Thread 725090048

Love these Spec Ops: The Line's loading screen quotes.
Sadly we can't talk about this game on /v/

>>725090048 (OP)
He is not me
I am not evil
therefore seeing him kill innocents isn't bad

>>725090048 (OP)
Troon OPs: The Rope

>>725090048 (OP)
I think the accusations of "you're a bad person" sort of fall flat with Spec Ops The Line because unlike say Undertale where you had to go out of your way to get the Genocide Ending by grinding so-called "monsters". In Spec Ops The Line there's no way to complete your initial mission of finding out what's going on, call in the cavalry and go home.

You have to call WP on civilians, you have to destroy their water supply, you have to mow down American troops. Even Far Cry 4 let you avoid the blood shed by having the player be able to wait for Pagan Minn in the dining hall.

Also the game was not a free game and whilst I understand developers have to be paid a salary and keep the lights on. It's very understandable for the player to want to get the most of the $60 they spent on a game rather than the player wanting to commit murder.

>undertale
Stopped reading there. KYS troonister.

>Troon Ops The ACK ACK Line

Stopped reading there. KYS troonister.

>>725090735
>the accusations of "you're a bad person"
It's just a jab on many heroic military shooters at the time, like CoD
"To kill for entertainment is harmless"

>>725090735
>the accusations of "you're a bad person"
It's just a jab on many heroic military shooters at the time, like CoD
Also, they didn't really accused you of being a bad person. Look at the final quotes "To kill for entertainment is harmless"

i clapped when i killed those civilians

>>725090735
>the accusations of "you're a bad person"
It's just a jab at many heroic military shooters at the time, like CoD
Also, they didn't really accuse you of being a bad person. Look at the final quotes "To kill for entertainment is harmless"

>tranny still seething about people caring more about spec ops than trannytale
LELKEK

>>725090048 (OP)
NOOOOOO I'M NOT EVIL
FUCK YOU
I'M A GOOD PERSON I'M A GOOD PERSON!!!!

>>725091167
I disagree, the game uses a lot of fourth wall breaks like Lugo pointing at the player saying it's your fault, the loading screen tips like

>How many Americans have you killed today?
>If you were a better person, you wouldn't be here.
>This is all your fault.
>Do you feel like a hero yet?

can be interpreted as statements aimed at the player rather than Walker himself since presumably, we the player are the only ones able to see those loading screen tips rather than any in-universe characters

>>725090048 (OP)
>years pass
>people ask the team what the fuck's up with the writing a few times over the years
>it turns out that a cornerstone of the plot went over the heads of like 95% of players
>the cornerstone of the plot basically everyone missed is that Walker died 100% dead in the first helicopter crash and that this is a no-joke "you're in your own personal purgatory" trope story
>everything after the helicopter crash simply isn't real, including all the plot twists, the hallucinations, the burning civilians, etc.
>a cornerstone hint that Walker is fucked is that the normal mapping (bump mapping?) on his eyes make them look "shattered", something most people just thought was a glitch, or they didn't notice
>another hint was that the devs liked to slip in the sound effects of helicopters in a few parts despite there not being any
>this is all on top of it being a bit of a satire aimed at people obsessed with military shooters and such

All this "effort" from the devs and:
>reviewers thought it was just an okay shooter, most probably didn't even finish it anyway
>normalfags who played it got confused by the story
>normalfags who didn't play it ignored it because it's a no-name, generic shooter
>high-IQ people ignored the game because it's a no-name, generic shooter
>everyone else who played it got annoyed by the "do you feel like a hero yet?" shit

Pic related: the dev, probably.

>>725090443
>I was just following orders
>soldiers are supposed to be heroes
>war simulators should make me feel good

>>725090735
i always felt like it was less "you're a bad person" and more "this genre is fucked up when you think about it"

>>725090048 (OP)
This game made me realise how much i love human suffering
I would love to serve in a war as drone operator and drop bomb on bunch of helpless civilians and soldier or give them a false hope only to kill them when they feel secure

>>725091301 (me)
*personal purgatory/hell

Pic related: me, for not paying attention while writing this.

>>725091030
NTA but it's kind of a meaningless statement, no? It'd be much more interesting to ask WHY killing people is fun when it's fictional. For this to have any kind of bite it probably needed Harper to acknowledge the player directly and ask them why whilst grappeling with the reality that he is just a generic caricature of an action hero made specifically to be a vessel for an (at first glace) surface level, generic thrid person cover shooter.

Of course this would change a lot of things, and it'd basically be a whole different game at that point, but then the whole guilt tripping/shaming angle would at least make sense to an extent, since it's coming from a digital puppet you're forcing to do said horrible things he doesn't WANT to do, rather than the game slapping you on the wrist when you actually NEED to do said bad stuff to experience the game you're playing.

>>725090735
>You have to call WP on civilians, you have to destroy their water supply, you have to mow down American troops.
But enough about the Israeli Defence Force

>>725090735
>undertale
Good to know the people who get mad about this game are retards.

>>725090048 (OP)
giga fucking kino, German masterpiece

>>725090048 (OP)
This game makes you stupid

>>725091301
>everything that happens isn't real
This trope should be illegal.

>>725091402
it's just sufferkino anon, not a deep philosophical criticism about video games and gamers

>>725091167
>>725091297
Found the interview I was looking for
https://web.archive.org/web/20160604021444/http://www.1up.com/features/horror-mysteries-spec-ops-the-line?pager.offset=1

>Like I was saying, we wanted the loading screens to feel like it wasn't just an attack on Walker in the game, but specifically designed to attack the player. We wanted the choice for the player to fall in line with the same thing. If the player wants to stop this journey they can stop playing the game.

In response to 1UP asking:
Did the idea ever come up of having a situation early on in the game where Lugo and Adams are telling you, "Why don't we just turn around?", and giving the players the opportunity to just do that? Giving them an ending right there?

Which imo saying "stop playing the game you spent $60 on otherwise you're a bad person" is pretty dumb and is a poor way to judge someone's moral character

>>725091437
I don't even like Undertale, it's more that I appreciate how Toby Fox constructed the Genocide Ending as something that players had to go out of their way to achieve and not stumble across it

>>725091419
KEK thanks Anon

>>725091319
I think it does achieve the deconstruction aspect of casting a more critical eye on modern military shooters but I think casting judgement on the player is a bit too much

>>725091402
>Harper
*Walker
I can't believe I forgot the dude's actual name lmao
>>725091529
>it's just sufferkino anon
I guess yeah, didn't really occur to me as such since most of the games I associate with sufferkino as a concept inspire suffering in me like pic related.

Maybe I should broaden my horizons; has anyone got some sufferkino they'd recommend?

>>725091612
>I appreciate how Toby Fox constructed the Genocide Ending
It's a tedious waste of time, the point wasn't to make a commentary on anything, it was to stop fat tumblr whales from accidentally having to do the sans fight and giving up on the game.

Ultimately the issue is that you don't understand the point of linearity in games.

>>725091693
>has anyone got some sufferkino they'd recommend
Lobotomy Corporation if you're a filthy secondary
Black Souls
Kara no Shoujo
Fullmetal Daemon Muramasa

>>725091778
>Lobotomy Corporation if you're a filthy secondary
I'm unfortunately not, though sometimes I wish I was just so I could have some brain cells and wasted hours back. Kara No Shoujo seems interesting, detective stuff is always based

>>725091742
>It's a tedious waste of time, the point wasn't to make a commentary on anything, it was to stop fat tumblr whales from accidentally having to do the sans fight and giving up on the game.
And ultimately it makes it more meaningful than being railroaded into committing war crimes. Not once did I ever go "oh man I did those things" because I didn't have a choice, I followed the creator's railroad of events.

>Ultimately the issue is that you don't understand the point of linearity in games.

It's more that Spec Ops The Line doesn't understand how judgement works, if you want to cast judgement on someone for their actions they have to be given a choice between doing good thing and bad thing.

If you want to have a game based around doing warcrimes, sure. But people are going to get the value out of their $60 that they paid for the game. The game doesn't need to bombard the player with asspats but it's dumb to say only bad people play Spec Ops The Line when there are many reasons why people would continue playing the game.

Even in more deterministic religions like Islam and Calvinistic Christianity affirm both divine decree/destiny and free will oxymoronically because they understand that God judges bad people because they're bad that did bad things in their exercise of choice

>>725092137
>cast judgement on someone
Here's your issue, you think you're Walker. You should really grow out of self-inserting, man.

>>725092195
>You should really grow out of self-inserting, man.

The devs literally designed aspects of the game in mind to attack the player.

>Like I was saying, we wanted the loading screens to feel like it wasn't just an attack on Walker in the game, but specifically designed to attack the player. We wanted the choice for the player to fall in line with the same thing. If the player wants to stop this journey they can stop playing the game.
https://web.archive.org/web/20160604021444/http://www.1up.com/features/horror-mysteries-spec-ops-the-line?pager.offset=1

Why did they remove this from Steam?

>>725092296
the bane of delisting, licensed music

>>725092296
undoubtedly music licenses

>>725092248
Actually I'm wrong, it's not the devs that said that. It's the lead writer of Spec Ops The Line that said that. Sorry I didn't mean to say that the 3D modeler or coder said that but rather the person that was in charge of the writing of the story, characters, scenarios etc. that said that

>>725092137
I don't like Undertale's implementation because it hides meaningful content in the form of fun boss fights behind the genocide playthrough. Black Souls has a much more interesting take on morality, wherein you're bombarded at every step of the way with the kill and rape button, but they are fully optional. The only reason to ever use them is curiosity. Just rewind your save file, no one has to know. And ending C is a masterclass in actually making the player feel guilt.

>>725090048 (OP)
>Cognitive Dissonance
You mean like your writing?
>What's right is what is necessary
Genocide of the subhumans is indeed righteous
>schizoid nonsense

>>725092296
too hardcore

>>725092534
Yeah that's fair, I haven't played Black Souls so I can't really criticize it and for all my appreciation for the Genocide Ending in Undertale. As you pointed out, you can make the exact same critique about people wanting to get their money's worth from the game and experience all the content. Especially since the Undyne the Undying and Sans fight are considered highlights in the game with how many thousands of remixes of Megalovania there are.

>>725090048 (OP)
we can its just been a while since its released so there's not much talk about it. i wish they made more games with a similar vibe

>>725090048 (OP)
I've come to appreciate this game more over the years, it's full of little details, if you really look into it this game had a lot of dedication and intent behind everything in it, all the lines were recorded in a single day for the main characters, thus why everyone sounds fucking exhausted by the end of it, the enemies react to the insane bullshit you're pulling off, they can't believe 3 retards are eliminating Elite CIA squads and an entire marine battalion.
In a world of irony poisoning this game takes itself 100% seriously and that's hard to find nowadays.
Also, it introduced me to Mogwai.
What the fuck is this captcha bullshit.

>>725090048 (OP)
Any other games like this but with actual good gameplay?

>>725092782
>all the lines were recorded in a single day for the main characters, thus why everyone sounds fucking exhausted by the end of it,

Yeah it's why I refuse to disregard Nolan North as a voice actor. He's an excellent one with so much range and ability, people just want him to do the Nathan Drake voice for the 1000th time

>>725090048 (OP)
The loading screens towards the end were awful enough to take me out of the experience when I encountered them. The story and loading images are more than enough to take in the message without the braindead hostile loading tips lines coming at you like a room temperature George Carlin routine

>>725091693
>has anyone got some sufferkino they'd recommend?
Pathologic 1&2
>I don't want to slowly walk across town for thirty hours
just Pathologic 2 then

>>725091301
Now answer yourself this, would getting this point (assuming it's true) make the game experience any better.

>>725092884
I didn't say it was a GOOD idea. The whole thing was an interesting experiment, sure, but it was a bad idea.

>>725091301
To be fair, the lead writer has pulled the death of the author card on himself saying it's up for interpretation even though most people will take his take as the "canon" story.

>>725090048 (OP)
>to kill for entertainment is harmless
i'm pretty sure killing for entertainment is still illegal

>>725090048 (OP)
>Don't kill.
>t. The Ten Commandments
That'll be $0. No tip necessary. Enjoy not spending several hours getting rugpulled by hipsters.

It's been over a decade and there are still so many people who don't get it.

>>725094042
Enlighten us.

>>725094042
Explain it to me as though I've never played it and never will.

I can see 2 possible points the game was trying to make
>war bad
>war vidya bad
The first one is such a tired truism that has been done better by hundreds of better games, movies and books. To think that the world needs to hear it again from you is just narcissism.
The second case is Jack Thompson tier retardation. It assumes people are unable to tell vidya fiction from reality, it's like condemning silly action blockbusters like Commando for glorifying violence, or the audience for enjoying them. Everyone knows it's not real and wrong to do in real life, it's just fun to pretend from time to time.

>>725094042
I saw the Extra Credits video. What more do you want?

>>725090048 (OP)
Because it's leftist propaganda and if you prod it's defenders enough that's exactly what you'll get out of them, instead of just the message about violence. That's what you really get if you unmask this games defenders, although no one will ever say ever dare say the obvious. Zoomers who are practically a muslim turd worlder worshiper generation too so I'm sure it does wonders for them at making it all feel very deep.

>>725094083
>>725094095
It's just a deconstruction of military shooter genre where many of these games at that time make you feel like a badass hero saving America.
In this game you play as a wanna be hero who fucked everything up.

>>725094324
Jaded hipsters hate war shooters because they think they're "neanderthal," not because of a behavioral link.

>>725094343
Why would you do that to yourself, those guys are worse pseuds that the game's writer.

>>725090861
Imagine comparing an unfinished game with an unlisted game. Now that's an ACK moment right there.

>>725094324
>The second case is Jack Thompson tier retardation. It assumes people are unable to tell vidya fiction from reality-
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAHHAHAHAHaaaa

Anon, tell me whats the problem with the image on the left? Even if you don't personally have an issue with it, what might society at large think of it?

>>725094362
>>725094419
So another possible point is
>stop having fun!
?

>>725094440
That wasn't as obvious to me a decade ago.

>>725094324
>It assumes people are unable to tell vidya fiction from reality
The majority of people can't.

>>725091301
>a bit of a satire aimed at people obsessed with military shooters
It IS a fucking military shooter though, with all the shitness that entailed at the time. Brown boring art direction, terminally short fucking campaign, hell it might have even had multiplayer. It was a bad example of it's own genre, whilst being so up its own ass the developers blamed the players for not getting a twist that in your words is fucking paramount yet changes just about fucking nothing besides making your actions irrelavant. All a dream ass type shit.

>>725094576
HELLO
ANYONE IN THIS THREAD THAT PLAYS FPSES:
DO YOU BELIEVE THAT YOU WERE IN IRAQ, AFGHANISTAN, WW2 OR THE CIVIL WAR AND KILLED HUNDREDS OR THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE
YES OR NO PLEASE

>>725094606
It's called being ironic, which means they not only get your $60 but also get to call you uneducated if you don't like it. Win-win.

>>725094324
>Everyone knows it's not real and wrong to do in real life, it's just fun to pretend from time to time.
>*joins the army to rape and burn down villages filled with brown people later down the line*
Wowzers.

>>725091612
I hate that "You can just turn it off," argument, because the first time it was said was in a completely different interview where the interviewer brought it up and the developer said, "You know, we never thought of that, but thinking about it that is a legitimate response."

>>725094925
Really lol? That's actually pretty hilarious

>>725094797
See >>725094515

>>725090735
Yeah, they fall flat because the game accuses you of something you did not do and are not responsible for because Walker's deeds are set in stone on a meta-narrative level whether you observe them or not. They were never meant to have been truthful or accurate to begin with. But you also need to not be a nigger to understand that and appreciate it. Majority of this board is non-white, so it is beyond them, they just get upset and react like screaming monkeys throwing feces.

Stop crying bitch tears over dead al-qaeda Iraqis.

>>725094905
>plays Spec Ops: The Line™ instead
>realizes that war is hell and killing people is wrong
>stays home and collects unemployment instead

I'm sure this happened numerous times.

>>725095405
But was the game fun?

>>725090048 (OP)
>play through the game I paid money for
>DAE I'M ACTUALLY THE BAD GUY??!?!
Midwit slop.

>>725095694
Name once.

13 years later and selfinsertfags STILL buttblasted by this game lmao

>>725095967
Good. Fuck you and fuck your money.

>>725095998
This delisted game has lived rent free in your head.

>>725095974
You never heard about that one guy that decided to not join the army and do no raping or pillaging? It was all over the front pages.

ou guys know art can get you to ask questions about urself without being a personal attack. you guys sound really retarded when you get mad about this.

take care of urself

undertale rendered this game obsolete

>>725095694
There are people stupid enough to have played MGS, join the US army, and then unfortunately survive long enough to boast about it to David Hayter at a convention.
I hate having to readjust my theory of mind to account for people way more retarded than I believe is even possible to exist in society.
>>725090443
Not entirely.
I am a player, credited as special guest in the opening, I can make fluff choices for walker but he made the choice to seek out glory, heroism and Conrad before the game even started.

>>725090735
>You have to call WP on civilians, you have to destroy their water supply, you have to mow down American troops
>It's very understandable for the player to want to get the most of the $60 they spent on a game
But you didn't have to buy the game. Why did you spend $60 on it? Because it was just the next military man fighting evil middle easterners game? It really didn't advertise itself in any meaningful way beyond that. Why did you buy this violent game instead of Guitar Hero, or Tony Hawk, or The Sims, or some sports game? Because you just think it's the norm and you don't question it? There's a thousand different games you could be playing but you gravitate towards the one where you kill a bunch of people, why? Have you ever asked yourself that?

>>725096734
>but you gravitate towards the one where you kill a bunch of people, why? Have you ever asked yourself that?

Because I want to be entertained with 60 dollars and my grasp on reality is strong enough that I can engage with a piece of fiction and know it's not real? This is the same argument people trot out to say violent videogames cause school shootings since "obviously" violent game = violent action

>>725096227
In accomplishing what?

>>725090048 (OP)
I don't have a problem with the game trying to say murder is immoral, I have a problem with the game presenting - or assuming - I am feeling bad for anything that happens in it.
I don't give a shit and phosphoring sandniggers seems hilarious on a fundamental level.

>like the concept of Spec Ops The Line
>also like mindlessly gunning down civilians when the server admin isnt looking in Arma 3 (i like to stir up shit in ‘hardcore’ autistic milsim servers)

>>725096831
>Because I want to be entertained with 60 dollars and my grasp on reality is strong enough that I can engage with a piece of fiction and know it's not real?
But why did you spend $60 on this game specifically? And why does killing fictional enemies give you the most entertainment? Why don't you get the same entertainment from planting a garden in Stardew Valley or creating a metropolis in Cites: Skylines? You chose to spend $60 on a game that focuses on nothing but killing and you never asked yourself why.

>>725094324
>It assumes people are unable to tell vidya fiction from reality
don't tell the US Army/Navy that since, y'know, they use CoD and shooters to recruit grunts now...

https://www.war.gov/News/Feature-Stories/Story/article/3244620/military-esports-how-gaming-is-changing-recruitment-morale/
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/feb/14/us-military-recruiting-video-games-targeting-teenagers

>>725096734
>Why did you spend $60 on it?
That's the neat thing, I didn't.

>>725091301
as someone who feinted / blacked out a few times, this shit terrifies me. you come to but there are shards of “memory” from the dream state while you were unconscious. i had some weird blood sugar or blood pressure thing, im fine now.

>>725096734
>But you didn't have to buy the game
Let's take this one step further: They didn't have to sell the game. Why did they? They didn't have to make the game at all. Why did they? You ever ask yourself that?

>>725090048 (OP)
>le we are the bad guys
no one cares about this overused trope

>>725095356
>the game accuses you of something you did not do and are not responsible for
But you did do it.
How do self-described "gamers" fail to grasp this vital nuance? It is a video game. It requires your input. You are not a spectator.

>>725092137
>It's more that Spec Ops The Line doesn't understand how judgement works, if you want to cast judgement on someone for their actions they have to be given a choice between doing good thing and bad thing.
It's actually that you don't understand how this game works, if you do something you're responsible for it.

>>725091301
Nice fanfiction.
The helicopter part was added last minute.
You can look it up on the interviews. One of the people at helm demanded an action sequence to start the game.

>>725098782
Just like how SOTL is a delisted game beside being the last entry of the IP huh? Rent free.

>>725090048 (OP)
It's because when you say "talk about it" you mean "agree with my opinion".

>>725092782
>this game takes itself 100% seriously and that's hard to find nowadays.
all of the games it's trying to be a commentary on also present themselves totally seriously

>>725092296
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_liczxalzk

>>725098565
>if you do something you're responsible for it.
Not at all. If you have no choice you have no responsibility.

>>725099542
Your opinion is objectively wrong

>>725091310
>Spec Ops
>war simulator
kek

>>725090048 (OP)
The game forces me to do all this. I don't get a Farcry 4 (wait for 15 mins for backup) and it would change the entire game. This shit is pushed on me, the player, to make a choice and the game to say "YEAH, WASNT THAT HORRIBLE? WHYD YA DO THAT? DON'T YOU FEEL....BAD?" Faggot shit trying it's hardest to guilt me for something that could never happen IRL.

And Obama sleeps easy, having drone striked all those civies....because he doesn't fucking care.

And why should I?

>>725091385
personal....PUGatory?

>>725100030
>The game forces me to do all this.
Did it hold a gun to your head?
>And why should I?
Game explicitly asks you this btw

>>725100204
Do you get a refund if you say fine I'll quit the game so I don't have to be forced to do bad thing?

>>725100204
Like most games, I want to finish it. So if I HAVE to dump WP on civies, sure, they aren't real. If I did that IRL, you'd be put in mil prison forever if you didn't die first.

>make you commit murder to progress
>YOU FUCKING GAMERCEL, WHY DID YOU LE KILL THEM????? YOU CULDA HAVE TURNED DA GAME OFF!!!! OH THAT WILL BE $60 + TIP BTW :))))

Why did everyone suddenly get vocal about war bad for vidya only when it come to modern wars? typically in the Middle East? you will not find anyone complaining about WWII games. But holy shit a game in Iraq? a game in Afghanistan? this is TOO MUCH. This is a recruitment ad! this is le jingoist propaganda! well what specifically is so much more innocent about WWII? why don't you give a shit about that? why is that completely okay to you?

>>725100325
I guess. But why would you do that? Are you that desperate to avoid being a bad guy in a video game?

>>725100332
>Like most games, I want to finish it.
Welcome to the point.

>>725100601
>This is a recruitment ad! this is le jingoist propaganda!
Answered your own question there didn't you

>>725100669
>Welcome to the point.

>>725095998
I don't get how people trick themselves into thinking it's a critique of the player or video games as a whole

>>725100693
Spec Ops fans are the most stereotypical libtards and it's not even funny because it's who they are.

>>725100669
>Are you that desperate to avoid being a bad guy in a video game?
I'm not Walker and neither are you.

>>725100728
Ah, you're certified?

>>725100882
Then your actions make even less sense.

>>725094515
Everyone knows vampires don't look like that in real life. Unfortunately.

>>725100807
You don't have to be a libtard to have a problem with these ghouls propagandizing our kids with lies into dying fighting their wars to make them money and territory we will never see.

>>725100601
because one is a legitimate anti-imperial war involving the whole world
the other is a warcrime war involving the imperialist US and making it seem like they're the good guys
hope this is simple enough for you to understand, I can answer your questions if you have any

>>725100807
You've got some weird stereotypes about libtards

>>725100979
>anti-imperial war
Most of the Allies' intention weren't anti-imperialist.

>>725100979
A fool can ask more questions than ten wise men can answer

>>725100979
>legitimate anti-imperial war
>involving the imperialist US
Yeah nah you just like that the Soviet Union was fighting in it your communist prick. Just be honest about it.

>>725101060
>>725101076
the axis was invading all its neighbouring countries
therefore it was an anti-imperialist war
cope harder, hitler lost

"War bad" exists because there are "war good" retards who think their masters are thinking of them instead of their own pockets.

>>725101153
It was fascist infighting dipshit, it's like two lions fighting over their prey, there's no situation where the prey survives.

>>725090048 (OP)
I just watched a video that mentioned this game! :OOOOOO!!! It's all connected!!

>>725101153
>cope hitler lost
I don't recall claiming Germany emerging victorious. And Stalin started the war with Germany to be honest, at least I choose to believe the icebreaker thesis to this day.

>>725100693
>>725100979
>video games do not cause le violence and enlistment
>only delisted dudebro games do
Have fun chasing your healthcare.

>>725101380
>Stalin started the war with Germany
what kind of ahistorical wehraboo nonsense is this lmao

>>725101430
Who are you quoting lmao
And why are you simping for people who hate you?

>>725101430
literal schizo

>>725101449
https://files.catbox.moe/d8klp3.pdf
https://files.catbox.moe/hjijny.pdf

>>725101490
>>725101528
Why does a delisted dudebro game live rent free in your heads?

At this point the only people defending spec ops are trolling.
Every reasonable defence of the game has been shot down by the writer interview, now you only have the "just don't finish the 60$ game bro" argument.

>>725101656
I'm not the one complaining though

>>725101656
it doesn't, I was just answering anon asking why ww2 games are more acceptable than american games promoting imperialism
why do trannies live rent free in your head?

>>725101746
Now you're just dismissing what OP said entirely.

>>725101720
See >>725094925

>>725101720
>Every reasonable defence of the game has been shot down by the writer interview
What exactly do you think it shows? Or what the "reasonable defence" was?

I play spec ops to enjoy the carnage.

>>725101779
You did not treat SOTL as a delisted game.

>>725101816
Well, this may come as a shock, but I am not, in fact, the OP

>>725101890
NTA but no one fucking cares if a game legally purchasable or not when it comes to discussing the intent of its themes.

>>725102025
See >>725101816

>>725102051
I'm not sure what this conversation looks like in your head at this point

>>725102094
This reply doesn't answer anything.

>>725102171
So why did you make it?

>>725092856
>that tip
kek

>>725101852
The idea that the loading screens are not about attacking the player was the only defense Spec Ops fags had.

>>725102273
Why are you like this?

>>725101595
>unironically linking anything written by Viktor Suvorov

>>725102354
No, that was the trolling.

>>725102354
It's just a light jab at people who expected the game to be just another generic military shooter where you play as a hero who save the day.

>>725090048 (OP)
the Nortubel of call of duty

You're not allowed to charge money if your primary purpose is satire
You compromise your message by putting personal monetary gain first, you make a marketable product before an intelligent argument
You either get to charge sixty bucks or you get to call the player a faggot for not putting the game down, doing both means you should be tarred and feathered

>>725090048 (OP)
this game makes more sense when you realize it's not "war bad" but rather "war games bad"
less of a political statement and more of a shot at other games

>>725092296
Liberal consensus is moving back to 'war is good actually' since Trump is pro-peace.

>>725100030
The game is a test to see how you choose what to do at the end, not a "Feel bad we forced you to do this" shit like Last of Us 2. People that felt bad missed the point that Walker is constantly pushing the blame, as you probably did playing too. Remeber, the first mission is to just leave.

>>725102704
>Republicans are literally coming around to "war is peace"
Brother, he didn't rename it the department of peace

>>725102801
>probably
Hell, no need to speculate, it's literally what 99% of the discourse surrounding this game is

>>725095405
I've never so much as heard of this game before, including in dozens of Spec Op threads. Tell us about it.

>>725094362
>In this game you play as a wanna be hero who fucked everything up.
Actually in the story it's the CIA and Mother Nature who fucked everything up.

>>725102812
Get back to me when he starts a war.

>>725090048 (OP)
>white people killing brown Arabs
Yikes! That’s a heckin no goarino, just like the white European Israeli settlers killing poor brown Palestinearinos

>>725103050
>He's so pro-peace he's only continuing wars!
wow

We will never have another game like Spec Ops: The Line ever gain.
And that's okay.

>>725103365
Indeed, one is enough

>>725102801
>not a "Feel bad we forced you to do this"
The loading screen tips say otherwise.
And yes, the writer confirmed they're aimed at the player.

>>725103304
Which wars is he continuing? The Gulf War and the Afghanistan War are over.

>>725103365
Spec Ops: The Line is talked about because its "one of a kind" as some essay niggas like say it is
If there were more games like it then it would drive to warcrime oversaturation

>>725103691
That anon is going to ignore that Trump recently took the vaxx and the country hosting the patient zero of COVID has not been given any sanction whatsoever. Typical of healthcare chaser.

>>725103549
>And yes, the writer confirmed they're aimed at the player.
That you needed this confirmation shows you're a midwit.
Anon was right, those loading screen tips are meant to make you feel more like Walker

>>725103914
?? Respond to the wrong post?

>>725104119
He's just an untreated schizophrenic who seems to have made his lack of mental healthcare part of his identity, pay him no mind

>>725104230
Go die to COVID 2.

>>725104260
>COVID 2
We're already up to COVID 19 silly

>>725103365
How can someone even make game like that anymore. The modern market would NEVER let something like this fly again like they did back in 2012.

>>725103549
The loading tips you speak of are only for when you die. I can imagine a lot of people being upset more about dying then upset at what they were doing.

>>725090048 (OP)
Spec Ops isnt even on Steam anymore, they removed it.

>>725105323
good.

>>725106653
>Video game history being lost is good
You're that butthurt about it huh

>>725106831
Yes. This is why it's also a good thing that the stupid stop killing games shit failed.

>>725090048 (OP)
>Sadly we can't talk about this game on /v/
This goes for 99% of games.

>>725105323
>Bought it before they took it down
I won.

I laughed out loud during the final helicopter sequence where I shredded the building and us aircraft, it was fun and subversive as fuck.

>>725091310
I wasn't following any orders. If it were up to me I'd turn around and walk away after first encounter as we're my fucking orders to begin with.

>removed for music licenses
Kill the RIAA

>>725109331
You only say that because you know what follows. Which renders your word rather hollow.

>>725090735
I got the secret best ending of Spec Ops by never buying or playing it

>>725110668
>ITT: people who failed the first boss fight in the game.

>>725110856
>saddam hussein.jpg

>>725110668
>>725110856
Great joke but honestly the obsession with having to have a "good ending" is genuinely what trips people up.

>>725090048 (OP)
>Sadly we can't talk about this game on /v/
And that's a good thing.
Page 10

>>725091492
It dont dislike it if well used.
What is real? If the person assumes its real then its as real as anything else.
Then it matters what you do with it aswell.
In here i think its handled well, you have no choice but to relive his war and at the end you decide if he is guilty or not. At the end of it all it was real in what way does the character make peace with himself.
Imagine a story where a lot happens, turns out it was a "dream/vr", the story can just end there and it sucks as it caused drama without consequence, but if you have that reveal, even if the character has it aswell, but still cant let that go because of trauma and by the end the character is different because of what happened in the dream, then its fair story, its part of the characters reality.

>>725094797
Yes

>>725111484
How does it feel to kill a man just for being on the other side?

>>725093135
Idiots are pretending that shooting pixels at other pixels = killing.

>>725090048 (OP)
This game is a great example of the damage we caused to the media by investing all money on graphics and nothing on interactivity.
You're not fooled into pulling a titans on everyone.
You watch a movie that you have to reel manually and gets blamed for reeling the movie. bioshock kinda exploits it's own linearity quite well, but this game is dumb.

>>725112010
>You watch a movie that you have to reel manually
You don't actually think this. I know that you don't actually believe this is what games are. Literally just this one brings out this disingenuousness in people.

>>725111056
the good ending is walker getting gunned down by the u.n because he's a deranged mass murderer beyond saving. the issue lies in the fact that the writers want you to feel like his actions are your fault, despite game progression being locked behind said actions.

>>725112173
Bro think for one second. We are talking in terms of story. A linear story where your only choice is "beat the game" vs "don't beat the game" is, in fact a movie where you reel manually.
>b-but gameplay
not relevant to the current discussion.

>>725091310
>war simulator
war is when US sends three goys to sand place

>>725091319
You wish

>>725112468
>art grabs you by the arm and drags you into an alley filled with shit and needles
How jewish is this kike?

>>725091383
> This game made me realise how much i love human suffering
I would love to serve in a war as drone operator and drop bomb on bunch of helpless civilians and soldier or give them a false hope only to kill them when they feel secure

>>725090048 (OP)
I fully support the wars on terror and drugs. Fewer browns/criminals is a good thing for everyone.

>>725112173
Games that you have a choice in how the story goes are not like that.
But spec ops the line is not a game where you have a input on how the story goes.

>>725112341
Bro I have thought about it and concluded that this is a disingenuous analogy no one would ever think to apply to any video game unless they have a really vested interest in denying its inherently interactive nature and thus, their own undeniable involvement.

>>725091161
I never even realized that the dead civilians were supposed to have been killed by the WP, I thought they had been locked up by the muslim terrorists and starved to death. Finding their bodies only strengthened my resolve to see my mission through. It was only when I read about it later did I realize that the devs were trying to make me feel bad about war (unsuccessful)

>>725090735
>i paid for this book so it should have a happy ending and steer away from uncomfortable subjects

>>725096831
But what is it about shooting and killing people that you find entertaining? Why has it become entertainment? Extremely popular entertainment, in fact. What is our obsession with causing death rooted in? Why do we enjoy it? Yes, it’s not real. Obviously. But it’s still a simulated version of an incredibly heinous act. It’s violent and gory. Why do we enjoy it? How did we get to this point where kids are so exposed to it that it’s the norm? What does that say about us as a society or even a species?

>>725091383
> This game made me realise how much i love human suffering I would love to serve in a war as drone operator and drop bomb on bunch of helpless civilians and soldier or give them a false hope only to kill them when they feel secure

>>725110015
No, I say that because it was my genuine feeling at my first playthrough. I turned around and tried to leave. Couldn't do it. So I played the game and all its teachings or morals were in effect on me as I'm not schizo that is the main character.

>>725092296
People kept refunding it instead of blowing up the civilians and the devs were getting salty.

>>725113003
>bluh bluh bluh interactive nature
we are talking about the story of a linear game. There is no interactivity beyond "beat this game you paid for or don't beat game you paid for".
The analogy is perfectly apt.

>>725112902
Neither does Super Mario Bros. So that is also a movie.

Why do these threads so consistently generate absolutely daft takes?

>>725097219
>Why don't you get the same entertainment from planting a garden in Stardew Valley or creating a metropolis in Cites: Skylines?
But I own all of those games too. What's with this retarded attempt at a gotcha?

>>725113350
>we are talking about the story of a linear game. There is no interactivity beyond the interactivity it has.
You don't understand the medium.

>war bad
powerful shit

>>725113516
Your fundamental argument is the same as saying "stop reading the book" or "stop watching the movie".
It's a linear game. There is no interactivity to be had.

>>725112842
>>725113091
Bitch

>>725113595
Games are interactive media. You control an avatar in this game, and the game requires your diegetic input.

Yes, it's different. But beyond that, "lel stop playing" ISN'T THE ACTUAL POINT RETARD

>>725090048 (OP)
i really should replay it one of this days. my favorite part is how they change as the game advances. When the game starts they are all like movie operators, super professional saying "contact" and asking for cover. By the ends its all just messed up, like "give me some fucking cover". The takedowns also change from clean style shots to just barbsric beatdowns. Man game is great.

>>725090048 (OP)
but i like bombing the browns doebiet?

>>725113595
>It's a linear game. There is no interactivity to be had.
PS this statement alone is so fucking dumb as to entirely disqualify you from discussing video games at all.

>>725096369
>There are people stupid enough to have played MGS, join the US army, and then unfortunately survive long enough to boast about it to David Hayter at a convention.
ngl, thats pretty funny. is there video of it, i wanna see his reaction.

I really liked this game. I dont self insert though. Its just not something I do. I'm just watching a character do things on screen like I would with a movie or tv show.

>>725113695
>>725113779
>diegetic imput
pressing the right trigger to shoot isn't any different than pressing play to watch the movie or using your hand to change the page.
>isn't the point
This is the classic argument of someone who has nothing to say but must say something.

>>725113853
>pressing the right trigger to shoot isn't any different than pressing play to watch the movie or using your hand to change the page.
Maybe if you're a boomer who has never played a game in his life, you would think so, yes.
>This is the classic argument of someone who has nothing to say but must say something.
Or it means you're missing the point. Retard.

>>725090735
nigga its a criticism on "i was just following orderd"

>>725113927
You just said "ur wrong" twice in a row, bro. Maybe try making a real argument next time.

>>725113951
Except that plenty of people realized that there were no orders anymore and they wanted to leave but the game doesn't give any option, and then the loading screen (directly stated to be an attack on the player by the writer of the game) go on how you're a bad person for playing the game.

>>725113951
Nigga, none of the things the lead writer wants to blame you for are your choice. You have no agency. They're scripted events. You're as good as a passive observer. No more culpable than someone watching a news report on murder is responsible for said murder.

You know who did have agency, though? The devs.
The devs conjured up the situation.
The devs made models for it.
The devs animated it.
The devs scripted it.
The devs made it happen.

The developers of the game are the real villains. And they're trying to shift the blame on (You). Isn't that outrageous?

>>725114047
I have made an argument. You're just unable to comprehend. I'm watching a feeble octogenarian trying to wrap his hole-riddled head around the concept of video games.
>Oh, so it's like... turning the page of a book?
No, peepaw, you're in control of the character. It's fundamentally different. If you don't grasp this distinction, we don't have a basis to begin to discuss this VIDEO GAME.

The hate for this game isn't real on this site. It's just all glow niggers upset a game makes the government and military look bad.

>>725114191
Who do you think Konrad is meant to represent?

>>725114192
>I totally made an argument!
And where is it?
>you're in control
ok, what can I do?
>keep playing until you beat the game
>stop playing or die an don't press continue
wow such interactivity

>>725114191
>I chose to pay for this game.
>I chose to play this game.
>You can't blame me.
BAAAAWWW I WAS DENIED MY GOOD FEELS AFTER MOWING DOWN CIVILIANS

Ah the final line of defense of the game is finally here.
Instead of actually making arguments, they'll just act disingenuous, and go for the "you don't get it" or "you missed the point" never actually forming a coherent argument beyond that.

>>725114425
>I made this awful, monstrous thing that glorifies murder and rape and mutilation
>what's that? you looked at it?
>YOU TERRORIST!!!! YOU'RE TO BLAME!!!
American logic at its finest.

>>725114425
>just don't play this 60$ game you bought bro
>just get spoiled on the story before buying the game bro
see, disingenuous.

>>725114352
>ok, what can I do?
PLAY THE GAME

>Okay so I can continue to the right and beat the game
>Or stop playing or die and don't press continue
wow Super Mario is such a movie game

>>725114425
>pay

>>725114454
You literally do not understand the medium well enough to discuss this video game, and you refuse, even after repeated attempts to explain it to you. You are genuinely too dumb for this game, and by extension, for any meaningful discussion surrounding games at all.
The irony is that, just like you did playing the game, again you are trying to blame others for your own failures. The arguments are right there for you to read. You just don't.

>>725114454
I just think these threads are just anons baiting each other desu

>>725114713
>no arguments
You could just actually make an argument. If you genuinely think people are missing the point, the logical thing to do is say
>the point is X
>this is why
instead of just repeating "I made an argument, you don't get it I totally made it".

>every choice has to have story impact or it isn't really a choice
Smells like millennial in here.

>>725091167
>"To kill for entertainment is harmless"
"it's just pixels" yeah pixels of WHAT?

>>725090048 (OP)
These are the retarded bullshit quotes that gaming journalist champion as deep and why they gave it high praises.

>>725114537
In terms of story super mario is linear with no interactivity yeah.
The gameplay is fun, but that's not relevant when discussing the story.
BTW, not a single person in the thread accused the game of being a "movie game" that has a completely different meaning.

>>725096734
>But you didn't have to buy the game. Why did you spend $60 on it?
I was told that it is deep and has something to say. I was lied to.

>>725090048 (OP)
Unironically, what "conflicting ideas" do they mean there?

>>725090048 (OP)
I still like the anime adaption of the game.

>>725090735
Nobody is going to be emotionally affected by crap like Undertale, though. It's a literal children's game, children don't even understand why killing is bad, they just like that a game allows you to kill every character (even if all of them are just low-effort 2D sprites), not because it's well written like Spec Ops.

>>725114962
I have repeatedly made an argument, Anon. You are simply refusing to get it. And the fact that you act like this regularly happens in these threads only means that you've already frustrated countless patient attempts to get you to think for once in your life. If you could only be humble enough to admit that there is something you do not get about this game, we could begin to teach you.

>>725115402
>writing that instead of just
>the argument is X
>this is why
lmao

>>725115097
>BTW, not a single person in the thread accused the game of being a "movie game" that has a completely different meaning.
You're right, they left off "game" entirely. Super Mario Bros. is a movie. Seeing the Super Mario Bros. movie is literally the same experience as playing Super Mario Bros.

>>725115361
>It's a literal children's game
it's a PEGI 16 game.

>>725115452
Why write it again when you've consistently shown your inability to grasp it anyway? You first have to accept that you're too dumb for video games. Then, when you're ready to stop being dumb, you can scroll up.

>>725114118
You've literally kept playing a game that forced you into murdering 50 innocent people including women and children. "muh scripted events" as if making pointless slaughter a mere option to be chosen out of curiosity on a second playthrough would be any better
YES you are evil.

>>725115563
Here we go, the next step when you have no arguments and cant elaborate on a point: Acting smug and throwing insults.

>>725115672
>You've literally kept playing a game
That I paid 60$ for and went in blind because I didn't want to be spoiled on the story.
>just stop playing and throw the 60$ in the trash bro
Devs should have made the game free if they really wanted to make a point, the cowards.

>>725115563
>Why write it again
You could just link the relevant post, you know. If you've already written it.

>>725104849
? What is there TO fly? It's not like characters are dropping n-words every 5 minutes

>>725115749
Fuck your money though? You've spent it on what would potentially be yet another generic CIA-backrolled brown people shooting simulator. For 60 bucks you can get like dozens of used books that you'd enjoy much more.

>>725115702
It's also the next step when my interlocutor is genuinely too dumb to understand what I am talking about and too proud to admit it.
>>725115760
Yes, I could. Do you think you'll suddenly grasp it if I did? No, of course you won't.

This conversation will not continue unless you can admit that the game went over your head.

>>725115825
I have to say that the "backrolled" was poorly uhh autocorrected.

>>725115672
Question. Who programmed the game? Who meticulously animated, scripted and sculpted the scene? Why isn't THAT obviously sick person being held responsible for these digital deaths? Why am I, merely an observer, being blamed instead?

>>725115749
What do you think the point is? If you think it's to get you to stop playing (I disagree): why make it easier for you to stop playing? What makes you think at any point that the devs wanted to give you an easy answer?

This is a game where there is no good ending. And for some reason, gamers really struggle with that.

>>725115849
>This conversation will not continue unless you can admit that the game went over your head.
Okay. It went over my head. I missed the point.

Will you explain it now? Thank you in advance.

>>725115941
>um i wasn't the one who created this sick, evil world
>time to napalm some gooks hehe :3
This is YOUR logic.

>>725115941
>merely an observer
You didn't play it?

>>725116019
>>725116043
Stop dodging the question. Why is the player to blame and not the developers?

>>725115998
All right. Then here's lesson one. Video games are not movies. Video games are interactive. Interactivity consists of everything you do to diegetically manipulate the game world.

Let this truth sink in, and you will receive the next lesson in another thread.

>>725116165
You've explained nothing. I rescind my thanks.

>>725115825
>just don't buy the game
not an argument.

>>725116248
"Don't buy it" is always, ALWAYS a valid argument. There is not a single case where it doesn't apply.

>>725115972
What do YOU think the point is?
There's plenty of games with bad endings, but none of them attack the player in the loading screen.

>>725090048 (OP)
/v/ doesn't want to talk about it because the writers are literal hippies who huff their own farts and they definitely meant for the loading screens to be directed at the player, it was said so in an interview
this would have been fine if they kept the section where you could kill the people killing civilians, but EVERY player proceeded to do that and try to save civilians so they decided to force it

>>725090048 (OP)
I wrote my tesis about this game. I'm very proud about It.

>>725116165
Ok, and what is the point?

>>725116113
Because nobody forced you to buy it. You chose to support that part of the industry that's essentially a propaganda machine for the US military.

Imagine if the multiplayer had three teams: Team A, Team B and Civilian Team. Team A and B are trying to kill the other team, capture the flag or whatever and the civilians just have to survive. Team A and B are not penalized for killing civilians.

L U D O

>>725116491
Nobody forced the devs to make it. They chose to support that part of the industry. Moreover, according to developer interviews, they chose to make the game darker and more violent despite the pushback from their employers to make it less so.

The developers are the real monsters. They are to blame. Not the player.

>>725116491
I also support the part of the industry that is a propaganda machine for the chinese government, so what?

>>725109072
same and it was only 6 euros. actually yesterday I was considering replaying it.

>>725116593
Most of them were wage labourers who couldn't give two shits about what the game they have to work on is about. The player... and the publisher. They're evil.

>>725116620
>giving more money to the part of the industry that's essentially a propaganda machine for the US military.
>wanting to kill more innocent fictional civilians
you monster

>>725116723
>The developers were only following orders!
Well, gee. Where have I seen this excuse before?

>>725102484
>a light jab
it's the entire premise, which falls flat because you aren't given a choice so not only is the story bad, disjointed and nonsensical, it also doesn't even practice what it preaches and actually give you a "win state" without doing war crimes. They LITERALLY stated in their interviews that when they let people actually make a choice, not a single person did war crimes, they preferred to take the harder route of gameplay to save people rather than do war crimes.

>>725103365
yeah, because it was a terrible game with a shit story with shit plotlines
i'd be glad we never have to deal with this pretentious gay shit ever again

>>725116779
Damn.

>>725113447
because people hate spec ops for being a pile of shit, falseflagging and trolling isn't going to cover the fact you buy a game only to be told to stop playing the game or your a faggot
this would have been fine, if there was a choice, but because there isn't a choice we get fucking threads about it every once in a while where people like you false flag and literally defend faggots who huff their own farts

>>725116561
I want to see a guerilla war game where both team Spec Ops and team Insurgents have to avoid pissing off the civilian population. If the population hate the Spec Ops they become hostile to them and start giving away intel, protesting and throwing molotovs at them. If it goes the other way, civilians start to rat out the Insurgents or might even lynch unlucky fighters caught by a mob.

>>725117318
Closest game would be Insurgency Inc

>>725117278
>this would have been fine, if there was a choice, but because there isn't a choice
This is how Nazis explained their rapings of 6 year old girls in Poland.

>>725116760
all jokes aside I had to see what the fuss was about. in the end it's a fine cover shooter but the story gave me a headache.

I THINK the point of the game was
>DON'T BUY GAMES ABOUT THE WAR IN THE MIDDLE EAST BECAUSE THEY'RE EVIL PROPAGANDA
Which kinda fell flat to me because I'm not american so the propaganda angle doesn't matter.
I see someone else saying "why do you enjoy games about killing"
because fictional killing isn't like real killing. I also enjoy peaceful city-building games like sim city, so it's not like I only enjoy fictional murder.

In the end, what is the actual message the devs were trying to send?
Can I get a real answer with no trolling?

>>725117679
>WAR BAD
>but also please give us money for making this war game where you commit war crimes, which we purposefully designed away the choices because we WANT the player to do warcrimes and feel bad about it(despite the fact that we think people who buy and play wargames are being propagandized)

undertale shits all over this game in every way

>>725117679
true america is the only nation on earth with military

>>725118084
I'm not russian or chinese either.

>>725113072
because death (and by consequence murder) is, or was, a natural thing, stripped from our mind by a sanitized societal system
we as gamers are just taking back what was ours

the fact this game still gets talked about semi-frequently proves it's at least worth playing once.
i don't get why so many spergs come out to call it shit, it's clearly memorable in some aspect otherwise people would've forgotten it alongside other shooters of the time like matt hazard , mindjack and alpha protocol.

>>725118376
bro

>>725118509
>Posts another american trooper from a different country

>>725118509
Imagine if he went on all fours and started firing the machine gun.

>>725118612
>>725118509
>>725118084
Wait hang on, so I got the message right? It really just is
>DON'T BUY GAMES ABOUT THE WAR IN THE MIDDLE EAST BECAUSE THEY'RE EVIL PROPAGANDA.
Why are people going "you didn't get the point" when people said that that is the point?

>>725118779
Not just the middle east. All wars. Yes, including *that* war. Including the Dresden bombings. Spec Ops fans are Nazis in disguise, wittingly or not.

>>725100601
>>725100693
>>725101430
oh wow, modern military shooters are totally causing people to join the army! kids and teens cannot distinguish fiction from reality and totally think they are going to be heroes in war! wow spec ops was totally criticizing a real issue that actually existed!

>>725118456
>alpha protocol.
Is a great game, fuck you.

>>725113765
Dick Cheney you're supposed to be dead

>>725090735
>In Spec Ops The Line there's no way to complete your initial mission of finding out what's going on, call in the cavalry and go home.
stormwall cut the comms and walker assumed command and ordered a rescue mission. he didnt do anything wrong here. the game is about justification of carnage. it's okay to kill cia armed refugees because we're just returning fire. it's okay to kill fellow US soldiers when we're just defending ourselves. even the unarmed burka girl deserved to die, shouldnt had spooked me. dumb bitch. but the wp part is mask off moment and theres no justification for it. so the game generates a villain and now it's conrad's fault. and everything is conrads fault until in the end you get rugpulled again that maybe there isnt any good reason to justify all the crap that happened here. players happily did all these things with the promise that a big bad moustache twirling final boss would take the blame and give them absolution.

>>725090048 (OP)
>you are still talking about it
Spec Ops won
You lost
It will be played for generations because of your emotional reaction

>>725120254
>players happily did all these things with the promise that a big bad moustache twirling final boss would take the blame and give them absolution
absolution for what, playing the game? lmao, you sound so dramatic

>>725118509
I'm not German either.

>>725119627
that no one remembers or talks about.

>>725119551
yes they are that's literally what propaganda is for

>>725121142
>literally ignores the data right in front of him
(you)

>>725121347
now show me the data from the universe with no videogames in it. that's right, it's even lower than what we have now.

>>725120676
absolution for things you cant justify with your own moral code. it's why the game makes people so mad. the promise of relief and the complete denial of it.

>>725121571
...again justify what? violence against pixels?

>>725092248
The point is they're not judging you like you're judging them for "judging you". They're writing a story and a few loading screen tips and presenting the content as they present it. The only judgement is yours of your own guilt. The game is attempting to illuminate thing to you, you're the one coming to the conclusion that they're judging you, because you're projecting.
You know what's actually in that interview you didn't read? A whole lot of a developer hoping you felt something, which you did. Then you reacted to it by throwing a tantrum.

>>725111806
Yeah, the game's writer is pretty dumb.

>>725112468
Read that again, he's not talking about woke politics or whatever you're trying to paint it as, he's saying if you make a moral choice available in a game you shouldn't be worried about how the audience will take it if it fits the artistic idea you're attempting to convey.
So if you're making something to feel like a disgusting choice you shouldn't hold back, so that it might actually impact the player in some way, instead of being bland and inoffensive.

>>725113816
This. I just flat out ignore the few times the game addresses the player because it serves no purpose to themes of the game.

>>725090048 (OP)
Well fundamentally it’s a mediocre to bad shooter with a sort of neat story and probably too much railroading. It’s a 6/10 buoyed by the surprise of people that haven’t played this sort of thing before.

>>725124216
i still think nier managed to have the best balance of connecting the player while showcasing how bad war is, especially in the end where it reminds you that you aren't nier despite giving his name by locking you in a room of with a ton the monsters you just learned mere moments ago were the real humans, with him not giving two shits about it because all he cares about is getting his sister/daughter back, all of this right before the final boss who is the same person as him with the same intentions and nier saying he's nothing like him

>>725120912
Being remembered doesn't mean it's a good game. People still remember superman 64.

>>725120912
it was just mentioned on gameranx as a good game that flopped

>>725126083
correction, it's a vid from last year, but still