
>the titans will awake!
>omg it's healing what do we do
all you needed was an old man to do a combo attack that does as much damage as you normally do anyways
the titans fight is terrible

>>712944967
I am 96

>>712944731
It jobbed to queen’s mech.

>>712944929
NTA but I could see it. Toby's gotta lock you in at some point, and the bedroom fiasco seems like the point of no return.

>>712944982
MANCOUNTRY is Deltarune's equivalent of the UK.

>Do Snowgrave
>Kris fears you and begs you to not to proceed with it
>Do normal/pacifist
>Beats you with a hockey stick
Fuck this little cunt, I was trying to be your wingman. Next save I'm picking all the friendless options

>>712944578
Only true gamers refused to answer the quiz questions and say I love TV

>>712944964
and they literally had backup via gerson, which makes it clear that unless they get *as* strong as him, it would still be hard as fuck to defeat them

>>712944927
British Kris is funny though

post the karl pilkington edit

>>712945013
This retarded idea of "hide the only difficult fights in secret routes and leave the story as a cakewalk" shit is pissing me off

>>712944860
Spamton NEO couuld break one's shell, but you have to slamdunk a human soul into its face hole to kill them, and if there's a bunch of them stomping all over the place it's gonna be GGs for hometown while you get the first one down

>>712944440
Tolkien was 45 for LotR nigga you just gotta move

>>712941616
>and boss fights usually pivot away from the bullet hell style into some gimmick or minigame.
Just like touhou!!

>>712945051
the real reason trashy exists is because of kris

>>712945016
which is still the strongest thing we've fought btw

>>712944614
>(you)elle reciprocal abuse sex
Toby pls

>>712945112
*blocks your path*

>>712944860
>super weak and the roaring doesn't matter

>ignoring the fact the FUCK SQUAD nearly got erased by 2 laser beams
>ignoring the fact the world was slowly flooded by darkness
>ignoring the fact even one single TITAN SPAWN was chasing them through the darkness and able to kill them dead
>ignoring the fact they're basically infinite spawners of darkness and that shadowed death was coming if you didn't climb up
>ignoring the fact that the only reason you didn't get 1 shot laserd was the fact you were climbing on it so it wouldn't hurt itself
>ignoring the fact that it wouldn't even be possible without the SOUL shining in the dark
>ignoring the fact it was the SOUL granting power to Susie and Gerson's rude blaster to even break its regeneration
>ignoring the fact that it was basically a FOUNTAIN and that it took a Human Soul to be dunked in to even close it

Spamton on a suit couldn't 1v1 Snowgrave Kris, get fucking real.

>Berdly shows up out of nowhere in Snowgrave with a halberd to grind
>intense remix of his theme starts playing
>it's called "Battle Against A True Gamer"
your reaction?

I LOVE TV!

>>712945186
The real fight is hidden, the game tricks you into thinking it's unbeatable and you have to reset to even get the option of fighting it properly

>>712945112
agnseed, holding a shadowcrystal should make the chapter boss harder but whatever

>>712945251
that's not hidden, that's just you giving up

>>712945204
CHADTON won the fight against Kris, there was literally nothing he could do to him without Noelle sucker punching him

>>712945224
i would kneel if he figured out that
>someone or someTHING is controlling kris, like a videogame
before anyone else, due to being a gamer himself

>>712945224
please don't write shit like this anymore

>>712945008
stop saving thumbnails

>>712945251
>t. scrub

>>712945141
he was also an english language professor who showed extraordinary talent at a young age. i'm a midwit whose only talent is following orders (no talent for music, took piano lessons for years but nothing clicked, can't draw, can't write, slow reader), and i go to a shitty no-name school in the middle of nowhere so i can become an insurance analyst

>>712945224
>Berdly unleashes his Supreme Gamer form
>it's just him putting a fedora on
>it somehow makes him the strongest boss in any chapter
>how is never explained

>>712945224
please keep writing shit like this

>>712945251
>this hard fight is secret because.... it's too hard and I assumed it was unbeatable

>>712945320
No, that's the game transitioning into a cutscene the second the party gets wiped for the first time

>>712945340
No

>>712937824
Yes and that's because the final fight is KILL or BE KILLED by Asgore. You literally cannot skip this btw, even if you do perfect pacifist you have to kill Asgore at least once to reach the true ending.

That, if anything, is proof that Deltarune will have a railroad ending.

>>712945224
>berdly shows up as a secret boss only if you abort snowgrave by saving him in the hospital to go on the twisted sword route
happening

>>712945326
That cheating fuck lost. We made things fair by stopping his little shitter of a plan and calling backup since he decided to be a healspam double action having mine attacking faglord. Get frozen by my sidepiece, shitfuck.

>>712945051
>Post yfw he STILL fucking hates you at the end of True Pacifist

>>712945336
solving a mystery via the wrong reasoning is always funny so I'd love if berdly was the one who blew the lid off everything perchance

>>712944830
Wasnt He Always A Tsundere?

>*What? NO. I Dont Care About Your Safety
*>I Only Care About Your Family Debt, You BAKA

>>712945393
Rouxls Kaard gave him a Rules card

>>712945204
>you were climbing on it so it wouldn't hurt itself
What a stupid rule, if they're supposed to exist just so they can destroy everything wouldn't it make more thematic sense for them to have zero sense of preservation and just attack everything without discrimination? they're not sentient either way

>>712945458
>railroad ending or just evil snow grave ending
That just sounds...awful, normie core will hate it beyond measure as well 4chan maybe

The "one ending" thing is a red herring btw

>>712945397
>>712945337
Who should I listen to?

>>712945560
yeah but having him now be interested in susie is pretty funny

>>712945458
Chapter 4 already had railroading with you being forced to mercy Jackenstein and forced to fight the Titan.

>>712945630
both
keep writing it and then delete it before you post anything

>>712945416
If you don't save before it the game progresses with no option to reset.
I thought beating the knight would require fighting tenna every single time before I realised you could backtrack

It's definitely presented as if it's a mandatory story loss

>>712945630
the heart :)

>>712945232
I LOVE TV!!!

>>712945326
>there was literally nothing he could do to hi-

>>712945535
Fuck Bitchris.

>>712945458
You don't kill Asgore though, Flowey kills him. And if you true pacifist then everyone lives.

>>712945619
>chapter 3

>>712945702
you know that you can be gay without being a giant fucking faggot, right?

>>712945619
it's gonna look like it's ending the same way initially and then SURPRISE! it changes depending on your choices
it's such a simple answer i'm amazed people are clinging to it

>>712945593
>wouldn't it make more thematic sense for them to have zero sense of preservation
prolly, but remember that it literally heals itself to stay alive in its fight. so it actually refusing to attack directly during the climbing segment does make sense within that context

>>712945326
>stalemate
>won
I'm a Spamtonfag but come on anon we know what happened last time someone tried that shit Undertale
what I never see anyone talking about however is how Snowgrave's Spamton NEO is basically a Titan skill-wise
>spawns little fuckers to attack you
>blaster shots almost identical Titan's attacks after he loses his shield
>gains incredible defense and regenerates when close to death
>game dictates you need external help to be defeated it

>>712945593
>meant to be a force of destruction
>but literally can't even do so because if a single creature gets on it, they kill themselves
Are you for real, or like, just pretending. Because this is the equivalent of your mega prototype tank having a self destruct button hardwired to a nuclear bomb if anyone ever gets inside of it ever without being on the whitelist, that's a glaring flaw. The tank crew can just kill the hijacker, or have anything else do it, that's like a nuclear warhead self defusing permanently because a russian existed within 10 kilometers.
>>712945710
Based

I hate that both Undertale and Deltarune's pixel artstyle is painfully simplistic (akin to pre-Gen 4 Pokemon) because god damn, Toby and his team know how to make character designs that can stand out.

>>712945579
>the two chucklefucks team up and become the strongest antagonist in the game
Toby could never

>>712945710
AIIIIEEEEEEEEEE

>>712945710
Kris Spams x-slash on Spamton and it doesn't work. Neo is known for its high defense for a reason.

>>712945832
Funny you mention Spamton NEO is a titan considering his final move is quite literally, turning into a BIG FUCKIN SHOT

>>712945416
Do you retards even play the game? Control is taken from you the second you lose and it forces you to manually restart to try again

>>712944828
>the heart(player[you]) is a hot evil bratty shortstack with a huge ass and thick thighs
i want noelle to rape correct her(you)
>>712944989
based fag

>>712945832
it's entirely possible that spamton neo is literally a titan in snowgrave
Although it would be a bit superfluous given that we know how he came about

>>712945710
JOBton bros...

>>712945859
If a mosquito lands on you do you just not crush it out of fear of killing yourself? The titans just fucking suck and Toby blew it

>>712945769
anon, I....

>>712945832
Does that mean snowgrave would one shot a titan?

>>712945710
i used to hate this theory but i never stopped to think what kris' knife would be in the dark world
it should be insanely OP

>>712945928
I knew I forgot to mention something in my post

BTW even in chapter 2 susie's heal gets stronger the more you use it
So theoretically she can be a better healer than ralsei before chapter 3 begins

Although it's kind of fucking stupid to grind that

>>712946006
if youre a modestly sized faggot you'll hit your head less

>>712946002
More accurately, this would be if a spider landed on you and you pulled out a .357 revolver to point blank that bitch. It's a plain bad idea, if you can vaporize the FUCK SQUAD you'll vaporize yourself too.

>>712945710
>Retards still refusing to accept that the attack comes from the knight
Do you underaged shonenspics actually think Kris is Goku? The VFX is named after the knight in the files

>>712945630
write and post it. nta but i like the gaymer bird

>>712946062
but does that carry over?

>>712945861
I like the simplistic art and hate how the new chapters moved away from it.

>>712946147
yes, IIRC

>>712946062
Does the grind for the better heal reset if you lose to Gerson? I don’t think it does but I wasn’t paying too much attention on the numbers.

People saying Sans is harder than the Knight are only saying it because you're used to the combat style by now. If the Knight was the final boss of Undertale genocide 10 years ago and Sans was the shadow crystal boss 2 weeks ago, no one would be saying that Sans is harder.

>>712945861
shit taste

>>712946103
>The VFX is named after the knight in the files
irrelevant when kris kneeling is called krisknighting

>no one
>DBZ reference
why are ESLs like this

>>712946062
I think chapter 2's improvements reset in chapter 3, but chapter 3's do carry over to 4.

>>712946163
No.

>>712946062
>she can be a better healer than ralsei
Not a high bar

>>712945928
So was Spamton's plan to become a titan so he would survive the roaring?

>>712946163
No, it carries between resets
It's sort of like a rubber banding mechanism if you know it exists

>>712946163
If anything it gets better after Gerson. I used it during the titan fight and it cost 77 TP and healed 100 HP

>>712946084
anon...........

>>712946201
Sure thing, let's ignore how every other sprite coming from the actual knight has the same naming as the surprise slash
You retards spout Mike tier theories and it hasn't even been a month

>>712946103
Its the same color and sprite as Kris's x-slash though. The knight's x-slash is red.

>>712946226
Spamton wants to become a lightner, that’s why he’s got the sun drawn in his shop and in his little personal “drive around town” ride. He’s likely using titan-like moves due to his proximity to the fountain of darkness

>>712946286
o

>>712945832
Sans died because he's a retard, defense mode Spamton is mathematically unkillable

>>712944114
Noelle being a vorefag makes a scary amount of sense

>>712946363
Susie and Ralsei simply aren't known for their high defense.
The rough taste of [Little Sponge] [Value Pack]

>>712946363
X slash is blue

>>712946367
Maybe his pursuit of [HEAVEN] was approaching something that is the inverse of a titan, equally powerful, but in the opposite way. Being made of light instead of dark. The Neo body is a lightner's dream after all.

>>712946103
>muh filename
Toby knows people will parse the fucking code for anything
he tried not making it super obvious and clearly he did since drooling retards like you took the bait

>>712946184
No.
Sans has:
>No invincibility frames.
>Karma poison
>UI attacks
>You have less health.
>You have worser items
>No party members to use as shield.
He is 100% harder.