Fuck you. Titanicus edition
Previous Thread:
>>96164185>HH 3.0 Leakshttps://imgur.com/a/jYokLre
https://files.catbox.moe/98h6h7.pdf
https://gofile.io/d/cnJk0N
>Mech Leakshttps://imgur.com/a/lRaqKSw
>SA Gofilehttps://gofile.io/d/YEEqBN
>New Edition upon ushttps://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/setting/warhammer-the-horus-heresy/
>Official FAQ/Errata/Downloads:https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/downloads/warhammer-the-horus-heresy/
>Thread FAQ (very old, remembers Age of Terra)https://pastebin.com/iUqNrrA8
https://pastebin.com/8riDmnhS
>30k TACTICA & TIPShttps://pastebin.com/Tm2P4QLp
https://1d6chan.miraheze.org/wiki/Age_of_Darkness-Warhammer_30k/2.0_Tactics/General_Tactics
ใAdeptus Titanicus and Legions Imperialisใ
>Official FAQ/Errata/Downloadshttps://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/downloads/legions-imperialis/
>List of Titan Legions with Badges and Colourshttps://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17Jccq0V--SwJifLVLwbisYnQeqLlS2pMSiPbGXp1Brs/htmlview
>More listshttps://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/List_of_Titan_Legions
>What size magnets do I need?5x1mm
>Tacticshttps://1d6chan.miraheze.orug/wiki/Adeptus_Titanicus/Tactics
>Thread question: Would your dudes crawl up a titan's leg to plant bombs and grenades in its moving parts?
>>96173109 (OP)>Would your dudes crawl up a titan's leg to plant bombs and grenades in its moving parts?I'm old enough to remember when Assault Marines could buy meltabombs for the whole squad
>>96173109 (OP)>Thread question:>Would your dudes crawl up a titan's leg to plant bombs and grenades in its moving parts?It's their speciality. Though usually it happens when the titan isn't moving
>mfw I'll never bring a Primarch so I'll never have to suffer a duel
>>96173153better is to never play HH3 and never have to use their imbalanced trash minigame at all.
>>96173163Its ok ESL-kun.
My anointed indomitus terminators with these head honcho . Here's hoping I don't just get fucked by Indomitus getting up box locked to the primaris terminators lol
I see why I haven't seen anyone post the kitbash I thought up.
Cmon just lemme take vortex grenades on my termis to yeet at the feet of a Titan. Just like the good old days.
>>96173188GW refuses to give us a plastic stormblade.
Fine, I'll do it myself.
Did we get any clarification on how snap shots work with template weapons?
You know I figured they did the lightning claws/power fist and thunder hammer split on the existing terminators to force people to buy saturnine ones. But saturnines just kinda suck at melee combat anyway?
>>96173109 (OP)So are nullificators just completely gone now? I don't see mention of them in any of the leaks or the legacies article.
>>96173234Gone or soon to be in a journal that coincidentally matches up with the release of the new cataphractii set.
Mentioned at the end of last thread, but it sure feels great that taking a siege breaker +ironfire means i either get 4 arquitors or 2 and 2 siege tanks. Would love more options
>>96173200Pretty sure you just use the snapshot to-hit roll to see if you land on target.
Will you switch to 3e or keep playing 2e?
>Champion lets you take an auxiliary detachment of vets and badasses
>Heralds score victory points for killing people in challenges
Shouldn't it be the other way around?
>>96173259I'm gonna play Titanicus.
>>96173261Shhh donโt question the product.
*ahem* Fuck 3.0, fuck GW, and fuck you. 1.0 forever.
>>96173256For clarity, I'm talking about flamer templates. You don't make a hit roll for them normally, and there's nothing to say that you would make one for a snap shot, which is confusing me.
>>96173261>Heralds score victory points for killing people in challengesDo you retards actually finish reading an entry before shitposting.
>>96173259>People on /hhg/>Playing the game.Ha. Ha ha. Haha ha. Hahahahahahahaaaaaaaaahaaaa!!
Good one anon. You're a funny one.
>>96173305Be glad they can even read a single sentence at all.
>>96173305What makes you think that they don't?
>>96173274I'd think you'd just fire normally. I mean it is a flamer after all. Not exactly a lot of aiming to be done.
>>96173186No one worth playing will enforce box lock.
>>96173272I do not yearn for the low AP pie plate meta, Anon. It sickens me.
>>96173186>hoods>chaos nurgle maces>chaos terminatorsI had to check a second to determine if dark angels, deathguard or word bearers.
>>96173259the group is taking a few months to try 3.0, then getting together to decide if we'll play it or stick with 2.0. we have about 30 people in the community
>>96173333Shitpost-kun, come on. They score points when the unit they're attached to wins a combat, the challenge part is just the first line of the rule.
>>96173443So when they win a challenge they score points?
>>96173443it's when the model or its unit wins a challenge
>>96173274wouldn't be surprised if it was an oversight now that blast can still shoot on snap shots
>>96173178Nah, the duel minigame seems really stupid. Has the same braindead DNA that has the duel mechanic in TOW/WHF.
>>96173259Neither. **Legions Imperialis**
>>96173408>>chaos nurgle macesholy shit kill yourself
>>96173518>omg wtf you didnt know those were primaris interdemptor "heavy melee weapons"
>>96173585why are the faggot angels using nurgle maces?
>>96173153For all the talk about what Primarch ought to take which gambit, I never cared for that.
I do think TH Praetor on TH Praetor could be a thing, and it'd follow the usual Finishing Blow -> Seize.
Proposed Guard Up as a counter to Finishing Blow (the 2nd guy cannot take the same gimmick the first guy takes) but it does seem like a bit of a slim chance.
Idk, maybe it'd be better for the reactive player to take Withdraw instead? Single attack, no WS modification, but ends the duel without granting any Resolution.
I think it's better than Test the Foe (full attacks and gain the advantage in the glory step, but if you choose to disengage and you are the most wounded, the other guy gets Combat Res)
>>96173548it's extra-funny because the absolute retard doesn't know that the nurgle plague marines and the non-primaris deathwing both used the same nurgle maces. They switched to a lame power-maul for the primaris deathwing kit to hide the fact that the dark angels use the same pair of nurgle weapons as deathguard (the one handed plague mace and the plague flail two-hander)
>>96173259I still play 1e, so I can use my black books and my old 7th ed Codexes for Great Crusade games with Orks and Eldar and the like.
>>96173596>nurgleThe Great Hornet Rat demands you cease this slander and return the weapons back to their rightful wielders.
>>96173619plague monks worship nurgle though
>>96173393Change the pie plate characteristics. Walla
>>96173596Pretty sure the imperium in general likes censers.
How did they get away with introducing completely new terminators at this stage in the game? Putting aside they look disgustingly new school too.
>>96173305Heralds score victory points for winning challenges and combats *if* they get to survive the match.
Yeah that's Champion's work ngl.
>>96173619Never. Nurgle's champions the Dark Angels own the plague censors now.
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>>96173622Lets feed the gimp some more.
>>96173638I've never once read any lore where a Space Wolf, Salamander, Imperial Fist, Ultramarine, White Scar, Raven Guard or Iron Hands has used one of the censors as a weapon. It's only the Death Guard and Dark Angels.
When does modern lore start within the book series?
>>96173655* and rightfully so, what a moronic idea of a weapon. Hey let's weaken the structural integrity and lower the mass of our hammers to put an incense-burner in the middle of the head, which will need to constantly be refilled with a logistics-wasting supplies of pointless rare incenses that would fall out or extinguish as the weapon is swung and with a power field thould should burn away any smoke coming out of the weapon, which no one should be alive to smell anyway.
They only have an actual purpose for Chaos where they spread diseases and nurgle could be magically refilling them using warp teleportation from his plague cauldrons, thus no logistical issues. And any structural weaknesses being negated by warpfuckery.
If dark angels cared so much about aesthetics and pleasant odors that they needed perfume-weaponry, their legion would have fallen to Slaanesh already.
>>96173622>>96173644Youโre both wrong. Plague Monks/Clan Pestilens worship what they think is an aspect of The Great Horned Rat but is actually Nurgle
>>96173619the great horned rat is just an aspect of Nurgle, just like how Khaela Mensha Khaine is simply an aspect of Khorne.
There's literally zero difference it's just a rebranding.
>>96173688The mass of the weapon would make a lot more sense hollow. A giant solid metal ball would be retarded and unweildy.
>>96173709for a human. Not for a space marine which can hold a heavy bolter in their bare hands and has a nuclear generator on their back providing them super-strength.
For them, using a tiny hollow hammer would be absolutely stupid and sacrifice reach with no purpose when they could use a weapon twice as long just as easily.
>>96173713The mechanics don't change.
>>96173693>>96173701All gods in Warhammer Fantasy are aspects of the Chaos gods and it's the same in 40k, that's why the Emperor was so desperate to eradicate religion.
Who's working on anything?
>>96173655>censors as a weapon>>96173709A hollow ball would also make a less optimal striking weapon. You'd have to make the walls thick so they won't crumple or flex upon impact, reducing the energy delivered to the target. There's a reason real life maces tend to have pretty small, solid heads, rather than hollow balls.
>>96173785What Chaos God is the Laughing God or Isha? What about the C'tan? Gork and Mork?
So was Lorgar really the favored one or was he lied to so that the gods could to Horus through him?
>>96173794Scorpius for a game this weekend.
Also Las sponsons for a conversion beamer pred
>>961738181001 rhino hulls I guess
>>96173816Canon: EVERYTHING was a lie and lorgar was just used
My retarded headcanon: If everything went right and everyone was pure of faith JUST like Lorgar then daemonic symbiosis of humanity could've happened as planned but it would've wiped out like 90% of humanity all in the name of THE TRUTH.
>>96173198Looks ridiculous in the absolute best way
>>96173818Hope you plan on putting a single bolter on that other cupola or that's an illegal loadout.
>>96173832End my suffering boy
Does the new tarantula's turret fit on the razorback's panel mount? Can you make a Deimos pattern razorback?
>>96173841It's a combi bolter on a scorpius it's legal
>>96173794I'm working on a
>a vanilla rhino>a vanilla 10-man tac squad>trying to finish Exodus
>>96173816I wish daemons were conventionally beautiful. It's super easy to reject evil when it looks ugly; it'd take conviction to reject it when both nature and logic urge you to accept their dark promise.
>>96173816The moment you interact with chaos, you are being puppetted
Doesn't matter who you are
Yes, even Horus and perturabo
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>>96173849Scorpius comes with two bolters now, one of which can be swapped for a combi-weapon (inc. a combi-bolter).
>>96173847Didn't they just make that conversion?
>>96173864We didn't see what top pane they used.
>>96173807>Laughing GodTzeentch
>IshaSlaanesh/Nurgle
>C'tanActually a totally different class of beings accidentally ret-created by The-Emperor-as-The-Dark-King during Horus' Day
>Gork and MorkKhorne
>>96173863I've become the raped
>>96173847The launcher does, so surely the guns use the same ring size.
Got 40 Mkiis, decided I've got enough tacs - which heavy/special weapons should I prioritise giving them?
>>96173794I am turning a storm raven into a storm eagle.
>>96173794I'm working on Siege Tyrants. I'd take a picture but it's 5:45 and there's no sun in the room.
>>96173886I'm gonna do a meltagun squad and a heavy flamer squad. The super expensive weapons don't seem worthwhile.
>>96173816Lorgar realises THE TRVTH during the Siege. The gods absolutely did manipulate him.
Its ok tho because its absolutely possible to manipulate them too. They're just reflections of you.
>>961739125 or 10 men? I'm wondering whether I should be slightly gamey and have a 5 man squad with each type of weapon.
>>96173816>>96173913What Lorgrar even DO during the Heresy? It seems like The Urizen gets mogged hard by his underlings.
>>96173807gork and mork are just khorne with a green paintjob. It's lore accurate that an ork fleet had so much fun krumpin' a khorne daemon prince that they went into the realm of khorne for more fun fights, and once they eventually died, khorne enjoyed the krumpin' violence so much, he resurrects the entire ork army outside his brass citadel every day to start the waaaaagh yet again. Their basic catchphrase is khorne. The one and only difference with orks is they don't pickup skulls afterward, because orks are stereotypical cockneys and Khorne knows it'd be impossible to teach them how to pickup litter or build anything.
Laughing God is just tzeentch, same schemes and plans, backstabbing trickeries and "just as planned" glorifying in defeats. Harlequin Solitaires (tzeentch champs who pretend to dance as slaanesh) are the only people allowed to come and go in the Black Library freely, the repository of all aeldari chaos lore and spells. Tzeentch opposes his annoying younger brother, Slaanesh, and a great tzeentch spell book opened in the black library with a Genius Planโข how the eldar can eventually sacrifice all their souls to "the god of death" (actually to Tzeentch) to keep them out of Slaanesh's reach. Hell, take a look at the booty-queen of the Ynnari, blue tzeentchian magic, blue tzeentch bird feathers, blue sphinx of tzeentch (sphiranx were elf cats of teclis that tzeentch tempted into joining him for power)
Isha is just the part of Nurgle's cycle that's joy and regrowth and life. He's the god of peace and just letting the circle of life keep going on, rather than ambitious schemes or anger. 'isha' canonically just lives inside of Nurgle's garden. If she was a god that actually was anti-Nurgle (she isn't) then he would want her kept as far away from his garden as possible as in the warp opposite powers repel and destroy each other (hence Nurgle living far away from Khorne's palace, etc.) But Isha is Nurgle so they live in the exact same place.
>>96173955>khorn found some orks amusing, so gork and mork are actually khornSo is the Hive Mind Slaanesh, because there were some tyranids on a Slaanesh daemon world? Outside of "there's some overlap in themes" do you have any hard evidence? By the same logic C'tan are aspects of the Chaos gods. The Deceiver clearly being Tzeentch and Nightbringer Khorne.
>>96173950Lorgar, lame as he is, did the most intelligent thing in the heresy - stay back a safe distance and watch because Chaos winning is guaranteed due to infinite power. Because of this, he didnt have to go get himself annihilated out of existence like Zayu Lardak or Horus.
>>96173978their entire catchphrase is "WAR" and they can't even have sex, all they do for eternity is just brawl and stab/shoot. Even their currency is just teeth (essentially bones) that they knock out of each other during brawls. The entire ork existence is literally nothing but VIOLENCE. It couldn't possibly be made more simple or obvious. Your retardation is truly monumental if you didn't already notice that orks are just the khorne faction.
>>96173992I take that as a "no".
>>96174001no one asked you, retard
>>96173870The Dark King did what?
>>96174004Apology accepted.
What will a regular PDF Whirlwind do that a Scorpius isn't better at? Let me guess, "killing Solar Auxilia". You know that's an euphemism for "it sucks".
what color are the emperors children eye lenses?
Im finalizing the first wave of my loyalist EC force and it seems like blue, green, and red are all on the list of colors they have canonically. for example what color are rylanors? I cant quite tell from this image and most fan art depicts him with blue eyes.
Doing combined arms, so far I've settled on what my Solar Aux legiones word bearers are gonna take
ALLIED DETACHMENT: LEGIONES AUXILIA ULTIMA PATTERN COHORT (Total = 430pts)
>Line Command Section (5 Models, Command Vox) = 75pts
>* Prime Advantage: Logistical Benefit
>Armoured Command Section (vanquisher cannon, lascannon, dozer blade) = 175pts
>Aethon Heavy Sentinel Squadron (2 Models, Lascannon x2, Hunter Killer Missiles x2) = 180pts
AUXILIARY DETACHMENT: INFANTRY TERCIO (Total = 365pts)
>Lasrifle Section (20 Models, Power Fist, Needle Pistol, Vexilla, Vox, Blast Chargers x19, Bayonet x19) = 90pts
>* Prime Advantage: Master Sergeant
>Hermes Light Sentinel Squadron (2 Models, Multi-Las x2) = 32pts
>Dracosan Armoured Transport (Demolisher Cannon, Dozer Blade) = 180pts
AUXILIARY DETACHMENT: INFANTRY TERCIO (Total = 365pts)
>Lasrifle Section (20 Models, Power Fist, Needle Pistol, Vexilla, Vox, Blast Chargers x19, Bayonet x19) = 90pts
>* Prime Advantage: Master Sergeant
>Hermes Light Sentinel Squadron (2 Models, Multi-Las x2) = 32pts
>Dracosan Armoured Transport (Demolisher Cannon, Dozer Blade) = 180pts
AUXILIARY DETACHMENT: ARMOUR TERCIO (Total = 330pts)
>Leman Russ Strike Tank (2 Models, vanquisher cannon x2, lascannon x2, dozer blade x2 = 330pts
What should I be packing for my Word Bearers to complement their SA friends? I was thinking of leaning into the Saturnine Termi stuff since it seems WB's kind of like it based on that fancy unit they're getting and I could probably do with some 2+ save killers, but with only 1500pts it seems like the body count would be low, and it does seem like WB's wanna just spam the shit out of line cause of their Apex Detachment so should I try and just drown everything in bodies and bolter fire? I definitely know I want to take an Overseer to join the line command section at the least
>>96174010I was just joking but he did give the necrontyr cancer
>>96174036FW and GW say green so that seems good for me
>>96174036Green or a blue-green
>>96173955This isn't even canon in 30k anymore. The gods as we understand them and see them depicted aren't even the only forces of chaos. They're just the only active forces, the pantheon is only half formed.
>start reading iron warriors lore since I want to learn more about them without youtube shorts telling me what to think about them
>read storm of iron
>iron warriors seems pretty cool in there
>read hammer of olympia
>peurterabo comes off as a massive faggot
I guess people can like a legion and not like it's primarch.
>>96174097Perturabo has always been horrible but at least he's an interesting flavour of horrible unlike most primarchs. Besides he works well as an explanation for how the IW happened.
I'm a numpty unable to critically think while I'm hopped up on pain meds, could Zardu's soulbinding power affect models in challenges/affect models before challenges happen?
Also, how would it work if cast on single model units like dreadnoughts, would units on the combat just not fight?
>>96174097At the very least all the traitor primarchs are kinda retarded faggots, maybe sans Alpharius. Loyalist are more split.
>>96174097Hammer of Olympia did him bad. Authors really wish to sell the idea of Perturabo being a manchild who throws tantrums and the like. From day one, decimation was a stupid thing to do, and throwing people at walls is retarded.
They never highlight the IW is the one routinarily tasked to do what others fail to do and their wars are not of conquest but of extermination...but that wouldn't be retarded, and the authors need the IW to be retarded.
I dont really know what command units i should take because most of them just seem useless when compared to a standard centurion but running 3 centurions is boring
Does anyone have the scan of the Liber Auxilia?
>>96174186Paying for armour doesn't seem like a bad idea. But also why are you running 3 command squads?
>>96174209I meant more for the command slots, Like Centurion etc. Master of Signals is not really worth it for me and so are most of the others they're kindof boring choices. I guess a champion works. I dont really feel the need to run any if all named characters for my army.
>>96174186Some of the consuls give you access to special detachments which can free up prime traits you would be spending on logistical benefits to be used for extra bonuses. Also some of the consuls can have some pretty bonkers stats (Vigilator can get to BS8, Champion can get to WS7). Centurions definitely have a place, but consuls are nice for specific niches.
Librarians seem much better this time around and you can take two disciplines; honestly wouldn't be shocked if every marine player was slotting a librarian into their list now.
>Justaerin are elite. Symbol: a power armoured marine with bolter and blade
>Reavers are heavy assault. Symbol: a terminator
This is beyond ridiculous
>>96174240If only there existed some more generic symbols for different battlefield roles in the fluff...
>>96174221Too bad lil bro. This is Herohammer. If you want more than three units of a different kind, you're going to have to bring multiple HQ
>>96174097hammer of olympia is just some garbage retcon trash. IW trademark is being the only space marines intelligent enough to fight like an actual army with tanks and artillery and siegecraft. GW flanderized them to just be world eaters minus the melee weapons and with no superpowers unlike WE berserkers.
>>96174240the entire symbol system is worthless. It's like GW replacing inches with colors in killteam rules.
It's literally never faster to use the obscure incorrect picture system than to type "Troops, Elites, Fast Attacks" in a real language. There's zero actual justification for the change.
>>96174176>IW is the one routinarily tasked to do what others fail to doAnon, that is massive cope and you know it.
Any other primarch and legion capable of self reflection and adapting their tactics to their foes' weaknesses would do better that the IW under pert's command, because he's completely immune to good advice, and learning from mistakes. The IW are cool, but ironically, in spite of pert, not because of him. He legit makes the fourth shittier that it had to be.
Anyone have a share with the Legions Imperialis rule books?
thanks, really wanna try out that game
>>96174271It gets me every time that they're EC as well.
>>96174221Once pdf options are there, the main draw of a cent is extra detachments. If you don't need them then there are other consuls that are a free or cheap straight upgrade.
>>96174249If only
>>96174263I mean I get that they wanted to separate the old Elites into Support (characters), Shock Assault (base Termies & linebreakers), Elite (vets & elite termies) and Retinue (command squads). I'm not even against that.
But I do not agree with their symbols, especially when they are Astartes-only. Yeah we get it, other factions are NPCs. But they don't need to rub it in.
>>96174271Looks better than anything you've posted.
>>96174271God that's embarassing. Like dude, you work for GW. This is your job and that's what you submit?
>>96174263>There's zero actual justification for the change.I saw that some units which used to fall under the broad umbrella of "fast attack" have been moved to first strike and others to recon, just to give an example.
This isn't a change I would necessarily hate, but its execution is absolute garbage. All they needed to do was add one or two additional types of force org slot, in addition to the original four, and assign the units in a logical way.
Also, yes the symbols are pure unintuitive trash, especially since they use the same silhouettes for the non-marine factions.
>>96174323The one I'm a big fan of is contemptors not being in elite.
>>96174240>>96174249>>96174263>>96174301Want to know something you can't unsee? Look at the Heavy Assault symbol. Look at his right hand. Ever wondered what the fuck is that on his vambrace? It's an alchem pistol.
EVERY Heavy Assault unit in 3.0 is Vet Sergeant Khorak of the Deathshroud, Horus Heresy 2, page 49. He dies in "Blackshield (2016)", by Chris Wraight.
>>96174271>Kat T>The Emperor's Children have the snazziest hues of all the Space Marines in The Horus Heresy, in my humble opinion. Most of my time on this project was spent gluing tiny bayonets onto the end of boltguns, but once that was done I painted the miniatures up in (more or less) the Emperor's Children colours using a simple mix of Base and Contrast paints. I got Agrellan Badland all over their legs while doing the bases, but I'm going to say it was deliberate and they're meant to have sandy armour from stomping through their surroundings.I think this is a way of drawing in new people into the hobby, and to assuage their fears of having badly painted minis, they showcased this to say that it doesn't matter how shitty your paintjob it, GW is proud of your paypigging.
>>96174276As stupid as any of the 'my dad could beat up your dad' is the IW clowning on IF does give decent credence to them being great at what they do.
>>96174301Have to remember even HQ/Elite/Troop/Fast/Heavy split was a change from 2e, where we just had Character/Squad/Support. With some army based variations, like IG having their own platoon formation armies were built on. It's a shame they went with such obtuse markings, when there was plenty of symbols used even in 30k that could've been used to mark the different units.
>>96174301>mfw every Primarch is Dorn
>>96174271>Kat T โ Emperorโs ChildrenOf course it's the DEI-hire tranny who gets finger-painted retard paintjobs posted on warcom. Oh, that's hilarious.
>>96174356>tfw "he" calls it them "my project">didnt even paint the base rims, just left cumsplatters everywhere
>>96174317That's like bitching about the accountant at an engineering firm not being able to design a bridge
>>96174332Yeah, if done well, it could have been an additional way of balancing strong units, by limiting the number that you field.
>>96174418that was a feature of classic warhammer40k. In 3.5 CSM Obliterator units are 0-1 Obliterator units per army. Iron Warriors basically are a RoW allowing taking more than 1 unit of obliterators, and you can bring one imperial guard basilisk.
>>96174412I think the more apt comparison would be the accountant from an engineering firm designing a bridge, thinking 'good enough', submitting it, and then everybody from qc to management signing off on it. Also, it's just a unique combo where they didn't attempt to do anything other than a base coat, and even that is dogshit.
>>96174433and Raptors are 0-1 except for Night Lords. It didn't require the convoluted symbols system. And the retard-symbols add nothing to it. One or two Elites are gonna be overpowered but another Elites unit will be weak as shit, by having Elites be the limiter, it just means the suboptimal elites unit never sees the slightest bit of play. If the limiter is instead just the Contemptor Dreadnought says 0-1 Contemptor per army, then the 2nd or 3rd best elites unit would be judged on its own merits and see more play.
>>96173794building saturnine atm
i'm thinking of getting a warlord titan very soon, once i figure out how to transport it
it would be a nice treat if i can keep sober
>>96174276Of course it is cope. It's the only thing they get. The closest thing they have to a dedicated writer is John French, and that's worse than having no writer at all.
So... What does Implacable advance even do?
>>96174366>IW clowning on IFThe Iron Cage was such a logistical shitshow that the IW ran out of munitions to fire at the IF long before wiping them out. By the end both sides were running into melee to bash each other to death like cavemen. They were on track to wipe each other out before Bobby showed up and tilted the scales in the IF's favor.
Pert's magnum opus turned out to be a giant murder-suicide box. Do you realize how ludicrous that is? To start with total control of the battlefield and using that advantage to set a trap so catclysmically retarded that your entire military apparatus is almost deleted in a fight you could have withdrawn from at any moment? It's spite taken so far that it becomes farcical.
>>96174451What's the build like? I'm still waiting for them to go on discount before I grab them since I don't want all the other crap in the box
keep up the effort anon, being an alcoholic is cringe and you're too cool for that
>>96174459You can volley fire with non heavy weapons.
>>96174463Best scenario is the Iron Cage's "empty fortress" is actually a giant magic circle, and all the blood spilled in it was a means to fuel Perturabo's ascedancy.
It WAS a giant murder-suicide box. And the worst thing is it worked.
>>96174472all the articulations are free, meaning you can pose it however you want.
it does come in a shitload of pieces
also you don't have enough on sprue to make a full unit of two disintegrators or two plasma bombard
very much agree
>>96174476Ah, as i thought then. I couldnt find it in the rulebook leak, thanks for the help.
>>96174463It does go both ways. IF also were happy to kill themselves attacking the cage.
>>96174484Iron Cage results - Imperial Fists legion entirely destroyed, Rogal WeakBitch Dorn takes the casualties as an excuse to adopt the Codex Astartes and no longer have a Legion of space marines, just one yellow Chapter of marines. (While Leman Russ still keeps a full Legion of space wolves even after the iron cage date)
Perturabo ascends to immortality.
Iron Warriors remain a full Legion for next 10,000 years not a chapter.
It's utterly impossible to argue that Fists didn't completely lose.
>>96174544>It's utterly impossible to argue that Fists didn't completely lose.Not when you're a black Library Writer. God that part of the Scouring is going to be a complete shitshow.
Best case scenario
>>96174484 is right and they make the whole thing one giant soul contract from Vashtorr to Peterturbo to make him an undivided daemon prince in return for X souls.
Would a veteran Raven Guard army be viable? I'm worried that three line units - i.e., max three vet tac squads - would be unfun for everyone. I like the idea of having a smaller elite force. My ultimate goal would be 3000 points.
>>96174271Wait what this isn't a joke?
Oh holy shit it's real.
>can't really come up with a reason to run breachers over tacticals
>>96174572I don't see why veteran RG wouldn't be viable. Vet tacs are only line 1 so you'd be at a scoring disadvantage vs tacticals or despoilers but you could address that disadvantage by just holding objectives longer than your enemy.
Just don't give out any disintegrator rifles, you can take the heavy disintegrators if you want tho.
>>96174582In what world is
> I like Breachers more than Tacticalsnot enough of a reason?
>>96174582They're tougher and less likely to be CC'd.
>>96174582They look cooler
>>961745824 Lascutters in breachers is kinda baller. That's 8" S10 AP2 Dmg2 Armourbane Ordinance(Dmg4 if stationary or reacting) shooting and S12 AP2 Dmg4 in melee.
Tactical marines don't have guns that break open landraiders and melee weapons that can crack open primarchs.
>>96174572Why would you think it'd be unfun? Most people are probably gonna be running upwards of 3-5 line units, and vet tacs are just 3+ save anyway so they're not that much hardier than the average tacs. If anything you might struggle a little since ap3 seems so much more abundant so they're liable to get their teeth kicked in, and also their line value is less than a normal tac squad so their objective is likely to get snatched from them.
I don't think that'd make them terrible since they can still get those disintegrators and combi's but still something to think about.
>>96174582AP3 being more available and tactical statuses make them far more of an appealing choice. It might seem counter intuitive for a troop choice, but I think they're one of those units where the more you support them the more they can shine
>Nearby augur squad so they can shieldwall every turn>5+ invulns with 20 models to chew through so the enemy needs to seriously make an effort to kill them>Heavy making them a little braver when getting shot at; including a centurion makes them some of the bravest vanilla choice troops you can take>Not tied to land raiders anymore and can take rhinos and drop podsThere's a lot of good arguements for taking them now desu
>entire online discourse revolves around people online who actually liked 2nd edition
hmm, think I'm gonna make my own mind up on this one. 3.0 may actually be good if it's making those people mad.
Now that the bongs are gone, 3.0 might not get shit talked so much here
>>96174618>Why would you think it'd be unfun? Most people are probably gonna be running upwards of 3-5 line units, and vet tacs are just 3+ save anyway so they're not that much hardier than the average tacs. If anything you might struggle a little since ap3 seems so much more abundant so they're liable to get their teeth kicked in, and also their line value is less than a normal tac squad so their objective is likely to get snatched from them.I guess I think it might be unfun for my opponent because of my disadvantage in line would make it too easy for my opponent. I wonder if RG shrouded would balance that.
I've also never played HH (or any other game for that matter) so have no reference point.
>>96174612I kitted them out and it ended up at like almost 300 points. I might just end up doing 10 with volkite and a nuncio vox.
>>96174625>>96174629do shills keep the same schedule or something? what the fuck
>>96174618>>96174582A 5++ means Breachers are 50% more resistant to AP3. It saves on a 1/3, but it can be used more than once, so the infinite sum converges to 1/2, do the sum if you must.
So, 50% more resilient, for 40% extra price (140 vs 100). They are niche, but now they're viable.
Won't they be getting extra stuff in the PDF? For real why do we bother - the rules won't be released until that PDF is here
>>96174642>Coordinated waves of shitposters doomposting with the same points copied off a Discord are fine>People talking about a new edition of a system releasing this weekend must be shillingRetard-kun pls
>>96174629we're still here bruv
>>96174662I'm just assuming there will be volkite chargers for 2ppm.
>>96173688>what a moronic idea of a weapon.
>>96174629Good morning you dull cunt
What are we thinking of loading these outflanky boys with, heavy support squad?
>>96174678>The one we believed fully vanquished comes back to haunt usLoken moment
>>96173688>a moronic idea of a weaponCome and say that to my face, you fucking heretic!
>>96174686I'm thinking Tyrants. They're not good but I like the concept:
Half a dozen lascannons arrive, and disembark half a HSS, but are still a danger to anything weaker than Elite
God I wish luna wolves had a cool color scheme.
>>96174673>>96174678>Oi bruv cunt chav cor blimey ya roight tosserWhy do LARPing retards think Bongs talk like this.
They speak Arabic, dumbshits.
>>96174629how's gibraltar today
>>96174636what are you talking about? Neither breachers nor warders lists volkite as an option. They only get bolters. They can have a nuncio vox or augury scanner. 1/5 can have a graviton gun or lascutter.
>>96174717They used to have volkite chargers as an option, some believe they will be an option again with the upcoming PDF
>>96174717Pdf options. I think it's likely they'll get volkite back.
>>96174723Chargers also just, make sense for boarding squads like breachers. Their main weakness over a bolter is short range which doesn't matter when you're fighting in a space ship.
how would (you) make power swords better
What is the purpose of a Praevian? With no melee upgrades he's functionally useless as anything other than a detachment unlocker.
What does the 'Battle Automata' rule do? I assume its good because otherwise I'm paying 95pts to get reactions on my Castellax.
>>96174727Make all power weapons equal.
Recon slots are going to be used for anything except actual Recons. 10 of them, with shotguns, cost 195 pts.
10 Actual Veteran Tacticals cost 160 pts. 180 pts if equalized with shotguns (you don't want them).
Yeah I know they have Infiltrate, Move Through Cover and Smokescreen, but come on
>>96174727A+1. That's it. Power mauls attack strong, power spears attack early, power axes attack deep.
Then power swords attack more.
>>96174729>functionally useless as anything other than a detachment unlockerwhere have you been, that's all characters now.
>>96174733in that case, why would you take a lightning claw?
Is it evil to not want more than a single HQ?
>>96174732Precision just got overcorrected from 2e.
>>96174745It's Rending 6+ (hits of 6 auto wound). But if you feel you'd need to have lightning claws add +1A, that might be okay. 2 of them add 2. Makes sense.
Whats the deal with the bongs & yookay, werent they supposed to get their internet censored. What actually happened, nothing?
I keep watching battle reports and 3.0 still looks fine to me. Maybe I'm just biased and after the shitfest 40k has become anything looks better comparatively.
>>96173109 (OP)>Journal for Istvaan V contains ONE (1) playable mission FUCKING
KEK
>>96173109 (OP)So because my autism is strong I need help with all things Iron Warriors. Which books are essential to learn their heraldry and see examples of sketches etc? The Black books of course but what about 2nd edition are there any gems in there showing different types of units etc?
>>96174801>essential to learn their heraldryit's hazard stripes, that's it.
>>96174801What's the idea you currently have about the Iron Warriors?
I'm re-reading the rules and vehicles still have battle/defense weapons and battle weapons still fire as snapshots if you split fire. Why were people complaining that vehicles had no restrictions for split firing anymore?
>>96174817I wanted to maybe add some more flair to the iron/steel finish. I was wondering if they also had parts of armour that were black for example or even yellow. Sort of like how imperial fist vets have black shoulder pads and helmets.
Iโve got some pretty basic ideas and those shoulder pads are a bit more inspiration, I donโt just want everyone with the classic hazards, Iโd like a mix of one stripe, a few, maybe a vertical line of yellow instead.
I donโt know I just feel like I want to experiment, I was thinking of using contrast paints to very slightly tint the armour like a filter maybe a dark blue maybe green? Hereโs an example, this guy isnโt just silver heโs tinted and the heraldry isnโt just stripes. I want to move away from the clean kinda 40K painting and really give my guys some character you know? Iโm rambling anon sorry
>>96174797It's clearly labeled part 1, silly billy.
We just didn't know it was one of those 300 part magazines to build your own scale human body or whatever
>>96174830These all sound like cool ideas anon. Try them out
>>96174830adding undertones and filters to everything is how you get next level paint jobs, experiment and have fun anon
>>96173163even better to play HH1 and not have any of the trashy reactions and minigames
>>96173642wtf is that? Did he fart?
>>96174866Seconding this. Paint funny highly saturated colors as your base tones and lightly drybrush metal overtop.
>>96173847Why? The Sicaran had a twin gun of that kind. I put a Sicaran's turret on top of a Rhino and the guns have the same length as the whole Rhino.
The turret has a quad gun of that type. It will look like trash.
>>96173841illegal? Oh no, better call the police before he goes to that game with that illegal plastic toy
>>96174356That person just copied my Pro Painting(tm) style, I cannot believe it.
>>96174732and smokescreen is trash. Recons lost smoke bomb rule where they were treated as 6" further away or whatever, instead they have zero extra defense unless they eat up your precious 1 stratagem point every turn of the game - making them a complete joke.
>>96174942You get 2 reactions per turn in a 3k game
>>96174758>I keep watching battle reports and 3.0 still looks fine to me.That's because:
a) You're a retarded faggot
b) Yeah it's still better than 40k by a country mile ngl
>>96174997Macca, go to sleep
>>96174732Recons are for nemesis bolters, literally no other reason to take them. Being sopport units makes them bad at even infiltrating in the front lines. Seekers do that better
I like to read every bitter post about 3.0 in my head with a nasally Australian accent
makes me chuckle
>>96175002>literally no other reason to take themcognis signum with infiltrate
>>96175010I go with Abaddon's voice in audiobooks.
>>96174936Good lord the humidity that image suggests.
>>96175051Does MotL stack?
What is the best anti-tank option now for SA? Still the Leman russ with vanquisher?
Does the line rule even exist for Mechanicum? Can't see any mention anywhere except that only Mago etc. accompanied units can contest objectives.
>>96174582Ap3 weapons seem easier to access now.
The +1T stratagem is pretty good again small arms fire. They are more resilient to status effects and you can now put them on a rhino. Line 1 instead of Line 2 is not as big of a difference either and their special weapon are pretty good. The gravgun in particular can pin vehicles very easily
Ngl taking 140 tacticals instead would probably be very close in survivability but they are way more of a viable option now than they were before and the rhino thing is huge for rushing objectives. A 5++ will make them last a lot more if they get charged by anything with power weapons
Not sure whether to go back and do transfers on the upper pads or leave it blank. This guy was a cunt to assemble. Time to build him a command squad.
>>96174997IDK man it still has basically all the things I like about the old system and new things I also like.
>>96175061Vanquisher seems genuinely very bad. 1 shot for 150, where a laser destroyer has 1 less damage but 2 shots for 55. For a leman russ a demolisher might work if it can sit still. A valdor seems a little bit better but not great. Laser destroyer rapiers are far and above the most efficient though.
>>96175079>+1T stratagem is pretty good again small arms fire.nta, but would you use +1T reaction or Medic! reaction that will also boost your CL and LD check afterwards? imo Big tactical blobls are sitting on important central objectives and use OW and Return fire with FotL. Small Breacher squads are sitting on dangerous but remote objectives with medic where they are getting blasted with ranged weapons that can reach them (lascannons, artillery). In the end it's probably situational.
>>96175071Iirc comptroller gives line?
>>96174758Beyond the legal jargon explanations the new rule set does look pretty good, different, but still fun to play.
I believe the problem arises when you want to build your army, it's understandable for you to adjust your lists in-between editions, but with some many people's models becoming illegal and the legacies bandaid just being for missing units, I think it's going to be a long time be the war journal DLC "fixes" this issue.p
>>96175091That is indeed a great choice. What about the heavy sentinels with melta lance? A squad of 3 seems like a decent mobile platform to zone out aggressive heavy transports.
>>96175082And an ass shot
>>96173109 (OP)QUICK anons, whatโs better the Contemptor or Leviathan (ranged)? What purposes do they serve are they legit both good?
>>96175118>but with some many people's models becoming illegal and the legacies bandaid just being for missing units, I think it's going to be a long time be the war journal DLC "fixes" this issue.pI get that and I agree but I'm waiting for the PDF to release so we know what we're actually losing. Some things like gorgons seem to be an obvious type and many other options look like they got removed (I assume) until GW release a terminator weapons pack. I also think that fixing consul loadouts needs a single line of text so that might happen at some point.
does master of the legion stack for more reactions, IE taking primarch and a praetor?
>>96175082...Is this supposed to be a pre-magnus TS? Genuinely no idea what legion that fella is supposed to be
>>96175133Just bee yourself.
>>96174176>They never highlight the IW is the one routinarily tasked to do what others fail to doAnon im sorry but thats really stupid as an argument.
All the legions had their hard fought wars and specializations. The DA had that whole "we are getting massacred by psychic vampire bugs" war going on.
The iron warriors were used for dirty and unglamorous siege warfare (which is also conveniently the style of war pertruabo chose to fight) and have on some occasions did things other legions couldnt, this doesent mean they were the toughest legion given the toughest jobs, it means that pertruabo had a particular talent or skillset and had some occasions to show it off.
Slowly slogging it under the cover of artillery fire isnt somehow harder than a decapitation strike assault where you bulldoze the enemies hardest warriors to slay the warlord. Its just less glamorous.
>>96175187Traitor ravenguard. The red pauldrons is a variant I do for high command/retinue
>>96175203He's posed like he just got told he has to go to Istvaan on his day off. Looking good though
>>96175203Good to see you painting anon, have you done a praetor yet? Show me yours so I can hate mine
>>96175203Looks like me when my wife gives me a list of chores
>>96175128I would agree. Hadn't really paid much thought to them melta lance + hunter killer battery seems solid..
>>96175133Is it because you want them for aesthetics? If so, why not pick the guns you like the looks of? I assume you don't want the saturnine dread due to the marmite looks?
>>96175133Neither are particularly good. Many of their best weapons got worse, the core rules aren't as favorible to dreadnoughts, vehicles got better, and maybe biggest of all their ws/bs got nerfed. If I was set on taking one, I'd probably go autocannon / storm cannon. Maybe melta on leviathan.
>>96175238Ahhhh yeah, well done you cocksucker. Beautiful gems, I want to eat
toc
md5: 68f67b8621bbc8e3bb00b6e580d953c2
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>>96175087From a fairly thorough review of the rules, this is my take and I think highly defensible - Green = has some strength where it's better than both other editions in some way / Orange = only completely inferior to one earlier edition / Red = completely inferior to both earlier editions. Looking at them in sum, I think there's only one take I can reasonable come to on the edition as a whole (completely ignoring army list issues).
>>96175238What green is that?
>>96175234Iโve ordered the Saturnine box because why not 35% discount but youโre right Iโm not a huge fan of how it looks, I went with Contemptor, Iโm a fan of one ranged and a melee weapon, itโll be iron warriors
>>96175237Gotcha, I actually love them both but I think Iโll just build stuff based on what I think looks cool right?
>>96175260vallejo games angel green
>>96175107Medic makes tacticals basically cost the same. The problem is that is doesn't do anything against D2 weapons and there's a lot of those. Mostly same issue as last edition I guess. I think breacher are good for rushing midfield objectives just bc you can pack them in a rhino and they will survive melee better than tacticals. But you'd probably want a bigger unit
>>96175272>based on what looks coolBest way to do it.
>>96175272rule of cool is always the way to go. contemptor, leviathan, and from the sounds of it the saturnine dread are all super easy to magnetize too.
>>96175082>>96175203Nice work anons but wow I hate those panel lines on the arms on the model. Didn't notice them until now.
>>96173109 (OP)Does Abaddon regret anything? Just reading Galaxy in Flames and it seems like after killing Loken/Tarik something changes. Honestly Istvaan 3 is so fucking brutal itโs hard to see how the astartes just carry on with their treachery I guess thereโs no going back after that
>>96175272Damn I wish I didn't hate how vallejo paints feel that color is perfect.
>>96175291He regrets not being even more based earlier.
>>96175135I think consuls are, for the most part, going to remain largely the same. You may get terminator/bike chaplains and librarians or whatever, but I assume librarians will remain bound to a force weapon and chaplains their crozius. Hopefully the legacy loadouts are less autistic about stuff like "the specific pistol on the model" though.
That much might even be good, mechanically speaking, give each of them a more distinct and specific gameplay identity
>>96175291He realises he's surrounded by a bunch of retards during the siege
>>96175309What about Perty? Is he the only competent one at the siege along with Abaddon?
>>96175315>Perty>Competent
>>96175315Perturabo quits the siege half way through because he was surrounded by retards
>>96175315Iirc perty before ragequitting sends him and some of the top SoH brass in a suicide mission and abby accepts because he wants to kill himself. He then proceeds to get robbed of that too. At the end of the heresy he actually regrets everything but he's in too deep now and knows he can't be forgiven.
for night lords, should I make some despoilers or stick to terror squads with rotary cannons and volkite like in 2ed?
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/vjcrg9dz/horus-heresy-downloads-talons-of-the-emperor-and-errata/
>>96175371Where the fuck are all the sisters units gone?
>>96175371Also no errata on the Gorgons, guess they don't get guns anymore
>>96175371These are looking pretty bad to me.
>>96175371>tartaros got weapons backSo whats up with the siege squad?
D1
md5: 0c67daf9fe3fc5d200f4ccfebc12df97
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>basically everything is D1
that's rough buddy
>>96175371>Books haven't even released yet.>Already have an FAQ to fix stuff that should have been caught during proof reading.Holy shit, what the fuck is going on with this edition?
>>96175398You say that like GW hasn't been doing this for years. Doesn't make it any less sad though.
>>96173188This is so goofy, I've been laughing at it for like 2 minutes.
What would we call this? What should it do?
>>96175371HAHA YES FUCK CUSTARDS! All 3 players can now cope and seethe this is a marine game
>>96175394As it should. We don't want wound creep like in 40k.
>>96175419Mechanicum won
kneel marine baby
>>96175371Valdor at 400 is crazy. Sisters gutted.
>>96175379Anon, are you retarded?
>>96175371This is even more anemic than 40k Custodes, impressive.
>>96175379Spoke too soon.
blind
md5: 4faee28165b9ffafe45fea2a25233628
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>>96175379might want to get your eyes checked anon
>>96175371Guess I'll just go fuck myself then.
>>96175291He just wanted a proper scrap.
>>96175434>>96175452I'd wait for the actual liber to come out. They'll be getting a bunch of plastic kits.
>>96175381Shields? Maybe they'll remove that unit from the pdf if they found adding that single line of text to the liber version worked already.
>>96175371>Flyers may arrive from any board edge from turn 2>Flare launchers are invulnerable saves>Points drop for Malcador, Infernus and Tank DestroyerSA bros, we keep winning! This is our edition, at last!
>>96175394They werent instant death before either right? That seems entirely fair. Custodes go first with lots of good Ap2 attacks, but they arent instant killing terminators per each one (although with lightning blows they CAN do it, critical hits if they charge)
>>96175466I do hope the book is better but it still seems a bit miserable, just hoping the plastic wave is going to make the opportunity count.
GW can fuck off
wheres the SoS units?
>>96175444>>96175442>>96175433NTA but I assume he's talking about the gun upgrades like graviton or heavies
Oh no, "PDFs will fix it" bros, the Sisters of Silence have ONE (1!) non-character non-vehicle unit.
>>961754892E for reference
Mechanicum bros, if Custards are looking like this do we still have hope
>>96175485No models no rules Anon :)
>>96175494Journal sloptica will fix it for you bro (sis)
is that a fucking normal Initiative S12 ap2 d3 crit 6+ shock armourbane fist???
>>96175507then make models!
stop pandering to homosexual custodes fans and actually EXPAND THE FUCKING TALONS RANGE
>>96175371>pre-release errataI'm sure this game was thoroughly playtested and proofread
>>96175528They are. They've said so several times already that it's the reason the liber will come a bit later.
>>96175371Gee what a fucking surprise
Don't know what was more of a waste of time, hearing /hhg/ bitch about it for 2 weeks or calling you retards for doing it
>>96175535Going by the need for a day negative one FAQ then it sounds like it was but only after it was sent to print. Lol
>>96175371>>96175444>Skyfire is just a mistake, they'll errata it
>>96175536theyll get 1 HQ option and thats it lmao
>>96175520Yes, on the telemon heavy dread.
>>96175552Can't shoot if he moves, that's fair enough if the gun is good. Hard to snipe on the run
>>96175539> They literally changed the rules to give the option BACKDECISIVE chud victory.
Also you aren't a Br*Tish poster are you? You have to LEAVE if you are (Canadians too just in case). 4chan says you are NOT allowed
>>96175536they previewed a custodes spear
there is no way in hell SoS will get new stuff before custodes
>>96175567If I was British or Canadian I'd be arrested for calling you retards online
>>96175552>heavy(FP)He can shoot if he stands still.
Custodes have a similar rule on their jetbike power lances, AM(0) (meaning zero attacks) but impact(A), so they get 1 attack on the charge and none otherwise.
I think its a really cool way to have what would otherwise have been a special rule "can only shoot if you stayed still/only use it if you charged" just be a naturally occuring part of the stats.
>>96175552Yes, unless he remains stationary
>>96175571They are referring to them as Talons all the time. It's gonna be both.
>>96175552>FP 0>Heavy (FP)They honestly should have done this trick much more often for snipers and other heavy weapons.
>>96175564>if the gun is good>D2
>>96175371>GW will never give tartaros their melee options back!>Only lightning claws is intentional!Fellow true believers... We won.
>>96175359rotor cannons are kino
>>96175571a female custodes model (tribune)
>>96175371Fucking hell they gutted SoS
I feel so bad for that one players that actually made the conversions for the pdf units
Another edition, another dogshit Vanus ruleset. Very sad.
>Venenum have the lowest CL and IN of the assassins
BASED
>>96175590>D2>crit strike 5+>can ignore eternal warrior>ignores shrouded>Ap2yea, seems good.
Hes a sniper assassin, hes good at sniping people.
>>96175539so predictable i have lost no faith at all
>>96175643What good is a sniper assassin if he can't kill a character in one shot
Are there indomitus terminators in 30k?
>the SoS army list is 4 units
lmao
>>96175664Damage 3 kills a centurion, damage 4, which he can also reach (he can pick which special rule to apply to his weapon every time he fires, one of those options is "shred"), kills a praetor.
He CAN kill a character in one shot.
Hes also range 100 and can only be snapshot if he isnt the closest model (or you have precision), so he probably gets more than one shot. The vindicare is absolutely capable at sniping out characters.
>>96175677They said they will be in the pdf
>>96175371>https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/vjcrg9dz/horus-heresy-downloads-talons-of-the-emperor-and-errata/> If youโve not yet secured your Saturnine box and your LibersOH NO, better buy them quickly before they are GONE. GONE they will be. Limited, quick quick quick. Oh no. Just think of all the FOMO. Think of all the girls you won't get without fielding Saturnine!1!! lmao, fuck you, GW.
>>96175698Get your outdated books asap!!
>>96175636Someone read nemesis I see :^)
>>96175507It's already a fucking legacies pdf
>>96175371I still need to test them in an actual game but Custards at least seem way more flavourful than in 2.0.
>Coronus get Assault Vehicle so you can actually build a mechanized infantry force>Arachnus weaponry get the BRRRRRRRRRRRT mode back>Adrathic weapons are fucking terrifying again>Guards get nerfed as they should, will strugle to wipe out TEQs but are still really hard to kill due to EW (1)>The Blade of Mercy aftermath is fucking hilarious.
>>96175614Vanus seem fun. Niche, but in a game where they matter they will matter a lot. You can pick where people deploy their fliers and shit. That storm eagle doom-drop? actually coming on in that corner there, far from any action or use.
So uuuh if tartaros get their fists back in faq, what the hell is the legacies "siege tartaros" supposed to be?
>>96175690>>96175696How are they different from tartaros or cataphractii in past editions?
>>96175726Will be hilarious if that entry doesn't exist
>>96175698They aren't limited though.
>>96175552If he stands still his FP increases to 1 due to Heavy(FP)...
>tribunes are EW (2)
I am vomit
>>96175726>legion agnostic tyrant/fulmentarus variant
>>96175371Oh no little Custodian, seems you dropped your Line on the way here
It's okay, the Silent Sister dropped 90% of her army, and she don't get line either
>>96175735>Oh no little Custodian, seems you dropped your Line on the way herecustodes are basically auto-lose kek
>>96175727No idea this edition
In 2.0 they werenโt as fast as Tartaros but could sweep unlike Cataphractii. And could get a 4+ invul if you went hammer and shield
>>96175730Would prove that the legacies article was making shit up for damage control
And that the one person with a brain on the team went "the fuck you mean tartaros siege squad? Just faq it"
>paint up and build entire 2000 point army of HH Emperor's Children
>never played any wargame before
>there's already another fucking EC player in the area who uses an extremely similar paint scheme for his army
FUCK.
>>96175733Custodes characters strong, more news at 11.
Its a 250pts melee character who has a damage 1 weapon (because theyre locked to spears this edition, the strongest of which is basically a paragon blade with +1 attack on the charge), it being good in duels is fine/good. Frankly eternal warrior is something they NEED to not get reliably beaten by more flexible (and often cheaper) marine characters, who exist as part of an army with such frivolous excesses as "line units", "artillery", "cheap troops" and "heavy support firepower". Also AV14.
Custodes do melee elite shock assault, thats it, they should at least be good at it.
>>96175747Declare a death war and duel him for use of the scheme. He has infringed on your perfection
>>96175727Cheaper than both, have the weaknesses of both. They were as slow as cata terminators and had the lower invuln of tartaros terminators, but were cheaper than either. They also had some decent wargear like thunder hammers and stormshields.
>>96175747>be the local EC player in the area for years>well established as the Emperor's Children guy>one day this new guy comes into the game store, already has an army case and all>he opens it>emperor's children>guy did zero fucking research on the local area players and what legions were already playedFUCK.
>>96175740Just sweep your opponent off every objective 5head.
Custodes seem fun and fluffy enough, theyre obviously not meant to sit there and hold objectives, theyre the "shit got real" super-troopers who come in to kick ass and chew bubblegum, theyre meant to kill all your dudes or die trying (and they will be doing a lot of that this edition I think)
>>96175755There's two Iron Warriors players in my store - me and this other guy, Dave.
Dave and I have decided that we are mortal enemies.
During a 2v2 game, we focused entirely on each other the whole game.
>>96175744>>96175752Hmm sounds cool. I guess my atavists army is happening after all. How did blackshields use to work? Do they have access to all the generic units?
>>96175766Basically.
Generic units only and you modified them with your BlackShields custom stuff.
>>96175755So Stacey showed up to prom wearing the same dress as you?
So fucking what?
>>96175766>How did blackshields use to work?You picked your force between the legions on a per-model basis, each model got benefits depending on what legion it was, with units benefiting from all the legions present, a bigger buff from the overall legion present, and then suffering debuffs based on all the legions present (for example any unit containing any NL models couldnt charge an enemy unless it outnumbered them)
>Do they have access to all the generic units?Yes. But you got no access to the legion specific stuff by default.
>>96175762That sounds based as fuck.
>>96175773>>96175777Hell yes. That's settled then.
>>96175677Yes, but remove the Crux Terminatus.
>>96175727Indomitus in 1.0 was directly inferior to Tartaros. In 2.0, they serve as a lesser middle ground between generic Cataphractii/Tartaros. They count as Troops and not Elites, are slightly cheaper since a Power Fist is baked into the cost, can do a Sweeping Advance unlike the former, but move just as slow and only upgrade to 4++ on taking a Storm Shield. Like them, it still had to contest against unique Terminators, though for a time Pride of the Legion could take them as extra scoring units, but that was removed.
>>96175610Thanks, but don't worry on my account, I have no intention of playing 3.0. My group has decided we'll stick with 2nd edition.
Plus, hey, rules are temporary, models are forever.
>custodes have a unique end of combat rule where they gang up on a guy and stab him to death
Absolutely hilarious, I'm starting to love this pdf
>>96175764I might
>>96175776You don't understand. We both painted up TRAITOR emperor's children. Why the fuck would traitor EC fight traitor EC? Not to mention that there's a limited number of 30k players in the area anyway, could've contributed to army variety if different decisions were made
Is Liber Questoris leaked yet?
>>96175485They have female Custodies, sisters literally are irrelevant.
>>96175777Blackshields โ Shattered Legions, anon.
>>96175816>traitor EC commanding officer insulted by another traitor EC company/chapter's commander during a dispute over resources while high as fuck>they fight
>>96175816>Why the fuck would traitor EC fight traitor EC?Bad intel?
Self-serving Praetor eliminating a rival that he can then claim was actually a loyalist?
>>96175816No, don't worry, I understand
And I think you're dumb for thinking you can dictate what people play
>>961758143.0 is a fucking mess but stuff like the Titans rules or Misericordia are absolute kino. If they give Custodians some of the options back in the Liber it may be their best iteration yet, in spirit at least.
>>96175473>point drops.>before the games even out.What the fuck is happening over there.
>>96175722You don't even need assault vehicle anymore faggot Kun.
Custodes don't need the step up or to not be disorganized to fucking murder most marines in assault.
>>96175814Wait, so Custodes are British?
>>96175727They are likely going to just be tartaros that can take shield to get a 4++ but gain Heavy, which basically makes them cataphractii
I doubt they will be troops this time around, that'd be kinda retarded
>>96175747>>96175755> I need to ask permission to have an army to not step on some overly sensitive faggots toesLmao. Also the better painted army is the TRVE player.
Also stop thinking antagonistically; you guys should now TEAM UP for epic doubles games
>>96175838Suits wanted the game on the 3 year cycle, rules guys rushed the book to meet the deadline.
>>96175816>Why the fuck would traitor EC fight traitor EC?Could be a force of renegade (but still traitor) EC who declare themselves seperate from the main EC, like blackshields but still painted purple. They launch a piratical raid on their brethren.
>>96175816Traitors are much more likely to team kill for retarded reasons like pride or 'le daemons made me do it'
>>96175489You are too generous anon I was just being illiterate
>>96175371>Have to break the news to my friend who was interested in getting into Heresy that the sisters lost all their units that got him interested in Heresy>Also have to tell him that he can't run the custodes with SA allies army he wanted to do so he won't be able to take Valdor and lead the charge with regular fighting men (and sisters)>Have to tell him the Tribune he made with the dual swords for his first model isn't legal anymoreI don't think he was actually going to start Heresy but damn
>>96175851Wait, so GW might actually have remembered the legion agnostic storm shields for tartaros that FW sold way back when, and given them rules? Damn.
>>96175860>>Also have to tell him that he can't run the custodes with SA allies army he wanted toHe can? You can take a warlord and allies.
>>96175816>>96175747>the fuck would traitor EC fight traitor EC?'The Soul, Severed' covers that while also being probably the best 30k ec story.
In fact, I don't think a single army would be more likely to fight itself with matching loyalty. Maybe mechanicum for opportunistic inter forge world rivalry. Traitor ec killing traitor ec is entirely in character and with precedent.
If you want to be even cooler, adjust your paint scheme to go either more or less chaos corrupted than the other guy and you have a perfectly clear reason for them to fight.
>>96175861Those rules were for the indomitus storm shields in 2.0
Tho I guess you could always put shields on tartaros and run them as indomitus
>>96175860I'm sure your friend exists.
>>96175873My friend goes to another school.
>>96175371>Day -1 errataSo the books are outdated before they even come out?
>>96175869Doesn't the warlord detachment have to be the same army as the primary? Cause if so then pretty sure pic related stops that from being possible
>>96175860>my friend who was interested in getting into Heresy that the sisters lost all their units that got him interested in Heresylol
lmao
>yea dude my friend was interested in the model-less sos units hidden away in the ass end of the Liber Imperialis book>yea the ones who have no art or visual representation and werent very mechanically interesting or powerful>those were the things which got him hooked on HH, his tie to the game and the source of his investment>Have to tell him the Tribune he made with the dual swords for his first model isn't legal anymoreThey can take paragon blades
>>96175298>That much might even be good, mechanically speaking, give each of them a more distinct and specific gameplay identityPeople like you should be stoned to death in the street by baying crowds after a week in the stocks having children throw dog turds at you.
>>96175882>Have rules issues that last months or are never fixed/clarified like in HH 2.0>Day 1 errataTake your pick.
>>96175893>well actually I liked having every consul be the exact same thunder hammer wielding dude>all of them having the exact same loadout was good and we should return to that, limitations on loadout are bad I want my centurions+1!
>>96175371>custodes get rapedToday is a good day.
>>96175882Happened with 40k Custodes in 9th. It was, and is, fucking hilarious.
>>96175841>The Coronus is fucking huge and you disembark from the rear so the set up extra inches are definitely welcome>Basically every Custodian melee weapon is D1 so you will need the Critical Hit (6+) from charging to seriously threaten elite TerminatorsI agree that it is not a huge deal in the context of 3.0 edition, but for an assault-centric army it is definitely nice.
>>96175539Pfff, as if it wasn't the weeks of bitching and righfully shouting down cocksucking shillfaggots like you that led to this being in there.
>>96175722>>The Blade of Mercy aftermath is fucking hilarious.Yup. Not good most of the time probably, but funny as fuck. You try to run and your warlord just gets shanked.
>>96175899shut the fuck up pardo
>>96175371>HH 1.0>custodes are fucking OP>HH 2.0>custodes are still fucking OP but only if you spam line units>HH 3.0>CUSTARDS SUCKTHE REIGN OF THE BANANA BOYS IS OVER
>>96175577Whereas sane, straight people with taste and refinement think it's a retarded approach to require everything autistically be crammed into the statline when a brief sentence of plain English has always sufficed in the past and would still.
In IW there is iron cohort detachment that requires you to run 2 arquitor bombards. What loadout should i run on them? I'm new to the games so rules are still mystery to me.
>>96175873Yeah sorry I just made him up so I could bitch here for the sake of it. Sorry but I don't actually do mentally ill shit like that, otherwise I'd probably be a lot funnier and come up with something more interesting
>>96175890He got fixated on the sisters when they dropped that one animation showing them off on warhammer tv. When I told him about the extra shit they had, it's what got him interested in getting into it.
>They can take paragon bladesYeah but those aren't meridian blades though
I don't know why I'm bothering to explain myself to you retards desu
>>96175787Whatever happened to the retard that painted his marines like this?
>>96175585They can refer to whatever they like, they're clearly going to waste the whole design/production allocation for the release remaking all the Custodes units to include ~30% female models and slightly adjust their proportions to match the nuMarines, while Sisters will likely be gutted due to their narrow model range with some vague promise of Journal upgrades down the line.
>>96175923Morbus is pretty good, but the grab thing is very spicy.
>>96175731>thatsthejoke.jpg
>>96175933They're splitting the 40k and 30k custodes lines
40k will get females, we're getting off safety
>>96175841Custodes are one of the armies that still REALLY care about getting the charge off. Without their impact(A) and critical strikes a lot of their damage just evaporates. Remember, they dont have reaping blow or nemesis attacks or whatever, that 3A they always had is it unless they charge. They will absolutely butcher despoilers and veterans still, but terminators (who are now t5) are a different matter. 3*2/3*2/3*1/2 =0.7 wounds to regular (non ws5) terminators.
>>96175920>>96175900Theyre still really scary melee units and have really nasty guns. A tribune will still rape your praetor, valdor can still fight primarchs on even footing. Custodes are not dead.
>>96175942no the joke is the 4chanoid complaining about a company marketing their new products on their website made to advertise new products
>>96175371JFC this edition is toast...
>>96175924>Yeah but those aren't meridian blades thoughSwords are swords dumbass. If the complaint was "this model is no longer legal" then that complaint is wrong. If the complaint is "well I wanted to use my super speshul sword profile and wont settle for the other, slightly less super speshul, super speshul sword" then you can go get fucked and cry about it.
>>96175946>40k will get femalesGW said that the first of the 10 thousand was female.
>>96173627>WallaDecimate yourself, violร !
>>96175956No they didn't
You're just playing telephone with arch
Another download. Just a lil' one.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/x0zklar7/take-the-dropsite-massacre-into-your-own-hands-with-a-free-mission-and-three-battle-reports/
>>96175899Sorry you exclusively played with other cocksucking faggots who were so busy desperately thinking about the next cocks you were going to suck you all just monoloadouted so you didn't have to think about it. Some of us actually played Heresy and so have no experience of the "issue" you present.
>>96175968fuck off dipshit
>begin to paint up marines as one legion
>see another legion paint scheme midway through that i decide i like more
>strip marines, paint in new legion paint scheme
>repeat
why does this keep happening
>>96175535this edition is already on desperation fire sales at -35% and it hasn't even hit day 1 of launch. The end and the death of horus heresy is nigh.
>>96175976only macca can save 30k
>>96175740Casually using all my reactions to make off points to deny Vanguard 3 and watch my opponent founder VP
>>96175899I kind of agree but I don't see why you wouldn't allow the option? I'm not giving a praevian 40 points of wargear when I only want him for the robots but if someone does more power to them.
>>96175979buy an ad, faggot
>>96175979>coming this summer>a beloved game, destroyed by a games company that worships satan>from the darkness, a fatass emerges>can one neckbeard save the hobby?>find out in HORUS HERESY: FAT FUCK EDITION
>>96175974Becuase you're actually alpha legion and your programming is deteriorating. Keeps the schemes just add a hydra or XX subtly on these various legions.
>>96175895I'll pick the first because I'm not interested in having FAQ churn too.
>>96175969Wasn't this posted already?
They posted the one mission from the journal as a free pdf?
>>96175973So that could make Valdor a Transman...interesting
>>96175969>one scenario from journal is now freeimagine having preordered the tactica journal holy fuck
>>96175883Just take custodes as allies.
>>96175973>Was he the very first? Or merely the greatest of those who survived from the early batches? He may not know the answer himself, and is not inclined to investigate, for Constantin Valdor is not a curious man.First custode batches were obviously a bunch of women, and then the single custode who survived successfully was Valdor, a man. Clearly this is GW blatantly implying that men are superior to women
>>96175931Dunno, I started a 40k project this year that is essentially a chapter of atavists that survived and keep doing their shit in pre-primarchs heraldry and doctrines and I'm using 99% heresy models for it. Seems like I'll be able to use pretty much everything in 30k too so I'll double dip with the same army.
>>96175473>Flyers may arrive from any board edge from turn 2I did not expect this. Dreadclaw stonks UP
>>96175973Anon, is English your second language?
That is not saying first ever was Female, it's saying that in the initial batch created, there were Females.
>>96175996Paypiggies lose again
>>96175973Since you obviously have 2nd grade reading comprehension, I'll offer to explain to you the difference between "was" and "were"
Would you lack that?
>>96176009the first batch of custodes were women, but their monthly cycles all synced up and they all had PMS on the same day, leaving the Emperor's life critically vulnerable to their terrible judgment. The batch was disposed of and all future custodes were made as males.
>>96175983because if every consul can just take every bit of gear? whats the difference between them? what is their individual identity in terms of what they can and cant do in combat? Is the only difference between a chaplain, centurion and librarian the fact that one pins you, one gives hatred and the other does nothing?
"forcing" a chaplain to use the crozius, their iconic weapon and symbol of office gives them a more defined mechanical identity, there are now things a chaplain might not be able to do that another character can. Likewise with "forcing" a librarian to use a force weapon (their iconic weapons associated with the profession). It makes them feel more unique rather than as some sort of amorphous "the marine character" wearing different hats for one special rule or another.
3.0 currently goes too far, especially with some characters, limiting things like "what sort of combi weapon they can have" or "what pistol they have" or having zero wargear options at all, which is unnecessary and a tad sillly, but if toned down a bit (wider access to ranged weapons/auxiliary gear like boarding/combat shields, access to power weapons for some consuls) the system is good
>>96175787Those were shattered legion rules, not black shield. BS are just a set of zany rules you choose from like militia worlds.
>>96175473>205 points for a S6 AP3 D2 hellstorm template.
>>96176018Then the Emperor got a whiff of Erda, got pussywhipped and she shat everywhere and made some new femstodes right before she scattered the primarchs like a dumbass. Warhammer lore writers clearly understand that women are the root of all evil
>>96176027No, lust is the problem.
>>96175921>t. insane homosexual
>>96175747>>96175755>pictured: the average EC player who throws a shit fit whenever he sees another EC player wearing the same dress
This is going to turn into another tranny clone situation, isn't it?
>>96175921>everything autistically be crammed into the statlineAnon its basic reading, the answer is right there in an obvious way without needing to look up special rules or whatever. Thats the beauty of more expressive statlines, greater information clarity.
>>96176026>needing to stand still with a template weapongood luck with that
>>96175381Siege Squad is is an old Imperial Armour unit that was sold as a resin upgrade. Hammer and shield tartaros.
>>96176042Imagine the twinkdeath
Its a shame they decided to shoot themselves in foot with the options fiasco given the rules for the stuff that IS there is pretty well done so far. Damage is well implemented, weapons have good flexibility, new units/weapons (saturnine and disintigrators) are handled well, talons have fun rules. And none of it matters because they just had to fuck with peoples wargear.
>>96176058What does that give me over cataphractii since I assume it makes me heavy?
>>96176051Hellstorms are like, 16" long dude, take tank cohort.
>>96176064If there hadn't been leeks, there wouldn't have been a reason for people to be outraged. Day 1 errata and legacies rules next week would have immediately answered a lot of questions people had. Which now remained unanswered for weeks, because only the books got leaked early, and GW stuck to their release schedule for the digital rules documents.
>>96176073It may be a unique shield type that isn't heavy. If it is then you can Shieldwall! for T6 termis at least.
>>96176073The ability to take a full hammer shield squad?
Storm shields did not make units heavy that's boarding shields
>>96176084IF shields give heavy iirc, so its probably just for the shield reaction.
>>96176082There's till would have been outrage. All reviews talked about it last Saturday. The only thing leaks did was advance the timeline a few days. Thats it. I'd also bet money they added a few things to it last minute because of it.
>>96176082But there were leaks, and there were obviously going to be leaks. Its like saying "if only the fanbase were patient and calm about it things would have been fine", it requires a fantasy world. GW should have known what the reaction would be and communicated better. Maybe release a list of the legacy units beforehand during the roadmap stage, maybe communicate better with influencers, maybe just release that "yea btw legacies will fix it" article a couple days earlier. Or hell, maybe just be honest with people beforehand and explain "the libers are designed to be an introductory book which is focussed around readily available units, you will have things missing but dont worry those units and some of those options will return in the legacies pdf so that people with them can keep their old collection", maybe something else.
Blaming serendipity for the situation is silly.
>>96176043The Emperor invents trannies
>and you shall be named...MY EMPEROR'S CHILDREN!!!
>>96176022As far as I know, atavists were the groups of blackshields that noped out of the heresy and continued the grea lt crusade as if nothing was happening using the terran grey heraldry. That's not the same as the shattered legions.
>>96176140>Or hell, maybe just be honest with people beforehand and explain "the libers are designed to be an introductory book which is focussed around readily available unitsThey did. This was literally said in one of the interviews way before the leaks.
>>96176116Never mind, there always would have been outrage, because people are fucking stupid illiterate retards that refuse to read or listen before jumping to conclusions to shit themselves over.
canon
md5: 1cd69d12fc499f40f0c81d8ba5d3b071
๐
>>96175932Me when I kill Martin Luther King then try to kill the only black primarch
>>96176166>This was literally said in one of the interviews way before the leaks.Anon, im sorry but that kind of proves the point. I would consider myself as someone who keeps up with the news fairly well, I read the articles and stuff. I have no idea what interview you are talking about or what that statement was.
This sort of communication should have been in an article on their community website called "what to expect in the libers" or something, where it is stated in unambiguous terms and ideally in bold text. Relying on someone catching some specific interview is not ideal communication when you want to address a wider audience.
>>96176164you are a big guy
>>96176156Are you responding to the right person?
why are most hh players cocksucking fags who have sex with each other post-game
>>96176191Bro are you gonna tell me you dont suck the homies good night?
What are you a faggot?
>>96176166>fucking stupid illiterate retards that refuse to read or listenIt's on GW for not even hinting to reviewers what was in the PDF. Even then we don't know if a Master of Signals can take a fucking bolter yet. GW released a half baked edition and gave reviewers half the info they needed to make a full review.
>>96176191Space Marines are inherently gay.
>>96175762Based Irontards. I play Death Guard and this Auxilia player has taken it upon himself to be my nemesis despite getting his shit rocked every game.
>>96176082The leaks came out two days before the review embargo and 90% of the influencers mentioned the missing stuff in their first impression
>>96176209Knights can get one snotted by multi-meltas now. Have fun
So now that Aircraft can come from any board edge from turn 2 onwards, what are you bringing in your aircraft for drop missions?
>>96176222Aircraft do not belong in a 28mm wargame. They will be banned from my table
>>96176209For the amount of people who had the book this week I'm surprised we didn't get at least a photo dump
>>96176220A multi melta does 6 damage at melta range, so no, they cant.
>>96176230Can I see your table anon? I wanna make one and I need inspiration.
>>96176222Storm Eagles is was already in my list. Going to fill it with breachers and a Siege Breaker and dump them on an objective and see what happens.
>>96176180which of the primarchs are even white? lion is a jew, perty is greek, khan is mongol, angron is some kind of mediterranean, robert is italian, magnus is a freak, lorgar is levantine, and vulkan is black. So that leaves
>fulgrim>leman>dorn>conrad>sanguinius>ferrus>morty>horus>corax>alphariusand at least a few of those are probably not. I donโt know how to classify conrad, mort, or ferrus.
>>96176253Based, breachers marching out of a storm eagle sounds cool af.
What's the siege breaker for tho?
>>96176260Learn to fucking read
>>96176253storm eagles look so good. they even bring respectable dakka for when they come back on a strafing run
>>96176260No, 6. The melta RANGE is 8". The damage is 3x2, which is 6.
>>96176164Nice to know heโs getting sold solo at least and not with the other mk2 fella
>that big boxHas GW finally found out they can up charge their models even more by just making the packaging bigger and filling them up with air like how those potato chip companies pack their shit?
>>96176257Konrad and morty are races which do not exist yet.
>>96176260The retardation that people have been having with melta(X) is going to give me an aneurysm.
>>96176267It used to be 12" in previous editions. Why did they change it?
>>96176257>KonradHungarian
>MortarionScottish Highlander
>FerrusScottish lowlander, EXTREME autism
>>96176284Because you touch yourself at night
>>96176284Because they are retarded, anon. The rules writers are retarded, and 4.0 (coming in 2028) will be even worse.
>>96176257>>fulgrimswede
>russswede (the other kind)
>dornamerican
>conradglaswegian
>sanguiniusenglish
>ferrusenglish (coal miner)
>mortyslav
>horusamerican
>coraxamerican (trailer park)
>alphariusglobohomo (jewish)
any white scars players left since bikes cant score anymore? Idk what to do other than go with sagyar mazan and ebon keshig.
>>96176267>multimelta HSS pay 12 points for 2 inches of melta range over a melta TSS.People were doomposting over these BTW.
>>96176264Phosphex bombs. It's a Terran XIXth detachment so phosphex rapiers too.
>>96176266Yeah, I'm doing nose HB. The centerline missiles are also defensive. So both will snap on drop off. Then it will swing around and dump it's guided missiles.
>>96175133>Contemptor or Leviathan (ranged)?lets make a small list of what we've got in 3.0:
-WS4, BS4 (intead of 5),
Contemptor got +1A (4) and Leviathan has one less A (4),
Leviathan lost HoW but now has an option for a phosphex discharger (great at killing 1w marines + Panic(3)).
Both got smokescreen (a 5+ shrouded reaction).
They now share the same FoC role with two other shooty dreads that are better at shooting (and more expensive).
So far out of all conteptors weapons i can see two roles:
1. Blasting Marines on the objective 30' away (from FotL) with Plasma+Cbeamer and Havoc launcher with Stun.
2. Shooting at Marines on the objective with Combi Flamers (Panic), Combi Grav (Pinning), and a Havoc Launcher (Stun) from close rangeโprobably the most annoying for your opponent if statuses will be applied. Flamer has an 8' range, so maybe getting a Dreadnought Drop Pod to deny tacticals some remote objective might be a thing. You are getting five melee attacks with two Gravis Power fists.
3. Killing vehicles with A2 D2 twin lascannon in 48' and a Gravis melta, which has a relatively rare D4 in 24'. So if Melta and 1 out of 2 lascannon shots hit, it's -6 HP. In melta range (8) on the move, it can potentially pop up LR with one shot (5+).
Leviathans ehh..the only new thing they got is a limited (3) phosphex discharger with AP3 5+ breaching blast with panic (3), which isโฆa great weapon. All his (anti 3+/2+) weapons are close ranged, but with his meltalance gun and fist, he can potentially blast 4 models with D3 melta (apothecaries won't help), which potentially can bring some of his points back? With Kharybdis he can come out of reserves on turn 1, then fly to some expensive unit, kill it, and then on turn 3 he can get into Kharybdis again and be moved to some other point on the battlefield for the last 4th turn. I mean, that way he can maybe find himself two big targets to kill, but with Areal reserves, he may not return to the battlefield at all.
>>96176284They changed it because melta became way more effective at anything other than tanks.
>>96176284Because meltas are now oneshot machines when inside melta range, so melta range is a premium and multi-meltas, as a common and spammable weapon, were toned down (perhaps too hard) to ensure they dont become a problem.
>>96176284because it's significantly simpler to have to memorize several weapon profiles and their respective melta ranges, instead of just knowing their max range and halving that in your head /sneed
>>96176302Yeah because they thought they were going to be 2 shots
>>96176190Yes but I think I misread your post.
>>96176305>snap on drop offDoes stable not negate this
>>96176311>meltalanceisn't the range on that like 12" now
>>96176302Yes, because this was before we learned many things, like "melta only deals damage to vehicles", "twin linked is gone" "multi melta damage isnt higher than meltagun damage" "all the big melta weapons lost shots relative to before"
When you see a damage 3 (doubles to 6) meltagun the assumption that "the bigger melta weapons will be even stronger" is both natural and fairly safe. The fact that GW seems to have ended up with a mostly balanced and restrained specialist weapon class is remarkable and to their credit, but it is not the expected result.
Let's just check on Ebay - oh god
>>96176339It's going to be so easy to make a saturnine command squad, huh?
>>96176339What's your intent here?
>>96176296All the white scars players killed themselves
>>96176339I just spent all morning adding them all to my ebay sniper bot lol. I won't get most if them, but I only need 3.
>>96176339Those are bids with a lot of time left, they will probably end much higher than that. I tried to buy a saturnine praetor yesterday and it was like ยฃ30 for one.
>>96176346Not unless the prices drop or you get lucky.
>>96176257Maybe not the place but why are people genuinely so obsessed with race nowadays
>>96176355Because they are retarded.
>>96176339Cool, now show me the buy it now listings
>>96176166>They did. This was literally said in one of the interviews way before the leaks.The problem is that nobody cares. People don't want army books for any game to be this, they want them to be complete rules for an army. Also the idea that it is somehow beneficial to new players for rules to be incomplete and for full rules to require additional purchases or downloads is obviously bullshit, its at best confusing, because someone has to explain to the new person in question where the fuck the rules are and at worst deceptive because it hides the allegedly problematic complexity as well as the cost of obtaining rules.
Its bad, it helps nobody and no excuse they're making is valid.
>>96176361That would torpedo his shitpost
>>96176355us politics lunacy spreading or being intentionally spreadto the rest of the world
20 man tactical squads: Is there a reason to run them anymore?
In 2.0 having an apothecary with a big unit sitting on an objective was a fun staple, but with the new scoring and how apothecaries work now I feel like it's just not worth it. Any other takes?
>>96176355Left wing politics
>>96176355Proximity. Easy not to care about the mutant and the abhuman when you never encounter them, but if they're ever-present they're constantly on your mind.
>>96176370Sure there are, its still a bigger scoring unit, still doubles up on apothecary benefits/reactions and is still harder to shift.
But now a 10 man squad in a rhino is faster and more mobile which is better for rushing objectives.
>>96176257>angron is some kind of mediterranean, robert is italianSince when are those not white?
>>96176324NTA but RAW, yes if you shoot more than one gun. RAI 50/50. Combat Assignments imply there are rules that negate the need for snapshots when shooting WITH flyers. The only one I've found is Stable and Super Heavy; so it may be that Stable is supposed to. That makes Xiphons stay within an interceptor role by being not stable and Fire Raptors doing avenger strike missions more on point as they couldn't fire their side guns.
>>96176368I think you're right on the nose of it anon
>>96176370Be Wurr Burrurs, run multiple corrupted units at 20 man. Get pinned or something? Nah, just lost another couple dudes, still scoring that sweet sweet Line VP.
>>96176355Because the browner, the more inbred.
40k noise marines make good Kakophoni, no? They're much cheaper
>>96176339Is this a fucking picture for ants?
>>96176355Indians. Indians everywhere. 50% of internet users are Indian
>>96175452>but muh sistersit's the opposite, you'll get more in future
>That sixth Liber will arrive a little later โ and our spies tell us that big things are afoot for the faction as a whole โ but until then, thereโs a free set of faction rules to download.
>>96176370Apothecaries still get a reaction 4+ to change D1 a 0 and it lasts all phase. Then a 4+ to resist statuses by 2. I'd say if there was anywhere apothecaries liked to be with 1w models it would be a 20man tac squad. 20 mans also return fire as stationary to trigger Fury. 60 shots back at 24 is pretty spooky.
>>96176362This. Nobody cares why you made your product bad on purpose. They care that your product is bad and think you're a dickhead for doing it on purpose.
>>96176381Old school american racism would claim Italians were not white.
>>96176401Can you still fury on return fire or is it just active turn?
>>96176413Yeah but why? Under what logic? Do they consider white just germanic people? Why not say germanic at that point?
>>96176370Not really, getting to objectives fast is more useful so 2 units in rhinos would work better. It also protects you more from statuses since the enemy needs to do it to both of them.
Tho desu mixing good melee units and tacticals is probably more useful than 2 tactical squads
>>96176421Just be stationary and shoot
>>96176387Yeah, just do some minor kitbashing, but even then you don't have to do much considering that the EC were pretty much thoroughly chaosified by Isstvan V. The earliest legion to thoroughly embrace chaos aside from the Word Bearers, in fact.
So do shield captains beat praetors? or is it even? Because theyre about the same points cost as a terminator praetor with hammer.
>>96176422>Under what logic?Because the identifiably Italian were the southern Italians, who are like 50% arab and very obviously not white (as the northern Italians, who are, generally agree).
>>96176434>who are like 50% arabSince when? And how? They were invaded by osotrogoths, and fucking attilla, not arabs.
>>96176288>Scottish lowlander, EXTREME autismhad me a good chuckle
>>96175371>>96175969>If youโve not yet picked up Saturnine, itโs still available for pre-order here, alongside the Libers and loads of reinforcements for your Legions.>If youโve not yet secured your Saturnine box and your Libers, you can order them all here.>PLEASE BUY OUR SHIT PLEASE
>>96176222Veletaris vanguard is looking spicier by the day, specially since flare shields is a straight inv save now
>>96176324Iโm unclear on this. I think the intention is that they have to snap fire on the drop mission. Otherwise they might even be a little too good. Iโm okay with them having to wait a turn to full fire.
>>96176332Yep, his autocannon is A4 (+1 FP if stationary) D2 Breaching 5+, but I don't think Levi is going to bring his points back with it in 4 turns. With the Custodes PDF released, maybe he will be more useful with his D3 attacks (probably not though with their WS5).
>>96176222I have Xyphons but I don't know if they're worth it considering I have to roll every turn for them
>>96176222I'll get a storm eagle or fire raptor the femtosecond they release in plastic.
>>96175371Wtf the custodes weapons are actually looking pretty good. The Telemon too.
Adratic disintegrators with 2D ap2 and no overload? What's going on?
>>96176453Flare LAUNCHER not Flare SHIELD.
It means the Arvus can pay 5 points for a 5++ to maybe protect it from getting shit on by anti aircraft guns and immediately killing all its passengers.
>>96176355It was all just a joke I wanted to rule up DAfags, but it didnโt work, you win some you lose some
>>96175536A single new plastic kit for the sisters will double their range.
And then GW can say with an absolutely straight face that the sisters got a massive expansion.
>>96176381The real answer is that American racism is downstream of Anglican bigotry, which combined both race supremacy and anti-Catholicism into a very particular cocktail.
>>96176477it was obvious low qual bait when you called lion a jew, but not alpharius
>>96176481I mean another kit with 3 sets of weapons like thr current on would be a massive expansion.
>>96176459It's unclear for everyone. I hope it gets a FAQ.
>>96176464Xiphons really seem to be only good to counter other flyers. Their lascannons get D2 on a reaction due to counting as stationary. Probably why they got cheaper. They aren't terrible bullying dreads, rhinos, and termis.
>>96176489I think you mean a kit with 1 weapon and a kit with the other weapon(s)
>>96176462Leviathan looks fun with double drill and a phosphex shot. Threatens vehicles with immediate annihilation, and can steal an objective from any infantry unit that fails their leadership test at -3. If they donโt fail, it can charge the unit and stop any scoring while being immune to the S4 return attacks. Probably doesnโt kill its points back, but it has other uses.
>>96176475That is ok anon, even if it gets intercepted it is 1 less reaction point for the enemy. SA has the numeric advantage and the upper hand in the reaction economy.
>>96176488Iโll try to step up my bait game. Itโs been a rough day at work, and I needed a quick (you) hit
>>96176444Do you seriously expect him to know about my compatriots? He, who probably hasn't even left his country in the entirety of his life and at most must have learned about race and anthropology from le chinz?
>>96176494Do you know what the Interceptor rule does because I dont and its bugging me.
I ordered some saturnine terminators from a scalper. I had to. I have to know how they are, for real.
can someone post that deviantart comic about the world eaters captain fighting the word bearers?
>>96176501I don't doubt it, I want 3 Lighters at least for target saturation.
>>96176519>Buying a readily available product from a scalper>Not just waiting a little until saturnine are sold separatelyBloody hell how much of a retard are you. Do you also run out onto the street, wallet in hand, screaming "Somebody please rob me!"?
>>96176515Interceptor or Air Combat Patrol?
>>96176515I think interceptor is the keyword thatโs needed to use the reaction
>>96176527https://www.deviantart.com/blairscartoons/gallery/80797470/vengeful-sons-30k-comic
gotchu, senpai
>>96176547Man, this had so much soul. I hope the autist who made it is doing okay.
>>96176519I laugh everytime I see those because the prices just get up marked to shit for my country cause of postage fees and our shitty dollar. Nothing like spending $160 forโฆ.3 saturnine terminators. Truly a deal for the ages
>>96176529I think the SA fliers are looking good all in all, a lighting with the guided hellfires is a significant threat as coming from any table edge means that we can get some nice angles for side and rear armor
Now that flyers are quite good, both strike and transport, what anti-air platforms are you guys thinking about using? I have a regular sicaran and a missile launcher HSS, but I donโt know if thatโs going to be enough.
>>96176547>>96176553unironically i'm tempted to make a world eaters centurion based on this guy
this comic should always be welcomed here, unlike those heresy discord fags
>>96176553I remember when we first discovered the comic.
Several threads were derailed by it, and multiple anons were told to shut the fuck up, stop asking what's the best loadout for termies or whatever, and just watch the Torgax duel with the rest of us.
Absolute SOVL.
>>96176553>>96176577>>96176587https://www.deviantart.com/blairscartoons/gallery/85787366/30k-comics
he's currently working on another comic if you're interested
>>96176474Yeah going full gunstodes still isn't really an option but they gained quite a lot of range and volume of fire on their heaviest guns. Caladius and gunship Telemons seem quite fun.
>>96176587smartest character in the setting
>hmmm this demon skull iconography looks evil and suspicious
>>>>96176598Jokes on you I just did the math and all I need are 2 shield captains, 40 Sagittarum Guard, 6 aquilon terminators, and 2 contemptor achilluses for my dream custodes army, and I already have the aquilons and contemptors stuffed in my closet somewhere
Bros give it to me straight, no doom posting, not shill sucking.
This edition, is it cooked?
>>96176626I think so but who knows. I don't think GW will bounce back from this.
>>96176626I'll tell you tomorrow after my first game
>>96176626If 10th 40k managed to stick around this will do too.
>>96176626I dont know anon, I am happy with the options for my SA but my BA are completely gutted. Time will tell.
>>96176355It peaks with summer time in America.
I wish GW would stop this fucking "drip feed army books"
I cannot believe that it increases sales to lock people out of options for 2 years
>>96176626I like the core rules, I don't like the liber rules.
>>96176664Are you in the right thread? HH is getting all but one army books tomorrow, at the release date of the new edition.
>>96176651For me, the things i like from this edition
>SA rules>List building being a lot more open i can run fun shit agian>Blast rule changes>Vehicle rule changes>Pysker changes. What i hate
Basically every other fucking change they made.
>>96176676Every army is getting their unique book tomorrow?
>>96176626I hate to say it but I think it depends upon the dlcs. I actually like the core rules, I think they are better than whatโs in 1.0 or 2.0. The legion rules do make them distinct, especially when you start writing lists, because there are some combos you can do with each unique detachment that simply canโt be replicated as efficiently by other legions. BUT just because the legions are distinct doesnโt mean they have flavor, and without flavor thereโs no point to the meal. If the dlc give us flavor, then itโll be fine, even if it does mean gw gets to swindle an extra $20-40 from us.
>>96176626One game in, it's still fun as a game. It's options got fucked and GW sucks cock buuuuuut if you have mentally stable friends or playgroup you can just houserule options and such back in.
That said flyers, blasts, vehicles in general, and knights are actually interesting for what I've seen. Time will tell.
>>96176679All but Talons who are getting a model wave hence the delay.
>>96176430It's interesting that the Emperor's Children have such a rapid fall in the Heresy. Like you said, they're pretty much fully fledged chaos space marines for the most part by Isstvan V, whereas most of the other Legions had a slower fall (but were still basically CSM by the Siege of Terra). The only exceptions to that are the Word Bearers (who fully fell to chaos Pre-Heresy), the Death Guard (who were, with the exception of Typhon and his warrior lodge cronies, pretty anti-chaos until the shenanigans that happened during the fleet's trip to Terra), and the Night Lords and Iron Warriors (who only "fell to chaos" Post-Heresy, and even then remain mostly apathetic to the Chaos Gods 10,000 years later)
>>96176676They aren't getting everything tomorrow, part of the books will be split into legacies and the remaining things are going to be in the journals if they add them there instead of binning them.
Well I'll eat crow
Guess I'll keep my eye out for the TSons one
Exodus bros...
Vindicare is bs7
He is officially the best shot in the entire game at bs8.
Now if only he could gain Paragon of battle
>>96176546Awesome, that means the lightning can actually shoot down other aircraft with its lascannons, thanks anon.
nice
md5: 923c16180731a6c8369725c196f802fa
๐
>>96176709Another common Alpha Legion W
>>96176364>>96176348I'm not suggesting that those are the final prices, those listings are all clearly auctions. I'm drawing attention to the market dynamics. One seller is splitting more than ten boxes whilst retailers are running fire sales.
>>96176749First GW release? Every time they release a fomo/discount box ebay is flooded with the individual kits
>>96176749That seller is known to buy a retarded amount of boxes and start auctions dirt cheap though, I got my land Raiders and Spartans from him from the 2.0 starter box and mk3 box splits.
>>96176749There are always splits
Not everyone wants 50 models. Maybe they just want 10 tac, the dread and a praetor.
Why did auxilia get point changes? What amount of "play testing" (lol) have they done to justify it? Are they just throwing darts at a board of random point values?
>>96176722Note when you use your xiphon that it does not care what battlefield edge it comes in on. You can go for whatever armor facing you want.
which novel is the one where fulgrim gets raped by his sons
>>96176709plus exodus can move and shoot with his gun
that said, I really like the vindicare having 0 shots with heavy (FP), they could have made a rule where he just cant move and shoot with his gun but instead actively worked it into how shooting works
same with the custodes jetbike lances, 0 attacks but have impact (AM)
>>96176782conceivable that an older test version is what went to print. They certainly sent other typos and omissions to the printers.
>H8NTRhow does the captcha know me so well?
>>96176793I'm honestly annoyed they didn't do this more. Could have been used as a method of balancing powerful single shot weapons more commonly than one time on an assassins sniper rifle.
>>96176782Its almost certainly "shit we printed an old version of the rules, we meant to update it to the new value before release".
>>96176760OK, bear with me
>>96176766Ebay sellers are buying a retarded amount of boxes to split - whilst simultaneosly retailers have such low demand they're running HH product line fire sales. I.e., how low is final consumer demand? Is Heresy 3.0 actually cooked?
>>96176626My take is "No."
If everything is discounted, it'll sell and people will play. If nothing is discounted, people will still buy and play. There also seems to be a major geographic split, it's only the Eurozone that's seeing these huge discounts, not the USA.
>>96176829>Ebay sellers are buying a retarded amount of boxes to splitLooks pretty standard to me
>>96176835To be fair its because they can get the box at a lower price so they can afford to discount and still make up the cost. US has to deal with importing as well.
>>96176782I don't know why they made it cheaper but I'm not gonna complain. I was already considering bringing a few malcadors before GW made them 35 points cheaper.
Did the malcador defender make it into this edition or is it dead?
>>96176860who would ever design a tank without a 360 degree turn radius? It also looks like the gun can't depress or raise. What nitwit designed this?
>>96176868Dead currently, Might get a new model tho.
>>96176868It's dead, jim.
>>96176874FUCK, it was the best modeled malcador variant
Captcha AODR2, a new age of darkness is upon the hobby
>>96173109 (OP)Clearly not all of fulgrim's sons are perfectionists
>>96176871The first tank designers? Armour being more important than moving, if you deploy tank en masse
>>96176749Which retailers are running fire sales?
>>96176879Came with the coolest crew too imo. I really wish GW would have added the old militia/guard guys to the remakes as an option for militia players.
>>96176871The malcador looks like such a piece of shit because GW started off designing it as an outdated shitbox that the russ replaced.
Since the russ is such a shitty design accidentally the GW sculptors designing the malcador had to make an even worse design on purpose so people would look at the russ and go "it could be worse."
>>96176892>Which retailers are running fire sales?Only bogs currently, Wayland is selling the box and libers at 35% off last I checked.
>Disintegration weapon plastic sprues introduced
>LGS profits disintegrate
Does /hhg/ like pottery in their meta narrative?
>>96176903In an ideal world, the Leman Russ would look more sensible and the Malcador would be the current Russ design
>>96176874Thatโs sad. It was dead in 2.0 and I think itโs dead in 40k too though I havenโt checked recently. Is there a game that I can play it in?
Why do other FW games like Necromunda, Blood Bowl, and The Old World get their rulebooks published digitally even in the current year while The Horse Hearsay only gets rulebooks published physically from hereon?
>>96176892This was announced at 11pm a few days before the release date. Fuck everyone who is claiming that this is normal
>>96176932I think I remember the Old World epubs going on sale the day that the physical copies released rather than when they went up for pre order.
>>96176938I have been in teh hobby for almost 2 decades now and i have never fucking seen a new edition box being discounted that much BEFORE the thing actually releases.
>>96176938Wayland games started this. They had as many as 3000 units available for purchase on their site and were offering 35% off (probably to clear that massive inventory). Now everybody else has to price match or be undercut.
All these people with the Questoris book, and no dump or PDF...
GW just released the DLC mission (yes the exact same singular mission that's in the paid journal) for free
>>96176952Its probably because most of them were bought by "official" titan owners and if you wanna know the most snobby group of faggots in this hobby, its people who own official GW titans.
>>96176930there's always HH 1.0 and older editions of 40k anon
>>96176932Stupidity, last ed we got free pdfs as soon as GW released the rules digitally which was a bit after each book was released. Now in a spectacular display of idiocy they must have thought that by not releasing digital versions we wouldn't get our hands on free pdfs as fast as last time but without anything to wait for the opposite happened.
>>96176930Not really. I'm sorry man but as the other anon says you can only run him in older editions.
>>96176946It's simple, really.
>leaks destroy any hype that existed for the new release. In fact, the opposite occurs, with the community throwing a shitstorm online. Many pre-orders are cancelled>GW take a whole week to respond to this and by then it's too late, the community goodwill is gone>it gets so bad that previously well-respected content creators get outed as shillsHaving a massive PR nightmare BEFORE THE PRODUCT EVEN RELEASES tends to affect sales outlook
>>96176257Vulkan isnโt black in the sense that you think he is. He was on Nocturne and Iโm assuming the planet then turn his skin black. So we donโt really know what his original skin type looked like. Do I understand that correctly? Heโs not a nigger though
>>96176955Paypigs lose again
>>96176871Think of it more like a tank destroyer casemate/SPG. They don't have turrets and gives you a few advantages over a 360 turret:
Cheaper, faster, simpler to make
More room internally as you're not constrained by a turret ring
Casemate designs can usually support larger calibre guns than turreted designs of the same weight class.
Casemates can be more armored as the turret ring doesn't have to take the weight.
More room internally which means you can have multiple loaders/higher ROF.
>>96176949Pretty much. I think the owner posted in dakka dakka that they bought way too many boxes. He would have known it was a stupid idea if he new anything about HH just by looking at the contents of the box
>>96176982Oh no i know why its happening, im saying that in my almost 2 decades i have never see them do a discount like this, so the peopel who are saying "Oh this happens all the time," Bullshit it never fucking happens.
>>96176257You're retarded. Jaghatai Khan is a white boy living the dream
>>96176988He has an African accent in the audiobooks, anon. Though it is true, many Salamanders legionaries aren't ethnically black and are just turned charcoal black by their geneseed's unique reaction to nocturne
>>96176993>multiple loaderswhy would you have multiple loaders? How would that speed up the loading of a single barreled cannon? What, is one of the loaders loading the round while the other seals the hatch? That saves you, what, a second or two of reload time?
>>96176938I don't know about normal but I don't find it hugely surprising. I've heard that it's pretty common for retailers to order too much of non-40k Warhammer products. If this is just a function of third parties overestimating the level of consumer interest in a product, that sucks for them, but it's not remarkable.
>>96177003is the khan marco polo?
>>96176982It all started with their own "Hearesy" bullshit
>>96176932They want to funnel you into their app.
>>96177018>I've heard that it's pretty common for retailers to order too much of non-40k Warhammer productsAh yes, Dominion
>>96176982>forgot to mention that accurate leaks show a gutted units list and a massive rules overhaul, thus catching GW in its own lie"Muh Hype was ruined" is massive cope.
>>96177018You are smoking crack
>>96177028No? The hype was ruined BECAUSE of the gutted unit list and massive shitty rules overhaul. There's no coping here. I'm just disappointed someone didn't murder Kevin Rountree during the week when the outrage was loudest
>>96176903The Malcador is also a schizotech abomination made by the Terran Technobarbarians and co opted by the Emperor during the thunder warrior days.
The reason its so shit in universe is because its a mad max cludge job made by people who had forgotten what real tanks looked like, the big E didn't give a shit about the army after he got his marines so they had to sit with the shitbox while everyone else got predators, also its engines were DAOT wonders but no one knew how they worked well enough to move them to a different body.
Its only during the late crusade when the Imperium got too big for space marines to efficiently protect that the army started getting better stuff. This is when tanks like the Russ start showing up.
Then after the Heresy and the second founding happened the imperial army had to massively expand and update its equipment so they could act as the imperiums first line of defence while the astartes were relegated to special forces roles. The Malcador was relegated to a reserve tank or left to the PDF after that.
Despite its faults tho I do like the Malcador. Its a great callback to that early period of IRL tank design when no one knew what the fuck they were doing and we got a lot of great silhouettes out of it.
>>96175552They changed the gun lmao
>>96177024HH community: "man, hh 2.0 really needs a big faq to fix the issues"
GW: "lol, lmao, after years of silence we're gonna be coy and then announce an entirely new edition you never asked for"
The HH community reacted with cautious optimism at best at first, while 40kiddies were ironically the most hyped for the release because they sperg out and soiface at any new edition for anything because "OOOOO SHINY" syndrome
>be GW
>Completely change how decades old core rules function, much to the annoyance of players
>Finally find an interesting way to work the new way the heavy core rule works now into the vindicare assassin
>FFW 2 hours
>Be GW
>Go back and change vindicare datasheet to no longer have that interesting heavy interaction
I hate these faggots like you wouldn't believe, the one cool thing they did and they fucked it up
>>96177040I donโt see why they would have to. standing still to shoot was perfectly fine.
>>96176955They've essentially announced that you should never pay for a journal? On the very first journal?
>>96177054Would the ordinance set AP to 2? Not sure how it works
>>96176988Vulkans a posthuman monster born 28k years into the future, he's not ethnically anything except "primarch."
Honestly all modern day races have probably branched off thousands of times at this point, humanity has actual subspecies again in 40k thats how wild things have gotten.
>>96177052>>96177040>ordnance (Ap)Does Ordnance have a special interaction with Ap? Cuz as far as I know twice 0 is still 0
>>96177034>there was hype about rules being put on a 3 year cyclePeople were on the defense before the rules were even leaked. GW then promises of "no major rules changes/overhauls" came out; and then the leaks proved that wrong.
Any hype was for the models themselves, nothing towards a new game addition this soon.
>>96177052Blame
>>96175552, some rules designer who shills here probably saw that retard's post and impulsively changed it
>>96177040>>96177052How the fuck does Ordinance AP even work if its a -?
>>96177040Did they make him more expensive too? Could have sworn he was 140p before
>>96177064Yes, ordnance(AP) is AP2, while Heavy(AP) is Ap-1 from what it was before
>>96177078I thought ordinance doubled the value? So how does it work if AP is 0?
>>96177052Wait Ordnance doubles a stat. Zero can't be doubled. Now let's say it does work based a linear scale as intended. That means heavy improves the AP by one to go from "-" to "6" and doubled the effect with Ordnance. That means it's AP5.
>>96177017Most tanks with decent sized guns had 2 loaders pre-1950s. Some guns had ammunition in 2 pieces (shell and bag, or canister), or even multiple bags depending on what ammo you were loading (HE doesn't tolerate high velocity so you use less charge). Also helps with fatigue and keeping up a ROF. You probably don't realise that 1-2 seconds is actually a pretty big difference when it comes to loading. It varies from crew to crew but that's anywhere from a 20% to a 50% faster reload.
>>96177074>>96177071>>96177064NONE of this shit is playtested. It's grade A slop. Woe to anyone with any confidence in the upcoming Legacies PDF
>>96177064Yeah thats exactly how it works, ordinance (AP) is AP2 when still, all other kinda of ordinance double whatever characteristic they're modifying when still instead.
>>96177092You say that like they actually playtest the thing in the proper books
>>96177099Thank you anon.
>>96177099That works but it's still pretty stupid that the gun looses all penetration from moving.
It was perfectly fine before
I hope the game survives long enough for plastic carnodon and aurox kits.
>>96177109>It was perfectly fine beforeIt was, but retards who cant read got confused by the FP:0
DESU this is killing my expectations.
If GW is LITERALLY fixing shit on the fly like this, bro...
>>96177074>>96177067Ordnance(AP) just sets the AP to 2, matter what it originally was.
>>96177117They are in this very thread and making changes based on people not getting basic concepts of the rules like Heavy (FP)
>>96176164The sprue for the guy is massive lmao. Reminder both of his primarch sized weapons have to fit on there
>>96177116Itโs also because GW canโt balance the damn rifle. Every other sniper can basically sprint around and dome you, while the best sniper the galaxy canโt move 1โ to get a better shot. This update is also stupid.
>>96177052they have some pajeetern working overtime on a friday to try and save their game
godsneed
I still don't know why they made the Earthshaker just a cheaper, longer ranged, significantly less effective Medusa.
A better thing to do would have been to make the Earthshaker a status machine while making the Medusa keep its niche as a more damaging weapon.
>>96176903What's wrong about the leman russ?
>>96177135>Every other sniper can basically sprint around and dome youSee that heavy there? It means they cant,
Every other sniper, just like the vindicare, relies on standing still to be effective. The rules make more sense when you read them.
>>96177049>while 40kiddies were ironically the most hyped for the release because they sperg out and soiface at any new edition for anything because "OOOOO SHINY" syndromeIn my case it's because 40k fucking sucks now and HH at its worst is still a substantial improvement over 10th.
>>96177142The sci-fi tank in the โHistoricals in spaceโ faction isnโt perfect modern vehicle, and was designed to look cool more than make sense. Peoples tank autism goes nuts over it.
>>96177099Still doesn't work RAW. The value of the gun isn't "AP" , the value is "-".
>>96177099Can't wait for them to overhaul the rules again in 3 more years because "lol we felt like it fuck you"
>>96177154He can shoot, hit, do 1 damage at AP:2, and pin while moving. He improves when he stays still. The Vindicare just doesnโt get to play when he moves.
>>96177163The value of ORDNANCE is AP. The AP of the gun is -.
>>96177052What was it before?
>>96177126>They are in this very threadMr. Workshop, if you're really here, I have a three day smo. Join me.
>>96177177The vindicare can move, shoot and deal four damage at Ap-
>>96177154>>96177052>FP1>D1/2What's that supposed to kill? Characters have 3+ wounds.
>>96177070How do we stop the 3 year cycle? Boycotts? Social media bitching? Fucking protesting outside of Warhammer World?
>>96177040They could have literally just airlifted the "Move or fire" rule from WFB and it would have worked perfectly.
>>96177189If you dont understand how their damage values go higher you dont know the rules well enough to talk about them.
>>96177189GW will never get snipers right. If everyone can have them then no solo dude is allowed to one shot a character.
>>96177193We can't but basically every community of each of their games already hates the 3 year cycle so they must know buy now.
>>96177186Now before he was move or shoot. And AP: - makes him worthless against anything thatโs not Aux or Militia unless he stays still.
So, how far are we from full scale leaks of all the new books? I'm not paying a dime for shit that needs a zero day patch.
>>96177198I'm asking because I don't get it. Does precision increase damage somehow?
>overhaul system that has worked well FOR OVER 3 DECADES (the 3rd ed 40k system HH ultimately traces itself back to came out in 1998)
>replace with SLOP
why? Why do they do this to our favorite game systems??
>>96177193During battle reports, commenting on temporary, sharing photos, etc throwing an extra line of "I'm not going to play 4th edition if it's within the next 10-12 years" or something like that. Channels and big events would have to collectively say the won't move to 4e if it's a 3 years cycle with comments and posts by the regular folks doubling down on it.
>>96177142Just go look up the billions of threads in the archive. People have had this conversation for almost 20 years on here alone and it doesn't help that over the years the fluff for russes has changed from them being mass produced and being as simple as it can get to make them in the hundreds of millions and to avoid, then modern, countermeasures like iff spoofing into being equipped with modern shit like IR, cameras, etc. Two things that will never change are the lack of suspensions and the height.
>>96177142Aesthetically? Nothing its a gorgeous machine.
But if we were analysing its design it has a few problems, the biggest one of these IMO is that its too fucking tall.
A shorter tank or tank destroyer with better barrel depression would be able to spot it fairly easily and in tank fights being seen first can prove decisive. Thats why modern tanks go wide instead of tall. Well one of the reasons at least.
>>96177205>basically every community of each of their games already hates the 3 year cycleDo they? Then why do they keep doing it??
>>96177180FP 0 so you couldn't shoot and move somewhat like the old heavy rules.
>>96177193The reason they do it is because usually the big launch boxes sell like crazy so if saturnine really has flopped then there's a chance they'll rethink the edition cycle.
>>96176938It all comes tumbling down
Tumbling down
Tumbling down
>>96177217That's 2 decades anon. But almost 3, yes.
>>96177212Critical strikes increase damage. Shred (which the vindicare assassin can get) also increases damage (this stacks).
Having a very high balistic skill gives innate critical hit chance when shooting.
The vindicare, vigilator and exodus all have BS7+, so they crit on 5s (4s for exodus). This raises their damage. Exodus and the vigilator also have heavy(D), which boosts their damage if they stand still. These elements combine to give all of them damage 3 if they crit (the vindicare can even go to damage 4), which is enough to one-shot centurions.
>>96177230Because there's only been 3 cycles and people got tired at the start of this one when the entire cycle was already prepared so they can't just not release all the shit they made in advance. GW operates at least 3 years in advance so any changes will take a while to show up.
>>96177217>why? Why do they do this to our favorite game systems??because it worked well for decades, and hh's popularity proved that it still holds up, and it's an even better system that their flagship games, which is simply unacceptable
if 40k and aos can't be better than 30k, they will enshittify 30k to be worse, just so they don't have to consider that maybe 3rd-7th editions were better than 8th-current
>>96175051>>96174960I used to get 4 in a 2k pts game, and didn't need to buy specific units for more, or spend one of them on smoke bombs
>>96175068>MotL doesn't stackOMG then what's the point of Special Assignment? Buy an extra praetor but he doesn't give an extra reaction and doesn't give an extra apex either - then why the fuck do you want one?! It is NOT for melee; a Champion could be better *and* he does unlock a valuable apex-like detachment
>>96177234AND WE'LL BE STUCK WITH 3.0 FOREVER??? THEY WON'T JUST CHANGE IT BACK TO 2.0???
WE'RE STUCK WITH THIS SLOP????
>>96177223#noeditionchurn #evergreen30k and stick with it. But YouTubers won't because they don't care enough.
>>96177252Yes anon, welcome to hell.
>>96177207the Vindicare fails to kill a fucking troop master half the time when he moves, its just worthless period.
>>96177260Youtubers have no incentive other than "creed" to stick to it. Meanwhile gargling GW's balls means that, maybe, one day they will be sent a 50 dollar box for free before being forgotten.
>>96177252No, enough people have to stick together to settle on a suite of common changes. Epic is still popular.
>>96177252I like 3.0 more than 2.0 because I don't play space marines.
1.0 is still peak tho.
>>96177217Robin Cruddace's ego can't accept that something designed by Andy Chambers and improved by Alan Bligh is better than the slop he writes, so he had to get his dorito-dusted fingers on Horus Heresy so he could bring it down to 40k's level.
This man has set back game design by at least 30 years
It's funny because 3rd 40k and 6th WHFB, arguably the best period of GW had both editions last a lot longer than usual (6 years) and outside of GW you have 5e pushing 11 years while being the best selling ttrpg ever. Stability sells in the long term.
>>96177249>OMG then what's the point of Special Assignment?You can take a high command special character alongside your custom praetor.
>>96177273Have you tried standing still then.
>>96177189>Bs7 so he crits on 5+>Can choose to take shred (5+)On a 5+ to hit he auto wounds at damage 4 and failing that he can go to 3 damage on a 5+ to wound
>>96177252Dude, this the reaction us 1.0 players had when 2.0 dropped.
If anything we should collectively retvrn to 1.0. Praise Alan!
>>96177284Ward was better than this. At least armies were fun when he wrote them.
If he was lead designer every army would have been fun. He has brought low by the mediocrity that surrounded him.
>>96177234But why not just do mid-edition refreshes or some shit?
>>96177299>Return to the edition where whoever could throw the most pie plates at the other wins
>>96177217Because you could get the HH 1.0 rules and run any old 40k codex. GW fucking despises things like this so once FW lost any influence they prepared, using 2.0 as a stepping stone, to make something incompatible with 3rd ed-style 40k books. I'm not insane it's all there in the dead sea scrolls and GW keeps a black midget in their basement that wrote the 3.0 rules. Not the midget, the basement did.
>>96177252Actually we aren't. In 3 years they'll come out with some even worse shit.
>>96177302We held up Ward as the Archenemy, when our true foe was hiding in his shadow. The fifth Chaos God, Cruddace.
>>96177294He does work standing still, I was speaking specifically about a moving Vindi being worthless in all circumstances.
That said in a 4 turn game hes shooting 4 bullets total. Being useless for 25% of the game is not a great look.
>>96177327You kill one centurion and hes basically made his points back. Plus he can two-tap a primarch since he ignores eternal warrior.
>>96177067>>96177074>>96177086The new edition may be dogshit, but you are all retarded. Ordnance (AP) sets it to 2.
>>96177312>Because you could get the HH 1.0 rules and run any old 40k codexHoly shit, you're right.
>assassin unlocking prime benefit only gives 3 slots for assassins
>I am still denied my execution force
Sasuga, GW
>>96177334lets hear your logic/reasoning anon
>>96177332>he ignores eternal warrior.Changed my mind, all hail sniper man, Bringing one in all my Aux lists.
>>96177286>Stability sells in the long termRight, Bolt Action and Battletech also proved this, but GW bigwigs are too focused on short term gains to release that they'd probably be making more money if they made one good long term ruleset and released a new boxed set for that same ruleset every 3 years than making a bunch of bad short term rulesets in the hopes that it will help them sell boxed sets.
The idiots are too retarded to realize that the main reason their box sets sell is models, not rules, and that by making a well-crafted and well-supported long term ruleset it would bring more players into the game in the long term since you'd have more people getting into the game for its own sake
>>96177312>run any old 40k codexHoly fuck I did not think of that. We could have a great crusade edition.
>>96177334>BRO YOU ARE SO RETARDED BY NOT KNOWING A RULE THAT IS NOT EVEN OFFICIALLY OUT YET!
>>96177364NTA, but as someone who actually tried this back in 7th no you can't. HH armies were way too overpowered and basically only Eldar and Daemons spamming psychic bullshit had a chance. And that was before inferno!
>>96173109 (OP)>Pre order still hasnโt been shipped from Wayland>Release is tomorrowSo shit, why do companies not ship FOR release day?
>>96177386why are you discussing the rules if you havenโt read them yet? do the reading before you show up to book club.
>>96177386yes anon, the rulebook leaked a week+ ago, if you are talking about the rules you really should know them.
>>96177394>>96177364Can confrim, you need to do some heavy tweaking in order to get it to work, mostly you need to do large point drops on 7th ed codexes for them to work. Thats the starting point.
>>96177394Right, which is why AU30k made fan xenos codices to play against 1.0 legions...until GW took down AU30K a year or two before 2.0 dropped...
>>96176838Okay lets try this again nice and slow and easy. If the ebay sellers are buying a lot of boxes like they always do AND the retailers - who they buy those boxes for - are still struggling to shift boxes to the point they're offering almost double the normal discount for non-FOMO products *during the preorder period*, what is the implication? Yes well done! That even fewer actual ordinary hobbyists are buying boxes from those retailers than the discount panic would imply.
>>96177359Precisely. Hopefully they course correct but who the fuck knows.
>>96177408*buy those boxes from, ffs
>>96177352Not inherently. He CAN.
So he can crit for 3 damage ignoring EW, for killing custodes, sigismund, DG centurions with the prime benefit and taking chunks out of primarchs. Or he can crit for 4 damage with shred, which is more overall but can be reduced vs some targets. Or he can take shock to go stun tanks.
>>96177395I be toy they never had those 3000 alleged copies, theyโre just attacking their competition. They can promise 35% off, make sales, force competitors to sell as 35% off incurring a loss, buy from those competitors, and use those purchases to fulfill the original orders they didnโt actually have stocked.
>>96177405Another group did the same thing for 2.0 for Orks and some of it works, but some of it was fucking busted to all hell and back, to the point that who ever made it clearly was favoriting the Orks
Like they had Ork Meka nobs that for 5 of them, it was like less then 250 points and it was a profile of T4, W3, Sv2, 5+++, Battle hardened, 2 killa saws which were just TH, like 3 attacks a piece, a banner that gave them rage and counter strike.
Oh and WS 5.
They were fucking busted.
>>96177309Because they are focused on short term profits over long term profits, and in their view they apparently seem to think having every big boxed starter set come with a brand new overhauled edition of the game helps those boxed sets sell slightly better
>>96177419>who ever made it clearly was favoriting the OrksGOOD. An Ork Warlord during the GC nearly killed the fucking Emperor, I should be AFRAID of orks. They shouldn't be chaff
>>96177416okay this kind of rocks. nowhere near as good as a unit of seekers, but itโs still very cool
>>96177386Maybe don't complain about how a rule works if you haven't read the fucking rule
>>96177419This is because fanfiction writers invariably have their head up their ass. They want to write the specialest rules and they want to write the best rules, the rules are their baby and they will take a knife to themselves before they start cutting things from the rules. Restraint is a fucking lost art.
>>96176892Wayland & Darksphere are both at 35% on Saturnine and Darksphere pushed it to 30% on HH generally. Alchemists Workshop are doing 30% on Saturnine. All of them did this in a rush in the last few days, implying they're hugely overstocked relative to demand, and these are three of the biggest UK etailers, big enough to also have physical locations.
>>96177430Right but im not talking about a ork warlord im talking about fucking Meka nobs which were Terminator equivalents mogging literally EVERYTHING in the game short of a leviathen dread, and the cost less then a basic bitch Terminator squad with TH.
They were insanely broken. Like custode levels of broken.
>>96177432I dont know which is better for sniping characters, but yea, the vindicare is a very cool dude. Even after they messed up his rifle (it was so cool before!). Its a neat way to have a sniper who can actually threaten the main characters of the setting/game without ending up with a gun that just deletes everything in its path. The culexus also has a sword that can ignore ALL saves (like it used to)
>>96177434One of the dumbest parts of it was for like i think 20 points?
You could get a boss pole which gave them Rage and fearless i think.
>>96177441No surprisingly it was not pano, they eventually updated it and nerfed them, along with Killa cans which were basically on par with Contemptors but only cost like 120 points.
>>96177447>You could get a boss pole which gave them Rage and fearless i think.No you see its balanced because custodes could do well against them in close combat!
>>96177335>>96177360>>96177364It's also the same reason behind the different proportions on new marines (increased height, smaller hands and heads) of the marines, it helps cement GW's grip on the market which has partly been eroded by 3rd party stuff. Just the same way core rules were available and allowed people to play with older codexes (with tweaks if you wanted to play against 30k armies as the other anons were saying) which meant you could get the main rules from FW which were new and non-finite(FW could just print more) and second hand codexes from ebay for cheap(because only the new edition exists according to the modern GW consumer). It is control from top to bottom. The midget's name's Jeremy.
Ok but the model has a 4+/4++. What am I missing?
>>96177443Seekers are broken because precision shots still wound against majority toughness and nothing except an apothecary can deduct damage from 1 to 0. So a single seeker squad with 20 shots against a primarch in a T4 command squad will take 2.5 damage per turn.
>20 shots>10 precision hits>5 breaches>2.5 failed 4++
>>96177178What is 2x0 anon?
>>96177465Read the rules retard
>>96177099
>>96177457Here you go, i found it, this is the "nerfed" version
Killa saws x2 2ap, armor bane, shred, unweildly
Waaahh banner gave fearless and rage 2 AND it gave line.
Mega armor gave a 5+++ (Nerfed to 6+++).
They were fucking stupid
>>96175371They don't score but an ally contingent of them seems useful. I will dust off my aquilon.
>>96177486Yea, thats about the sort of garbage you would expect from people writing fanfic rules. More! More! More rules, more options, more weapons, drop those costs! But its balanced because theyre only BS2!
>>96177504Yeah it was not fun OH and here is the best part of it, they had a RoW, because of course they did, where you could DS like 3 units of them.
Which sucsk because like a lot of the other stuff in there was pretty fun to deal with.
>>96177510They had several rites of war I believe, because of course they did, rites of war are flashy and fun and clearly those rules need more buffs!
>>96177310This is such a bullshit argument when we all know itโs easily house ruled.
>>96177518Yeah it was not fun, the only way to really fight that list was to bubble wrap yourself in a corner because you knew it was coming, and then just light them the fuck up, but if you did not have a HSS to do that, or dreads ready to fuck on them, it was so awful.
>>96177460It's like a worse version of Bitcoin
>>96177418Yeah sure James. It's not a flop, one of the biggest retailers in the UK is just engaged in a 1000 layers of folded steel-tier scheme to buy boxes from their competitors for significantly more money than they could have bought them from GW...
>>96177460Wouldn't "reduce" make the AP better? If you reduce AP6 by two, it becomes AP4. 6-2=4.
>>96177418Woah 4d chess! Trust the plan guys
>>96177463Speaking of majority toughness and precision. What are all the ways to protect your primarch/high command from seekers so you donโt give up easy points every game? So far I can think of
>deathwing companions (no precision)>Shield trait terminators (T6)>saturnine terminators (T6)>iron circle (T7)>AL reaction (precision 6+ only)>be in a transport (no precision)is that everything?
>>96177418>I be toy they never had those 3000 alleged copies, theyโre just attacking their competitionIm pretty fucking sure this is HIGHLY illegal
>>96177547There's a section that clarifies worsening and improving that uses AP as an example. It works like how it sounds. Also still 4+/4++ so it doesn't care about AP at all.
>>96177476Nah, knowing I made you sperg is much more fun than trying to parse ChatGWPT's shitty writing.
>>96177418This is unreal cope
>>96177547Anon please download the rulebook in the OP. They literally put in a long paragraph about modifying AP that no one needed except for you apparently.
>>96177553yea, thats about it, regular terminators are also just t5 so that helps.
>>96177543More or less likely than them having 3000 boxes in inventory? Most retail stores get a handful. GW wants people burying from the webstore because theyโre huge cunts to FLGSs.
>>96177558good thing nobody commits crimes, definitely not a store run by a convicted pedophile
>>96176791The Reflection Crack'd
and it wasn't rape
litter.catbox.moe/1ckcnpz6yhblkupg.epub
>>96177287I want a Praetor because he gives me +1 Reaction and an Apex detachment. If I didn't want those I'd just take a Champion and give him Paragon for WS7
>>96177567>write rules so that by RAW it works differently from RAI>but somehow it's your faultThen again, GW thinks math is an opinion, so I'm not surprised.
>>96174097Most IW material is written by unironic IF fanboys and it really shows.
>>96176734The legion for WAACfags keeps on winning!
>>96177528How would you house rule them? Itโs an arms race, if you donโt bring the same amount of them to a game as your opponent youโre just fucked.
>>96177587So weird that Lucius, Fabius, and Julius never got so much as a nod in Siege of Terra.
>>96177460Re download the PDF, they changed it to -1d (min 1) which is just eternal warrior, but whatever at least it does something
>>96177604Sorry itโs black library, EC are there to be humiliated by real characters not have plot relevance.
>>96177609what the f u c k is this pdf
>>96177364https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1Z0WDs7_EvOhzauO3AwDHUlyQZu518XXk?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTAAYnJpZBExWFU4WDJkOGFxNDdraUhIbgEeAYiBY700AdcMB4Ia9cogdJQZklgLVwf6yeC1MsSABFe-g03iaHc2tnYFsjM_aem__ioFEyNG3rAKOk4aaGmmHQ
The eldar one is supposedly broken (what a shock) but you can still have fun.
>>96177593That is literally the opposite of what rules as intended means.
>>96177621They did the same thing in 9th 40k where they accidentally released the 0.9 beta PDF instead of the 1.0 release
>>96177486This layout is perfect why the fuck did they move around stuff for the 3.0 one?
>>96177630I mean it was fan made, 3.0 is something of an abomination.
>>96177208full rulebook and most of LAs in gofile, SA rules in gofile, mechanicum rules in one of imgur albums most of it but not full, there are some questoris pages. gofile in OP
>>96177630Cuz they had to shoehorn in another 4 stats at the top
>>96177634That's the same layout 7th and both 1.0 and 2.0 used. 3.0 is basically the same but with some stuff moved around for no reason that makes it harder to look at. That's what I don't get.
>>96177641Because they can show this to the suits and say "and here is another improvement from the previous editions".
>>96177625Thanks a ton. Would you say that for these armies (eldar in particular) that increasing the points would even them out a bit?
Misericordia users be like
>>96177670If there's ever a rule that do not make any sense it's this one.
>>96177667I have not played with these books, just repeating what I've heard.
>>96177640The statline isn't what has moved around.
>>96177697The statline needs to be much wider so they divided the options into 2 columns to not have half the page be dotted lines
>>96177688Silly is a Culexus' Etherium reduces Damage by one down to a minimum of one. Meaning they die to bolters all the same.
Isn't it basically Eternal Warrior 1?
>>96177688Also Sagittarum are stuck waiting to win a combat to shank you.
>>96177752It's literally EW 1
>>96177704That doesn't need moving the unit composition on top where it's hard to see horizontaly.
>>96176809>Hater>HunterWtf is this even supposed to spell?
>>96175756>Custodes seem fun and fluffy enough, theyre obviously not meant to sit there and hold objectivesCustards were literally designed to sit there and hold one(1)[singular] objective. (they failed)
>>96177821To be fair they held the webway like a motherfucker.
Where are the knight paradigms?
/hhg/ I come to you in a time of peril. I am stuck in a perpetual cycle of trying and failing to come up with ideas for a new army for 2.0. Anyone got any fun ideas for Blackshield warbands or unusual takes on Loyalist legions. I'm open to(and if anything prefer) stuff that requires heavy conversions.
>>961776296 Billion dollars company btw
>>96177865go back to the threads when the leaks started and look at all the people posting armies that are illegal now in 3.0
>>96177486Hmm, how would you port orks into 3.0 without making them completely fucking horrible to play against?
Like for mega armour specifically, ok M4 because orks are slow as fuck and Mega armour makes them even slower. WS4 because Nobz aren't tremendously more skilled than boyz, just stronger and tougher, BS2 can stay as is because its proppa Orky.
Then for the physical stats, a regular ork would be what, S4 T4? A nob would be S5 T4 with 2 wounds, so mega armoured Nobz should be S5 T5 with 3 wounds.
I3 is fine, 3 attacks is fine, mental stats should be pretty fun. Orkz should have lower leadership and intelligence but higher cool and willpower compared to contemporaries in other armies with mob rule patching up their leadership.
LD7, CL9, WP8 IN6 sounds about right for nobz, mega armour would be heavy for that extra +1 CL for an effective 10CL, MANZ probably shouldn't care about suppressing fire or pinning sniper shots, if anything it would get them excited.
SAV2+, no invulnerable save.
Power Claws are just power fists, same statline. Nobz are allowed to hit like lascannons in melee.
No twin linked anymore so just 2 shootas glued together, 6 shots at S4 AP- D1 with assault. Rokkits would just be a Hunter killer, skorchas are a heavy flamer. Both limited 1 naturally.
Killsaws would be reaping blow (1) power swords, paired killsaws get +1 attacks and reaping blow (2)
Boss nob can buy a Cybork body for EW(1) and a boss pole for +1 LD.
Bulky 3, Impact (A), Feel No Pain (5+) jobs good.
Points would be what, 50 points per model? Heavy assault choice, free melee weapon swap, 5 points for an extra saw, 5 point kombi rokkit, 10 point kombi skorcha
>Custodes don't have axes
>vexilla replaces melee weapons
Genuinely what the hell is this? Not even a matter of box loadouts only, box loadouts are illegal too.
>>96177867No amount of stock value will prevent the underpaid web manager from making a human mistake.
>>96177891Honestly with the shake up to 3.0 profiles in generalโฆ.good luck. The current profiles are made for 1.0 and 2.0. If you can make it happen I commend you. But trying to get the right numbers would take months of consistent play testing while keeping fluff in mind.
>>96177903James started his crack habit when writing. Sorry!
>>96177359Hell, if they even took a moment to consider, they'd notice they have 5 core games (40k, AoS, LotR, TOW, HH.) They can already run a ten year cycle and be releasing a new edition every other year. On off years they can cycle a specialist game and do a tie-in with the core game it's related to.
This gives players stability, reduces pressure on design/production/painting, and promotes a steady, long-term consumption model for the customer-base.
>>96177591Thats cool and all, but some people want to take characters they like, or to ally in sigismund into their BA force or whatever. Special Assignment is not mechanically optional, its not supposed to be, its there to enable suboptimal play for the sake of "I want to use my action figures"
>>96177891Would give them low LD and cool and make those based on unit size. WP would be mid to high and int would be low
>>96177891Everything but FnP seems fine. Perhaps as a reaction for models with Mega Armor keyword.
Aww it is a pity that they addressed Test the Foe's confusion, yet Guard Up remains pointless :(
>>96177911when you make 6B you can pay enough and multiply staff and still make 6B.
How james coom taste, faggot ?
>>96177891FNP seems excessive, and I feel like orks as an undisciplined and not particularly "Mentally resillient" species should have a naturally low cool. Orks are actually fairly cowardly considering, hence mob rule. Big mobs are hard to affect, but on their own orks are far brave than their equivalents elsewhere.
>>96177891>Killsaws would be reaping blow (1) power swordskillsaws are chainfist equivalents
>Rokkits would just be a Hunter killerNormak krak missile works better imo
Orks in general should probably have the malefic rule for mobrule, they don't run away but the nob bashes them. Only if there's a nob in the unit
>>96177598Iron warrior players are professional victims
>>96175371Sisters of Silence have no interaction with psychers aside from hatred?
I get that Fear messes up the stats but that just feels lazy. They are as effective at scaring anyone else
>>96177967NTA but Mob Rule would have to be well done or it will be orks suffering from a status every turn or effectively immune. Something more than just flat modifier for models in a squad. Maybe start at Ld5 Cl5 and +1 for every 5 models in the unit beyond the first, then +1 for every ork unit within 12" and LoS that also has mob rule. Two mobs of 20 next to each other would be 9 for example. Taking one out and wounding the other would have consequences.
Just spit balling. Might not be the answer just thought with theme first.
>>96177959You don't make 6B by paying enough.
What are peoples thoughts on legions imperialis?
And which of the factions/legion are your favorite for it ?
>>96178018Lovely rules and minis, not enough players
>>96177959Also how is saying they unerpay their web managers is loving james cum you idiot?
>>96177943>>96177967You're probably right on the FNP honestly, being W3 alone is already a considerable durability buff since most things that you use against terminators are D2 so they take twice as many swings to kill on average.
As for the High Cool. Orks in my mind are fairly cowardly so they have human tier leadership and are about as likely to rout as equivalent humans are if they think they're losing a fight. But since Orkz willingly strap themselves to single use rockets, swing missiles on poles as melee weapons and only ever bother landing by crashlanding I honestly think they'd have a high Cool score simply because theyre too stupid to realise they should look for cover when a snipers shooting them.
>>96178018Fun but an entirely new game. Just don't have the time or space.
>>96178018The legions might as well all be the same. The difference in rules for them (outside of a couple that are either OP or do nothing) is so slight it's laughable.
How degenerate were some of the human forces that fought in HH?
Were there abhumans? Just ugly hunched mother fuckers or did it go towards beastmen-like but without going full rape goats?
>>96178043Absolutely went all the way to goat, pretty sure they're described in the siege books
>>96178032>theyre too stupid to realise they should look for cover when a snipers shooting them.Could go wildcard and be like maelific and take wounds instead of statuses
>>96178043>goatsSure did, it was one of the provenances
>>96178043Abhumans of every flavour and variety you can imagine saw combat in the horus heresy. They were generally treated horribly by the Imperium so most jumped at the chance to join the traitors to fuck up their oppressors. The ones who remained loyal were either too smart or too stupid to join chaos.
>>96178032I think it should be tied to mob rule. When acting as part of the mob orcs are brave and unshakable, willing to do anything to impress the ladz and sorta just carried by the vibes of the stampede. Maybe have each unit get +1 to all mental stats (to a cap) for nearby units/models/models in the unit.
>>96178047>>96178054Neat, I wonder when those will show up for 3rd.
2nd has that fun custom setup for your army.
>>96177891wait orks are not S3 T4 anymore?
imgine buying a mars pattern reaver titan for 1500โฌ and then fucking up the paint job
>>96178076Pretty sure they lost the s3 in 6th ed.
>>96178039Yeah, you have some abilities that basically do nothing... and they have fucking Alpha Legion with deep striking Leviathans in your opponents deployment zone turn 1.
It's absolutely all over the place.
>>96178076I thought they got +1 strength for charging
When are we expecting the official PDF's to hit the Gofile? Fairly quickly? It'll be nice to have clean and complete scans of everything at last.
>>96177821hate NTR, which is the shorthand for netorare, a porn genre for weebs
>>96178018I prefer epic armageddon with some tweaked AU lists for 30k plus other homebrew.
>>96178043You have even worse civilizations/abhumans surviving the great crusade than 40k. Go wild.
I'm no good at armor marks.
Is this IV or VI?
>>96177625I wish I could download these but it gives me a https error.
>>96178066My personal vision for mob rule had 2 parts.
At base mob rule would mean orks only run from shooting when they hit 50% casualties instead of the normal 25%, the presence of boyz around them convinces them that incoming fire can't be that dangerous if there are still so many of them left.
In addition, Orks can use an appropriate Command units LD instead of their own when testing so long as that command unit is in range and line of sight. This means orks rally around their leaders even when they're not directly in the unit.
Not all ork leaders could do this, just orks with an appropriate special rule called, idk "mob boss"
Warlords and Warbosses all get "Mob boss" as do Boss Nobz, different ranges tho.
Boss nobz would have mob boss (6"), Warbosses and big mekz have mob boss (9") and Warlords boss Mob boss (12"). they can all buy a boss pole which adds 6" to the range of this Aura but it takes up the same slot as a Kustom force field, Tellyporta or other kinds of useful Wargear.
And of course they have different LD values, Boss Nobz and Big mechs have LD8, Warbosses are LD9 and the Warlord high command choice is LD10.
When do the new rules come to list building apps?
>>96178173Here u go anon.
https://files.catbox.moe/s0o4qt.pdf
https://files.catbox.moe/ubaazu.pdf
https://files.catbox.moe/js75ya.pdf
https://litter.catbox.moe/4i60xmrzm82j4hqs.pdf
>>961781971-2 weeks usually.
This might be longer because list building is not exactly linear in 3.0
>>96178197The git at /BSData/horus-heresy-3rd-edition/activity is already shaping up pretty decently, no release yet but rapid progress thanks to leaks.
>>96177865Traitor UM. Up to you if they worked with Horus much/allies of convenience with the rest of the traitors. Bit of an "Ultramar first" line of thinking after seeing how much of a shithole the rest of the imperium is
>>96178261> little red 'Make Ultramar Great Again' helmets
>>96178261>Ultramar first>shack up with the guys who set it on fire and massacred its >>96178261people
Classic
>>96175198the main issue comes from multiple other legions talking shit about how that form of combat, which usually takes the longest and has the highest number of casualties, is beneath them and not worthy of praise.
Combine that with how the IW were scattered due to being relegated to finishing up/reinforcing planets that other legions completely abandoned after doing the cool part of fighting makes their resentment fairly understandable. Not sayin they are not retarded, but the base of their growing bitterness checks out.
>>96177578Where the fuck are you getting 3000 from?
>>96178076They are T5 at this point in 40k
>>96178094They were still S3 + furious charge in 7th I'm pretty sure
>>96178022Sae experience, great game, but not many around to play with
>>96173109 (OP)Iโm fucking disappointed with Wayland, order hasnโt been shipped so wonโt be here for tomorrow. Does anyone know if they ship items on Saturday?
INB4 itโs all a ruse and they didnโt have enough to fulfil
>>96178257battlescribe is still around? I thought the dev died or some shit
>>96178332Wayland Games are notorious for this.
>>96177418>sell as 35% off incurring a lossThat's very much not a loss
>>96177865I'll probably never do these now, so fuck it see if you fancy them:
Blackshields - Sons of Iapetus
The result of conspiracy between nationalist elements of Saturnine Polity and scattered hidden survivors of the Ringer culture to subvert the Space Marine recruitment process and secure a force capable of reclaiming Saturn's independence from Terra's Imperium. Over many decades of the Great Crusade an unknown number of candidates were put forward as fodder for the Legions through outwardly impeccable Saturnine sources, each primed to receive an Astropathic trigger that would awaken their true allegiance. Whether the stewards of this conspiracy were willing participants, unknowing dupes, or merely exploiting the chaos of the times they enacted their plan at the onset of the Heresy and began to marshal their Manchurian forces. Across the Imperium amidst the madness of brother turning against brother at first a few and then many Marines began to vanish from their units. The deep integration of the Saturnine Fleet with the Imperium and the many renowned Rogue Traders appointed from that realm offered countless pathways for the deserters to reach their mustering on Paramar V and the final result of their gambit exceeded their greatest hopes with a full dozen companies' worth of Marines arriving within the year.
Of these roughly 1200 warriors, 200 would be dispatched immediately to the aid of Cthonia as the price of the Warmaster's favour and promised aid in freeing Saturn from the Emperor's yoke. Indeed, the Traitor counter-invasion of Cthonia in early 007.M31 would be the first recorded sighting of the Sons of Iapetus in open conflict against the Imperium in their panoply of polished bone accented by purpura and bearing the astrological sign of their namesake....(cont)
>>96178384(cont)...Two further Company-strength forces were dispatched on missions known only to their commanders. The remaining strength of their force departed the Paramar system quietly in the days before the system was engulfed by the first of many Imperial counterattacks, spending the next three years carefully infiltrating the Sol system with the aid of Alpha Legion operatives and conducting covert operations to prepare for Saturnine secession when Horus' invasion began. [boxout about conflicts with agents of the Sigilite - who had begun to suspect Saturn was not as secure as was generally assumed - including several Knights Errant]
With the bloody opening moves of the Solar War underway the Sons of Iapetus, backed by five full Cohorts of Saturnine Hoplites loyal to their cause, began their doomed revolt against Imperial rule. The battle raged for several years but ultimately the desire for freedom could not stand against the competing interests of Emperor and Warmaster and despite their heavy use of Saturnine pattern wargear their forces were ravaged by both Malcador's campaign to secure the Saturn system for his Chosen and then by the Night Lords' terror campaign that attempted to thwart him. Before the Solar War had even concluded, the last remnants of the New Polity's forces were driven from orbit with less than 200 surviving Sons known to be among them. Their final fate remains a mystery to all but a few.
>>96178319o damn just checked an army builder for 7th and they are still str 3 FC.
RIP
>>96178348I knew it, I shouldโve gone with element games but Iโm hoping the wait is worth the extra discount? Who fucking knows itโs annoyed me because I had a day off next Monday but Iโm assuming they wonโt ship it for ages, Iโve seen fucking redditors have their orders shipped TODAY so thatโs just shit
>>96177602By being friends?
>>96177903>AxesOnly available on terminators and wardens (not heresy kits) plus they said that "guardian spears" envelop both spear and axe heads
>VexillaAlways has on the guardian kit, the warden kit (not a heresy kit) has offhand weapons to accommodate vexilla
>>96178332My order has been dispatched today, I only ordered on Wednesday
>>96176553he seems to be okay, i wished him happy bday on instagram a few days ago.
What's the best discount store in Canada these days, we still dont have the combat patrol mag sadly
>>96178406I used wayland before and they were decent, elemental didnt give the best discounts for what they did have in stock
>>96178433Fackkkk sake I ordered Wednesday too anon still bloody nothing
>>96177914>started his habit.He started rehab when writing, this wasn't negligence it was spite directed at anyone who might be happier than him.
>>96178446Sorry anon, I'd share mine with you, but I'm going to flog it all
>>96178459Kek to be fair I also ordered the two liber books so maybe something with that? God knows Iโll just have to wait
>>96178384>>96178392NTA but I liked this little writeup anon. People had many reasons for rebelling against him on Terra which is a fact often forgotten.
>>96178178Im not sure I like that 25%/50% difference, because 25% is already meant to represent "theres not many guys left". I do like the LD aura thing for various commanders, but I feel like the base rule should be some variant of "base stats are improved when more models are present around you". A unit of 10 boys should feel less brave than a unit of 30 you know?
To me a rule like "mob rule" should have two elements to it. When you have lots of dudes present and your army is fresh it should feel brave and unstoppable, like you can just weather losses and statuses and not really worry too much (relative to the cost of course). But it should also come with the understanding that once your units degrade and your ranks think everything is going to break, that your army will rout and flee and run for the hills when others might stay and fight to the bitter end.
>>96178307No, I can understand being bitter about it, siege warfare sucks and the iron warriors through a mixture of doing not very glamorous jobs and not being very good at PR ended up disliked and generally overlooked.
But I just disagree with the characterization that they/perty got given the hardest jobs in the imperium no one else could do, that theirs was an especially heavy burden. I simply dont think THAT part of it is true.
>>96178473Scattered people had every reason to resist conquest by a foreign power. But Imperial subjects have 0 reason to renounce to the responsibilities and protection of the Imperium, especially after realizing the magnitude of the xenos problem.
It's not even like they are being exploited and abused and given nothing in return: this isn't Scotland :^)
>>96174240Elites are rare, heavy assaults are not and are pretty easy to get more of.
>>96174369Ahhh, I love the little marine picture.
Is anyone going to the Expanded Realms Heresy event in NJ tomorrow?
I have to say im really liking the rules for the talons of the emperor stuff. If legacy rules are written like this it should be pretty good.
>>96178317Iโd have to find the picture. Someone went to the website and saw that 3000 were available to put in their basket, but if they tried a higher ridiculous number, like 3500, they got a warning that there wasnโt enough stock.
How shit is picrel right now? Rescued this one so had no choice on loadout
>>96178614Did you paint it or what? Looks like a decent job on highlights and weathers. I prefer glowing plasma myself though which would be easy to do.
>>96178614Probably fine. The plasma blast now has a chance to ID veterans and terminators, so thats nice. The missile launcher isnt as good as before, it wont kill marines by the handful, but its an anti infantry blast weapon which should complement the wider loadout.
>>96178327>People are literally just buying out the Saturnine PraetorLmao
>>96178614Plasma is about the same as last edition so still decent at blasting terminators and elites (especially since no more heavy rerolling saves vs blasts) and aialos I know got nerfed to basically just be ap4 barrage poke damage
>>96178639Yea. Why is he so popular?
>>96178614Not amazing but It's not terrible. The plasma got to keep breaching 4+ and 5" plate and is 2D now. The alternative is 6 normal plasma shots but without overload so that's nice
>>96178640>Plasma is about the same as last editionMuch better actually, it was S7 in 2.0 wasnt it?
>>96178644his rules seem strong
For reference, this multilisting is for the contents of at least 10 boxes
>>96178639UK has great prices on this stuff but it's all $20 to ship to the US. Which is odd because I've bought from there before and sometimes shipping is <$8
>Europe has multiple 30-35% off fire sales on HH
>Canada no sales
Grim.
>>96178657Oh. Lots of the termis around so I guess people are just going to run him solo?
>>96178201These work, thanks my guy.
>>961786441) You can add him as a one off to your collection
2) You can buy 4 for a command squad
3) Actually comes with a ton of options
That's what I've got so far boss. Anecdotally he's also the only thing from the box that I want
>>96178644He's cool looking and is very modular, saturnines in general are surprisingly poseable
Baseline saturnines are kind of whatever in terms of rules, but I have a feeling command squad saturnines with a praetor are going to be a solid brick wall to drop down on an objective. WS5 will make them very difficult to move in melee, even for knights. I'm just going to build mine as a command squad myself, even without seeing the rules.
>>96178614It does a good enough job against both infantry, 2 damage breaching 4+ blast 5โ. So youโll probably catch most of a squad with the blast, half of those instantly die, or a quarter to to a third of shooting terminators. It might not be what your army needs, but it will make its points back.
>>96178657Not really desu.
>>96178644Hes the new cool character model, and theres some genuinely rather interesting conversions you can do with him. Hes also much easier to fit into an existing force than the other stuff.
Speaking personally hes the one model im interested in from the kit (well, and MkII armor I guess, but thats kinda abstract, I dont so much care about specifically MKII as much as "cheap power armored asses").
>>96178673the termies suck
>>96178689>Not really desu.he can fight primarchs
>>96178660As an ebay seller you only ship cheapass surface mail so many times before you get tired of being burned by assholes who claim the package never arrived and get ebay to refund their money and switch to tracked courier services, which are expensive for even their cheap options.
>>96178717>he can fight primarchsNo the fuck he cant. The weakest primarch (corax probably) will utterly annihilate him.
I know they said "he can hang with the biggest and toughest fighters in the game" during the reveal, but he really cant, the saturnine praetor is barely an upgrade over the regular praetor in many situations. You get +1T, +1W and +1D per weapon over a thunder hammer at the cost of -1I and -1A. he has 20% more damage than a raw praetor (with thunder hammer) at the cost of being one of the slowest things in the game, with an average focus result of "d6" because his initiative is 4, the hammer subtracts 3 and he gets -1 for being heavy.
I bought a couple of the underslung plasma cannons. I'm gonna assemble on saturnine terminator without the pauldrons and mount the plasma cannons in their place and then give it a disintigrator
>>96178752Oh and also hes m5 heavy and 200pts base. The saturnine praetor just isnt very good or practical. He can situationally do good work, and is quite good at challenges vs certain opponents, but in the grand scheme of things I do not think you will see him very much in game.
I'm annoyed there isn't an alternate chest without the aquila for the termis
>>96178335Newrecruit uses BS data files
>>96178684>but I have a feeling command squad saturnines with a praetor are going to be a solid brick wall to drop down on an objective.There's something to be said that saturnine command squads will be WS5 and either S6/8 D3, which means they're one of the few marine units that can one shot custodes, while taking hits in return.
>>96178752I'm curious if any consuls will get access to saturnine. Saturnines are very clearly meant to be deep striked (struck?), so a potential HQ + command squad with one gun arm each will be able to shoot off of their objective and put up a good fight against anyone who tries to push them off. Will they actually be points efficient in that role? Who knows, probably not.
>they auto lose the focus rollAll the more reason to go for finishing blow, since they're pretty hard to kill in one round.
Do any legions have a way to give them eternal warrior?
>>96178787It's a few minutes of filing per chest piece.
>>96178814I believe DG can with their silly prime advantage
>>96178787Same. Decorative elements should be kept sparse on models that are meant to be used by any and all legions.
>>96178814Praevian Saturnine with robots sounds fun
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
>>96178814>All the more reason to go for finishing blow, since they're pretty hard to kill in one round.They are, but afaik the ttk on them is two rounds with or without finishing blow. Plus with only 4 attacks they are very vulnerable to guard up even if they do get to pick first and pick finishing blow (and given how slow they are they wont be charging often).
>Do any legions have a way to give them eternal warrior?IF can, their gambit means you get no bonus to the focus roll from initiative (so youre actually at -1, rather than 0) but gives EW(1).
>>96178824Thats centurions and centurions in terminator armor only. Maybe once we get the saturnine centurion.
Plus its a prime advantage, and a saturnine praetor is high command that cant get them.
>>96178820I know, but it is still annoying that half-ish of the armies would not continue wearing it so I have to do it.
>Vulkan first gifted Saturnine suits to the legions right before the HH
They're gonna have to pull something out of their ass to justify how DA, SW, TS, UM and WS got their stock when they'd all been preoccupied away from Terra since before the action on Isstvan III, or even since before the Ullanor Triumph.
>>96178814>>96178850But basically look at it this way: A saturnine praetor is normally a 20% damage increase over a thunder hammer praetor. In a challenge with the +1A for going first factored in, the saturnine praetor is dead even in terms of damage (before gambits one way or the other) at 4 attacks to 6, and the other guy is striking first.
Theyre situationally very strong, but theyre not insane. Good for flattering fuckers like sigismund though.
>>96178850If a primarch is throwing guard up at you, you're probably doing ok.
I think if there was a way to get a saturnine praetor to WS7, there's a statistical chance to win a challenge against *some* primarchs solely on the fact that they would be rolling 4+ to hit, 2+ to wound and have D3/D4 (with gambits), but that would still be a lot of luck.
>>96178787>>96178826It's a saturnine aquila, not imperial.
>>96178865Thunder hammer praetors are only wounding on a 3+, gotta remember they're S+3 now
He can win the gambit, but unless he feints you're going to get +1 damage on a D3 weapon which is still pretty scary
Doesn't mean a saturnine praetor should (or really can) be going around looking for challenges, but he's not useless by any means. I like him for beating up dreads/knights personally.
>>96178897it looks like dogshit
>>96178897Ummm actually GW marketing said it's cool, guys.
>>96178795Noted. time to play around with that
>>96178886>If a primarch is throwing guard up at you, you're probably doing ok.A primarch isnt. Im talking about "another praetor"
A primarch just stomps the saturnine praetor the hard way. Corax, without finishing blow (meaning probably flurry of blows) does something like 11*1/6*1/2*2+11*1/2*1/2*1/2= or 3.2 wounds to the saturnine praetor. The saturnine praetor swings back (with finishing blow) for 4*1/6*1/2*3+4*1/6*5/6*1/2*2 = 1.6 wounds to corax.
Corax then kills him next round, scoring 6 combat resolution and earning like half his points back while remaining more or less fully combat functional.
Corax is (imo) by far the weakest primarch. Try that shit vs vuilkan or the lion and you arent getting to swing.
>>96178908>but unless he feints you're going to get +1 damage on a D3 weapon which is still pretty scaryIt is, but thats where guard up comes in. Making someone with only 4A hit on 5s into a 4++ is going to lead to a lot of complete whiffs. Even if the ones that get through are quite scary (potentially d5 on the crit, which is kinda nuts).
>>96178960>uhh guys we accidentally put an aquilla on it>just tell the slop eating retards its a different aquilla, theyll buy it anyway lmao.
>>96178979>It is, but thats where guard up comes in.If he goes for guard up, he gives up his focus roll advantage and is only making 1 attack, and even while hitting on 5s you only need to land 2 to squish a praetor (or 1 to win that combat and get advantage)
>>96178991Yeah total accident that it has only one head. Oops, our bad. Lost the other head.
>>96178859Vulkan used his Amazon Prime Advantage
>>96178859The same way they got any mk4, Contemptors, Sabres, Sicarans, leviathans, or deredeos? There's a bunch of shit noted as not having been introduced until near the end if the great Crusade, either you figure out how your dudes got a hold if it or you don't buy it.
>>96179018>or you don't buy it Yes I think that's pretty much how it's going with the Saturnine box
>>96178859I thought the Scars had JUST received their one new shipment of stuff right as they had their first encounters with the Alpha Legion at the beginning of the Heresy
So they don't have A LOT, but some. Then they raid traitor ships for most of the heresy until landing on Terra where they get all the equipment they can possibly use (including Mk7 which is explicitly mentioned in the Mk6 entry in the new rulebook)
>>96178859Prosperity isnโt so far out in the galaxy that the TS couldnโt have had any, and the loyalists who were abroad could pick theirs up later in the war.
>>96178998>he gives up his focus roll advantage and is only making 1 attackGuard up has no bearing on the focus roll? It just reduces your damage to 1 attack.
Also challenge advantage isnt down to "who does more damage", its about who wins the focus roll-off. The saturnine praetor is basically never going to have it (unless they use some very specific legion gambits like the TSONS or IH ones). If you want finishing blow to really put a dent in that saturnine but he, as the challenger, gets first pick, you guard up, have him (probably) whiff everything (could get splattered if he high-rolls but thats life for you) and then since you have challenge advantage vs him you pick the first gambit next round and finishing blow instead of him.
>>96179054>ProsperityProspero, fuck
>>96179054TS also were buddy buddy with a forgeworld that was studying psychic tech which saturnine stuff sort of is
>>96179057>Guard up has no bearing on the focus roll? It just reduces your damage to 1 attack.That's what I mean, you don't get the +1 attack from winning the focus roll because you only make a single attack regardless.
>>96179073Sure. but so what? Youre doing it to weather the storm in a situation where your opponent has an advantage you would rather they not. You arent taking it to kill them, youre taking it so the saturnine hammer man whiffs with his grand total of four attacks.
You can worry about damage once you have control of the challenge round two onwards.
>>96178850You know, I thought the Scars gambit was pretty shitty but the idea of being able to ignore all your focus debuffs if you roll high seems like it has the potential to be funny, if not actually effective
>>96179116If you're going to win the focus roll anyway, why not just go for finishing blow first
The + to your next focus roll isn't all that important if you're an artificer/jump pack praetor fighting a cataphractii/saturnine praetor since it's next to impossible to lose the roll
>>96179116>Sure, but so what?Because he can do the same thing back, and +1A isn't generally as good as +1D. Especially when a TH praetor is wounding 3s while a saturnine is wounding on 2s
>>96178767>hes m5 heavy and 200pts baseI believe he'll often be full 260 pts, because of the deepstrike. It is very expensive, but at M5" the unit is basically unusable otherwise
>>96179137>, why not just go for finishing blow firstBecause the challenger makes the first choice in the first round. So if the saturnine praetor challenges you he will always pick first, and if he wants finishing blow he gets it. So you focus on surviving to the second round onwards, where the first choice instead goes to the fighter with challenge advantage
But yes, a lot of the benefit of guard up is wasted vs a saturnine praetor since theyre SO comically slow that you have to try to go after them a lot of the time.
>>96179157Do what, guard up? Yea, I guess he could. Might actually be pretty good for them since they have fewer attacks to lose and its one of the few ways for them to go first thanks to providing a large static buff.
Holy fuck this lasted a minute. Time to migrate.
>>96179187>>96179187>>96179187
>>96178814It does feel weird that such a chubby thing can be Weapon Skill 5 or even 6
Also, all terminators should be able to buy deepstrike
Deepstrike needs an overhaul
>>96178426Image limit is reached but wardens are still listed in the custodes section of heresy. Kill yourself, retarded shill.
>>96179175Maybe, but thats EVEN more points. Like at that point hes what, a full 100pts more than a kitted out terminator praetor? Thats quite a lot. Thats custodes tribune points.
The saturnine praetor is a very scary, very tough, model. But its just not that good in enough spots and expensive enough that I think overall its not going to see too much play (besides maybe the cool factor of "I have the biggest guy on the table, isnt he cool")
>>96179157>>96179178Also, if youre that worried about "what happens after the guard up", you can end the challenge. If you attack into him and whiff a whole lot and hes going to get like +5 to focus next round and splatter you? just end it. Take whatwever damage you took and did (probably not much either way at this point) and go home. You have that freedom of seeing how it turns out and walking away if it looks scary.
>>96174097>I guess people can like a legion and not like it's primarch>>96174136Hi, Warhounds veteran here. Let me tell you about the worst day of my life...
>Captcha: ASSMD
I think people misunderstand how challenges work, going first has never meant instant win, not in 40k. The biggest factor is WS, if a saturnine praetor gets a buff from a librarian to ws 7 there are several primarchs he could fight (lorgar for instance is only ws 6) of course primarchs will still likely tool him, the only non custodes who can really go toe to toe with any primary is Malagra arch magos, with a possible ws 10 thanks to gambit 2+/4+/5+++ they can take hits and trade them back well enough, as even a primary will have a hard time hitting them. However the saturnine praetor will make mincemeat of anything less then a Tribune or buffed magos he's also the only character that's not a primary to get a dam. 3 weapon. You guys have too much math hammer thinking, math hammer fails the moment you start rolling dice. Rather then use percentages I have mock fights using actual dice rolls, ten times. You find that anything can happen, but more often then not saturnine praetor will kick the crap out of anything from Praetors to magos, but still lose to SM Paragon champions or arquitor magisterium Paragons. WS means more then initiative, period. Toughness and saves also mean more then initiative. As only a guy with a power fist is gonna wound that saturnine praetor or magos on a 2, best a Paragon blade is gonna do is wound in 6 and the saturnine axe will wound your praetor on 2 and do 2 wounds. Your challenge thinking doesn't hold up in real games and with real dice rolls. Sure he won't beat a primary, but who really will anything else he can throw hands with and win.
>>96174369>the crossed swordsYyyesssssss
>>96174440>You TriedNot that I'm ANY better. Actually, 80% of all posted models should be to this standard. Showcasefags gonna overachieve
>>96179271>. The biggest factor is WS, if a saturnine praetor gets a buff from a librarian to ws 7 tLibrarians can buff WS?
>there are several primarchs he could fight (lorgar for instance is only ws 6)A saturnine praetor can NOT fight lorgar. Lorgar would absolutely flatten him. The illuminarum is a war-crime.
>they can take hits and trade them back well enough, as even a primary will have a hard time hitting them.Maybe, although several primarchs have really nasty spikes on 5s to hit (curze, vulkan, russ, sanguinius, horus, ferrus, perty and lorgar).
>and the saturnine axe will wound your praetor on 2 and do 2 wounds.The axe is S5, it wounds on 3s vs marines and 4s vs terminators.
>>96175309>surrounded by a bunch of retards during the siege>kill the Emperor>50%+ of the pride of the legions on Terra >why can't I hold all these demons >order a general retreat, consigning 100% of your brothers to permanent damnationThis is why I'll never read a full book of this trash
>>96175444Wait, they errata'd the heavy chainsaw for Assault squads, but NOT Vet Assaults? Doohoohohoh
>>96175485>Eldar-ass sloots
>>96179472With horus dead all the demons just vanished, the veil of unreality he was keeping in place was gone. Also with horus dead the command structure - which had already broken down - was now entirely gone, and the ultramarines and dark angles were showing up.
Staying to fight was not the winning move there.
>>96175988>FAT FUCK EDITIONDohohoho, I hope this sticks
>>96176230>Aircraft do not belong in a 28mm wargame. For a long time *the entire point* of i infantry warfare in 41M was that *offboard lascannons obliterated all flyers*
I think some of the very first GW non-skimmers were Towers of Tzeentch
>>96176230This is correct simply because the table size does not support Aircraft to function like actual aircraft.
This did not really dawn on me until i played LI which you actually get to use aircraft how they should opperate.
The only aircraft that should be allowed in 28mm scale are gunship type air crafts which basically just end up being flying hovering vehicles.
At most you should jsut be able to buy bombing runs or airstrikes as a asset.
>>96179057>>96179073Which is the one where you automatically win the focus roll next round if you survive? Test the Foe?
>>96176355racefaggots decided they want to be taken seriously again
![99853002371_THHTraitorOverseerConsul01[1]](/images/tg/1753472942423118.jpg)
