>>81946139
>Turns out we were both khhv weirdos dating for the first time at 18, which is kinda nice.
>18
Anon, you are super lucky. When you're older, women expect you to have some money.

I'm 25, and have never gotten to the point of having sex with a girl besides a couple escorts back in 2018, so I'm virtually a virgin. I do receive NEETbucks and occasionally work for my dad at his job without pay, but I'm essentially unemployed. I can't work any normal 9 to 5 or A time to B time job due to my insomnia which I believe is at least mostly caused by OCD. I'm planning on going back to college this year for something like engineering or mathematics, but at the moment, I'm pretty fucked, and I graduated high school when I was 17.

I had my first kiss at 15 with a 24-year-old predator in 2015. She was probably a 6/10. We made out. We also held hands. I'm not sure if we hugged, but I was feeling her up. I turned 25 last month. I did lose my virginity at 18, but very regrettably so to an ugly escort. One or two days later, I had sex with a nicer escort who was short and a 4/10 to make up for the horrible experience. Her pussy was really tight, but I only had sex with her for around 5 minutes. I also met three girls on one occasion each for feet worship from the time I was 17, with the last time having been in November 2022. That's it. That's my entire sexual history. I blame covid for fucking up my life from March 2020 to January 2024. I was pretty much at home the entire time. I have interacted with women at the gym a few times since then, though.

I need to lose around 60 pounds of fat, and I should be somewhere around a 7 or 8/10 by that point, since I'm jacked since I started lifting in 2013. I've even been on steroids since August 31st, 2024. I hope to find a way to make more money in the future, but there is so much uncertainty at the moment. Thank you if you've read all this. I would actually send a small amount of bitcoin if you drop an address.

When it comes to short term dating / hooking up, men typically have to settle for whatever they can get. If you want casual sex with 5/10+ women on a somewhat regular basis, you pretty much have to be an 8/10+, possibly 7/10 if you're lucky, chad. It's the opposite for dating / long term dating. Women typically have to settle for what they can get, while men try to get the best woman they can get. So ideally, the man and the woman get their looksmatch, ignoring things like one partner potentially having a disgustingly large amount of money.

For short term dating / hooking up, looks is pretty much all that matters. As a man, you'll work towards maximizing your looks, getting lean and jacked. For dating / long term dating, not being mentally ill and having money matter way more. The neurotypical man with a lot of wealth is going to have way more success here, and the broke and mentally ill man is going to have the least. Both short term and long term dating are unfair, but I believe it's easier for men to improve on their looks to achieve 7/10+ looks than it is to drastically improve on mental illness and become wealthy. It's easier for the average man to improve his short term dating success than it is for the average man to improve his long term dating success.

Chad pretty much always gets all the girls, but tons of women will be unavailable to you for long term dating if you're poor, and tons of women will break up with you if they don't want to put up with your mental illness. Success in long term dating is almost necessary for reproduction, unless you knock up a crazy or low-IQ girl.

Women will always be hypergamous. Self esteem typically plays a role in what type of partner you can get, and women typically have lower self esteem than men, but they still typically have higher standards than men.

When it comes to short term dating / hooking up, men typically have to settle for whatever they can get. If you want casual sex with 5/10+ women on a somewhat regular basis, you pretty much have to be an 8/10+, possibly 7/10 if you're lucky, chad. It's the opposite for dating / long term dating. Women typically have to settle for what they can get, while men try to get the best woman they can get. So ideally, the man and the woman get their looksmatch, ignoring things like one partner potentially having a disgustingly large amount of money.

For short term dating / hooking up, looks is pretty much all that matters. As a man, you'll work towards maximizing your looks, getting lean and jacked. For dating / long term dating, not being mentally ill and having money matter way more. The neurotypical man with a lot of wealth is going to have way more success here, and the broke and mentally ill man is going to have the least. Both short term and long term dating are unfair, but I believe it's easier for men to improve on their looks to achieve 7/10+ looks than it is to drastically improve on mental illness and become wealthy. It's easier for the average man to improve his short term dating success than it is for the average man to improve his long term dating success.

>>81841716
I don't have any signs of aging in my face. I could achieve 8/10 looks through getting lean (I'm already jacked and on steroids.), and a lot of women actually unironically prefer the faces of men in their 30s. I'm 25, so I've got plenty of time. I don't feel old. Most men won't show signs of bodily weakness until they're in their late 30s or early 40s if they've been lifting for years. There could even potentially be a younger girl who is a trust fund kid who would essentially be paying me to be her boyfriend. The reason I'm looking for an older woman is honestly because I have a bit of a fetish for them (Women in their 30s are the best. Also, I made out with a 24-year-old woman when I was 15.), but also because she would likely have a house and not be worried about displeasing her wealthy daddy by choosing a bum like me. (I still get NEETbucks, so I wouldn't be a total financial parasite.) I don't actually want to be a parasite, so I would be doing work around the house and cooking meals for her and helping her with various things. (My dad is a chef, so I know a lot.)

>>81799233
hi anon
i should really watch madoka magica

Let's say you're an incel, but you're not a quitter. You started going to the gym and got really seriously about education / making money and worked on living with whatever mental illnesses you have, along with learning lots of useful skills, like DIY repairs and cooking. Years pass by, and you're now a 30-year-old virgin with a chad 8/10+ body and an income of $120,000, but, even with going out to socialize to improve your social autism, you're still a mentally-ill social autist, and most women can detect this and get some level of ick from it.

So, you're now a high SMV man, but you still have to live with mental illness, and you have no sexual experience. Also, just because you're making $120,000 at 30 doesn't mean you're wealthy. Wealth takes years to build up. We're assuming you suddenly somehow developed an income of $120,000 at 30. Wealthy girls with rich daddies are still out of reach, even if they're 3/10.

Essentially, after all these years of self improvement, you can now finally get an average woman around your age, average in income and looks. (2020s Stacy will likely recognize the insane monetary value attached to her body and go with a rich guy.) The thing is, a lot of these average women will still be turned off by your social autism and mental illness weirdness, so you'd still have to put some additional work in to get one of these women.

The easiest, most stable girlfriend you could get would likely be a loser girl around your age. To me, the most important thing is that she's sweet and that she's at least not crazy in a way that could hurt you. She could be an unemployed druggie, and she would view you as this amazing man coming to save her and give her a quality of life she thought she would never be able to attain. Statistically speaking, she would likely have a ton of sexual experience while you have none, and possibly even a child. You would need to fix her up a bit, but afterwards, you could marry her and have a child of your own.

I know deep down inside once I get to the point I'm high SMV overall, HOPEFULLY by the time I'm in my early 30s (I turned 25 in June.), that I'll gladly take a girlfriend, even if it feels like a raw deal, since she would've given her best years to young chad. Exercise is most important for your mental health, but having a sexual partner comes second. I'm always going to feel some resentment over this fact.

As a mentalcel, if I ever do achieve a high SMV, it will have been through massive self improvement efforts over many years. I've got OCD, which fucks you over in life in multiple ways. I am not a quitter. I've made lots of progress with time, but damn, there are somehow guys who have seemingly little issue getting girlfriends and getting sex starting in high school, despite not being high achievers or even being far below-average losers, yet social autists like me have to make massive changes to ourselves over many years just to get a girlfriend.

I got back into lifting in January 2024, and I've lost a ton of fat and gained a ton of muscle, including a lot of the muscle I had back when I was 19 before covid. I even started taking steroids at the end of August. I still need to lose around 60 pounds of fat before I'll be lean, though. I do receive NEETbucks, but this is not sustainable, and I'm not going to be able to get a girlfriend while being low income and living with my dad. I occasionally help my dad at work for free, but I haven't been able to get a job all these years due to insomnia caused by OCD. I am incapable of maintaining any sort of schedule. My insomnia has gradually gotten better, and I've made tons of improvements, but I still cannot hold any sort of job that requires me to be present from A time to B time. My current plan is to go back to college this year to study mechanical engineering. I'm hoping that with a mechanical engineering degree, that I could land some sort of job that would be more flexible. I can't think of an alternative.

I've concluded that there are two main reasons why I'm an incel.

The biggest one is mental illness. I have OCD. This shit screws you over in life in multiple ways. It is known for people with OCD to lose their virginity at an older age and have less sexual partners, and this includes females with OCD.

The second biggest reason, which is much less significant than the first, is being poor. If I were hypothetically born into a top 1% family, even with my OCD, I'm almost certain I would be way more successful with women. Being poor in general has greatly limited me in life, and wealth generally translates into freedom. I would've been able to go out and find some women, even if they were sugar babies and gold diggers. Fuck, I don't doubt for a second that I could've found some women who would've been seriously interested in marrying and reproducing with me. Even gold diggers often have a strong desire to reproduce, and they don't seem to care if they reproduce with a 3/10 if he's loaded, and that would also lock them in with the rich guy. Even if I weren't interested in a sugar baby or girlfriend, I would've been able to afford all the sex work I could've dreamed of. I would've met some women I regularly did kinky shit with, even though I would've been paying them for their company. This would still be a massive improvement from being an incel. Going back to classical antiquity and for most of human history, the stereotype was that the rich guys got all the beautiful women, not the "chads" or highly physically attractive men. Compared to men, women seemingly value money more than sex.

>comecei a me candidatar para ser dev estágiario/júnior
>mais de três empresas me pediram para fazer teste de "raciocínio lógico"
>literalmente putaria de ensino fundamental, equação de primeiro grau, diagrama de venn e silogismos aristotélicos
porra, chega a ser humilhante ter que fazer isso.

Lots of anons have told me that looks is all there is to attracting women. Although I believe women are very visual, they're not hypervisual like men. I've actually recently begun theorizing that men by default have negative sexual value, and that their sexual value becomes less negative as they become more physically attractive. This is apparent via escort prices. In the US, an 8/10 stacy will cost you $2000 for one hour of sex, while there are plenty of chads who have stacy girlfriends without having to cough up any money. Hell, even a 3/10 or possibly 2/10 escort in her mid to late 30s will cost an average of around $500 in the US. This tells me there are tons of wealthy, likely older, beta males with low SMV who just happen to have a lot of money. (Older people tend to have more money.) Escort prices have been increasing over the years faster than the rate of inflation.

The only men who have positive sexual value attributed to their bodies are going to be literal 10/10 chads, and possibly a few 9/10s. Not even 8/10 chads are going to have positive sexual value, because tons of 4/10 to 6/10 beckies could easily hook up with them, so why would they pay for their time? 8/10 chads have neutral sexual value, and they'd still have to put in a bit of work to score with an 8/10 stacy. Meanwhile, men will pay $200 or sometimes $300 for one hour with a 1/10 woman in her mid 30s to mid 40s. 10/10 chads have similar monetary value attached to their bodies as hideous 1/10 women.

Women seem to care a lot about wealth and status, as well. Women will often perceive the man getting the most attention from women as being the most attractive. This has to do with status. I've also heard that personality plays a role, but it's pretty much just masculine personality traits, so anything that makes you appear strong or like you have a high self esteem / confidence (even if you're actually a loser irl, but for some reason, you're programmed to always have a high self esteem).

Do you anons bring any nice foods and drinks with you to bed for those rare occasions where you want to drink something sweet or eat a small amount of food? What would you place near your bed? For me, I would place some nice sweet teas, some fruit, some pie slices, and some fat-free Greek yogurt for protein. I hadn't tried this yet. I want to do it, but I don't know what you anons have tried or do with your setups.

I'm still a bit flustered at the fact that most Americans lost their virginity in high school, while I, as a recently-turned 25-year-old man, would still be a virgin today had I not experimented with sex work when I was 18. I had girls crushing on me in high school, and I likely stood a chance with a couple women, including a 24-year-old woman who made out with me when I was 15.

Anyway, men seem to start dating and having sex in high school. What is the average age at which men will move in with their girlfriend or the other way around? I figure this isn't often done when either of you are still living with your parents. From my research, couples typically start moving in together in their mid to late 20s.

Bump.

I hate doctors. Don't ever go to a doctor where you'll be seeing residents all the time. I recently turned 25, but I remember a year ago right before turning 24 asking for some finasteride, and they refused to prescribe it to be, essentially telling me I don't need it. The purpose of the medication is to prevent balding. How the fuck would a 24-year-old taking finasteride be problematic? I'm pretty sure if I were in the EU (I am based in the US.) that I could just walk up to a pharmacy and buy some finasteride with my own cash without a prescription. I hate how doctors have this much power over your health. It makes me feel like I'm still legally a child.

Fortunately, I don't appear to have any balding at the moment, but I really don't want to see any androgenic balding.

I could go on and on, bringing up actual controlled substance prescriptions, like sleeping pills, stimulants, and opioids, but that would take a while. Doctors have too much power over people.

I've been told repeatedly over the years that women have sex drives just as high as men, but that they are just programmed to only want to have sex with chad, so they essentially almost only get turned on by men who are 8/10+. Although this behavior is observable irl, I'm still unconvinced that women have the same sex drives as men.

When men take really high doses of androgens for the purpose of gaining muscle and strength, they experience increases in sex drive. This is commonly known about and experienced. When women take even small amounts of androgens, like anavar, for the same purpose, they typically experience even larger increases in sex drive. This is commonly known about and experienced. When trannies take their hrt and get really low levels of androgens in their blood, their sex drives typically plummet and they even often have difficulties getting aroused enough to get an erection. This is commonly known about and experienced. Therefore, on a biological level, at least in large part due to hormones, it is likely the case that women, on average, have smaller sex drives than men. I suspect this is in part evolutionary to make women even more hypergamous. There's an evolutionary reason for around 110 men being born for every 100 women. Of course, some women are nymphomaniacs, but this isn't the norm, and outside of maybe a few social groups, women like this are pretty rare.

The top 18% of Americans have a net worth of $1,000,000 or more, and the top 1% of Americans have a net worth of $11,000,000 or more. 1 in 5 Americans have $1,000,000 or more in assets. For those from low-income families who essentially inherit nothing, $1,000,000 alone, after taxes, is a very difficult task to achieve that most people who are very disciplined and work very hard won't achieve until they're older, likely in their 40s, and this would require far above average effort, and 1/5th of Americans have this level of wealth.

How the fuck is someone supposed to acquire $11,000,000 through hard work? You could tell somebody that if they did X, Y, and Z, and were very consistent and disciplined, that they could, somewhat realistically, become an elite athlete, as in be in the top 1% in an athletic discipline. You absolutely cannot say the same with entering the top 1% wealth-wise.

Let's say there is a very disciplined and intelligent 12-year-old boy by the name of Jacob. Jacob works really hard in school, getting top grades, and is interested in entering the top 1% by the time he's 35. (He doesn't want to wait until he's some old fuck before he's rich.) Let's give Jacob an IQ of 130 to give him a bit of an advantage without making him a literal genius and have him be born into a low income family with no prospect of inheriting any wealth. What should Jacob do from this moment to virtually ensure that he will develop a net worth of $11,000,000 by the time he's 35? Don't forget about taxes. When you're a high earner, the government takes away half of your income.

Also, it's worth noting that income inequality is about the same in the US as it is in Europe, but wealth inequality is way worse.

>>235611
>instead of just acknowledging that person's accomplishment, feels so outclassed that they have to imagine shooting him to feel better about themselves
I'm not one of these anons. I don't do martial arts, but I really want to in the future. My little brother does boxing. I train really hard in the gym to build my body and get super strong, and I started lifting in 2013. I feel pretty good about myself for working towards improving myself every day. However, there is one thing that really pisses me off and makes me super jealous: rich people.

You can tell people that if they did X, Y, and Z, and worked really hard consistently over so many years, that they could realistically stand a chance at being an elite athlete, as in being in the top 1% in an athletic discipline. You absolutely cannot tell somebody that if they did X, Y, and Z, that they would realistically stand a chance at entering the top 1% wealth-wise. If you're in the top 1% in the US in 2025, you have a net worth of at least $11,000,000. (18% of Americans have a net worth of $1,000,000.) How the fuck are you supposed to gain anywhere near that amount of wealth, in 2025 dollars, within your lifetime? Don't forget about taxes. Also, being rich doesn't really matter when you're old, anyway. Funnily enough, income inequality is about the same in the US and Europe, but wealth inequality is way greater in the US. It largely has to do with inheritance. Don't forget there are tons of people out there who get underpaid, even if they're making something like $80,000 per year, and there are tons of people getting overpaid with several millions of dollars per year.

>>81566987
>as you two can keep contact for a bit before you ask her and dont be weird you might have a shot. make it clear that you are ambitious, maybe even start on that degree.
I would either contact her through facebook or through a friend I still have contact with. What would I even say? I still don't feel ready. I want to at least have a car before I message her. I technically work for my dad occasionally, but I don't get paid for it. My dad is the chef of a kitchen, but he doesn't own the place, and if I received a salary, I would lose my NEETbucks. As for employment, so I don't sound like a loser, I would just tell her I work for my dad in his kitchen. I would really want to be enrolled at college before contacting her, so I could show her my ambition, but maybe this wouldn't be discussed until the actual date. I'm still a bit fat, and this hurts my self esteem, so I should probably lose around 40 more pounds before even seeing her. I've actually never been on a date before or had a girlfriend before. My first sexual experience was when I made out with a 24-year-old woman when I was a 15-year-old freshman, and I regrettably lost my virginity to an ugly, old prostitute when I was 18.

I'm 25, and I still don't have a driver license. I plan on going back to college this year, and I am seriously going to need a license if I actually want to be successful this time around. From my research, my state provides a massive PDF for all the rules of the road and everything you need to know. I have this PDF saved. The thing is, it's super long, and I know I would forget a lot of stuff. Are there any videos I could watch that go over everything, especially the most important stuff? I actually want to be a good driver, so I'll go over the important stuff in that PDF afterwards. I am based in the US.

I've got OCD, and this has seriously fucked my life up more than anything else. I turned 25 two days ago, and from the time I was 17 after graduating high school to today, I haven't made any real progress. I have been receiving NEETbucks since I was 21, but it's really not that much, and I haven't been able to find a job that works with my OCD insomnia. I cannot work any job that requires me to be on a schedule: to work from A time to B time.

It's been so long, nearly 8 years, and I have to do something. I'm deciding to go back to college this year to seriously study mechanical engineering. Even if I lose the money on the initial investment through not being able to find an engineering job, it still would've been worth having taken a shot. You typically get more flexibility with high-skill jobs like engineering. I'm not giving up. I also seriously got back into lifting January 2024, and this year, I want to take my life even further.

Anyway, I was born into a poor family, and I have no money saved up. I only have around $700 in disposable income each month. I live with my dad.

I just feel like a complete shithead for having been an incel all this time. I feel like even if I did eventually get a decent paying job, all the women available to me would be used up roasties with decent body counts and way more experience with other men.