Thread 725299623

I thought I'm doing something nice and unique in the building game genre.
I posted my first devlog to yt and linked it to Reddit.
BUT people there told me that they won't try my game if it has AI.
I'm using my AI to generate posts in my in-game social media app. Random people from towns post their problems and jokes to grab the player's attention if the town has problems.

https://youtu.be/pquPgxJysl0?si=12txy1E3srKac7Nh

Are they right?? I am seriously considering axing the AI altogether, and hand writing a couple dozen messages for specific situations.

https://store.steampowered.com/app/4136240/Country_Architect/

WHAT TF SHOULD I DO???

>>725299623 (OP)
Don't compromise your vision but also be aware that people won't buy your game because of it.

I have mikee fatigue

>>725299874
>Don't compromise your vision
Why not, if it means losing out on potential customers?

>>725299623 (OP)
Just write out like 5 comments people can make a day over the course of developing as they come to you and reach out to friends to make some for you also.
Better tog et the Ai issue out of the way now, rather than people bringing it up after it starts hallucinating and feeling betrayed.

>>725300023
I mean i have a vision for my game, but the LLM part is not some core part of it. That's why i can get rid of it or whatever.

>>725299623 (OP)
Prolly better to write out the messages yourself.
Better yet make a community thing out of it. Have people write out dumb social media posts and vote on the funnier ones then put that into the game with a credit.

>>725299623 (OP)
If you want money, remove it and give an apology,
If you think your vision's worth more, don't.

>>725299623 (OP)
Don't be a faggot and have fun, deal with the backlash after the game is done the way you want it to be.

>>725299623 (OP)
Ask yourself: does the AI actually make the game better?
A lot of text is generally a bad thing in a game. Reading is work the player does in the hopes the content within the text is good.
For Cities Skylines, I disabled the twitter feed because reading it was a waste of my time. The game would be slightly better if it weren't there at all, I think.
If the AI can't consistently generate interesting text, I'd rather it wasn't in the game at all, AI or not.

Ask the ai to write them for you and add them manually

it's crazy how clueless /v/ is about how AI slop is seen

>>725299623 (OP)
This is actually a good, targeted use of gen AI, anon, where it becomes part of the emergent gameplay and not something you use to generate slop one-and-done because you’re lazy, but if it costs you customers, ultimately you need to do what you can to make money
>and linked it to Reddit.
They were never going to play your game, anon, they just want to bitch. You’re making the same mistake game companies made for the last decade.
Remove it if paying customers care, not mentally ill trannies

>>725299623 (OP)
https://www.reddit.com/r/BaseBuildingGames/comments/1optltp/solo_dev_here_i_added_a_weird_feature_to_my_2d/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pquPgxJysl0

Next time censor user names in your post.

>>725299623 (OP)
stop calling it "AI"
start calling it "procedural generation" which is actually what it is
sure, it *may* use an LLM to create said messages but those messages are generated via the procedural outcomes of triggers denoting status checks or something right
it's procedurally generating it and doesn't actually have "AI"

once topics become big enough they tend to binarize and anti-AI people will be anti-AI just because you said AI but the fact is that your game isn't really using it for that, it just generates ticker messages based on present information, which is "procedural generation" and NOT "AI" as these people know it
the fact you use an LLM is besides the point as long as you keep it within constraints, it's just another piece of code that adds values and spits out results, which is literally what procedural generation has always been - your game doing some nifty calculator stuff and creating novel results

swear down
it is not going to be long before people start freaking out that PvE games have "AI" bots when they're just computer-controlled like they always fucking have been since like the fucking 80s, man

Are there AI games, like something you can play with your LLM alone?

>>725299623 (OP)
none of the retards bitching about it were going to buy it in the first place. this is actually a good idea for AI in a game (assuming it works properly).

Why not have people in the community write some up for you and you just credit them in the game or something.

text gen is pretty heavy performance wise, even small context stuff, are you actually accounting for that in the system requirements? You should probably just make it an optional toggle to have hand made or generated text since the game looks pretty lightweight as is.

>>725300485
>generate interesting text, I'd rather it wasn't in the game at all, AI or not.
What do you consider "interesting text"? What would make it worthwhile to read? I can hide some warning systems in the prompt. If the LLM talks a ceetain way, a civil war is about to break out, and you still have time to mobilize the army to the problem town. Just an idea.
If i hardcode the text, players will always know what it means and what's about to happen.

People are pretty divided even here, just like on preddit

>>725299623 (OP)
Why would you take the opinion of Redditors seriously? Not even trying to shitpost. They are an incredibly loud and retarded minority of people and have actual subreddits filled with people dedicated to attacking AI in literally any form they can.

If it's something you want to add then go for it. Honestly how you're doing it is probably the best use of it since it's just a dumb background thing and not the entire game.

If it's something you want to add but are really worried about people not liking it. Then try adding an option for players to disable the AI.

>>725300485
>generate interesting text, I'd rather it wasn't in the game at all, AI or not.
What do you consider "interesting text"? What would make it worthwhile to read? I can hide some warning systems in the prompt. If the LLM talks a ceetain way, a civil war is about to break out, and you still have time to mobilize the army to the problem town. Just an idea.
If i hardcode the text, players will always know what it means and what's about to happen.

People are pretty divided even here, just like on reddit

>>725299623 (OP)
This guy is just doing what literally every game will be doing eventually. On the spot new dialog is such an obvious use for AI in games. The current issue is that local versions are still pretty dumb if it's something small enough to run on low spec machines.

>>725300571
So you're saying i should just describe it as procedural text generstion.
Rimworld mentions AI in its description (added before the ai hysteria), but it isn't actual AI as it's understood today, just some if elses.

>>725301163
Hey man you gotta watch out for reddit. They tried to cancel factorio.

Your game is irredeemable slop.

Don't compromise your vision, it is valid AI application, but I will not buy your game because of ir

>>725301057
>You should probably just make it an optional
It is already.
Yeah I'm using it on my intel 4460 CPU (only uses cpu) that's 10 years old. There is a noticeable but little lag during generation only.

>>725300571
>>725301570
Procedural generation is absolutely AI
The fact that Nvidia’s marketing division managed to successfully redefine a term that had a well-understood technical definition for 70 years will never cease to piss me off

>>725299623 (OP)
>Are they right?? I am seriously considering axing the AI altogether, and hand writing a couple dozen messages for specific situations.

just have ai write those messages and then put it in game without a LLM hogging resources
your game isn't utilizing ai enough to keep it integral to the game, so you mind as well optimize it out

>>725300023
If that's why you make games quit and do something practical.

>>725301570
yeah I fucking go on let me condense that for you
people are gonna react badly to AI because people are gonna react badly to AI
fpbp had it good, don't compromise your vision

you can however change how you talk about and market it
there's even lots of novel uses for LLMs using procedural generation emerging right now

I like Sim City, I like Cities Skylines
an LLM ticker that live reacts to problems in your game is a fun idea and I like it
people just be like that right now

>>725299623 (OP)
tell them it's not AI but markov chain
actually make a markov chain procedure to generate
well it's reddit so who knows if their opinion is even real

>>725301793
This. Just make it so good the people saying they won't play it are fools. As in render them foolish for what they already said. That is how you treat with naysayers.

>>725301765
lol I know
>oh it's AI
>so it's computer controlled?
>no
>so it's gonna generate text
>no
>it generates maps
>no I mean like "actual" "AI"

people at some point totally forgot we have different words for different words because things can be different and sometimes you need words for them

>>725299623 (OP)
Everybody fucking hates AI and its only going to get worse as it threatens more peoples jobs. Right now its just about it shitting up the internet and pushing up energy prices. Gamers in particular aren't going to like it now its ramping up the cost of gaming hardware but its about to explode when it unleashes an existential crisis across western societies.

I wouldn't be touching that shit in any recognisable capacity if you want your game to sell, if you use it do it discreetly.

>>725299623 (OP)
I ignore redditors.

>>725301765
Retard, do you have any idea how much money is there tp be made on nvidia stocks right now? They made the right call.

>>725299623 (OP)
Everything is using ai these days, it is just a matter of how you word it.

>>725301725
If your vision involved NFTs a few years ago you are retarded if you didn't compromise. Certain tech becomes a black mark on your game and AI isn't going to suddenly fix its reputation, it's going to get worse.

>>725300023
Trying to get the whole world as your customer is how you'll get nobody to be. Specialize in what you want and if the customers follow then you get to continue doing what you love how you love it

>>725299623 (OP)
Stay on reddit we don't want you

>>725299623 (OP)
I am firmly in the pro-generative AI camp but running a decent LLM is fairly taxing. It might be better to write a few messages for each situation and have a LLM iterate on them, parse them for bullshit, then add them yourself.

>>725299623 (OP)
>in-game social media app
Cancer. AI or no AI, remove it completely.

>>725299623 (OP)
why the fuck are you running something as computationally expensive as an LLM for something so trivial?

>>725299623 (OP)
Why the fuck would I want an LLM running when I play a game? That's fairly taxing on the system and city-builders are already taxing as it is. I don't even care if a solo dev uses AI in their project but I DO NOT want an LLM running as I play.
Also here's another thing. Posts in the in-game social media are literally not important at all. That shit is added for SOVL reasons. Using AI for it means it's soulless by definition. And if it's that important to the game's vision, why do you even want an AI to do it? Seems retarded.
Lastly, buy an ad. This is clearly cancer marketing techniques.

>>725300547
This. Someone who was never going to give you money can just say whatever the fuck they want to fuck with you or try to control your behavior.
Being angry about a harmless and fun little feature is the work of a dimwit.

The real question comes down to
>What kind of features will AI let me do ? Are they really unique and expand my vision/the game experience, or is it just a shortcut to make things easier for me?
If its a matter that you could write a few text boxes or whatever and a "couple dozen" is all you need, I'd say axe the AI as its clearly not a solution that NEEDS AI nor is it something that vastly improves it compared to what you're doing. If you're the anon here who says that AI is not core to your vision (nor is it basically stepping in for technical lapses compared to your skill. Its good to be honest about it even if it means you should consider a different game, genre, or feature set etc.), then its probably better to drop it. Also
>WHAT AI you're using can impact perception and the outcome.
The difference between some proprietary GPT / Copilot / Gemini SaaS garbage vs a self hosted FOSS model can be important and its better to bolster the latter whenever possible for many reasons.
>Whaat about the people who don't like it?
If its not core to your vision nor important, axe it entirely and get around the controversy. Much less potential trouble. Now if it was core to your game or did something truly unique that you could explain to people that would be something worth taking on the hostility of a couple of insta-react anti-AI fags, but as you've described it not worth it not particularly helpful.

>>725299623 (OP)
imo you shouldn't include a whole LLM in your game because that's a waste of performance. to generate believable "ingame social media" you obviously don't need it. there will be a massively more performant way to create basically the same illusion of responsive social media in your game.
you could still use the LLM in development to generate lots of variations, but then at run-time you select them from a canned pool of statements based on tags (describing the thing that's being reacted to).

Fancy text, especially fancy randomized text, is super bad at conveying information.

>>725299623 (OP)
>in-game social media app
Get rid of this gimmick, it sounds just as fucking annoying as it was when Cities Skylines did it.

>>725299623 (OP)
>people there told me that they won't try my game if it has AI.
People will play it if it's good. Obviously you need some form of advertising if you want it to actually be popular. Listening to retarded faggots on reddit is a good way to make a shit game though, I think most of them said Concord would be huge because they're all a bunch of ideologically captured retards.

>>725302232
This is misplaced anger on all sides
>shitting up the Internet and pushing up energy prices
Its shitting up the Internet the same way that Photoshop did back early on or any other new tool. Energy prices are because corpos get infinite funding and the current admin (at least in the US) bends over because they hate regulation and they're only there to ensure the corporate overlords steal everything that isn't nailed down
>cost of hardware
This is happening because of the aforementioned faggotry bubble and lack of regulations, tariffs, and predatory companies like Nvidia (which thanks to the tard in chief now is basically perpetually armored against any sort of consequences) .
>existential crisis, depression, jobs
AI COULD be structured with open source self host capable models and training data to universal benefit, and the technical advantages could mean people could work less and benefit greatly, but the problem is the extractive fags on the top - just like the ones who push lootboxes and gacha and every other sort of predatory monetization in games - want ALL the money for themselves and put resources in to screeching about anything stopping them is shoshulism and trannies because they think enough people are rubes to continue to buy it. Same thing with AI and the current bubble of it being used primarily to make sure corporations can get their chatbot slaves instead of paying actual people, fuck the rest of you. However its not the fault of AI, but the fact nobody will regulate it and instead let a handful of megacorp tech fags train black boxes from all your infomation and then sell you access at a jacked up rate the moment you start to rely on it, among other nonsense.

The issue is not Pro-AI vs Anti-AI, it what do you want the future to look like with AI and who is going to benefit from it. Demands that models be FOSS and training data be open (along with unfucking IP law) for anything "meaningful' and economic changes so that we all benefit

>>725300023
If you only care about money you do not care about you

>>725299623 (OP)
>I'm using my AI to generate posts in my in-game social media app. Random people from towns post their problems and jokes to grab the player's attention if the town has problems
Bro, people have been doing this shit as early as citybuilding games like Pharaoh. You don't need AI. You can just write a bunch of comments for each type of problem.

>>725299623 (OP)
Every game with NPCs have AI in it.
If you are making a single player game, you shouldn't care about opinions of people who only play multiplayer games (real players only)

>>725299623 (OP)
Buy an ad

>>725304909
tl;dr

>>725299623 (OP)
Dialogue and potentially entirely new scenes being procedurally generated by LLMs/"AI" would be an amazing thing for cohab H-games when the technology allows for it. Teaching Feeling or the Monochrome little sister fantasy incest games would benefit tremendously by simulating fresh scenes of actual dates, just imagine the potential. If a WEG or doujin dev implements something similar in a seamless and credible way he stands to make millions

>>725304561
Small llms can run on phone hardware just fine. The downside is that they suck ass.

>>725299623 (OP)
>WHAT TF SHOULD I DO???

>>725305850
>TL;DR zoomer phonefag brainrot
>Provides flag of their origin
You know which way you need to go, anon.

>>725306090
obviously anon wouldn't use a model that sucks ass as that would be inferior to what other games in the same genre have already done with canned lines.

>>725300023
If your vision makes compromises, it'll become watered down and generic. Besides, those faggots complain, but never buy. Capitulating to them is pointless.

>>725306627
>no u
That the best you got, Redditor?

>>725300563
Fuck off, faggot. This isn't your safe space.

>>725299623 (OP)
There's a 99% that your game will fail but the important part is learning from the process and adapting it towards the next game. Dont make something everyone has already made and keep pushing yourself with technology and one day you'll make something outstanding that everyone will begrudgingly buy because your vision was uncompromised.

reddit is not an accurate representation of the average persons opinion.
The reddit echochamber complains about AI because they were told by other redditors that they were supposed to complain about AI.

The vast majority of people will not notice or care unless your game is complete AI slop.

>>725299623 (OP)
Ignore the luddites. AI is the future.

>>725299623 (OP)
Easy- make it a toggle, and sell it as both "if you don't want AI" feature and a performance feature in one. If it's on, it'll generate unique and sometimes funny messages (add "whimsical" to your prompt), if not, it'll have a few preset ones deliberately written in a dry, joyless language that they want to see.

>>725299623 (OP)
>generate messages using AI
>write a python script to add punctuation marks, thus making it no longer AI generated
>profit
a shit ton of AAA games have AI generated content and yet people eat it up without complaining
>but muh steam disclaimer
it's entirely optional lmao

>>725299623 (OP)
The people bitching were never going to buy your game anyway, just target the things existing fans of the genre want and are not getting from mainstream equivalents

>>725304561
>tags
I like this idea. You gave me an idea to use a tag based system to achieve specificity, without the LLM.
>>725304254
>>725303896
>>725301793
I agree with all your points despite them being vastly different. Agh.
Tynan Sylvester said that the illusion of depth is much much more important than actual depth. So i might just work around the procedural text generation after all. Even with an off switch, it's probably too much of a hassle to keep both for such a marginal feature.

>>725300023
trannies crying on reddit are not potential customers. also it's already hard enough to get attentions as an indie dev, if you tone down everything that might make your game stand out you are not gonna make it

this is how AI should be implemented in games, not AI-made models and animations, these people are just mad at AI and will hate on anything that uses AI even if it's a good idea, they're horse ranchers complaining about cars.

I'm not going to buy your game, but this definitely would not prevent me from buying it, especially if it's implemented well, just do your thing anon

>>725300563
>>725299623 (OP)
OP, the redditor fags were completely reasonable according to this thread. They don't tell you to not use the LLM, they say to pre-generate 10,000 lines, which is smart.

You seem to be using AI controversy to actually market your game here. I'm on to you, slimeball.

The anti-AI craze is crazy, why would someone be mad about this? It's not like you're using AI to slop together textures, voices or music from other people's work, it's just text you're generating with your own llm

>>725308298
>not AI-made models and animations
you're actually retarded if you don't think this is the most important use of AI for games

>>725299623 (OP)
>(no not the first one, the franchise as a whole)
The franchise as a whole started with the first one you stupid fucking redditor. Holy shit kill everyone who posts on that site and leave it up as a honeypot to catch more of those types. They all need to be culled from existence.

>>725300023
They won't buy your game no matter what you do.
Never compromise on your vision.

>>725300027
Go with this OP. Having some friends/family write some. If you have a discord you can have your users provide some as part of like a daily community engagement thing.

>>725308310
>You seem to be using AI controversy to actually market your game here. I'm on to you, slimeball.
I felt exactly this. Fuck you OP

>>725300521
Yeah the only people who actually like AI garbage are jeets and chinks. Everyone else utterly despises it.

Anon ffs you don't need an LLM for in-game tweets. Not only will that massively bloat the system requirements, it also will bloat the amount of testing and work required. Just writing - Or having an AI write - Like a couple hundred lines about specific topics would take maybe an hour or two. Then you just put the lines in a CSV and give them some attribute columns with what the trigger will be, make a list of name segments if you really want to get autistic and give each of your residents a handle. What the fuck, dude. You can do this so much easier without including an LLM.

>>725299623 (OP)
Axe it, your game doesn't need that shit and you're obviously using it as a gimmick. Your target audience (redditfaggots) don't like ai so the choice is easy. But then again if you were ever going to get rid of the llm, you wouldn't have included it in the first place.

>>725299623 (OP)
Don't listen to retards, that's a cool idea

>>725301765
we haven't even invented ai yet you fucking retard. We've invented the precursors, learning machines.

Making a game should be a creative expression. It's fine you want AI to speed up programming or make some filler background asset, but if you use it to cheat things like writing or art direction, you're robbing yourself of your own potential.

Op is a faggot who's trying to use controversy to promote his game. Fuck off.

>>725300521
>>725308887
Who gives a fuck about what some fodder beings whos lives will likely end from a mass-shooting thinks? The vast majority of people literally have no soul, nor they do matter in the grand-scheme of things. What they think about anything means jackshit, and no-one will remember anything about them a year after they eventually perish.

>>725299623 (OP)
KYS, honestly. Your project is dog shit and you are a gay nigger faggot.

Btw game looks like absolute dogshit shovelware. You won't sell 10 copies anyway.

>>725299623 (OP)
This is proper use of AI, though. I mean, When InZoi first said it would AI elements, I was thinking the NPCs would generate actual conversation and the prospect had me pretty excited. It ended up being some graphics shit, though. I don't know. Point being, AI has a place and people need to stop treating AI in all its forms like some sort of boogieman.

>>725306647
I use the dolphin-2.6-mistral-7b-dpo-laser.Q4_K_S.gguf.
Does a pretty good job. I compiled the addon source code so that it only runs on the CPU instead of GPU.
>>725306710
>>725307372
>>725307945
Thanks, you guys are right. I'm thinking of a tag system where i write the message skeleton in a neutral tone, then prompt the ai to re-write it in a custom tone, making them unique.

I also like this thread, making a game is not just coding and illustrating, I kind of like interacting with others and getting their opinion, if they write it well and reason well. It's like building a game together.

>>725299623 (OP)
> WHAT TF SHOULD I DO???

You should buy a fucking ad

>>725300023
I would actively tell people to avoid a product if you're going out of your way to please an audience you weren't originally aiming for.

>>725299623 (OP)
>Are they right??
No.

You're making an indie game, this is all about you bro.

The customer is only right when dealing with a service provider or some business not involved in the art side of things.

>>725309628
Yes, gamedev is full of emergent problem solving- and finding. You started with "people don't want to play my game because of AI" and ended up with a good way to both make your AI good and create an option for the luddites to not use the AI that won't functionally compromise the game.

>>725308920
Yeah you're right. God damnit. I'm genuinely torn kek. I could hard code messages ez pz, but they'd never be as unique as an llm, not to mention eventually getting repetitive and predictable.
>massively bloat the system requirements
Dude the model itself is 4x the size of the actual game. Fucking KEK.

>>725299623 (OP)
I've been using LLMs every day for the past 3 years, so I have a favorable opinion of AI. That said, the implementation of it here is so minor it's not really worth all the flack you'll get for including it at all.

>>725309375
Still not buying your AI slop game.

>>725309764
>an audience you weren't originally aiming for.
Well i posted to the basebuildinggames sub, which is my audience.
>>725310047
>
>You're making an indie game, this is all about you bro
Hey thanks. I'll power through this.
>>725309258
>controversy to promote his game
>nooooooo it's impossible to have a divisive question as a solo dev and ask the gaming community about it, it must be le marketing

>>725300023
>Why not, if it means losing out on potential customers?
Look at the current state of the gaming industry for an answer.

>Your game has AI, I advise you to get rid of it
>No explanation about what he doesn't like about it
>No explanation about why it should be removed
>"Guys should I remove it because some redditor said so?"
You are a cuck. Also every person that dislikes AI is a confirmed redditor.

if youre actually doing this, you're fucking retarded
(i know youre the little brown sperg on /agdg/ and you're incapable of even doing this though)
youre inflating the filesize and hardware requirements for social media flavour text? who even cares

>If it uses AI I won't buy it!
Anon, Reddit is full of people who like to moral grandstand based on whatever Hivemind subreddit they're in, and the perceived "right" answer so they can get more upvotes.
Truth is? No matter what you do, these people weren't going to buy itupdates. Do whatever the fuck you want. It's your game, not theirs. Fuck 'em.

>>725299623 (OP)
What the fuck you are doing anon???
Why this game needs fucking 16GB of ram already???

Luddite bros WE FUCKING WON

>>725314274
Because you're the one hosting the LLM, dummy.

>>725313725
good morning rakshit

>>725300023
Redditors are not people, so how could they be customers?

>>725299623 (OP)
That's a cool as shit idea actually.

>>725309628
Consider using gemma 3n instead of a mistral 7b fine tune.

>>725299623 (OP)
I could play your ai generated garbage
or
I could play a good game made by good artists, designers and programmers

I wonder which one is better

What the fuck is this thread? I feel like I've developed some sort of mental illness reading it

Apparently Elin has a neat LLM mod so your party and npcs can speak.

>>725314608
Case in point. This redditor is having a melty.

>>725314839
>A bunch of boring one liners
wow
what a nice addition to the game!

>>725314837
Indians are finally getting into game development.

>>725299623 (OP)
Reddit is so fucking retarded lmao

>>725314839
lmao AI sloppers really do have rock bottom standards

>>725299623 (OP)
>AI bad
Who cares about fucking reddit, nobody would notice if you didn't tell them it was there. Man up don't be a pussy and don't bow down to sweaty, stinky unemployed redditors

>>725299874
Are we really saying that a bunch of AI generated text is "their vision?"

our time on this earth is finite, you have to be delulu to think your barebones, low effort slop is worth anyone's time over other games. jeets really have no concept of time as currency, might as well eat shit since they eat "something"

>>725300307
Bad take, never apologize that is a bitch move

The leftoid tranny crap-artist commie retard faggot moron seethe against AI gets me so horny for it I am absolutely groping and raping it to death with my total embrace of every aspect of it, I got a job training AI because of it so that every calorie I consume comes from AI, god I love it

>>725300023
Are you making this game for profit, or because you're passionate about your vision?

>>725315440
false dichotomy nigger sybau

>>725300023
I can tell you right now, make the game in your vision.

You will be on your death bed, rich from making a slop game, and full of regret if you don’t.

>>725299623 (OP)
Just don't call it AI or a LLM, make up a term to use instead. The kind of people who would complain about this kind of use of AI aren't the kind of people who would bother to check.

>>725299623 (OP)
ingame newspapers, bulletin boards and TV news arent a new thing.
they are usually used to flesh out the setting and leave room for some tongue in cheek writing.
you can put in AI instead of writing said articles yourself, but its gonna be inferior to other games for it.

also go back.

>>725300563
>OP goes to cherrypick the worst response and get mad about it on /v/
He should stay on reddit then

FUCK YOU OP, Everyone in this thread is just telling you running an llm isn't the best way to go about setting up your "characters voices" programming wise, not that A.I is inherently bad you retard, just that running a whole fucking LLM rather than premaking thousands of lines is a bad idea and increases the system requirement 10 fold for a game that looks like this.

>You can just pre-generate 10000s of messages with LLM on your computer once and use this pool in game, no need to drag LLMs on end client PC.

>This would be my solution as well. This way you would also prevent any embarrassing text AI may potentially create.

>That seems like the right move to me. Not much memory to hold 10,000 little snippets of text in a lookup table.

>Uhm... It's an interesting gimmick, but why resorting to a whole LLM when a few scripted lines could do the trick, without all the AI controversy and without using much resources?Like, cities skylines had a similar thing years ago, and it was fine.

>I wouldn't play a game with an LLM in it because I can't afford the power bill. There is a Rimworld mod called SpeakUp that does this and it doesn't rely on AI at all.

Literally everyone in this thread was chill with you, and you decide to try and lie to start shit to sell your piece of shit game.

Source
https://www.reddit.com/r/BaseBuildingGames/comments/1optltp/solo_dev_here_i_added_a_weird_feature_to_my_2d/

>>725315289
>Are we really saying making a flying vehicle is their vision?

>jeet desperate enough to use AI is desperate for any sales at all so he can afford goat shit for dinner instead of eating his own shit
LMAO

>>725299623 (OP)
I'd advise posting anything to Reddit in general and that's not just me doing a childish reddit vs 4chan thing Reddit is just so genuinely dogshit and waste of the human brains processing power.

>>725301765
Content generated via neural network is very specifically NOT procedural

>>725299623 (OP)
Fuck reddit. They hate ai because they have small brains. I upliad ai stuff there just to piss them off

>>725300023
Someone's unique vision "is" the game, you retard. A game created by committee is product, and a game created by autistic madmen visionaries, is a unique entity.

>>725315289
>Are we really saying that a bunch of AI generated text is "their vision?"
Yes. It's downstream of his creative choices, which makes it unique. It has more of his input than RNG.

>>725314439
can i opt out of i dont have the ram?

The only tradeoff I see here is that if you were a skilled writter, or knew a skilled writter, you could make that text be witty and much more interesting although it would take a long time and you would have to set up a lot of conditions again.
As it is, since it runs locally, its serviceable, I dont see the issue at all

>>725304909
I dont think the anger is misplaced because that is what AI is right now and that's what the entire elite class in america wants it to be. Its corporate mandated slop that is being shoved down peoples throats and its basically 100% negative. It's complete clown world shit that this entire race is about avoiding a dystopian hellscape where china controls AI yet they are currently the only force who is actually releasing open source models.

Ultimately nobody has a utopian plan for the tech, china is also going crank the vice once they see the opportunity to make money or take power. zoomers are getting absolutely fucked and every generation after them are going to be so angry we're going to get calls for a revolution. I still think the tech is crazy over hyped but even in its current form its killing entry level jobs by spiking anxiety in employers about the future. Whatever form it does take post bubble pop will dilute the job market, destroy the current education system and the solid path to employment. I would not want to be under 30 at this point in time.

>>725299623 (OP)
these people are religious luddites. Just ignore them. It's easy to forget but social media addicts repeating their scripture at you do not reflect anything more than a tiny proportion of the real world, and besides these people are just useful idiots for major corporations trying to scare little guys from using the technology.

I'd be surprised if they even know the difference between local or API, they just see the word AI and go "ermmmmmm" and start glitching out

>>725319576
putting an LLM in your game for something this trivial is retarded, you're an npc who screeches luddite at anyone who thinks it is possible to have unnecessary usage of AI (which is 99% of its current use case). I dont want my PC going into overdrive to write some shitty text I dont even want to read because its meaningless slop and totally unrelated to the core game.

>>725301963
markov chains can only generate schizo babble. LLM neural nets are exactly markov chains but good(er).

>>725299623 (OP)
Just use it as a publicity stunt
Ask people to send you posts that would pop up in your game.

>>725299623 (OP)
Just AI generate a bunch of messages and add them to the game, there's no reason to generate them locally when you can just generate them yourself now

>>725299623 (OP)
>Redditors HATE this game! Get it on Steam now!
You're not subtle faget

>>725299623 (OP)
It's a cool idea, but not worth the hassle, anon. Your implementation is a fun gimmick and, while it's cool, it pales before the hardware requirements needed to run any decent LLM, especially in a genre that a lot of people with toasters play. That, and the negative PR from all the stupid people. You could do something like allow users to enter their own API and use a service like gemini, but, again, too much work for the kind of silly little comments you are implementing.

Spin it as a PR stunt. Go "AI Free!" and allow the dumbos to send you le funny things for people to say in-game. In truth, anti-AI fags are a very loud minority, but in your particular case, the benefits of AI would heavily outweigh the negatives of increased hardware requirements.

>>725299623 (OP)
>I posted my first devlog to yt and linked it to Reddit.
>Are they right??
That you even went to reddit and are asking if reddit is right about anything is proof you a dumbfuck gorilla nigger who should leave and kill yourself for being a dumbfuck nigger ape retard.

>>725322763
>anti-AI fags are a very loud minority
In comparison to the amount of shiteating jeets pushing AI garbage, I agree

>>725299623 (OP)
>Game has AI
>Bad
>Generate 1000x random messages with AI and put them in game, so you can claim there's no AI in game
>Good
Use your brain, retard.

>>725299623 (OP)
>reddit
go back

>>725322763
>anti-AI fags are a very loud minority
>71% of U.S. adults are concerned that AI will cause permanent job losses, according to a Reuters/Ipsos poll from August 2025.
>A separate survey from EY found that 65% of employees are anxious about AI replacing their job.
>About half of workers (52%) say they’re worried about the future impact of AI use in the workplace, and 32% think it will lead to fewer job opportunities for them in the long run
This is ignoring every other negative effect of the tech. You can call them luddites all you want but they are the majority and they dont like it. The only reason anyone is pro AI is they are either invested in the stock market or they are an obnoxious coomer with dreams of making a porn patreon. Oh, or they are indian or some equivalent third world retard who thinks AI is a kind of god.

>>725301518
Its so stupid to think this would be good. Not that I'm sure it won't become prevalent, because many people are stupid, but I literally can't imagine anything more stupid than ai character speech.

When an npc says something in Skyrim, its worth as much as its worth because its fully canon and intended, you know someone put it there and that its a legitimate part of the world. The particulars of what they say are definitely something someone would actually say in Skyrim.

If an AI is just leaking out bilge its meaningless. If they tell you the wailing creek is named that because in the year 1212 a whole village worth of kids were playing and drowned there and their mothers went apeshit on the banks you don't actually know if thats true or if that character would think or say that.

trash

>>725299623 (OP)
Don't listen to anti-AI trannies. It sounds like a great idea. Literally no normal person has any issue with AI so long as it's not being used to pump out low effort slop, which is clearly not what you're doing.

>>725301518
Dialogue in games is already laborious and a waste of time to read, you really want absolutely meaningless fluff to be the go to standard? I dont want to talk to a chatbot, sticking an anime avatar on it and throwing it in a game doesnt change this.

>>725324464
dont be a luddite, invest in nvidia, we're going to the moon and I'm going to retire early.

>posting it on reddit
how about you stay there?

>>725308887
Everyone is fine with AI if they don't realize it's AI.

>>725324019
>>71% of U.S. adults are concerned that AI will cause permanent job losses, according to a Reuters/Ipsos poll from August 2025.
not him but if you believe this you are mentally retarded
half of US adults don't even know what AI is.

>>725319576
Are you sure the anti-ai crowd are redditors, because this has to be the most fedora lord post I've read in a long time

>>725301226
Nonononono don't force the players to read different text for the same thing. As you get better at the game, it's much preferable to read a line and instantly know what you're dealing with than having to read a whole page to understand what's going on.

>>725324609
you realize early investors literally did retire early right

>>725299623 (OP)
How desperate do you have to be, to come crying on 4chan for help? Buy an ad, slop bro.

>>725324841
>half of US adults don't even know what AI is.
lol
>Approximately 62% of U.S. adults own stock
There isn't a single person on earth who is invested in the american stock market that doesnt know about AI at this point, their entire portfolio is about to crash when the bubble pops.

>>725325148
early investors are nerds who were investing in a chip manufacturer/gaming company. The vast majority of people who are now invested are clueless boomers scrambling to get on the AI train after its already left the station.

>>725299623 (OP)
I don't care that your game uses AI, I just think you need to go the fuck back.

>>725325490
>Approximately 62% of U.S. adults own stock
disingenuous claim
>when the bubble pops.
oh you're one of those retards

>>725299623 (OP)
Just don't disclose it on the store page. Steam only really cares if you're using ai images anyways.

>>725299623 (OP)
Redditor are all trannies and wont buy your game anyways. They spend all their complaining about games instead of playing them, just like /v/

>>725299874
fpbp

>>725301656
do not redeem

>>725326521
>oh you're one of those retards
and you're one of those retards who's over invested and think arguing on 4chan is a productive use of time to boost your net wealth. Sorry, not interest in talking to golems who are covertly covering for their investments over actually discussing a topic.

AI investment being a bubble and AI as a technology are two completely separate topics and you can be bullish on the tech while recognising none of the companies will ever pay back their venture capital investors.

>>725315604
In city building games those things are humorous the first time you see them. When you see the same message pop up for the 500th time, it doesn't matter how good the writing is, it's grating.
>just write more line bro, just one more line and it won't get repetitive, I promise bro please, just one more line is all it will take
It doesn't matter how many lines they write, in a city building type game they will have seen it a hundred times in their playthrough.

>>725300023
You will fit right in the "game industry" just fine lmao. They all think like this nowadays.

>>725300023
you're between a rock and a hard place. you have 2 options
>continue with the original plan and hope enough people stick around
>axe it, pissing off the people who were ok with it (you're removing a feature). furthermore, anyone who's sworn off buying it is unlikely to reconsider it (either because they'll never find out that you've axed it or because they're convinced that the game's permanently tarnished)

>>725301134
he means if the text feels like worthless noise, it becomes a nuisance rather than helpful
generally, if you want the player to take action on a warning, you have to make the message consistent. if you don't, the cognitive load will be much higher since the player can't tell what the problem is and what to do from a glance.

>>725328019
seethe harder, maybe your fantasies might come true

>>725328857
you revealed too much about your position, I already know I'm talking to a zombie who only cares about where his money is parked, this is a boring, pointless conversation now.

>>725320152
>I dont want my PC going into overdrive to write some shitty text I dont even want to read because its meaningless slop and totally unrelated to the core game.
Ok? Don't buy the game then, retard. You are not the target audience. Cry about it somewhere else.

>>725330314
fucking moron, nobody is buying this game in the first place, including you. This is a shill thread that has been co-opted to discuss AI for the millionth time.

>>725329158
take your meds too

>>725324019
Sorry but you are a mongoloid retard. Being "worried" about AI taking your job doesn't mean you are a schizo that swears will never consume anything with AI, and ultimately, those are the only people that you have to worry about when selling a product.

The fact is, the general public doesn't give a fuck, and only permanently online weirdos do. Your parents are probably watching AI videos on Instagram and having a great fucking time, none the wiser.

>>725324137
>If an AI is just leaking out bilge its meaningless. If they tell you the wailing creek is named that because in the year 1212 a whole village worth of kids were playing and drowned there and their mothers went apeshit on the banks you don't actually know if thats true or if that character would think or say that.

Does it matter, dipshit? Guess how folklore spreads in real life, retard. It's by people "thinking" they know shit about whatever

>>725330637
That's a single metric, its also the most reliable for determining whether someone is going to like the tech or not. This completely ignores the millions of people who hate AI slop spamming the entire internet, hate that its driving up GPU and RAM prices, hate that its loved by the lowest IQ people on the planet etc.. what's you're problem, why so concerned whether people like or hate the tech? you got some ulterior motive?

>>725299623 (OP)
be a villain. use more AI. fuck em

>>725299623 (OP)
Here's the thing. These hypocrites will consume AI by big corporations. They are doing it on a daily basis, knowingly or unknowingly. Just like how they will use phones created by slave labor.
This AI shit is just a way to bully indie creators for doing something they are still too lazy to even attempt.

>>725299623 (OP)
ignore these cunts

>>725324137
>but I literally can't imagine anything
This is your problem. You're a dogmatic sperg that can't think at all. You just abide by luddite idiocy.

>>725331581
>luddite idiocy.
witerwally hitler!

>>725330740
Who is "thinking" in this scenario. Cause its not the NPC and its not a writer and its certainly not you

>>725314839
wow this is worth all the extra electricity my GPU is gobbling up!

>local LLM aka the worst kind
>to slop out write-only text
lmao

>>725331581
If this is your level of reading comprehension I'm not surprised you have absolutely no understanding of what's good or why it's good.

>>725332254
You're arguing Skyrim dialogue is worth anything.

>>725299623 (OP)
who gives a fuck, why are you listening to reddit? are you making a game YOU would want to play or are you making a game redditors would want to play? the customer is always wrong, do yourself a favor and learn that fast

>>725299623 (OP)
So it generates the posts while running? Do they have to configure an API connection or do you have a model embedded?
Former is going to be too hard for most normalfags.

But to answer your question, the reality is that these redditors are going to be on the wrong side of history and eventually interactive AI dialog is going to be all over and it's going to make the static repetitive of dialog of the past seem like trash in comparison. You are basically ahead of the curve.
However the way you are using in your game sounds kind of minor and doesn't seem like it is really adding all that much to the experience. So you are probably losing more from the drama than you're gaining and you are small enough to be in a position to get lynched by seething reddit tranny brigades who can focus all their energy on you as one of the first people to do this kind of thing.

So you have the choice between kissing their ass and begging forgiveness and maybe saving some money (they are already pissed at you for daring to not hate AI so you are still not going to be free of drama at this point). Or alternatively you do what you want and ignore them as they call you a Nazi. Personally I would never let a reddit tranny bully me and impact my business decisions on principle but it's your business to decide on.

>>725300023
>"""""potential customers"""""
All the shit in current videogames happened because every single developers chased the mythical "potential customers" who will never come. Make your shit your own way and they will come if it's good.

>>725300521
>it's crazy how clueless /v/ is about how AI slop is seen
Everybody I know irl either has no opinion on AI or likes it and uses it all the time. Starving porn artists and hack musicians on r/antiwork are not the world.

>>725299623 (OP)
I think it's a great idea but some people are clearly not ready for it. Since it's a local LLM, the only thing they can complain about is whose content was used to train the specific model you're packaging and if they gave consent for it.
You could drop AI, use it as a publicity stunt "now AI free! we listen to you guys :)))", but keep the feature as an optional add-in they can download separately with plenty of disclaimers saying it's an experiment and not to download if you don't feel comfortable with AI. More work for you to allow both modes, but capturing more potential people.

>>725301791
This, get into webdev if you want to earn a living, easier to code and bigger payouts.

>>725299623 (OP)
Its a simple question, do you want trans money or not?

>>725332748
Is it or is it not? If its literally worth nothing it then should they just not have had it? If its truly worth nothing who cares about """"""improving"""" it with ai, its even easier to just not have it than to pollute the game with ai slop. If it is worth something, even the tiniest amount, then it should be real written dialogue.

>>725314920
>A bunch of boring one liners
I'd definitely take that over the same one-liner repeated 10k times over 100 hours of gameplay.

>>725333689
It's not about improving anything necessarily it's just another way to do dialogue. No random video game dialogue is worth anything it's just some random shit for your entertainment you autist.

>>725299623 (OP)
>Using reddit in the first place
Stopped reading there, i don't care if you posted the cure for cancer, you should kill yourself

>>725324609
>dont be a luddite, invest in nvidia, we're going to the moon and I'm going to retire early.
I've already made thousands swing trading it in the last year, my only regret is not putting even more money into it.

>>725333845
If it isn't worth anything why have it at all.

>It's not about improving anything necessarily it's just another way to do dialogue

Its a way so infinitely worse as to be almost impossible to express. Its a way of making sure no dialogue in the game matters or means anything to the degree that dialogue ever matters, and if you think games should have it then it does matter to some degree.

> for your entertainment

I'm generally entertained to the degree I think things are good, and I'm less entertained when I think things are worse or don't even qualitatively qualify as what they purport to be. Like fake dialogue thats not an intentional part of a creative work, crafted to fit in the world and be canon.

>>725299623 (OP)
>>725300023
arc raiders uses ai for the voice changer im pretty sure and all the faggots and redditors eat up that slop so why wouldn't they like your game?

>>725334380
>asking baby questions
>defending skyrim npc dialogue
Waste of time trying to reason with a disingenuous retard.

the retards have just had "ai bad" drilled into their heads and cant conceptualise a use case for it that isnt "hurr durr you stole art"

>>725334380
>I'm with the heckin union and if a contractor isn't getting paid $200 an hour to flush every toilet and turn every screw we start breaking kneecaps and rioting!

>>725334690
We've already established you can't really read. You're getting intimidated by sentences you don't understand and short-circuiting. No wonder you like ai so much.

>>725299623 (OP)
You are such a fucking dipshit for revealing that you use AI in your game. You deserve to be tossed out of society and straight into a rehabilitation center for 5 years.

>>725324825
this
the jeet/chink thing is just cope, they "hate it" too
the fact is people don't mind ai if it's done well and disguised enough

>>725335052
That's like saying people don't mind being cheated on if they don't know its happening.

Kind of. But that doesn't make it fine. It means they're forming opinions based on false information, they're mistaken, and it doesn't change the reality of the nature of the situation

>>725335384
>That's like saying people don't mind being cheated on if they don't know its happening.
no it's not because they're looking at it and like it
fucking retard

>>725299623 (OP)
I'm not hating on AI but I don't think you will get a good result letting a tiny LLM generate shit on the fly
It will produce unfiltered(low quality) and repetitive garbage at least half the time
Generating them using actually big LLM in production and curating them to be implemented in the game is better, and better for performance too (you can even use AI for curating them too btw)
And this way you don't need to disclose that you use AI on the steam page, so even anti-AI faggots will still consider buying your game without knowing that you used AI as a tool during development

>>725334839
Why are you trying to turn it into a labour issue when I've spoken purely in terms of the quality and nature of what the end recipient gets.

If you order a steak and its literally raw on one side do you not complain because it would be outrageous to pay the cook "200 dollars an hour to turn over every steak."

>>725299623 (OP)
>BUT people there told me that they won't try my game if it has AI.
Trannies and leftists hate AI because it invalidates their meaningless paper-pushing lives. Stay the course, do what your vision tells you.

>>725335574
You can be looking at your wife who's cheating on you and liking her if you don't know.

I mean for me it would depend on not knowing. Maybe you're different.

>>725335384
>That's like saying people don't mind being cheated on if they don't know its happening.
The use of AI is not a betrayal in any way most companies do not disclose every detail of their creative process.
You simply want to witch hunt people you perceive as chuds for not wanting to give you money for your art.
>it doesn't change the reality of the nature of the situation
What is the reality of the situation, that you feel AI is hurting your wallet so those who use it must be punished?
Do you also feel companies should be required to disclose if they have trannies on their development team so chuds can choose to boycott for destroying the country?

>>725299623 (OP)
>and linked it to Reddit.
why

>>725325012
Absolutely true. Don't waste the player's time trying to hunt for relevant information. The advantage of repeating messages, if you have to have them, if that the player can quickly comprehend and react to what the game state is. Having constantly mutating messages that the player has to stop and read to figure out what, if any, important information is supposedly being relayed is bad.

>>725299623 (OP)
anyone complaining about AI doesn't deserve your game, OP.

>>725336027
>and linked it to Reddit.
>why
That's the real question here.
Surely OP realizes that if redditfags were pissed over him using AI they are going to be double pissed now that he has gone to a site generally considered their most hated enemies to bitch about them.
Perhaps he is intentionally trying to generate rage for exposure.

>>725336201
No one visits this cumslurping cesspit since the hack

>>725300023
Redditors are subhuman

>>725300023
most people won't give a shit if the game is good, and you'll always have haters

>>725305714
This. How the fuck is this still up? He posted his own game's steam page. What a nigger.

>>725335837
>The use of AI is not a betrayal in any way most companies do not disclose every detail of their creative process.

It is a fact that, if known, would ruin it for people with taste for whom the value of creative works is based on a dynamic of intentionality. Betrayal is not the concept here. It is a fact that, if known, will radically alter peoples opinions on something despite the superficial appearance of it having the potential to remain the same. Like whether or not you are being cheated on

>What is the reality of the situation

Art is a combination of two things, the intentionality/detailed craft of an artist, and reality. Its not that every little element of art is determined by an artist-directors don't have full control of every little thing that shows up in the background of a movie if its shot on location for example. But its always one of the two things-either something a human brain chose or did, something reflective of reality, or a mixture of the two

This informs how you can approach these works. Its informed by this context. If I see something on the screen, even a minor detail, it either reflects the beauty or qualities of the world, or it can be read into as something the creator did for a reason, whether a substantive reason to be interpreted, or out of aesthetic preference. All that is meaningful as a means of engaging with another mind, and even if I interpret things differently than intended, the difference in how I interpreted it versus what they intended is meaningful as a map of the gulf between people

AI is neither. Its not captured or seized upon reality and it isnt intentional or human made down to all the very fine details. Its white noise. Its meaningless. And when theres any ai, it may as well all be ai, cause any little detail may or may not mean anything, even in the sense of being an aesthetic choice or something the creator thought would be cool. You cant engage with anything, cause any of it could actually be nothing

>>725299623 (OP)
idk AI is cool

>>725299623 (OP)
Redditors aren't people. You should not consider any opinion they give to be valid outside of pure coincidence of the occasional alignment with reality.

Redditors are the dumbest most stupid fucking people on the planet and you should never use them to gauge anything in any direction.
Bring it to people you know instead of relying on random faggots.

>y-yeah I'm a solo dev!
>developer is a thirdworlder
>UI is a permanent placeholder
>keen on advertising the game despite having only an early prototype
>steam early access
>simple 2D game having system requirements of a 2018 AAA game
>"procedural generation"
>poor/lazy visuals
>"inspired by xxx"
>lazy AI art
>core features of the game based on poor/unpractical solutions
>makes an "organic" thread to advertise his "game"

>>725300023
Because you can't please everyone

>>725324019
>62% of U.S. adults say they interact with AI at least several times a week
>73% say they’d be willing to let AI assist them at least a little with day-to-day activities.
People are both afraid it will take jobs and enjoy that it can help/entertain them.

>>725337334
You should check out my game instead, but I'm cool so I won't tell you what it is. Good luck finding it on steam, it could be any game at all.

>>725337413
Unironically based. I will look into your game.

>I posted my first devlog to yt and linked it to Reddit.
If reddit is your target demo, go back there, faggot.

>>725337413
I already bought it.

>>725333326
Huh, so that's why /v/ loves AI

>>725337446
>>725337520
I hate niggers, yes I am publicly announcing that as the dev and no my sales won't suffer for it.

>>725332748
>he doesn't go to the cloud district often

>>725337646
Sora writes dialogue better in its little videos than I've ever seen in any bethesda game ever made in history, or ever will make. The end of argument and I win forever and this cannot be undone.

>>725337646
>>725337743
https://sora.chatgpt.com/explore

>>725336893
>AI is neither. Its not captured or seized upon reality and it isnt intentional or human made down to all the very fine details.
Humans choose things when crafting an AI character you can provide multiple paragraphs hashing out the characters speaking style, personality, likes/dislikes, opinions and quirks.

You think massive switch statements for dialog where you say
>If character dislikes dark places and room brightness < 40 output "This place sure is creepy"
Is good and human

but a massive prompt for an AI character with instructions:
>You dislike dark places and find them creepy
>You will offer your opinion on locations during your travels
>Current room brightness is 40
is evil and fake?

Are procgen dungeons that have been around for years and random number generators also evil because the artist did not code every detail of that interaction? I'm not sure you realize just how much shit happens randomly and dynamically already based on large lists of situational programmed behavior patterns.

>>725336893
>>725337971
This argument is stupid as fuck and both of you are retarded and autistic for arguing to this degree about it.

>>725300485
SimCity 3000 would be a worse game without the news ticker.

>>725338125
>This argument is stupid as fuck and both of you are retarded and autistic for arguing to this degree about it.
People on Reddit are literally dying over this. Have some god damn compassion anon.

>>725299623 (OP)
Just make a status bar at the top of the UI that has angry faces with a hospital icon that shows up under some threshold no one wants to read text with no meaning behind it

>>725300571
This is a great take on the matter.
Final word to the OP:
>I went to the autistic retard gathering and honked an air horn, turns out they did not like that at all.
I mean, you can try to reword it or capitalize on the negative PR which would not be BAD given hundreds of games release on Steam each day.

>>725301765
Retard.

>>725324019
>This is ignoring every other negative effect of the tech
Liberals are now crying "Dey took our jobs" when automatization and outsourcing have effectively eliminated hundreds of thousands of job openings since the 2000s but they only began to care when it was their turn.
Ai is no different and it can open new venues for those smart enough to work in the technology just like in any other field where specialists are needed but as usual you cannot replace those openings because any form of automatization will effectively be cheaper and more effective, and it will eliminate openings.

Think how the first cotton gin came to end slavery.

This is something that is an on going situation in the automobile industry.
The US is pretty much fucking done for in that area with no hope of recovery because the industry cannot produce parts or complete vehicles cheaper than China or South Korea. Anything from lack of raw material, unions and environmental laws prevent this from ever happening. Meanwhile Germany remains due to severe protectionism laws and because German cars are seen as luxury goods, not to mention Germany's population is somewhat more manageable.

>>725337893
INFINITE
CONTENT
https://sora.chatgpt.com/p/s_690f16d835b08191a582712e235cf282

>>725337971
>Humans choose things when crafting an AI character you can provide multiple paragraphs hashing out the characters speaking style, personality, likes/dislikes, opinions and quirks.

Right but nothing I'm saying depends on the idea that there's zero human input into ai stuff. Its that 1)there's generally vastly, vastly less, there's this whole new void taking up most of the space and 2) since I don't know where the line is within a work between ai and non ai, basically everything can't be engaged with as usual

>You think massive switch statements... is good and human

Well you're talking about what you see as a deficit of how dialogue is handled in video games without ai. But we all know creative works and elements of them can be excellent or bad or anywhere in between. There's always good and bad art and elements thereof. And with video games, there are technical and practical limitations. But that's all the game. Maybe the best this field of art has done does have some kind of deficit, though personally I don't agree. But say you're right that its lacking and isn't "good and human". Ai doesn't solve that for me because its not better, more human and good art. Its an absence of art. Its water in the brain.

>Are procgen dungeons that have been around for years and random number generators also evil because the artist did not code every detail of that interaction?

That's a wildly case by case basis and a lot of elements go into each case as to whether it shares the same issues with ai images and writing. I appreciate in Hades for example that the individual rooms are actually all fully hand crafted and its just the order thats randomized. Regular rng certainly doesn't count as its generally just randomly or semi randomly selecting crafted outcomes. No Man's Sky is an interesting case but it would turn into an essay trying to litigate that

>>725338125
You're now just the most retarded participant in this arguement

>>725339005
I don't understand ESL speak.

>>725300521
>it's crazy how clueless /v/ is about how AI slop is seen
All of my co-workers happily use AI. The real world is not reddit.

>>725339047
You don't understand EFL speak either.

>>725339215
>You're now just the most

>>725299623 (OP)
If you like it your way, make it your way. Catering to bitches makes your game less appealing, trust yourself if you want it to be your own art. That being said, content warning has a similar system with npc comments based on content and I believe they didn't use any generative ai, so it could certainly be done another way if you'd prefer I guess.

There's no real reason to be against AI

>muh environment
Your politicians are literally lying to you in an attempt to cover up their failures, like Texas' failure to fix their water outages for the past 15 years

>muh art
AI can draw better than 80% of humans already. It's a fact that makes all the wannabe artists seethe, which is why they hate it so much.

>muh job
Your job was going to be destroyed anyway. Either by robots, outsourcing, or just because the US is in a death spiral. At least if everyone loses their job to AI there's a slight chance UBI will be implemented.

>>725338330
I think the AI debate is basically just therapy lol. Anti-AIs are mindbroken and need to vent.

>>725339304
I'm now sure you're ESL.

>>725339537
AI can be shitty, that's one valid if not short sighted reason to be against it. Democratizing art has it's positives and its negatives in that regard.
No taste hacks will use it to more easily make things that suck, same thing happened with youtube and photoshop. But to ignore the good that comes with progress is dumb.

>>725299623 (OP)
>AI
Idk just hearing about it kills all my interest in anything no matter how it's used. I would rather have inane keyboard smash drivel as long as it was from a person.
The barrier to entry for AI is zero, so would rather see my own generations 100% of the time.

>>725339537
Furthermore on your based argument,
>muh environment
Wasn't a problem when we could've built nuclear reactors all those years ago but everyone decided it was too much work to be slightly educated and much easier to just follow all propaganda they are ever told about anything. It also doesn't become a problem when talking about how pajeets and chinks create more waste and pollution in the world than everyone else in history ever combined.


>muh art
Good artists are the ones who have put their passion and effort into being good not out of getting praise or money but because they are using it to articulate strong experiences and emotions within themselves into this world, and it is done in the darkest prisons on this Earth where the inhabitants will never leave. AI is only destructive to furfaggot retards on furaffinity who need $600 per commission of some obscure fetish only rich dentists secretly have to eat.

>muh job
Money is soon to be worthless if you didn't consider it so already and if your job can be completely replaced by AI without quality suffering I am completely for it. People have been having their jobs phased out by automation since automation existed, and it wasn't a problem for you then? Didn't care about it for them? My job is irreplaceable up until the point that people just start getting everything they want infinitely for free.

>>725337334
>simple 2D game having system requirements of a 2018 AAA game
makes me physically ill how common this is now. turn on project zomboid and 2 mins later my computer sounds like a jet engine

>>725315504
I'm going to be full of regret for not getting her number anyways desu, might as well be rich too.

>>725339537
water outages?
Texas claimed to have fixed the ERCOT grid for the forseeable future but that was long before the data center craze. Those data centers eat up power and water like a megacity does and it's going to WRECK the rural south wherever they build them. Lots of these rural fucks are already scraping by with inflation. 2x-ing their utilities will be a gut punch.
The only reason to be pro-data center is if you work for one of these tech centers or you REALLY want a dozen or more different AIs that are slightly different to pick from.
AI is an enormous bubble anyway and getting a computer to write shit for you instead of a human is... well if Open AI actually turned a profit without investors then you would probably be paying $1000 a month for your chatbot subscription.

>>725339941
>i just cant stop thinking about HERRRR
lmao what? grow up retard

>>725340114
kek then you just grow up and make slop

>>725299623 (OP)
I’d just do this:
>I am seriously considering axing the AI altogether, and hand writing a couple dozen messages for specific situations.
Because, really, it’s not that much effort and if you write 200 or so it would be way more than enough.

Just seems a meaningless task to delegate to an AI in the first place let alone if it’s a turn off for dweebs.

>>725301765
the definition of AI has shifted from "NPC hear noise; NPC investigate" to "SEARCHING ALL OF HUMAN KNOWLEDGE FOR RECIPE TO MAKE A LATTE... SEARCHING..."

>>725300563
Fuck off safe space bitch

>>725300023
>muh AI
>muh customers
Eat shit and die.

>>725301765
>weak AI
>"yes, this is AI"
>a billion times stronger AI
>"AI ISNT REAL AND WILL NEVER EXIST SKREEEE"

>>725340508
>WELL IF YOU FIXED EVERY PIPE IN THE STATE THEN YOU COULD SPARE ENOUGH WATER TO GENERATE AI TITS
I mean yeah you're right. Water is the de facto limit on civilization. Water use needs to be rethought in general if everyone is on the "number go up" plan or it's going to be another landmine buried up ahead

Another thread of AIjeets relentlessly getting bullied, feels good.

>>725300097
>>725300097
You're an idiot. Not stupid.... you obviously just don't understand **marketing** and you don't understand this Luddite infested website.

1: don't call it AI or even mention the word llm. Never do that stupid shit again

2: say it's procedurally generated text, never say the word LLM and never say the word ai you idiot. Technically an LLM is basically proc gen

Hell you can even say "*I use proc gen algorithms that uses statistical and semantic structures of language from large text corpora to generate contextually coherent and linguistically informed outputs.*" That would be perfectly accurate to say, most people are too uneducated to even know you just basically said LLM.
Also just run the game yourself 100 times and record what the ai says for certain events and just script that in. User the LLM to generate the lines and then add the lines into the game. Llms have steep requirements.
That easy you can use a juicy LLM and when you update the game add more lines

>>725340828
what if anon has a hyper-specific language model that isn't LARGE? what would that be???

>>725300547
>>725304165
trvke
these people are fucking retarded. it's popular to hold a self-appointed moral high-ground stance on AI on the internet so that's what they're doing. they don't even know why they're against it, they just think that's the proper opinion to hold.
ignore retards

>>725340184
>Just seems a meaningless task to delegate to an AI in the first place let alone if it’s a turn off for dweebs.
While I think the feature in general is kind of insignificant, the benefit of AI here is due to the sheer number of variables and states it can handle. It's like having a chain of thousands of switch/if statements.
It doesn't just have 200 cases it potentially has millions which realistically just cannot be coded by a person.
It can handle if it's 2pm and raining outside and you've been playing the game for 2 hours, and a building just collapsed and a guy just got hit by a car, and you are not popular with the townpeople and you are currently staring at your budget menu, and you named your character Hitler.
It can give responses for a scope of extremely unique and specific scenarios that a human would never be able to handle through manual checks.

>>725299623 (OP)
Why not just use AI and ignore the pathetic redditors seething over AI.

>>725299623 (OP)
NEVER GIVE UP, NEVER SURRENDER, APOLOGIES ARE FOR PUSSIES, SHIT ON THEIR POSTS, REDDIT IS FOR GIRLS

not buying your game though, thats nerd shit.

>>725299623 (OP)
you should pay for an ad

>>725299623 (OP)
>i use AI to generate text for throwaway garbage
nobody is going to give a shit. they care about things like art/music/voice, since that often infringes on actual talent/content/work. as long as you're upfront about what the ai is doing and how trivial/meaningless the function is, nobody is going to care. any squeaky wheels left over were never going to buy the game anyway, and you objectively cant please everybody anyway. dont worry about it. its also better to make a quality product with a niche focus, than to water shit down for the sake of "potential customers" and then appeal to nobody. like, doom appeals to a specific market, and they should lean into that. imagine if doom went pg and toned down the violence in order to "appeal to more people". nobody would play it. make what you want, but make it pure and good. the right audience will find it (as long as they get to actually hear about it).

>>725339875
>but everyone decided it was too much work
No, the fossil fuel industry magnates lobbied the governments to preserve their dominance in the energy sector and not to spend money because they now have to compete with emerging new technologies. It was encouragement of technological stagnation for the sake of profiteering. Same exact situation as with Kodak and digital cameras that they suppressed, which had cost them everything in the long run, except this time it was a nation-wide monopoly and not an invention of a single man.

>>725299623 (OP)
I don't think it's a good idea because of the hallucinations, your llm could get you in trouble posting something controversial or copyrighted or calling someone a fag
Would be a better compromise to use your llm for producing a large quantity of messages and just run them through some review
Nothing fancy you'd just be looking for messages that might get you in trouble
It's maybe less efficient and flexible but no matter how flexible you make it people will just tire of the game itself eventually.
even if complaint messages are highly dynamic the gameplay loop won't be

>>725300827
You can tell it to be you GM in a gay tabletop roleplaying session. I know saying it's gay is redundant but some people might not know of tabletop roleplay
You could basically ask it for shit to translate and correct, being effectively better than duolingo
Idk, anything you can play with pen and paper is available I guess but know it will say and do dumb shit eventually

>>725348012
>your llm could get you in trouble posting something controversial or copyrighted or calling someone a fag
2 more weeks

>>725300023
>Why not, if it means losing out on potential customers?
Maybe don't make a 'unique building game' and work on mobile slop if you are looking for profits.

>>725299623 (OP)
>Building sim autism where the citizens can actually interact or give feedback or just mindless chatting to give the illusion of actual town people using an AI as an engine to make sure they are always doing something new and not using the same 5-10 generic lines
Damn that sounds awesome OP, don't let the dumb faggots bring down your morale, that right there might make the difference between a new indie hit or just another 1$ steam garbage bin game

>>725299623 (OP)
thats a really cool and creative use of AI, it running local is also nice
stick to your vision OP

Sounds like a fun idea to me as opposed to seeing repeating messages. If it can react to the way you build things and have some citizens shit on your gameplay/spam conspiracy theories out of nowhere that'd be even better, like citizens shit posting to each other about you building another hospital.
Or citizens being baffled how some fucked up layout just works and they all live in prosperity despite town's infrastructure being Mr,Bones Wild Ride tier.

>>725299623 (OP)
You will never make it. If you don't have a vision, just give up already.

>>725320278
well it's random messages, who cares if it's schizo babbles? wouldn't it be funny if your residents were schizos haha.

Don't worry OP I'm not gonna play your game whether it has AI or not.

>>725324520
>I dont want to talk to a chatbot,
Whenever you interact with an NPC in a video game, you're talking to a chatbot

The thing about feedback is that most people don't really know what they want so you need a skill to filter through their words and figure out what it is that bothered them. I remember seeing an article about that, where niggas complained about one mechanic or ability or whatever the fuck but the devs changed something seemingly unrelated and miniscule just a tiny bit and after a while it was suddenly fine because it turned out that they were fine with the thing they were complaining about and what really pissed them off was something else. The way you present shit is super important too, if you even mention the word AI you're probably fucked. I don't really know how to work around that one though because I'm not a marketer.

>>725299623 (OP)
How does an AI LLM differ from making your own AI that does the same fucking job (i.e. pick out tweets according to city health)? It's the exact same thing with extra steps.

This is legitimately retarded and proof that redditfags don't actually know what they are protesting. Ignore the virtue signaling faggots and use AI, brother.

>>725299623 (OP)
>AI

>>725300023
follow that line of thought to its conclusion and you will end up axing everything that gives your product any fucking soul and end up with ACTUAL slop

be passionate
let seething redditors advertise for you as they shriek "AI"

>>725300023
You can't make everyone happy. If I knew a dev caved before redditors, of all people, I wouldn't buy their game either.

>>725300023
That is not a potential customer, that is a faggot

A potential customer is someone like me who might have bought your game, but won't now that I see you are bending over to please faggots

>>725299623 (OP)
dont listen to redditors, never apologize or even acknowledge it, just 100% ignore it

>>725300023
you can't please everyone
all you can do is make the game YOU want to make and watch how it turns out

>>725299623 (OP)
Reddit and twitter are on an anti-AI crusade for no real reason other than "I heard it's bad so it's bad". Nothing can be gained from interacting with such mental deficiency.

>>725299623 (OP)
It's kinda lamentable that a presented ""option"" to ""interact"" with "people" on the internet is reddit. I mean, it's not an option at all. The place is soulless bots. Is that what it amounts to? Over time, I think new generations will switch to different websites. It's starting with tiktok and people complain about it but the fact is real people aren't going to go to the internet for fun or otherwise and think reddit.

>>725299623 (OP)
>I'm using my AI to generate posts in my in-game social media app.
so, just like real life?

>>725299623 (OP)
apologize and let some tranny write it

>>725315408
Get a life.

>>725333326
anything with a hexagon has a hidden star of david

>>725299623 (OP)
Check that vampire that was kinda popular some time ago, or DougDoug's entire career the last year or so. Truth is, in the real world, as long as you use ai for creative stuff and not just to save time, people will probably like it. It's actually only reddit and xitter who have this weird jihad against the very concept of ai ever being used. These motherfuckers don't even use chatgpt to answer questions.

>>725299623 (OP)
Go back to r*ddit, for starters

>>725328060
its actually fine and less annoying than having to parse soulless AI slop text for the same informaton that is arranged in a slightly different way every time every single time.

nice advertisement campaign dumbass
imagine puttin AI in your shitty game

>>725299623 (OP)
Your game looks like dogshit so it probably doesnt matter anyways. 4 copies sold vs 5 copies sold if you know what I mean

>>725299623 (OP)
tell those redditors that if they ever clicked on a youtube video with an AI generated thumbnail then they're not entitlted to an opinion

Is this a Free Cities thread? I hate the AI implementation, I want it to stay a text game.

>>725300023
>customers
they're not going to buy it regardless
did you learn nothing from concord?

>>725354030
hory shet I remember that game, its been years since I loaded it up. whats changed

>people still denying AI and thinking there's a "bubble" after every major country has dumped trillions into it
L O L

I refuse to pay

>>725355616
>charges 12 hours of waging for a simple bust drawn in 30 minutes tops

>>725299623 (OP)
Train the LLM on some example cities you've made that run well and use it to recommend next steps in development or city/region layout templates. Stuff like that that the community won't get all pissy about it. Or, at least, minimally pissy. Then branch it out when the feel the water is safe to do so.

Another dogshit ad thread that baited all the 90IQ third world shitskins who infest /v/. He got one (1) slightly critical comment after shilling his game on reddit and came straight here pretending he started some controversy when he very obviously did not. His youtube video also has barely any views. How fucking retarded are all you people for taking this spic retard at his word? You don't even have to investigate further to tell he's lying, since to begin with if any redditors were actually seething he would have included it in the screenshot. The public internet won't be worth using until all brown people get deported from our countries and firewalled.

Don't use AI just because you can. A lot of people are doing that right now and it's fucking them up because AI is NOT ready for all the stuff that the hype claims it's ready for. Creative text gen in particular is fucking terrible.

>>725355523
oh no no no no no

>>725357070
>Don't use AI! The technology is not there yet! It will never get there! AI is not capable of anything at all!

>>725357440
No one said that, faggot AI fanboy. You try running text gen on a local LLM small enough to fit in an indie game and tell us about the quality of the output. Even 20b+ models struggle to keep things cohesive, yet alone creative.

>>725357440
Correct. You finally got it.

>>725300023
>Why not, if it means losing out on potential customers?
In stocks, they have a saying: "Never treat missed potential as a loss".
This is because if you do, you'll chase missed potential like a crackfiend and end up losing a lot more money because of it.

>>725357635
>the quality of the output
I mean, I think it's bit of a waste of computer resources but in this case it's just generating some flavor text, literally just in-game tweets. They definitely don't need to be quality.

>>725357440
you sound like one of those retards who were shilling NFTs some time ago.

>>725299623 (OP)
>Are they right?? I am seriously considering axing the AI altogether, and hand writing a couple dozen messages for specific situations.
Might be for the best, I know it seems like it'd be a smart decision that could potentially create infinite responses to account for scaling factors as development progresses, but realistically it'll only result in half baked vaguely relevant responses that you'll have to read through anyways.
It shouldn't be that hard to spend a few minutes every night coming up with additional responses based on conditions in game after you've been working on the game all day.
Trust me, it's better to have hand made content over AI generated content.
For as much as I tend to be the kind of person to say "fuck everyone else, do your thing", you probably should listen to them here.

>>725306451
Ranch, or cool ranch?

>>725300307
Cuck tactic over here

>>725357843
>AI is just like NTFs

Actual retard here, point and laugh.

>>725355523
I love the slight sense of anxiety dripping from these posts. Not again, it couldn't be happening again after throwing their neetbux into the crypto and NFT grift, this time it's different, it has to be.

>>725358171
AI is more wasteful. thats about it.

>>725299623 (OP)
- computationally more expensive, potentially communicates inaccurate information about the state of the game to players, can cause issues with maintaining a consistent tone, likely to cause some people who notice the required disclosure to avoid the game
+ you don't have to write a couple dozen status messages by hand

>>725357114
Thank you papa Trump and media shills for giving me another dump to buy more Nvidia stock and swing it in a month for more profit.
Please give me another week of fud news articles that Nvidia is super duper dead this time and nobody is going to buy GPUs anymore.
Gift that keeps on giving.

>>725357838
Then they don't need to exist at all. They will add nothing to the game if they aren't interesting.

They're overreacting. You're using AI to generate little snippets of flavor text, right? A small detail meant to make your in-game world appear livelier? This is how generative AI should be used in indie game dev, as a supplementary tool that can handle small but time-consuming tasks that would otherwise keep you from focusing on what's important. What were you supposed to do? Hire one of those redditors to write the material for you?

>>725358526
who knows.
nobody had flavor text in their games before shitty chatbots came out.

>>725358623
My father-in-law is a programmer, I asked him what it would take to write a dozen words of flavor text, I will never forget his answer, "we can't, we don't know how to do it"

>>725358526
>They're overreacting
Where did you see an overreaction?

>>725358839
>Where did you see an overreaction?
They were chanting "Down with nazis", sending him death threats and trying to find his home address.

>>725299623 (OP)
>I'm using my AI to generate posts in my in-game social media app. Random people from towns post their problems and jokes to grab the player's attention if the town has problems.

Anon, this is exactly how AI should be used in games. But for it to be popularized, someone has to start implementing the idea. Maybe you won't be able to popularize, likely you'll take a hit from sales (cause you're appealing to lol redditards) but if you truly believe in this tech, build it to inspire other game developers to think it's cool and take risk to gamble with you so ingame local AI gets so refined that it gets adopted and accepted.

Best of luck anon, we believe in you.

>>725358839
>I have to ask myself if the game is worth it.
>The benefits don't balance out the negative perception of it.
Sounds like an overreaction to me.

>>725324019
What is their opinion on jeets and wetbacks?

>>725358998
instead of a butlerian jihad, it was a butlerian reverse-holocaust

>>725359190
maybe if you're a retard faggot baby.

>>725358761
good thing the digital savior just arrived to drag us out of illiteracy.

>>725299623 (OP)
ignore redditors, they are worthless peons who know nothing. AI is the future.

Why are leftists SO MUCH against AI no matter what?

>>725358998
I don't get the joke.

>>725359190
"They" = reddit, retard.

>>725359410
rightoids arent big AI fans either.
its just browns like you.

>>725359410
Because their oligarchs don't have a foothold in it and ours do and no other reason.

>>725300023
survivorship bias. appeasing to 1 guy with an opinion makes you lose 10 sales to people who silently prefered what the game was before changes.

>>725317925
Yes. I'll update the the min requirements. It cam be turned off completely already.
And since i only have a single PC to test on, i couldn't go very low with requirements. Once i have playtesters, if I'll ever haveany, theycam report on how it runs on their rig.

>>725359270
>Oh, the moral quandary of playing a game that was refined with the help of an LLM! Whatever shall I do?!
Luddite.

>>725324825
>everyone is fine with eating chocolate cake filled with poisoned dogshit if you cover up the taste and don't disclose that it's poison and dogshit

>>725359493
enjoy your three sales and two refunds.

>>725359410
>Why are leftists SO MUCH against AI no matter what?
Same reason rednecks are against illegal immigration so much.
>They're takin muh jerbs
Leftists mostly have do-nothing artsy desk jobs so they are the most threatened.

>>725359527
If the only thing you got from cake was tasting it yes.

>>725359602
>They're takin muh jerbs
We're against illegal (and legal) immigration for LOADS more reasons

>>725359538
I'm not OP, but I'll forward your regards.

>>725359602
I would just like my ethnicity to have its own state governed in the interest of that ethnicity like every other ethnicity has so we do not become a stateless people.

>>725359607
thanks for admitting that AI cultists are psychopaths, Sam Altman.

>>725359410
tv said it bad

>>725360035
??? I admitted your metaphor was faulty because it introduced a consequence of eating poison (being poisoned) that doesn't exist in AI (by your own admission, if the "taste" of it can be hidden there is no other downstream effect unless you care about artists being paid, which would brand you a homosexual in my mind). If you need a food metaphor to rationalize your opinion it's probably retarded.

>>725341276
>these people are fucking retarded. it's popular to hold a self-appointed moral high-ground stance on AI on the internet so that's what they're doing. they don't even know why they're against it, they just think that's the proper opinion to hold.
They think correctly. AI is bad. If you're too lazy to write some townsfolk dialogue by yourself, your game is not worth buying and your life is not worth living.

>>725299623 (OP)
>>725299874
if your vision is using AI to procedurally generate meaningless slop instead of using the social media system to tell original jokes and stories, you should just cut it from the game because it's going to be soulless filler anyway.

>>725360446
AIjeets instantly feel entitled to their money even though they want to half ass the most human aspects of games and hand them over to a chat bot.
Whats funnier is that they think they have any sort of leverage.
I have a near infinite amount of games to pick from. Why would I pick something thats lazily churned out by chatgpt and even pay for that?
They cant answer this question.

>>725360563
yeah cool shit like rumors being spread online like in SMT, Megaman Battlenet and .//hack goes straight out the window with that.
OP should kys himself. Just more trash shitting up steam.

>>725360646
saying AI should kill himself is super extreme and isn't helpful at all. ease up, slingblade.

Sorry nobody wants to commission your shitty art anymore, we rather use AI

>>725360735
its actually the most helpful thing anyone could ask.

>>725360735
>AI
meant OP, woops. lol

The word AI has about as much meaning as the word racism these days. Yet another term where people hold strong beliefs about shit they don't understand.
You can ask these retards why AI is bad and they'll just sperg out and spit buzzwords at you, they know absolutely nothing about this technology, there's an endless pile of flaws and things they could criticise but instead they just blather on about fucking nonsense and social media spam.
These idiots don't even fucking know what an LLM is or how it differs to image gen for fuck's sake. Imagine having a hysterical fit over a fucking text generator spitting out one or two sentence blurbs occasionally with a little more flexibility than having a handful of pre-existing lines. They're so used to hearing about how AI fucks up code or creates mediocre fawed art that they somehow believe that a game will be "poisoned" for having something as simple as throwaway NPC lines, it's pathetic.
If anything this is pretty much the only area that AI should be used in as far as gaming goes: replacing procedural generation and allowing you to interact or explore in ways that aren't feasible for someone to manually do by hand. Simply allowing the player to personally and freely explore unique scenarios/encounters while operating under a system designed by humans: it's not something that's replacing anyone nor is it something that's even a big deal, it's just some extra padding that's hard for AI to fuck up and adds a little bit more interactivity.
That said, as far as performance goes I'm not really convinced that it's worth implementing locally, and it's both too expensive and (potentially) too laggy to do it over the internet with a decent large model.
inb4 some zero-nuance retard feels obliged to screech incoherently at this post like a dog trained to have a Pavlovian response

>>725360795
did you ask claude to write that post for you

>>725360846
yeah trump did that to AItrannies right now:
>>725357114

>>725360829
Good dog.

>>725299623 (OP)
>I'm using my AI to generate posts in my in-game social media app. Random people from towns post their problems and jokes to grab the player's attention if the town has problems.
Words are free, you typed them right now. (Hopefully.) You can just write these yourself, you don't need to offload it to AI.

Remember this, if you didn't care enough to write it, why should I care enough to read it? This goes for all AI slop. It's not all about the output, the human intention behind it matters.

>>725360829
lol you got got by the spoiler

>>725360945
not possible, as I didnt read it.

>>725360952
yeah man thats totally going to happen.

>>725360961
That's why you got got.

WTF I love reddit now

>>725360829
got 'eem kek

>>725299623 (OP)
>you can easily turn it off
I don't see the big issue, if they don't like it they can turn it off

>>725299623 (OP)
>Drumming up controversy when the thread in question was incredibly logical and tame
Gfys, faggot. I doubt you're even the guy making the game, but if you are, I hope it fails. Eat a dick, you conniving cunt

>>725360938
>Remember this, if you didn't care enough to write it, why should I care enough to read it? This goes for all AI slop. It's not all about the output, the human intention behind it matters.
So I don't have to pay woke people for their art and music anymore and can support devs without feeling like my money goes to entitled city slickers?
And you said AI was bad?

>>725360867
>sucess is when the government is willing to bail you out
Out of what?

>>725361068
They could also just not buy the game.

>>725361089
genuinely mindbroken

but i suppose youd have to be to be an AI nignog

>>725361110
Understandable, I had the same hardline stance against body type a/b and I won. You won't but I get it.

>>725361094
they are asking for government handouts because they cannot attract any more investors and the beast demands more tribute to keep going.

>>725361178
Anon you're the one seething that your "skill" is now redundant and people can easily replace it with a simple tool

>>725300023
Kys retard, you deserve failure

>>725360938
That's a retarded simplification, if there is AI generated text they did write it because they told it what to write, they just didn't choose and arrange the exact word sequences.

>>725361270
Sounds like a jewish usury problem not an AI problem.

>>725361384
if you are financially and technologically illiterate, sure.

>>725299623 (OP)
I'm going to have to side (against my will) with OP here.
>No internet
>no third parties
>I assume it's a FOSS LLM
>doesn't harvest your data
>only used to generate a bunch of posts
I think this is as ideal of a use case you're going to get with AI and writing: it creating a bunch of junk/one off posts.
The issue the redditors have is the term itself here: unless there's something deeper at play this is fine. I would just not call it AI, not even bring attention to it. Just give them the option to toggle it or not.
>>725340828
Yea exactly this is what I was saying. Have the issues humanity has with an idea is it's label, not it's virtue. See strawmanning.

>>725361320
>They told the AI what to write bro, it's totally the same.
Kill yourself.

Dictated but not read,
Anon

>>725361427
>I think this is as ideal of a use case you're going to get with AI and writing: it creating a bunch of junk/one off posts.
It begs the question why your game needs a bunch of garbage text if no one is expected to read it or have written it.

>uhmm there's no god or no soul, humans are just a program that has been programmed since birth
>NOOOO YOU CAN'T USE AI ART AND WRITING, THERE'S NO SOUL OR HUMAN HEART IN IT!
Exaggeration asides this is actually somewhat truthful with their mindset, the way they think they sound more religious than most Christians

>>725361472
I didn't say it was the same, my point is they put effort into refining a set of prompts, probably more than they would writing a set of static responses, so you have no basis to argue the author didn't care enough creating the text to justify you not caring enough to read it.

>>725361609
yeah might as well replace the news blurbs with symbols or set premade warnings and drop this farce.

>>725361621
Deconstructionists don't really believe in deconstruction it was just a weapon.

>>725361094
>Out of what?
Nothing. A problem that never existed and never needed or was expected to need any kind of bailout.
Literally fud to give whale investors a chance to buy a dip same as the last five times it happened. Remember deepseek, the chip shortages, restricting sales to china, and the tariffs that were all going to be the death of AI and were forgotten after a month?
But I appreciate normalfag paperhands being dumb so I can make some more money.

>>725361609
>>725361728
It can add flavor text and you can account for a bunch of systems at once. So instead of a tweet complaining about bad plumping only, you can have tweets that combine the issues of bad plumping and crime together.

>>725299623 (OP)
People, especially Reddit, have such a confrontational attitude to AI. They don't even let you shitpost with it, which is like the best use of AI


If I want to generate a picture of Guts on Joe Rogan, who the fuck are they to get pissy?

>>725301646
I didn't follow, for what reason?

>>725360795
>inb4 some zero-nuance retard feels obliged to screech incoherently at this post like a dog trained to have a Pavlovian response
>>725360905
Based, I hate those posters. Their goal is not to argue about facts and data: instead it's to engage in cliche arguments. We complain about schizos/infamous posters, but I often wonder how many useless flame wars here are just the same handful of men arguing to each other

>>725299623 (OP)
>The negative perception of it
Learn to ignore the retarded anon. They're not going to give you good advice.

>>725361923
I have soured on AI shitposts.
They used to be kino before the masses got a hold of them but now the output is all garbage.
Now its dogshit facebook boomer humor shat out in the garbage fake ghibli style with twenty layers of piss on it.
Normalniggers ruin everything. They dont deserve anything.

>>725361842
>Can't figure out how to add an aside without a LLM
Also, you're stupid.

>>725361923
People used to make photoshopped images when they wanted to shitpost on the internet. What's the word, soul?

>>725299623 (OP)
i just dont think listening to reddit is a good idea idk

>>725362167
Yours is niggerfaggot.

>>725299623 (OP)
>I am seriously considering axing the AI altogether, and hand writing a couple dozen messages for specific situations.
You should axe it anyway because this sounds very stupidly overengineered.

>>725361621
>Exaggeration asides this is actually somewhat truthful with their mindset, the way they think they sound more religious than most Christians
Because they're poser atheists who are only atheist for the sake of sticking it to the chuds and being degenerates but don't actually give a fuck about science or logic. Their brains still naturally want to be sheeple and blindly, slavishly worship something so they instead invent their own pseudo religion where they worship trees, fake science, communism, or twitter influencers

smells like curry seasoning in this thread ew
youll never escape mumbai, no matter how much free access to gemini google gives you lol

>>725360795
Thank you. Every time I see someone capable of thoughtful nuance, restores just a little bit reassurance I need to cope in life. It feels increasingly difficult to hold a position of reasonable criticism that isn't senseless demonization or mindless devotion.

>>725362167
1 minute on Chatgpt or 10 minutes on Photoshop gives the same basic result.

>>725362573
wrong, one was selected from an option of four while the other was genuine human expression

the 10 minutes in photoshop mean more

>>725360795
So this entire rant boils down to
>Ai is being sold by snakeoil merchants but is really just a cheap gimmick and not worth using

>>725362689
Most humans are pieces of shit, and the AI was created by Jews so the AI winds most of the time.

>check thread
>AI wars
>some anons think this is a choice between money and art, and don't actually know what makes money or what art is

>check video
>third world voice
>bad graphics
>unclear what the game even is (plop things down until named blobs grow in size?)
>literally cities skylines twitter messages but AI generated
The game won't sell both because it's bad and because you clearly don't have money for marketing. Reddit is a bad place for advice. This Tibetan basket weaving forum is a bad place for advice.

I assume this thread has only gotten so big because it's about AI and Indians are being triggered by the concept that AI isn't a god.

>>725299623 (OP)
Ax the local AI
Then use AI to generate hundreds of social media posts
It'd be the same thing but you'd also get to pull one over on redditors who screech about AI but are totally fine with turd world countries destroying the planet and killing babies

>>725361969
If you get pre canned responses it means nobody cares about your done to death trash post.
The aijeet debate was over years ago.
Get the hint, retard newfag.

>>725363093
The faggot who's been jerking himself about nuance will now declare himself the winner because you replied negatively.

>>725362689
art is about choices, your art is "yours" because of the choices that went into making it

>>725299623 (OP)
Just delete any emdashes and it jumps from obvious to "is this ai or just a really boring person?"

>>725361621
>pay ME for what an AI spits out!
>monkey NFTs are a good investment! It's different to when a bank says you have money because now it's cloud computing that says you have money!
>theft is A-Okay!
>I like AI anime! Finally, I can cut the Japanese out of the picture!
>AI are children who are learning to grow! Just two more weeks and it'll be a legal age artist!
>fuck humanity, gimme child tiddies
>errors? They're fine because, uhhh, wokies who disagreed with what I'm training my AI on disagree with what my AI outputs
Honestly you basing your identity on a program that spits out broken images, to own the libs, is sad
Why can't you be a trad artist? Are you the technology an corpo addicted lib who's afraid of people who can use pencils?

>>725299623 (OP)
tl;dr but
using an llm could be okay if you make it clear to players where it is used, and are using it for something that somehow benefits from runtime generation in a way similar to procedural generation (such as high reactivity to in-game events)
however if you are generating content offline then you are completely wasting your player's time

>>725363313
You don't dictate anyone's behavior and it burns you inside kek eat shit totalitarian

>>725363462
>be drawer
>create whenever I want
>be proompter
>never create, only type
>be reliant on big corp to make software
Or more likely... be a loser who begs in AI threads. If being a proompter means you're satisfied and making everything you could ever want at the push of a button... why are you not posting your proompts with every reply here? Why are you even here? Why aren't you having fun proompting?
What kind of loser comes here every day to cry that someone, somewhere on the internet doesn't think AI is saving humanity, one artefact laden child breast at a time?

The "negative perception" is a tiny handful of retarded boomers who can't get over being wrong about LLMs. And they were probably never gonna buy your shit anyway. Most people don't actually give a fuck, look at how much AI slop gets posted all across the internet and gets millions of updoots and laughs. Just use it and disclose it so the morons crying about it can feel like they're relevant by "boycotting" you.

>>725299623 (OP)
I think you should go ahead with your idea because it is unique and interesting and at the end of the day anyone not embracing new technology are going to be left behind by those who do.

People have a retarded obsessioon with AI but I really don't think you have too much to worry about in this specific instance. The main thing people dislike about AI is when it is used in a way that seems lazy. Things like "I can't draw so I use AI" or "I can't write so I will use AI to write good things for me" or "I don't know how to code so I will let the AI code for me".

However when it is used for immersion by creating endless amounts of small details that would have been a waste of resources or simply not feasible to spend that much time on as a small producer, I think it is a good thing. Like when people used AI to make automatically generated art for each individual leaf on trees in their game, that is something that would have been a massive waste of time to spend effort making thousands of custom drawings for but that can add immersion. Same with the mod someone made for GTA Online that made civilians have automatically generated voice responses to your voice chat, clearly that would not be feasible with actual voice acting and it will not always be high quality but it's a small fun detail that uses AI to add a lot of immersion to the background.

I think your idea of using AI to make small unimportant but amusing automatically regenerated fake social media messages in your game sounds like a perfect implementation of AI and I think you should go ahead with your idea.

>>725362763
Sort of. LLMs are useful for filler chatter and CYOA-style content, they're not magic "do everything" machines but they can be a good gimmick for random NPCs and for sandbox style games.
They'd also be good for those hyper autistic porn games where you farm stats and have a bunch of overly-specific fetishes that don't actually amount to anything because there's not enough writers and far too many variables to account for everything.
Unfortunately it's not very cost, resource, or time efficient to have LLMs running all this on the fly at the moment. And as you've said, the industry relies on lies and false advertising to keep the money flowing in so development is all over the place and the actual practical uses for this technology aren't being prioritised over pandering to investors and soulless corporations. Fortunately open source development is catching up a little, and we've seen some improvements on lower resource models that can run locally, as well as some smaller businesses fine-tuning and training for creative (and adult) content.

I didn't even read the rest of the thread, but don't be retarded, OP.
People reject AI because it suggests that the person creating something isn't really putting in the effort. Your cause is different from using AI to do the graphics, music, or the entire game for you. People who are using AI to make entire games just want easy money. That's not your case, you're using an algorithm capable of generating coherent sentences so that your game reacts to the player's decisions.
And yes, idiots and redditors will reject it because they just follow the herd. They don't know why AI is rejected (which I just explained), but since the herd rejects it, they reject it too, even though its use is not a reason for rejection.

Note: Just keep in mind that LLMs tend to be much more limited than they appear, and people may grow tired of the tone and "personality" of LLM-generated text over time, but this will happen with anything procedural you try as well.

>>725363313
Why are you so obsessed about money, are you doing art just because of money?

>>725299623 (OP)
>I'm using my AI to generate posts in my in-game social media app. Random people from towns post their problems and jokes to grab the player's attention if the town has problems.
That's an extremely good use for AI and would really help make a city builder feel alive.
>WHAT TF SHOULD I DO???
Just make it optional. Write some messages for people who have it disabled.

>>725299623 (OP)
why would you listen to redditards and trannies?

>>725299623 (OP)
>city building game
>AI to generate posts in my in-game social media app
How do you handle safety? What if your LLM spits out something like: "There's too many niggers in this town #crimerate"

>>725363737
If you read the thread you'd realise OP was a grifting nigger like most AIjeets and wasn't even really getting any pushback, just looking to shill his game.

>>725363767
>>>>I want to be paid to draw!
>>>I want to be paid to proompt!
>>Why are you obsessed with money?
>Why are YOU obsessed with money?
You're so fucked in the head with your corp worship you can't even read.

>>725299623 (OP)
make active ai optional
generate a couple hundred lines to use if the ai setting is toggled off

i cant imagine using ai generation locally is easy on toasters, and the tweet ticker is not important enough to dedicate that many resources to if your pc can't handle it

still leave the option to use the local ai generation tho, its cool if you can run it

>>725364096
>What if your LLM spits out something like: "There's too many niggers in this town #crimerate"
Fuck that'd be funny

>>725299623 (OP)
Do the opposite of whatever Reddit says.

>>725299623 (OP)
>no not the first one, the franchise as a whole
what

>>725363250
with such 5D fool proof mental traps he should consider a career in law, rather than defending his indian brethren on 4chan.

>>725364096
Identifying the source of unsafety is a good first step to handling safety for any reasonable use of that word.

>>725364096
Lmao. Yeah the AI going full Grok MechaHitler is also a worry when you're doing AI conversations

>>725363618
>, look at how much AI slop gets posted all across the internet and gets millions of updoots and laughs.
now charge them for it and see how much you make

>>725364129
Yes, I had noticed just by reading his message, but I decided to post it anyway in case he was genuinely retarded.

>>725365069
Noooo, having niggers be able to be near you so they can slit your throat for a million dollar gofundme payout is safe, you know what's unsafe? Being able to say say they shouldn't be able to do that.

>>725324825
>if they don't realize it's AI.
absolutely huge if
all the art is obvious to anyone
all the essays are immediately obvious to any native english speaker

>>725364096
>How do you handle safety? What if your LLM spits out something like: "There's too many niggers in this town #crimerate"

>>725365286
SAFETY IS WHEN YOU ARE NICE TO NIGGERS, IT JUST 8S OK??!!?

>>725363737
>People reject AI because it suggests that the person creating something isn't really putting in the effort.
yeah, like generating all the text for ingame npcs.

>>725299623 (OP)
Ask yourself this:
>Does your game meaningfully produce enough different outcomes that the text assets you will be showing the player will be meaningfully unique due to that generation?

A lot of games - stuff like Zoo Tycoon - use simple mad lib localization approaches.
Stuff like
>Boy! I sure had fun at [LOCATION_ORIGIN]. I really need to get to [LOCATION_DESTINATION] though!

That isn't foundationally different then what a micro model will give you if you tell it to give you a string based on going from point to point.
I get what you are going for, its a neat idea - but its the sort of thing where the players end experience isn't being meaningfully improved over just having a mad libs approach and doing it like pre-llm games did it.
Understand that ai is a major consumer issue right now and you have to weigh the benefits of using the tech vs the stigma involved.

If you really don't feel like writing mad libs, just generate the text beforehand during development and strip the model instead of running a micro model in every executable to generate text snippets on the fly.

>>725300023
>potential customers
as if they have thoughts and opinions of their own

>>725359527
>food analogy

>>725365069
Identifying the source of unsafety is an act of antisemitism.

>>725365580
You have no concept of how much effort it would take to implement the mechanic being described, and have not even tried to imagine a creative AI process beyond hitting a button and publishing what comes out. I estimate your IQ at 80.

>>725299623 (OP)
>YOU USED AI TO MAKE RANDOM NUMBERS ON THE BARCODES OF CEREAL BOX LITTER MODELS IN YOUR GAME!? UGH, NO THANKS.
I hate virtue signaling brainlets that just shit on anything having to do with AI, even when it's just being used as a glorified randomizer.
They'll never generate a good movie, or produce a viable real-time photorealistic render of a game, but making random text messages as vague background noise is whatever.

>>725361621
>Autist can't understand that the same word can have wildly different meanings and connotations depending on the context
lmao

>>725365950
you are right no game before had flavor text before.
>creative AI process
lmao

>>725365950
Most IDE's have the capacity to create novel codebases on their own now. You can just tell your IDE to make an application with a given set of parameters and it will do it for you.

Manually writing all of the npc dialogue by hand yourself takes more effort than downloading model weights and having gemini script up a micro model for you to use them.

>>725299623 (OP)
some people are autistically against anything involving AI, but i think there are a lot of neat usecases for it in video games

>>725366106
80 might be generous.

AI is only acceptable in media that's free. No sane person would pay for that. The best you can get away with are donations.

>>725299623 (OP)
Dont axe it you mongoloid.

>>725367080
What about in mixed media that uses AI in only a subset of them like videogames

>>725340431
>a billion times stronger AI
lmao

>>725367362
I think any AI is a dealbreaker for a lot of dedicated gamers. Say they'd rather buy a game with 0 voiceover than some AI voiced lines.

>>725367518
Sounds like an ideological hardline not based in practicality, we know how those go.

>>725299623 (OP)
>>WHAT TF SHOULD I DO???
You should do what you've always been told. Don't give a single fuck about Redditors.

>>725299623 (OP)
Why do you give a fuck about what reddit thinks? They don't play or buy anything, they just bitch about it and tell other people what to do. Just do what you want and tell them to fuck off.

>>725300023
Please consider how many games have been ruined because test audiences are too fucking retarded to understand basic mechanics. Then consider that Reddit is an even worse source of valid criticism.

>>725299623 (OP)
Couldn't you just write the posts yourself?

>>725299623 (OP)
Not your safe space, not your personal army, buy an ad and also kill yourself for faking controversy.

>>725300023
passion
what's missing in vidya

>>725336134
Idk. It could be an interesting gameplay mechanic. This isn't some fast paced shooting game. You're supposed to use you brain to actually make the right decisions. That's how country building works irl too. If you can't pick upon hints, you miss opportunities.

>>725300023
vidya industry greed in a nutshell

>>725328289
Yeah don't worry I'm keeping it. I'll make it different though and use a tag system like i already wrote.
>make it optional
Both redditors and 4chinners are telling me this, meanwhile it IS already optional, turned off easily.
I'll just continue working hard on it and let the work speak for itself.
Hope to make more devlogs and ask people here for opinions. It's truly a great feeling when people seem passionate about a topic, so i can work something out that'd work. I'm not even halfway through reading all the comments.

>>725299623 (OP)
>op not only browses reddit but digs through the comment sections

>indie devs start using AI
can't wait for the increase on the slop, soon both AAA and indies will be nothing but trash not worth playing.
there is already 52 games on average being released on steam with a good chunk being haf assed. the shitshow will probably reach 200 daily releases by 2027 lol

>>725299623 (OP)
ARC Raiders uses AI and not a peep. Stop caring about what homeless people think, they're not real people.

>>725299623 (OP)
These people care more about pixels being slop than the literal food they eat made out of slop (soi oil, ultra processed, disgusting). You can't take them seriously and so you shouldn't disclose AI use whenever possible.

>>725362828
it's insane this is the only post out of 500 calling out this game as bad
LLM doesn't matter, it's stupid that you're running it locally but it won't be a factor in this game failing at all

this is the type of shit that just dies on the "all new releases" page of steam, and you never get your 100 dollars back

>>725371850
I cook my own food and you are still an AIjeet.

>>725338127
Cities: Skylines would be a better game without the Chirper feed.

>>725300023
>>725299623 (OP)
Here's what you do.
>Say that AI is temp solution because you can't afford anything more
>You'll get rid of it once 1.0 version comes out
>never get rid of it
>people will eventually forget about it
And remember to never listen to people that had not yet buyed your game.

>>725372689
>it's insane this is the only post out of 500 calling out this game as bad
do you think anyone is gonna bother even checking the game out? lol

>>725299623 (OP)
Those citizen tweets are instantly recognisable as AI. The issue isn't about whether you use a local model vs a remote one vs pre-generating them. The issue is that I hate reading LLM output unless I'm knowingly deliberately using one (and I'm not a huge fan of it even then).

If I'm playing a game and I see a text box pop up with LLM drivel, I'll probably stop playing.

>>725333386
>Everybody I know irl either has no opinion on AI or likes it and uses it all the time.
yeah we know that ranjeesh

>>725299623 (OP)
Go back and stay there

>>725317567
do big brains not bother to spellcheck?