>3 seater as primary fighter
What was the republic thinking??

>>63870655 (OP)
They were operated by clones, their lives didn't matter.

>>63870655 (OP)
The Republic also used the Z-95, V-19, V-wing, and Y-wing as air superiority/multirole fighters on top of a plethora of other models in less common use.

>>63870655 (OP)
Wasn't it more of a Long range fighter/bomber?

>>63870655 (OP)
??

>>63870689

>>63870655 (OP)
Can’t outmaneuver droids…. But people don’t like seeing clones die. So by putting 3 in a fighter it gives it 3x the plot armor.

>>63870881
>people don’t like seeing clones die
I do :3

>>63870655 (OP)
>still believes scifi is written based on logic and not rule of cool and plastic injection molding limitations for toys

>>63870655 (OP)
Republic Clone Pilots had plenty of single seat fighters
Alpha-3 V-wing
V-19 Torrent
Z-95 headhunter

the ARC-170 was more of a long range heavy fighter using the WW2 analogy something like a P-38 lightning or the German BF-110 which even had the backwards facing gun.

it's a torpedo bomber, not a fighter

I don't know about the republics thought process but I know George's:
>Heh but what if jar jar was in it, yes and what if three jar jars were in it!

>>63871096
in this instance george looks towards ww2 naval combat. this clearly has ww2 torpedo bomber vibes.

he based malevolence in tcw on bismark and its hunt (right down to y-wings damaging it enough for warships to catch up to it, and it being scuttled)

>>63870689
It's still cheaper to use your clones more efficiently.
>dude we're talking about a government that financed two death stars
Yeah I know.

>>63870655 (OP)
Three-man fighters are based

>>63870655 (OP)
They had long range hyperdrives installed, so you need a navigator on board.

>>63873046
The navigator is the R4, middle seat is the WSO.

>>63870655 (OP)
>What was the republic thinking??
Hevy fightre cool
Spoiler: They were right.

>>63870655 (OP)
There are clearly four seats. Why you gotta disparage droids like that?

>>63871003
>P-38 lightning
id say its a mix of the tbm avenger and the Bf110 that you already mentioned

>>63873295
Republicucks don't respect droids because they know they're far superior to lab grown meat. They'd rather call us clankers and scrap metal

>>63870655 (OP)
>What was the republic thinking??
the fighter is capable of serving as a command vehicle

>>63870689
No, the clones where expensive compared to a droid army.
It was pretty much a smaller elite force of clones with jedi generals vs a massive droid army that came faster out of the factory then you could kill them.

>>63871015
Hell yeah

>>63870826
That’s an attacker, it’s made for attacking big ass planes

>>63873648
>Not even enough clones grown to conquer a single planet

>>63873660
Clones where never supposed to win anyway, that was not the role they had, they just had to drag out the war long enough so all the jedi where in the exposed for order 66.

>>63873681
They were still supposed to be able to fight a galactic war and not instantly be overwhelmed because they were too few to fight over even a couple of worlds

>>63870655 (OP)
It's a long range strike fighter. The primary fighter is the V-wing.

>>63870655 (OP)

ARC-170s are basically the Republic’s equivalent of B5N or TBM Avenger torpedo bombers, mainly intended for long range power projection/attacking Separatist starships. The actual canon mainstay air superiority fighter is the V-Wing. They have only get portrayed as air superiority fighters in the games because of their prominence in Revenge of the Sith (where they performed very poorly).

>>63870932

Based

>>63870655 (OP)
The V-19 Torrent was the superiority fighter in the early war, the Z-95 slowly took its place alongside the V-Wing. Both struggled against hordes of dirt cheap CIS droid fighters. It's why the TIE-LN is short range, cheap, with no anti-capital ship capability, but excellent in a dogfight. It was designed to out swarm the CIS swarms.

Don't get me wrong, the ARC-170 is an abomination that can't decide if it wants to be a fighter, a bomber, or a long range recon ship. But the republic wasn't fielding them to be a primary fighter.

>>63873660
Planetary battles in Star Wars always seem to take place in a handful of strategic points, rather than throughout the whole planet. It's logically retarded, but the clone army's size does make sense in universe.

>>63874311
I preferred the pre-prequels EU explanation that TIEs were shit because the Emperor didn't want to give one man craft too much power.

>>63874341
That's reasonable too. The Empire is not supposed to be a functional autocracy, and being terrified of long range fighter pilots defecting or going rogue is reasonable from the POV of an illegitimate despot. Also the fear that if warfare shifted to small craft focus, he could no longer justify the massive vanity projects the empire liked engaging in.

Though in my opinion the TIE actually does pretty well at what it was designed to do in the movies. It's a short range fighter, designed to dogfight and intercept enemy small craft. Three of them are a credible threat to the falcon. They do well against the Alliance's X-Wings in the trench run (of course we can assume those were some of the empire's best pilots following Vader), and we see standard TIE-LNs continue to be credible threats to our heroes' small craft in the following movies, although they're seen struggling more as time goes on, that makes sense for an aging fighter.

By contrast, I feel like the Imperial Star Destroyer is really overhyped. In the movies we only ever see it bully ships far below its weight class.

>>63874311
>alongside the V-Wing
I always thought that thing was a bomber because of BF2

>>63870689
>using organic pilots at all when sentient robots/computers exist
It's all retarded.

>>63874373
Same. I guess they were already having the rebels re-use the LAAT so they didn't want the republic to re-use the Y-Wing?

>>63874341
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DqfgwY9Sj_0
Stargate did the evil galaxy wide empire a lot better.

>>63874341
>because the Emperor didn't want
Star Wars has an overexplaining problem. They could have just said they wanted to have as many fighters as possible in each star destroyer and the TIE actually works very well and their losses are usually low.

TIE Fighter and X-wing vs TIE fighter brought it back to parity with the Z-95 and the lack of shields was balanced with more armor and better speed and turning.

The movies TIEs are never worse than the rebel fighters they face.

>>63870689
The Republic is unironically evil. Using human clones that have no rights, aging them from birthing chambers to be slave soldiers to fight and die in a war that they never instigated to be killed in horrific and brutal ways and never remembered or cared about, to never be loved, never have a family, never live a normal peaceful life. Their sole purpose to die fighting a bunch of droids.
Say what you want about the CIS, but at least they are more ethical in waging war. They use robots primarily as a fighting force that are barely sentient, just machines not of flesh and blood, build for one purpose; combat. The CIS really might actually be righteous in the clone wars the more I think about it. I get that they were just pawns of Sheev, but at the same time they had every right to not be ruled by the Republic and forge their own economic destinies rather than keeping the the trillions of humans on coruscant fat and greedy.

>>63874896
>CIS, but at least they are more ethical in waging war. They use robots primarily as a fighting force that are barely sentient
Robots should never have rights. A droid's software can be saved, copied or replaced. CIS also never did warcrimes unlike genocidal jedi.

>>63874914
You know, come to think of it, there was probably a ton of abuse at those Jedi Temples... all of the masters having all that power over those little small children padawans... there's no way some of those kids didn't get molested.

>>63874914
>CIS also never did warcrimes unlike genocidal jedi.
ok sheev

>>63874925
CIS droids literally always accepted surrender.

>>63874925
Name them please.

>>63874958
>The Confederacy would attempt to commit a mass genocide on the people of Mahran under orders from Count Dooku. The planet was of strategic importance to the Confederacy because of its vast quantities of natural resources. In response, the people of Mahran begged the Jedi Council to send aid. The Jedi responded by sending Jedi General Chubor with a task force of clone troopers. However, they were too late to prevent Separatist forces from laying waste much of the planet, including the capital city. The Republic attempted to escort the remaining Mahranee off world but were stopped when the Separatists launched a massive attack, slaughtering all the civilians, Jedi and clones

>>63874976
>Mahran
They deserved it

>>63870655 (OP)
They won the war so they were clearly thinking correctly.

>inb4 the Empire won the war
Where did the equipment, vehicles, weapons, etc. the Empire first used come from?

>>63874989
during their assault on Coruscant the confederation bombarded the civilian population of the planet by dropping their burning warships on them

>>63874896
The tragedy of the Republic is that it was all the things that Palpatine said it was. Inept, bureaucratic, cruel, and so on. It deserved to be replaced, but like in so many revolutions the cure was worse than the disease. The CIS were like most early revolutionaries; useful early on, then disposed of when the true leadership seized unlimited power.

While I hated most of the sequels, I did think it was a somewhat fitting that the New Republic, which was founded so soon after the Old Republic fell, would turn into the same kind of helpless and barely functional government that could once again be destroyed with relative ease. If the New Republic had been founded a bit later and outside of most living memory, maybe it could unshackle itself from the legacy of the Old.

If I would like anything for stories set after episode IX, I want to see no Republic and no Empire. Instead there could more independent systems and small confederacies that reject centralization but do keep actual standing armies and fleets.

>>63870655 (OP)
It WASN'T their primary fighter, though. That was taken by the V-19 in the early war and the Z-95 Headhunter in the mid-to-late war.

>>63874364
Reasonable take. Always got the impression that standard TIEs were solid ships but with a wide performance envelope that could make them extremely dangerous in the hands of a pilot that could push them to the limit. With TIE interceptors being the natural next step.

>Star Destroyers always get destroyed or outmaneuvered in stupid ways

Yeah. Something that’s supposed to have been complete and utter overkill in all but the very largest of engagements turns into a space version of Mr. Magoo in all appearances, and gets wrecked because jodhpurs are evil.

>>63874327
>Planetary battles in Star Wars always seem to take place in a handful of strategic points, rather than throughout the whole planet. It's logically retarded
I think it's logical if you accept cheap, ubiquitous hyperdrive and sublight technology.
Why exploit a tier 2 resource on a planet if the next planet over has a tier 1 resource for the taking?
When hopping planets is practically a commuting distance, there's a lot less pressure to develop marginal worlds or to exploit every last corner of them.

I like to think that most Star Wars planets only have a few cities and the rest is wilderness and lost ruins of extinct planet-bound civilisations.

>>63874922
>there's no way some of those kids didn't get molested.
I think that would be hard to get away with that when surrounded by people who can read your emotions, intentions and sometimes thoughts.
Jedi are also taught self-control as standard.

>>63870655 (OP)
>Aggressive ReConnaissance-170
Pretty sure it wasn't designed as a frontline fighter but you work with what you have.

>workhorse of the clone wars
>workhorse of the rebellion
What more do you need?

I just like the shot of it exploding and the bodies falling out.

More air batle scenes should portray the meat/body aspect of an airkill.

>>63876106
Most air battles cause the body to disappear to ash due to the weapons involved.
>and the bodies falling out.
>happens once (1)
Lol

Is it just me or does Star Wars forget these things are supposed to have 3 pilots quite a lot?
>>63876106
Ace Combat Assault Horizon did that with the stupid DFM mode.

>>63876090
Weird that the Rebel Alliance didn't reprogram those droid starships, they would have made excellent force multipliers.

Then just spam A-wings and Y-wings to victory.

>>63876201
Have to imagine by the time the rebellion was really hitting its stride(roughly 10 years after the clone wars ended) the empire would have scrapped most droid factories and surplus.

>>63876562
The Imperial military spent its early years justifying its existence and overreach by slapping about 'Separatist holdouts', some of which were deliberately exploited to bypass protections for worlds with valuable resources that centuries-old regulations prevented the development of. Imperial glowies would take caches of ex-seppie weapons and drop them on these 'Legacy Worlds' (think of them as planetary-scale national parks) for military recon to conveniently find and use as evidence to revoke the senate's protections.

>>63873654
What would stop the tail gunner from shooting off his own tail?

>>63877566
>What would stop the tail gunner from shooting off his own tail?
I think there's a lock-out when pointed directly back?

>>63874327
Well not all planets are home to civilizations like earth, a planet that was colonised might just have like 3 cities, which may not even be that big.

>>63876201
>Weird that the Rebel Alliance didn't reprogram those droid starships
Rebels using droids wouldn't be beneficial to their cause. Remember that most big name rebels were part of the Imperial government and using droids from the previous war would get them branded as traitors and their support would dwindle.

>>63877885
Yeah. Remember the official name for the Rebellion is "The Alliance to Restore the Republic". They wanted nothing to do with any residual CIS.

>>63874914
Yeah, you hit the head on why even if Star Wars droids are sentient, giving them the same rights as organics would be terrible as the Techno-Union could manufacture an army of yesmen who are programmed to agree with them to drown out all demographics.

>>63876201
droids became a big taboo after tcw.

trillions or more were killed by them after all.

>>63874364
>>63874341
the TIE's do exactly what they're supposed to do. be cheap, exendable, swarm attackcraft for you trillions of spaarti clone sharted out printed fighter pilots.

the whole point of the TIE and the associated fighter corp is to inflict and receive massive casualites. because the death and suffering etc all feeds into the dark side and super-powers up Big E and Vader man. all the while your tie fighter 'wing' that started out with 144 goobs, flash taught in the cylinder, get's whittled down to eventually you're left with 12-24 seriously insane, deadly veterans who take your crappy cheap fighters, and use it to murder anything that looks at them funny, no matter how much 'better' their craft is.

all for about 1/3 the cost of getting 24 normal humans and training them up properly, and giving them an actual space superiority fighter.
same reason the empire printed 1000 man job lots of identical, shit stormtroopers and then sent them into meatgrinders to kill and die in massive numbers, with maybe 200-300 extremely deadly, psycho veterans coming out alive on the other end.

people also forget about the economies of scale.
you need MILLIONS of star destroyers, Imperial I
s or II's just to patrol your new Empire. the associated starfighter corp. well that's hundreds of millions. then add in all the garrisons and such. and now you need trillions and so of the things.

which the average citizen will never ever see. on most imperial worlds the have ID cards and such change from old republic to imperial insignia. maybe some local cops get replaced by a few squads of stormies. and some ISB goons start hanging around. their government gets replaced. but for the actual people.. well they don't see any of the empire doing empire shit. all they know is the holonet, the IMPERIAl holonet, reporting on the empires legions and destroyers smashing this pirate nest that cell of bandits. you can trade along the hylian way again!

>>63875058
you're forgetting that's because the rule of two sith spent literal thousands of years corrupting it. perverting it. preying upon any greedy, selfish corrupt idiot's weaknesses and pushing them over the edge.

>>63870655 (OP)
>Republic ARC-170 fighter designers, 18 BBY (colorized)

>>63871196
at least post the superior Ju-88 if you're going to wehragoon

>>63874896
the CIS enslaved not just its clones but also its civilians however

>>63875129
>When hopping planets is practically a commuting distance, there's a lot less pressure to develop marginal worlds or to exploit every last corner of them.
that's part of the problem with TPM, which is otherwise a pretty alright movie: Coruscant to Tatooine is half a week away
just because they have a busted hyperdrive, they can't catch a fucking space taxi or whatever to get to Coruscant. or say trade in the Queen's ship for a junker with a working hyperdrive.
the Tatooine subplot of TPM is like travelling from Seattle to New York and suddenly being forced to gamble in a casino in Idaho for a radiator and a local slaveboy

>>63876201
Palpatine was afraid of the Rebels using his own tools against him, so one of the first things he did was to wipe out the CIS droid armies and the Kaminoan cloners

>>63877974
>Imperial WaPo headline: Alliance To Restore The Republic Recruits Deeply Problematic CIS "Azov Legions" In Its Rebellion Against Pupitin

>>63878160
>trillions or more were killed by them after all.
Except for corescant, I think most worlds in star wars are more lightly populated than we'd expect because almost nobody is limited to the planet they live on.

>>63878259
yeah
>South Dakota population: ~1 million
>New York State population: ~19 million

>>63878259
If that were the case, why would a crime infested desert shithole like tattooine even be inhabited at all.

>>63878339
Because its cheap to film there.

But really, the cost of living is low; outer rim territory, but still somehow along major trading and travel lanes for some reason.

>>63878339
>why would a crime infested desert shithole like tattooine even be inhabited at all
Because they can infest it with crime, which makes it attractive to criminals.
That it sucks is why it's not a Republic planet and just a pitstop between some trading routes, which feeds back into the crime due to smuggling opportunities. It did have a brief gold rush due to some minable mineral but it fell through due to impurities.

Even so, there are basically three native groups on tattooine.
Civilians left behind after the mining boom dried up who support the spaceport and related trading post via moisture farming or whatever.
Jawa who are a devolved precursor species imprisoned on the planet.
Sand people (Tusken Raideds) who are a different devolution of the same thing as Jawas.

Tattooine is kind of Tortuga crossed with Abu Dhabi.

>>63878339
tattoine is so lowly populated, that they farm moisture out of the air, producing some of the galaxy's cleanest, least polluted water, with zero anything in it except for h2o. that they then sell to the core worlds like coruscant for a jillion percent markup. that's why that small crappy farmers like the owen and beru, could afford to just bydroids whenever jawas came through, and still had work for their adopted son. why they could jsut buy speeders, and a t-16 just for their son to fuck about with.
>that is like a farmer here on our real earth buying their kid a fucking f4 phantom (complete with cannon) just so the kid can go blasting through the fucking grand canyon in it on his days off, popping fucking bears and shit with the gun
we also see the darklighter family pretty much being so wealthy, they can buy pretty much whatever they like, and run whole swathes of the planet like fucking JABBA did.

>>63878339
>why would a crime infested desert shithole like tattooine even be inhabited at all
It's basically picrel

>>63878259
the cis invaded multiple worlds and burnt the surface away of many, led by a cyborg. trillions of casualties would be a low-end for a universe with a billion inhabitable star systems.

>>63878424
Nah, the T-16 is more like owning a demilitarized crop-duster.

>>63878542
not fast or agile enough. and remember, its single blaster rated the safe as one of the x-wings. and it had almost the same level of avionics in it.

hell, the more i think about it, that's like owning a fucking f 16 A

>>63878580
>not fast or agile enough
Bruh, it's called the worm bomber for a reason, because pilots would do dive bombing while dusting crops.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPKCD8nC9w8

>>63878339
Think of it like a truck stop that's being run by a cartel. It's in a convenient position on the outer trade lanes, so they can fleece anyone who actually wants to stop there (without actually robbing them because it's bad for business) and use it as a base for slaver raids and such.

>>63878239
>Pupitin
Palputin

>>63878644
its still not equivalent. remember, the t-16 had so many bells and whistles in it, it was almsot identical in the cockpit to the x wing, a premiere, top of the line, space superiority fighter. and as said, its laser cannon was rated the same as one from off an x wing.

>>63878695
>its still not equivalent. remember, the t-16 had so many bells and whistles in it, it was almsot identical in the cockpit to the x wing, a premiere, top of the line, space superiority fighter. and as said, its laser cannon was rated the same as one from off an x wing.

imagine how bored this guy must have been after he won. what even comes close to being the one that finished a thousand year old revenge plan, killing his archenemies, most of them not even knowing what defeated them, all while throwing the literal senate at yoda

>>63878225
I think that's not it, the Republic just became too large and corrupt mostly on its own.
There were two evil people (who often plot to kill or undermine the other) having to work from the shadows and nudge the Republic to be more corrupt vs thousands of Jedi who openly have a giant temple near the Galactic Senate and are quasi-part of the government.

>>63878339
same reason the Middle East, Africa and India exists today, anon
unwillingness to either conquer them or nuke them

>>63878716
>make stupid claim
>be corrected
>hurr durr YOU NERD

>>63874896

The CIS didn’t use droids for ethical reasons, it used droids because its military was largely compromised of the private armies of the Trade Federation; who were massive cheapskates that used droids because they were cheaper and even more willing to blindly follow orders than traditional mercenaries. Your average hired gun for Czerka corporation might have second thoughts about trying to shoot Jedi or demand extra money upfront.

>>63875058
>The tragedy of the Republic is that it was all the things that Palpatine said it was. Inept, bureaucratic, cruel, and so on.

Palpatine and his predecessors were instrumental in causing the institutional rot that brought down the Republic. Grand Plan and all.

>>63876201

There isn’t exactly a source for this in EU or Disney, but I always assumed that the shutdown command bricked the droids to prevent them from simply being reactivated unless you gave them a software patch overriding the shutdown.

>>63874364

This, the Empire is a dysfunctional shithole, rife with corruption, graft, backstabbing, purges, and the general shittiness you find in most totalitarian states.

>>63870986
>Merchandising! Merchandising! where the real money from the movie is made!

(Have you heard that both Mel Brooks and Rick Moranis are doing Spaceballs 2, with Brooks at the sprightly young age of 98, and its due out next year? )

>>63878339
Thanks to a post-Disney YA book, Tatooine has a canon population of 200,000, not necessarily including Jawas or Tuskens. It's an entire planet with the population of Tallahassee, Florida.

>>63879576
Yeah, the teaser was worth a chuckle.

>>63880432
nothing disney is star wars. go jump in a lake.

>>63880432
Writers don't even have a basic understanding of measurements or scale, time after time it keeps being absolutly fuckin laughable

>>63880729
Like how the Droid Army outnumbers the GRA by billions. I think the official numbers for the clones have always been like 10 million or something. Pro tip if you write sci-fi, unless you're trying to strictly keep a sense of scientific realism, just don't fucking bother giving hard numbers for anything. This is how you end up with there being 1 million Space Marines for the entire Imperium or a Gundam with an extremel low generator output.

>>63874896
>Palpatine puts in an order for a secret clone army that the Republic will have to use to prevent being overwhelmed by the rebellion Palpatine fomented
>"Wow, Palpatine was really right about those Republic guys, huh?"
No shit.

>>63878461
Point of order: According to an information packet distributed to authors (like Alan Dean Foster) after the first move came out, there were about 25,000 inhabited worlds in the old Republic. Not billions.

>>63874594
y-wing being a republic fighter was a 2008 clone wars addition iirc

>>63874896
>The CIS really might actually be righteous in the clone wars the more I think about it
were it not for lucas and later the clone wars character assassinating Dooku and the CIS as a whole you'd be right for the most part although obsiously they weren't saints ant there's nuances to both sides

the prequels really were just one giant missed opportunity

>>63875058
I think if anything the new republic would have a lot of dysfunction just due to having to use a lot of imperial left overs.
Look at reconstruction or the de-nazifying of germany both didn't go so well and this version of trying to erase the old regime wouldn't even get outside help.

>Instead there could more independent systems and small confederacies that reject centralization but do keep actual standing armies and fleets.
that actually is the plot going forward in the sequels apparently but that requires outside reading lmao

>>63878217
The Empire doesn't use clones outside of special exceptions like the 501st.

>>63881096
no. the empire uses mass produced personnel in all ranks and levels from cheap and nasty spaarti cylinders. leavening the chaff with recruitment such as academies at carida, etc.
its why they can turn out fully crewed warships so fast. fast flash taught clones.

you're confusing the long, expensive kaminoan cloning with the cheap and nasty spaarti.

>>63878728
>He won
He didn't though and still had work to do, since Yoda, Obi-wan and yet an increasing amount of Jedi who survived ordered 66 needed to be hunted down.

Plus while he didn't have absolute power yet even when the republic became the empire because the senate still had some power even if they were essentially republican rubber stamp legislator for him since there were still some occasions where opposition to his plans sprung up like with the Imperial Defense Recruitment Bill, which shuttered the Clone Army and officially created the Imperial Stormtrooper program and dumped the clones to the curb. Although Palpatine had to personally step in to make sure that bill got across the finish line, and that's probably what he loved doing, always being a few moves ahead of everyone else.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBD4nLhesOU

>>63881096
>The Empire doesn't use clones
Only because the Kamino clone facility was destroyed. They would have continued otherwise.

>>63881297
no. they already were moving away from kaminoan to spaarti before the end of the clone wars. because they could only stretch the DNA from jango so far, they ran out of Jango, what with him being dead and all. plus kaminoan takes years and years, and cost a fuckload.
spaarti clones were being mass produced on coruscant's moon, the moon of commenor, and some other places. its how the empire was able to suddenly shit out the trillions of military aged young men needed to crew all their new big ships they 'suddenly' had, fly the teeming trillions of fighters, and suddenly have legions of legions.

>>63878225
>rule of two sith
You say that while sheev has 3+ apprentices at the same time, some of which know about each other: dooku, grevious, anakin. Plus the apprentices seek apprentices of their own. Fun side about sith is they don't mind ignoring their own rules. The only point of "rule of two" is that there's no loyal lieutenants or hiearchy beyond master-apprentice and the apprentice is known likely to betray their master if able.

>>63881354
>sheev has 3+ apprentices at the same time, some of which know about each other: dooku, grevious, anakin
Anakin killed Dooku and took his place
Grievous was never a Sith, he's not even a Force user

>>63881297
>>63881333
Tarkin and Plapatine were already wanting to wind down the Clone Program because of how expensive it was. Yes, clone troops are better than conscripts, but you still need to pay the bills and Tarkin would rather see that money go to his terror weapons like the Death Star. And once Rampart's TK program was seen as viable, it all but sealed the clone army and Kamino's fate.

>>63881379
oh i see the problem. take your fucking disneytardation retcons, revisions and fucktardery and shove them right back up your keister where they came from, you fucking faggot.

we're talking star wars. not disneyfag hatewank.

>>63878695
>T-16 was 1/4th as good as xwing
>Z-95 was half as good as xwing
I'm starting to think the xwing is not as advanced as they say and just glued two Z-95s together.

>>63881414
Get some help.

>>63881354
>You say that while sheev has 3+ apprentices at the same time
Only Dooku and Maul coexisted and they were different kinds of sigh and apprentices. I'm not sure how much they knew about each other either.

>>63878339
The further you get from the core the more people don't want to deal with it. Hutts might be gangsters but they for the most part keep to themselves and keep things relatively sane.

>>63876201
Poor optics, most of the imperial worlds are going to be anti-CIS and you won't win hearts and minds by using their tools or even teaming up with them, which is why the rebellion ignored any sep holdouts.

>>63880937
The movie-verse Y-Wing was always meant to be a fighter. The DOS games turned it into a bomber.

>>63880432
>Tatooine has a canon population of 200,000, not necessarily including Jawas or Tuskens. It's an entire planet with the population of Tallahassee, Florida
That's not unreasonable, it's a truckstop with a casino and some farms.

>>63881562
Always funny how that went, but it seems like the meme of the y-wing being the F-4 Phantom II has withstood the test of time and canon switch.

>>63876201
Besides the fact the OT came out first and nobody had any idea what the Separatists were...

The Empire probably scrapped most of the CIS's ships postwar, and what ships that might be derelict in deep space would have a poor match-up against the Imperial Fleet. I can't see a totalitarian despot-run state just leaving a bunch of warships lying around.

Of course, if the Rebels came across an old recusant or munificent, it's a free ship. This should go for old republic ships too. I've seen occasional art of an old clone wars ship in a rebel battlegroup and it makes me smile.

>>63874896
Lucas really fucked up the clone wars didn't he?

I love the ARC-170 so much bros

I think its such a cool looking ship

>>63882566
He flat out says there are heroes and villains on both sides.

>>63870932
Bulli

>>63874914
CIS did several "base delta zero" operations and released bio-weapons. Which would be considered warcrimes.

>>63882559

Something like 40% of the Separatist Navy was lost in the Battle of Coruscant, so much so that the CIS leadership was essentially on the run for the remaining weeks/months of the war because they didn’t have enough starships left to guard a capital. It’s safe to say that a majority of the navy had been destroyed by war’s end and what ships were taken as trophies by the Empire and later scrapped, were used by their now skeletal crews as what was left of the Separatist holdouts degenerated into piracy, or simply left derelict to drift in the emptiness of space. Whatever their fate, Separatist warships were a rarity by the Galactic Civil War.

>>63882566

The Clone Wars should have started out in Episode 1 as a regional conflict that by Episode 2 has completely spiraled out of control and the Republic is on the verge of total defeat to the CIS Droid Army's overwhelming superiority in numbers. Clone troopers are only adopted after Palpatine successfully usurps the Chancellorship in a last ditch attempt to turn the tide and Palpatine uses it to begin supplanting the Republic’s traditional institutions such as the regular professional army and the Jedi Order. By Episode 3, clones now make up the overwhelming majority of enlisted ranks and years of bloody combat have left the officer class completely disillusioned with democracy, with the loudest voice advocating dictatorship being none other than a certain Jedi, Anakin Skywalker.

Think of it as a parallel to the First World War, as some say that Nazism was born in the trenches of the Western Front, the Empire is born in the trenches of the Outer Rim Sieges.

>>63874896
The clone army was comissioned by Dooku.
The Republic didn't even know about it until Obi Wan showed up on Kamino trying to hunt down Jango.

>ARC-170
>Aggressive ReConnaissance 170 Starfighter

It was meant as a heavy fighter / long range interceptor / escort. Literally based off the P61. Meant to fly deep into enemy territory, attack whatever it has to attack including capital ships and then fly back home and with its rear tail gunner kill anything trying to chase it.

In practice I would say its like a cross between P38, F14 and F18

>>63881526
Qui Gon's death is what pushed Dooku to defect. Dooku didn't become a Sith until Maul was already dead.

>>63874896
Your post is exactly why Lucas had to go overboard in making the CIS overtly evil in the CGI Clone Wars show. Prior to that show most Legends material tacitly acknowledged how morally grey the Clone Wars were, and was better for it.

Also, both the Republican AND the CIS were puppets of Sheev.

>>63883377
>Lucas
doesn't do shit outside of his movies
he virtually ignores the EU
>the CGI Clone Wars show
is Filoni's fanfiction, nothing to do with Lucas

>>63883377
I think with the CIS, Grievous got away from them. But since he was so successful in his campaigns, they kept him on (along with Dooku being a Sith and all).

Grievous ordering a planet's surface wiped out isn't really anything different than what humans on earth do to one another; it's just cities instead of planets.

>>63883401
>Executive producer and worked with Filoni
As much as you hate it, orange buttcheeks is cannon.

>>63883401
>is Filoni's fanfiction, nothing to do with Lucas
NTA, but Lucas had a lot of story input in TCW, which is why it's actual bearable compared to Rebels.

>>63883418
Also he funded it, unlike Rebels which is why the quality took a major hit.
Which is a shame because Disney does have the money to make good looking stuff.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APLn2v8ykYs

>>63883414
Speaking of that.
It was nice to see Grevious get a few wins like when he wiped out the Nightsisters and how when he deals with enemies that are his target without plot armor he doesn't fuck around and just stabs them
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APLn2v8ykYs

>>63883401
>doesn't do shit outside of his movies
>he virtually ignores the EU

If you have sole veto power for works set in your fictional universe and you allow them to be published, that's tacit approval for the fanbase to consider them canon.


Lucas doesn't like Mara Jade? Well he shouldn't have permitted works with her in them to be published then.

>>63883418
Also he funded it, unlike Rebels which is why the quality took a major hit.
Which is a shame because Disney does have the money to make good looking stuff.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APLn2v8ykYs

>>63883414
Speaking of that.
It was nice to see Grevious get a few wins like when he wiped out the Nightsisters and how when he deals with enemies that are his target without plot armor he doesn't fuck around and just stabs them
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRnVj-sblOE

>>63878217
>>63881096
Whole point of de-investing in clones was that Palps figured out grabbing recruits from his trillions-strong manpower pool was more efficient than trying to get the government to raise a bunch of children.

>>63880432
There are only two cities on the entire planet worth a fuck (Mos Espa and Mos Eisely) and they're both low-density ports where it's uncommon to see buildings over two stories, and they don't cover much land area either. They exist in fairly close proximity to each other and it can be assumed that the majority of the planet's moisture farms (which provide both water and food via underground hydroponic chambers) are clustered around them.

>>63883582
>There are only two cities on the entire planet worth a fuck (Mos Espa and Mos Eisely)

Uhhhh... Anchorhead?

Why don't the Rebels just launch drones into Coruscant?

Why didn't the Empire just use Yavin buster bombs to blow the Rebels?

>>63883597

The Empire is incredibly incompetent, but it's not Russia-tier incompetent. That would be the First Order.

>>63883605
That's clanker talk buddy

>>63870655 (OP)
IT AINT ME
IT AINT MEEEE
I AIN'T NO SENATORS CLONE
IT AINT ME
IT AINT MEEEE
I AIN'T NO KAMINOAN SONNNN

>>63883347
>Qui Gon's death is what pushed Dooku to defect. Dooku didn't become a Sith until Maul was already dead.
How does the timing of that line up with Kamino?

>>63883596
The only thing of note that Anchorhead has is the central garrison for the Imperial occupation, and even that is downright tiny. The town's a hole.

>>63883417
>>63883418
he's indifferent
you can see it in the BTS between the movies and the various EU media
when he talks about EU stuff he basically shrugs and says "oh someone came up with that and it sounded interesting so we went with that"
he is much more firm with his conception of the movies

>>63883479
personally I think the concept of a unified cross-media universe just went totally over his head. as far as he's concerned he made his movies and the rest is enjoying the profits
not to mention the scale and minutiae of the whole thing is understandably totally out of control of one person's ability to manage really

>>63883892
iirc AOTC takes place ten-plus years after TPM
the instant Maul died, Dooku hired Jango and the Kaminoans

that being said, it's been claimed that Maul was just the tool and Dooku was always Palpatine's true apprentice
fuck knows
different EU authors write different things

>>63874327
Most sci-fi setting that take place on a galactic stage don't really make sense in terms of numbers or logistics.
It's fine, Star Wars is just a mixing pot of samurai movies, world war 2 movies, Flash Gordon adventures and Vietnam war era politics, set in space. It's an entirely vibes-based universe.

The EU and I guess the new expanded canon is all just attempts to work backwards to explain stuff that wasn't ever written to be fully coherent and explainable. Flash Gordon probably never stops to explain Ming the Merciless' tax policy or defence procurement scheme. A lot of the extra Star Wars canon is written by and for people who for whatever reason want that answered. Sometimes the stuff they come up with is good, sometimes it's bad, and frequently it needlessly overexplains, but then again that's kind of what the audience for the expanded canon wants, so whatever.

>>63878728
He could honestly have conducted his force experiments to become a force being without fucking up the galaxy.

>>63884372
>that being said, it's been claimed that Maul was just the tool and Dooku was always Palpatine's true apprentice
Yes, there is some notion about that Maul was a sith assassin and thus not an actual sith but just a tool they use. Which means the rule of two was still in effect, which is a retarded workaround, but then again the rule of two is retarded.

>>63874327
The clones themselves probably were only a small fraction of the anti-CIS forces, and systems had their own defensive forces and fleets (which we do see). So it works.

>>63884436
No they were very much the main fighting force. There were no other fighting force with the size and cohesion to do what they did.
But as someone else said many planets weren't densly populated.

Of course when it comes to stuff like the twi'lek homeplanet they were kinda just sex-slaved away I guess because twi'leks are the galaxys laughing stock.

>>63884461
The thing is, we see several systems' forces supported by the clones in episode 3 and tcw (just looking at george's canon). In a way, they seem very much like the republic's marines that are transported to where they're needed, but they may or may not do the majority of the actual fighting.

>>63884430
how else to have an endless array of lower-tier mini-boss Force-using minions to fight through before getting to Big Boss... Asajj Ventress, Mara Jade and the other Hands...

but since Maul did get the proper title of "Darth", unlike the others on that list, I feel like he was in fact Palpatine's blue-eyed boy and beat Dooku to the job, up until he got halved by The Greatest Jedi

>>63884461
>>63884436
>systems had their own defensive forces and fleets
that's what we're told, but it's not what we see, for budget reasons: the movie costume department is actually quite underfunded. the main reason why we have Ewoks is because they couldn't afford full-size Wookie suits, so we had to have the whole princess-discovers-primitive-species-who-defeat-Empire arc because the costume budget could only afford pint-size chibi-Wookies!
(what a way to run a fucking franchise)
part of why Lucas was dead-set on Gungans is because he wanted to depict a proper different-species battle as he'd envisioned it.
but animation models are still expensive, even in the 00s era.

so the only place we get to see the SW universe as it should be, with armies of different species involved, is novels and comics.
which everyone ignores.
Lucas included.

>>63884470
though with saying this, the majority of the republic fleet we see is crewed by clones, so it's probably a bit of both. local forces fight when they can, and if they can't, they get backup by the clones who're all along the front with the fleet.

>>63883479
He considers EU canon to be separate from the film canon. He doesn't actively try to contradict it, but he also doesn't care much if he does.

>>63884471
>primitive-species-who-defeat-Empire arc
George always wanted to show that as a Vietnam War analogy. And the wookie idea was scrapped because it's already established that at least Chewbacca, and by extension the other Wookies, are a high tech race.
>what a way to run a fucking franchise
George Lucas was a pioneer in the cohesive film franchise thing. Cut him a little slack, nobody had ever done shit like this before he did it.

>VF-1 Tomcat in 1975
No way this wasn't the inspiration for the X-Wing's scheme.

>>63884797
Red-5 studio model for comparison, but I assume it's already burnt in all of our memories.

>>63884797

>>63884797
>>VF-1 with red stripes
I remember that looking different.

>>63884372
Actually, Sifo-Dyas commissioned the creation of the clone army before the invasion of Naboo, so Maul was still a full man at the time.

>>63885712
right, I wasn't exactly sure of the timeline (which might also change anyway given the historical fluidity of canon)
if so, then it's possible that Dooku had not been "dubbed" by Palpatine as Darth Tyranus yet

>>63874896
wow, congratulations for catching the surface level plot of the first season of the childrens show.

>>63874364
>(of course we can assume those were some of the empire's best pilots following Vader)
Even better (worse) those were just two random pilots he grabbed on the way to his fighter.

>>63874569
The Trade Federation was the most intelligent thing to come out of Star Wars and I'm very upset that they became absolute jobbers on a level worse than the Empire/First order in some nuDisney media. You had minimal casualties due to most living people not being where the fighting was, a cheap mass producable droid that even poorfags could own as a home defense bot capable of killing a Jedi with a lucky shot and with enough numbers, Research and Development that produced droids capable of surpassing Jedi in some areas, a motive that was more than just a 2 dimensional power grab, etc.

>>63886556
>two random pilots he grabbed on the way to his fighter.
Assuming "Vader's escort" wasn't a roster pair of guys playing sabacc until he stormed in, or a pair of slots in the CAP that would break off from their formation to follow the leader.

>>63886556
I would assume that Vader would be able to immediately sus out mediocre pilots just by feeling, he is a natural ace pilot in his own right.

>ARC-170
>primary fighter
How did you come to this conclusion, exactly?

>>63886556
>>63886625
>>63886631
>>63874364
Just a heads up, during the battle of Yavin, Tarkin refused to order the scramble any TIEs because he was so confident the rebels couldn't do anything against the death star.
Every TIE that sorted was part of Black Squadron, which was under the direct command of Vader including the two pilots he had as wingmen, 'Backstabber' and 'Mauler'
So they weren't just random pilots Vader picked up, but the best of the best in the imperial navy.

>>63886649
Something to do with the combination of shielding and turbolasers correct? It wasn't until they realized the rebels were doing suicide runs on the vent/port that they sent out fighters.

>>63886631
>I would assume that Vader would be able to immediately sus out mediocre pilots
I would assume that mediocre pilots aren't allowed in the same hanger as Vader by any Lt who wants to keep his commission.

>>63886556
>>63886625

I always assumed those pilots were members of Death Squadron (Vader's personal fleet, led by the Executor) and that the pilots were his own escorts.

>>63886652
>Something to do with the combination of shielding and turbolasers correct?
Because the turbolasers were having trouble getting a bead.

>>63886652
>>63886670

The turbolaser batteries were intended for use against starships and unable to accurately hit the smaller X-Wings

>>63886673
I also thought they were concerned about friendly fire, outside of some star destroyers where you could consider some serious coordination and training between known pilots and gunnery crews I haven't seen ties flying close to Imperial laser batteries going off. Once the turrets became too cumbersome they sent out the fighters.

>>63886652
Tarkin was told the turbolasers were having trouble shooting down the fighters and didn't care, and even after the they figured out the plan of the rebels and told Tarkin to evacuate, Tarkin says this.
>Evacuate? In our moment of triumph? I think you overestimate their chances.
It was basically absolute hubris on Tarkin's part that got him killed and the Death Star

>>63886665
>by any Lt who wants to keep his commission.
More like keep his life, Vader had a tendency to kill anyone failed him.
>But Piett!
Vader would have choked him out on the command deck of the Executor for letting the millenium falcon escape Bespin, but Vader was to preoccupied with Luke. Also he came back in Return of the Jedi due to fan demand.

>>63883605
That image is dead wrong. The Clone Wars are more comparable to WWII than the GCW is. The GCW bears more resemblance to the various proxy/guerilla wars of the Cold War, most prominently Vietnam. Lucas's sequel plans would have resembled the Global War on Terror, with Darth Maul as a Bin Laden figure leading former Imperial forces as well as various crime syndicates.

>>63886750
>Vader would have choked him out on the command deck of the Executor for letting the millenium falcon escape Bespin, but Vader
probably Force-sensed that R2-D2 fixed the hyperdrive

>>63886991
>Lucas's sequel plans
we have no idea what those were
>would have resembled the Global War on Terror
9/11 dropped while AOTC was in production and OIF happened right before ROTS
coupled with the obvious Nam parallels, this meant the Clone Wars EU actually resembled GWOT considerably

one of my favourites is not-MASH

>>63887017
>we have no idea what those were
You are either willfully ignorant or hopelessly retarded.

>>63887029
oh really? tell us what (you think) those plans were then

>>63887050
It's been public knowledge for about five years now. If you haven't already heard you're NGMI.

>>63880762
>1380 kw for RX-78
>fucking 951kw for the Zaku II
NICE ULTRACOMPACT FUSHION YOU'VE GOT THERE MISTER MINOVSKY

>>63870873
Aw now I’m sad

>>63887017
>probably Force-sensed that R2-D2 fixed the hyperdrive
He'd still hold Piett responsible, like how he immediately killed Needa for losing track of the Falcon near the asteroid field

>>63881562
oh im stupid I wrote that with a high fever,
I meant to say the Y-wing being a republic ship was a clone wars addition

>>63883916
That was Bestine, not Anchorhead. Anchorhead was actually the main rebel city, at least in SWG.

>>63886750
>>63887017
>>63887203
One can infer that Vader spared Piett because he knew it was his own damn fault Luke and The Falcon escaped.

>>63886991
>Lucas's sequel plans would have resembled the Global War on Terror, with Darth Maul as a Bin Laden figure leading former Imperial forces as well as various crime syndicates.

Honestly that's pretty bad. Not as bad as the Disney-made Sequels, but still pretty bad.

>>63874914
>the CIS would never ever never do a heckin' genocide!

>>63888306
I mean, it's on par with Lucas given the fall of the Republic was supposed to based on the fall of the Roman Republic and everyone just assumed he was taking pot shots at Bush. Or the irony of how the machinations and death of democracy in the Star Wars universes coincidentally matches more with current events.

>>63886750
>Vader had a tendency to kill anyone failed him.
Not immediately. Ozzel got a few fuckups in before Vader finally had enough and killed him.

>>63888306
Depends on how it would've been handled. God knows he would've had a fairly concrete plan for the trilogy as a whole going into 7, unlike Disney.

>>63888745
Hard to say, Ozzel just thought Hoth wasn't worth their time and got overridden by Vader, his real fuck up came when he had the fleet come out of hyperspace to close to the planet so they lost the element of surprise and Vader choked him out on the spot.

>>63883596
It's thousands of years old by the time of New Hope, it might not even exist anymore.

>>63888835
https://youtu.be/tpJnMVKO6Vo?si=8tuAmfyNw7CJLvoa&t=235

>>63881019
>Look at reconstruction or the de-nazifying of germany both didn't go so well and this version of trying to erase the old regime wouldn't even get outside help.

What was was left of the Empire tore itself apart in civil war as soon as Palpatine died (the Rebel Alliance didn't even liberate Coruscant for another three years and found the place a war zone) so it's not really comparable to the Third Reich or the Confederate States, which remained mostly coherent as governments right up until they were dissolved.

>>63870655 (OP)
The ARC-170 was more of a fighter bomber or strike fighter than a primary fighter. The Z-95 did most of their air to air fighting, and the V-wing was the intended companion to the 170.

>disney declares EU non-canon
>star wars wikia adds the tabs to switch between "canon" and "legends"
>the "legends" is everything that was in the then-canon EU, swaths of great backstories and information about everything
>the "canon" information for everything is literally less than a paragraph long for almost everything
Lucas made out like a goddamn bandit with that deal but man, what a fucking disaster

>>63874311
I think the republic's tendency to make everything multi-role makes sense when you realize that they started the war with nothing and had to throw together a navy as fast as possible. They didn't have nearly as many ships as the CIS, so they couldn't have a fleet composed of frigates, destroyers, cruisers, and carriers. So instead they just used do it all star destroyers that could do the job of a cruiser and a carrier, then added a bunch of militarized civilian hulls to make up the difference.

>>63874914
The CIS were a non-stop war crime factory because Sidious kept making Dooku put psychopaths in charge of his forces. Between space Frankenstein, space Mengele, and another space Frankenstein being his scientists, and a cyborg drug junkie with anger issues, a collection of radical egoist space warlocks, contract killers, slavers, and the chinese space amazon guys who liked to test new weapons on civilians its a wonder they had any support at all.

>>63889159
its okay anon, just pretend the new "canon" shit doesn't exist, and stay in the EU timeline. its better that way
>t. taught himself Mando'a in middle school

>>63875008
The war was a farce. It wouldn't have even started if Sheev hadn't given the republic an army at the start, and would have ended in a couple of weeks if he hadn't repeatedly sabotaged the separatists.

>>63881562
>>63887413
The y-wing was always meant to be a trash picked junk fighter bomber from a previous war. That's why its missing most of its paneling.

>>63881414
Kamino got fucked in legends canon too.

Be honest /k/, you would have done the same thing.

>>63878542
>demilitarized crop-duster
Fuckers had 3 guns including a laser cannon.

>>63886991
The Clone Wars is like WW1 in that its the death of the old galaxy. You get to see in real time the transition from the beautiful and regal old republic to the drab and utilitarian empire.

>>63889269

Gotta stop those womp rats from eating your crops

>>63889265
Yeah, even if it wasn't my mother getting killed. Those things were a menace and had to be gotten rid of. They raided, raped, murdered farms all across the country side.

>>63875058
>Congress of Europe on a galactic scale
That's absolutely retarded from a political perspective but my God would it make for some good cinema

>>63889280

Honestly, the only way this encounter wasn't going to end in a massacre would have been if Shmi had not already been on death's door but still seriously injured enough that Anakin had to sneak her out of the camp and back to safety. Any other scenario and he's going to be lopping off some heads.

I actually feel that's a "what-if" scenario that doesn't get discussed nearly enough by fans. What if Shmi hadn't died and Anakin hadn't slaughtered the village?

>>63889144
yeah while that's the legends lore (frankly i dont know much of it) I was thinking that a lot of the imperial systems of governance would be inherited in some form, and since that government was dysfunctional as all hell I can imagine that it would transfer, alongside the general culture and personnel to some degree to a new republic
whether or not thats lore accurate to disney or legsnds canon idk but that would be how I'd expect things to go, regardless of whether or not there were various imperial remnant factions

>>63889299
>I actually feel that's a "what-if" scenario that doesn't get discussed nearly enough by fans. What if Shmi hadn't died and Anakin hadn't slaughtered the village?
You can find some "What if?" YT channels that go over that
But theres not much to discuss, he wouldn't take that first plunge to the dark side and he'd have the knowledge that both Shmi was safe and that visions aren't set in stone and shouldn't be trusted wholeheartedly, he'd still be mistrusting on the Jedi order but he wouldn't hold a grudge like he did in canon

>>63889216
kandosii, you giant fucking NERD

>>63889159
>the "canon" information for everything is literally less than a paragraph long for almost everything
>what a fucking disaster
a clean slate for Disney and Filoni to rewrite their fanfiction with all the branding but no strings attached was exactly what they wanted

>>63889249
No, it was missing its paneling to make maintenance easier. Rebel maintenance was stressed and opted to not bother with having to take on and off the paneling

>>63890713
I'm speaking from an out of universe visual design perspective. Most of the rebel equipment was meant to look like beat up WW2 surplus because that's what it was meant to be the in universe equivalent of. Regardless of what secondary material authors wrote later, George and Ralph intended that it was an old beat up fighter that the rebels got second hand.

>>63891354
No, it was meant to resemble a stripped-down hot rod.

>>63889144
Don't forget the back and forth periods where the Empire reunified or the Warlords cooperated and how the war ended in 19 years after Yavin, with peace that allowed system to join the New Republic or the Empire if they wanted.

Or how the New Republic turned out to be such a shitshow, the Empire (Fel Empire) took over after the second galactic civil war in 42ABY with Leia's daughter as the Empress. So much for republicanism in that family. Hell, just before that pic related was the Chancellor of the New Republic. A fucking Imperial Grand Admiral

Legends and Disney Mon Mothma is a retard.

>>63886649
What kind of shittery do you have to engage in to get the callsign 'Backstabber'?

>>63892510

>>63891579
In all fairness everything about Daala is bullshit and without Tarkin giving her a free ride for being his piece of ass she should have been outmaneuvered, outplayed, outgunned, and out an airlock by the time ESB rolled around.

>>63889269
Nah. Standard model has no weapons, but an optional airgun mount is available to civilians in some (rural) jurisdictions. Laser armed models are LEO sale only.
Of course, plenty of the LEO sale only models end up in the hands of rebels somehow. Weird how that always seems to happen with Incom products...

>>63892510
he flew into Vader's TIE when Han bounced them, thus costing the Empire arguably, well, everything

no doubt Disney will soon come up with a miniseries explaining how she was really a Rebel infiltrator with a tragic past - orphaned by AT-ATs, raped by stormtroopers, Vader forgot her birthday, perhaps - and this was all actually an elaborate plot to destroy the Empire and so she was really the hero all along, not that cis-white farmboy Luke

>>63889265
If anything I'm surprised Tusken are still around, why is nobody exterminating a bunch of tribes of rapists, bandits and murderers?

>>63893677
They're incredibly hostile and they live in the harshest parts of the Dune Sea, anyone that is afected by them has no means to take the fight to them and the ones that do have the means are the Hutts who don't give a shit about the people as long as they keep working

>>63893688
Dead and kidnapped farmers don't work a lot
Keeping the Tusken in check should at least be of some interest to the Hutts

>>63893827
you have to put on your dictator hat, anon
dictators want to keep people harassed, poor, and uneducated so they're easier to control
Tuskens are oppressing Tatooine farmers for free, they're doing the Hutts' work for them
all the Hutts need to do is ensure Tuskens don't raid them too much, just enough
the Tuskens are aware of this too
eventually the Hutt-Tusken relationship reaches an unspoken (or spoken) equilibrium, that Tuskens and Hutts each get to pillage just this much, which makes everyone happy
well, except the Tatooine farmers

this applies everywhere from UN-recognised countries in Africa to street gangs in darkest Detroit

>>63889159
Disney throwing out the entire post fall of the empire lore, rebuild of the republic and the yuuzhan vong invasion was so stupid, i know why they did it, but still, so fucking dumb.
The actions of sheev make so much more sense when he becomes emperor when you take in to account he was building up the galaxy for a war against the yuushan vong.

>>63895256
the vong were shit and I'm glad they got put in the trash
the whole fall of the empire and recreation of the republic was way better though than the sequels braindead attempt at recreating the setting of the original trilogy with everyone in the new republic being braindead so the first order can come into power

Anyone and everyone who praises Andor is a faggot deserving of death.

>>63895927
first let's establish your credentials: what do you think of ESB, TPM, TFA, R1 and Mandalorian?
>Anyone and everyone who praises Andor is a faggot deserving of death.
really?
I've been meaning to do it since people tell me it's a SW spy flick which is interesting, me being a big fan of Tinker Tailor and Cardinal Of The Kremlin, so could you give an unspoiled review?

>>63895989
Shut up, faggot.

>>63896006
what's your fucking problem, I haven't even watched it

>>63896015
You type like a faggot.

>>63896015
Probably this guy who hates anything from the Disney era even if it's decent.
>>63881414

>>63896022
ah I should have realised
thanks

>>63896022
>even if it's decent.
Imagine being so raped and buck-broken that you guzzle down Trandor just because it's not a Filoni.

>>63896119
Calm down MIGA

>>63884405
A few years back, I bought this decrepit Buck Rogers book at a yard sale.

The weapon designs in Buck Rogers & Flash Gordon are hilariously bad. I kinda like em.

This book is "THE PLANETOID PLOT."
As you can see from the back cover teaser, Buck has a tomboy adventure-girlfriend who gets herself into trouble.
It was illustrated by a US Army veteran.
So you see, /ak/ threads already existed even as early as the 1920's...

>>63895989
It's a shame that Andor couldn't get the treatment they obviously planned for it.
I'd recommend you check it out but don't go in expecting some amazingly well written masterpiece. As far as SW things go, or just disney made slop in general, it's easily one of the best efforts they made.

It's unusual for Disney. They do a lot of things that make me forget this is a "don't take any risks, keep it squeaky clean" company that owns the IP. Like, and for a modern SW thing, there's a lot of stuff in the meat of the show that would likely disinterest a child at best, and completely fly over their little brain. Again, it's unusual for a Disney production. That's the best way I can describe what it does.

>>63883417
*sexy orange tushy

>>63896326
What the fuck does that have to do with you being a Disney shit-eater?

>>63892581
I mean, I'd do that to those aforementioned sexy orange cheeks after a shower

>>63896562
>It's a shame that Andor couldn't get the treatment they obviously planned for it.
I think my wife and I watched the first couple of episodes, but I found it incredibly boring and not-very-well-thought-out, so we bailed on it.

I'm still just mad that they ruined the Mandalorian so quickly.

>>63895989
It's probably best Star Wars movie /series since OT, best Disney one for sure. No much jedi, force or other fan favourite stuff like that tho. Instead it has competent empire, quick brutal action and was written by actual adults.
Starts bit slow, but I recommend watching at least first 3 episodes.

>>63886649
>Retcon
Wasn't in the movie. Didn't happen.

>>63896459
ITS BUCK ROGERS
YAAAAAAAAAAAAY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdE1xH93k4A

>>63896938
Also acting and dialogue are top notch
https://youtu.be/nNYt3m_D7ws

>>63896876
Your mental illness for starters?

>>63897151
>Everyone who doesn't slurp down this disney product is mentally ill
Do you read the shit you type?

>>63897230
You just proved your own mental illness by making up fake scenarios in your head.

>>63888306
I mean realizing that an Israel type stand in was with all along would be a nice twist.

>>63870689
Post lightsaber, nigger

>>63871196
the more dudes in a plane the better. nothing better than flying 36 hours with your 4 closest buddies

tail gunners are neat
why wouldn't you want to go to war with your battle buddies covering your six

>>63897408
Just four?

>>63897424
That's two football teams plus a referee right there.

>>63897432
The plane may not be wide enough, but it might be long enough...

>>63870655 (OP)
tail gunner is antiquated and a little silly but star wars is WW2 in space so its cool, w/e, but why the fuck do you need a WSO when there's ALSO an astromech droid? its basically a 4 man crew for a fighter bomber

>>63897424
God I love that deathtrap piece of shit so much

>>63897480
to exchange bants

>>63897563
R2 had the best bantz tho

>>63897593
yeah but now you have two other dudes plus the droid to bant with

V-Wing supremacy

>>63896920
Yeah, it starts out with like, highschool-tier writing and slowly picks up. My pops dropped it too till I picked it up and managed to get through the first season. The second season had a lot more moments of at least respecting the intelligence of the viewer. But the series is thoroughly more about the "vibes" in the beginning than some groundbreaking plot.
The second season capitalized on the characterization really well though, I remember being thoroughly entertained by it for the most part.

>>63897629
pretty nice but this is the best vehicle design in the galaxy

>>63887079
>a single M1 abrams has a powerplant equal to that of a gundam

>>63881275
Why Palpatine was the only character through the prequel trilogy who treated people in a sort of normal affable way? All the other were either autistic, religious nuts, jerks and just plain stupid? Was it so hard to be normal?

>>63896920
the first 2 or 3 episodes are incredibly slow

>>63896562
>this is a "don't take any risks, keep it squeaky clean" company
Marvel and Pirates aren't that squeaky clean but I take your point

>>63896938
>watch at least first 3 episodes
I've watched the first 2, it's so draggy

>>63897790
I think it actually makes sense that almost all characters in sci-fi are insane.
Just look at how crazy we're getting and it's only 2025.

>>63897790
>the only "normal" one was pretending all along and is really the most abnormal of the lot
learn something, young man

>>63870655 (OP)
>we are at the point where the average /k/ fag looks like picrel

>>63897841
a war tourist posted this

>>63895989
Andor was so good that Disney's literally dropping the Star Wars part off the title in marketing so that new people actually gave it a shot.
Like other anons said, it's slow to start but very quickly picks up (this goes for both seasons). The Ghorman massacre episode and the final Ferrix arc are amazing if I had to bring up highlights.

>>63897947
>unspoiled review?
gonna have to take 2 points off. 8/10

>>63895989
Tony Gilroy wrote it in a way that constantly pushed boundaries in ways that he expected Disney to nix, but every time he pitched something controversial Kathleen Kennedy just went "Do it" without hesitation.
It is a show that takes great pains to make everything seem genuine. People talk a lot about Star Wars being a 'lived-in universe', but Andor goes above and beyond that. You get a true sense of how the whole place feels to exist in. High-level meetings between Imperial officers are treated with such gravitas that they are downright riveting, the struggles of the political sphere in an Empire that is seeking to do away with politics altogether is a major point, and you see society at its lowest and its highest on both sides of the conflict.
Andor is a story about the Rebellion before it was the Alliance to Restore the Republic. It's a bunch of isolated cells, often with no knowledge of each other, scurrying about and nipping at the Empire's heels while trying to avoid getting stomped on.
And they DO get stomped on. The Empire's evils are on full display in ways that, despite typically being of a much smaller scale than blowing up the odd planet, feel so much more sickening because they are carefully crafted to resemble real historical events and patterns. Gilroy is a history buff and you can absolutely tell.
Not a single moment is wasted. Everything is relevant somewhere.

>>63898913
>Gilroy is a history buff and you can absolutely tell
hm
gotta say, that might be the line that sold me
>Not a single moment is wasted. Everything is relevant somewhere
the first episodes are so durned slow though

>>63889159
I was at least okay at the time when they tossed out the EU. But the sheer gall the bastards had when they then went and wholesale lifted parts of it out altogether with the worst parts of it(the Superweapon of the Week spam, Palps coming back via clone, the Mando Wank) and idiots still claiming that Disney Canon is better just makes it horrible.

>>63889159
At this point Lucas could probably rebuy Star Wars by 2030 and do whatever he wants with it and people would love him for it.

>>63899110
>the first episodes are so durned slow though
nta, but the only thing you could cut from first episode is the simp, but you would have to replace him anyway with someone else that knows MC and have reason to rat him out.
It's slow, but every characters has its payoff later

>>63897838
>>the only "normal" one was pretending all along and is really the most abnormal of the lot
wow hes literally me

>>63897790
Because he was manipulating them, he was grooming Anikan from the start

>>63899260
He is literally 81 years old.

>>63900795
Mel Brooks is 98 and we're getting Spaceballs 2.
And if anything the reveal shows he hasn't lost his touch at all.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WsK-KPi_w3w

>>63901219
calling it now: he won't live to see the premiere
he looks his age alright
I admire the fact that he's trying to die doing the thing he loved though
but if I were him I'd find a better way to spend the ~1 lucid hour of every day he's probably got

>>63901219
>Mel Brooks is 98
He turns 99 saturday!

>>63897663
My nigga

>>63897278
Based chad-wing enjoyer

>>63901219
Is Mel Brooks jewish?

>>63874914
t. Separatist scum

>>63901491
Happy Birthday to him.

>>63907584
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/mel-brooks-on-anti-semitism/

>>63901219
Lucas doesn't worship Moloch and so doesn't have access to the powers that grants.

>>63870655 (OP)
>What was the republic thinking??
>we can fit more actors in one shot and pay the camera crew less money

>>63907584
You have never watched any of his movies, have you?

>>63883883

>Some folks were born, had a mom and dad
>Didn't just come out of a tube
>And when the man says clones to the front
>Oooh they point the cannon at you, lord.

>It ain't me, it ain't me
>I ain't nobody's son son
>It ain't me, it ain't me
>I'm ain't no fortunate one.

>Some folks are born with microbes in the blood
>Lord, the Jedi find them quick, lord
>But when the droids come marchin' to the gate
>They're off waving a shiny stick around.

>It ain't me, it ain't me
>I ain't got the force, son
>It ain't me, it ain't me
>I'm ain't no fortunate one.

>Some folks inherit a senate seat like that
>They grow you for a war, yeah
>And when you ask 'em how many need to die
>Hoo, they only answer, more more more

>It ain't me, it ain't me
>I ain't no senator's son, son
>It ain't me, it ain't me
>I'm ain't no fortunate one.

>It ain't me, it ain't me
>I ain't nobody's son son
>It ain't me, it ain't me
>I'm ain't no fortunate one.

>>63907584

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ex5p6dk2W_I

>>63901219
>he hasn't lost his touch at all.
His movies from the 60s and 70s were the best. The later ones lacked punch.

>>63881354
The entire point of Palpatine was that he was the first sith to stop giving a shit about the rule of two. He was so power hungry that he fully intended to live for eternity and do evil space wizard shit forever. That's the reason why he nerfed Vader and he probably even intended to just body swap with him before he got burnt to a crisp on Mustafar. The reason the entire sith line ended with Palpatine being the last true sith is because he got so greedy that he basically fucked up everything. If the Empire lasted long enough he would've started a Sith Order eventually.

>>63911348
>he fully intended to live for eternity and do evil space wizard shit forever
that has nothing to do with not respecting the rule of 2
>body swap
is that possible in SW?

>be able to purchase your own personal starfighter
>not have computer controlled turrets, or driod controlled turrents
Why do so many people in star wars engage in direct dogfights and 16th century ship battles?

>>63907584
Very and he's based as fuck.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZAZhtT-dUyo

>>63911516
lmao
the song is remarkably similar to Men In Tights

>>63908242
>Lucas doesn't worship Moloch
But he does serve Mammon

>>63895927

Based

>>63895989

Not him but

>ESB, TPM

/k/ino

>TFA, R1 and Mandalorian

Disney and therefore garbage

>>63896022
>Probably this guy who hates anything from the Disney era

Objectively correct, this is EU country, Fagloniggers and Disney shills not welcome.

>>63911352
>is that possible in SW?
Yes. It's called 'transfer essence'. Palpatine's old Sith master Darth Plagueis "the Wise" was planning on betraying and body snatching Palps as a way of staying alive long enough that he could meet the prophesized "Chosen One" (who Plagueis is implied to have played a part in creating) and take over his body. Palpatine might have been planning on doing the same to Vader, except Vader turned out to be a big ol' disappointment (not to mention he wasn't in good shape physically). Palpatine ended up doing post-mortem transference except he did it with one of his own clones.

>>63911348
>he was the first sith to stop giving a shit about the rule of two.
Not quite true. In the EU, Darth Plagueis was still around during the Phantom Menace and Palpatine taking Maul as his apprentice was part of Plagueis' plan, so that's three Darths right there.

>>63911352
>that has nothing to do with not respecting the rule of 2
It does because that evil space wizard shit included the Inquisitorius and the various dark side cults he started in both canon and legends. In regard to body swapping, yes, it's possible in both canon and legends.

>>63911946
come now R1's alright

>>63911971
right thanks
is that how he returned in the EU?

>>63912151
>Inquisitorius
there was an EU argument that the Emperor's Hands don't count because they're only, so to speak, candidates for apprenticeship, which is signified by a "Darth" title

nice /tv/ thread

>>63912382

>>63912340
>is that how he returned in the EU?
Pretty much yeah, dude had a bunch of clones of himself made in case he died. Unfortunately for him his clones wound up getting sabatoged by one of his last remaining bodyguards. So he now has to corrupt Luke so that he could he steal his body for himself. TRoS wound up taking most of the plot of Dark Empire and made it worse.
Also young Palps looks pretty great, pic related.

>>63911348
>He was so power hungry that he fully intended to live for eternity and do evil space wizard shit forever
Loads of Sith lords were after immortality.

>>63911352
>is that possible in SW?
In EU, basically anything is possible with the force.
Force Teleportation is a power in the EU.

>>63911358
>Why do so many people in star wars engage in direct dogfights and 16th century ship battles?
For the same reason they fight in melee. It's primarily a cinematic universe and exists to be aesthetic.

>>63912382
>nice /tv/ thread
You always get the best threads off-board. They've been done to death on their home boards and the board autists prevent any new exploration of the topic.

>>63913520
>Also young Palps looks pretty great
If I was spinning up clones of myself, I'd probably take a few liberties with the muscle growth and fat depositing mechanisms.

>>63912340
I thought the EU argument was always silly because by that point he had already given up on the rule of two thing. He considered himself the one true sith and everyone else was just his lackey (even Vader). He eventually planned to replace every non-force user running the Empire with a dark side adept of some variety.

>>63913520
I think it's funny that Sheev looked like an ordinary guy before the Dark Side pickled his face.