Thread 718979194

This gif makes playerfags seethe. It's like magic

I thought it was obvious the soul belongs to Dess

>>718979194 (OP)
Anon, just because your phone turns on auto-brightness doesn't mean it's not still you on the phonecall
The SOUL is canonically a DEVICE you control

>>718980479
Auto brightness doesn't heal niggas

>>718980807
It heals your eyes from the strain of squinting in the sun.

im expecting a piccolo edit one of these days

>>718980479
But it wasn't a conscious decision made by you. You were never with them in the dark, someone else is.

>>718980983
>But it wasn't a conscious decision made by you.
That doesn't change the fact that you're still controlling the SOUL. Your own human body does shit without conscious thought all the time, retard; do you have to think to digest your food? Do you have to think to reflexively remove your hand from a hot stove?
And, again, the SOUL is still a device controlled BY YOU. Devices do shit without asking the user constantly, how many times have you let Windows auto-update?

>>718981119
Kris does something without our input and you rightfully assert that he's not you. The soul does something without you, and you can't accept that it's not you.

>>718981241
Kris isn't literally referred to as a DEVICE in the files, retard.

>>718981286
You aren't a device.

>>718981330
Are my posts calling you a faggot retard suddenly not made by me because I'm using a device called a "computer" to make them, faggot retard?

why bring up this and not the fact that the soul is what closes the fountains, and does so seemingly just as independently as this

>>718981364
You're not the soul anymore than you are Kris because you control both. What about that aren't you understanding?

>>718981419
Gee, anon, I can't believe you suddenly aren't being retarded on the internet because you're doing it through a computer. That's crazy how that works.

>>718981386
I mean if I had it in gif form I'd post it.

The heart also closes the fountain at the end of each chapter without player input or consent.
Any reason why this theory only showed up now and not during chapter 1 and 2?

>>718979194 (OP)
This again? Guess I'll post this again too. In my opinion if Deltarune is trying to do the meta thing with the soul it would be stupid honestly. Not being able to communicate with anyone in the game on any sort of level despite you knowing what's going on just doesn't make any sense if the soul is supposed to be you in that way

>>718981457
Yes anon, I am my computer.

>>718981573
>Not being able to communicate with anyone in the game on any sort of level despite you knowing what's going on just doesn't make any sense if the soul is supposed to be you in that way
You're implying the player is the only one who knows what's going on.
The opposite is most likely true. It's very clear everyone else knows what's going on, and the player is in the dark.
What use would the player communicating be in that case?

>>718981573
>Not being able to communicate with anyone in the game on any sort of level despite you knowing what's going on just doesn't make any sense if the soul is supposed to be you in that way
You're unironically making the "but why can't I use my meta knowledge in the exact way I just thought of" argument?

>>718981643
>>718981645
>Hey here's this meta game and you're a part of it but fuck you, you can't even talk to any of the characters about it
Doubt that's the point of this game there's obviously something far more interesting going on

>>718981573
>Not being able to communicate with anyone in the game on any sort of level despite you knowing what's going on just doesn't make any sense if the soul is supposed to be you in that way
The SOUL is a rudimentary device which needs an intermediary to achieve higher functions. It's why the save screen looks like picrel before you beat Chapter 1. It's why all of the dialog options are clearly using Kris's thoughts until you play weird route, at which point the act of the SOUL speaking directly through Kris in any fashion is so reality-breaking that it causes the snowflakes on Noelle's wallpaper to move. It's why, during the creation of the vessel at the start of the game, you deliberately had to give it personality traits and characteristics; without a basis to work off of, you can't do shit through the SOUL besides maybe move around. It needs an actual VESSEL, not just a shell.

>>718981713
>you can't even talk to any of the characters about it
Again, if you could tell Kris anything, his answer would be
>I already know, you fucking retard
YOU are the one who's being left out.

>>718981713
>the game should work the way I say because that's how using metaknowledge is supposed to work!

>>718981789
No because I doubt he's aware this is a game, Chara didn't know Undertale was game. That's just not the way these games are meta this isn't DDLC

>>718979194 (OP)
People who think the soul is literally (You) were always retarded.

We literally saw this exact twist in Undertale already. Frisk wasn't (You).

>>718981763
Very well put anon.

>>718981897
We saw it with Chara and Frisk and yet these people think it'll be any different.

>>718981897
>Frisk wasn't (You).
Yeah because Frisk was (You)r vessel, retard. Undertale just fumbled the whole dynamic by muddying it with the whole "naming the fallen child" bit. Deltarune is clearly playing the whole focus on the "dynamic between player and character when both parties are aware of the divide" shit way more directly.

>>718981981
Exactly, you weren't a part of Undertale's narrative either

The soul is actually the heart of Lorkhan.

>>718981981
>Undertale just fumbled the whole dynamic by muddying it with the whole "naming the fallen child" bit.
That and Chara being the weakest point of the game really but people will never admit that

>>718982098
heart.png ain't got shit on the heart of lorkhan let's be real

>>718982116
Deltarune is like if you took the weakest point of Undertale and made it the entire game

>>718981763
This doesn't prove the soul is you.

>>718982197
>weakest point of Undertale and made it the entire game
Elaborate

>>718982054
Are you daft? The separation between Player and Character is the entire ending twist of both routes in Undertale, Toby just got hamhanded with it and, in his attempt to drive the point home by having "The (You) that exists when you name a character in an RPG" exist as a separate character so that he can have it either lecture you directly (Genocide) or by proxy (Pacifist), he accidentally created a really confusing metaphor that to retards who can't fathom the idea of "author fumbles his own point" looks like "OH ACTUALLY IT WAS A SPOOKY DEMON KID THE WHOLE TIME".

Deltarune, in all four chapters so far, has made it ABUNDANTLY clear that it's essentially playing the same dynamic as Undertale far, far more directly by removing the stupid fucking intermediary party and just having (You) pilot a literal control device rather than split it with more metaphorical bullshit that didn't work, and SOMEHOW retards like you are still missing the point and think the SOUL has any character or direction beyond being THE LITERAL DEVICE BY WHICH (YOU) INTERACT WITH THE WORLD.

>>718982129
I dunno, man, could Susie punch the soul and just obliterate it? I don't think so.

the soul is me the boy is me the goat and the dino are also me i am omnipresent and do not care

>>718982280
I doubt the soul has no character because it does shit on its own

>>718982354
the heart of lorkhan was never destroyed, it can't be because it's one with nirn

>>718982426
Sure looked destroyed when I punched it.

>>718982367
>because it does shit on its own
See
>>718981119
>>718980479

>>718982447
nobody knows where it went but that doesn't mean it was destroyed in the same way the dwemer didn't necessarily die, let's say it was destroyed, the nerevarine destroyed it then. susie ain't got shit on a tes player character

>>718982448
So? It's obviously conscious

>>718982569
Do you consider your phone and computer to be conscious?

>>718982613
Bro it's a HEART. A SOUL

At least one of these anons should play INSIDE.

>>718979194 (OP)
Why would it when the game makes it clear that it's the opposite.

>>718982494
>susie ain't got shit on a tes player character
You wanna say that to her fucking face, bitch?

>>718982679
At least one of these anons should play OUTSIDE
In traffic

>>718982650
>it's a HEART. A SOUL
It's a DEVICE. The game literally internally refers to it as such.

Did you shed a tear for him?

>>718982758
woaaah heaven let your light shine down
>>718982762
uhhhh ja

DR is just Marathon Toby just hasn't realized it yet

>>718979194 (OP)
You've been spamming threads with this 24/7 for a week straight and I still have no idea what I'm supposed to see here.

I don't care about the OP discussion, I'm just here to release my Deltarune autism rant.
To be clear, I believe Dess is The Knight, but every time someone brings up the possibility that Rudy could be the Knight, the response is always, "He's sick, retard. He couldn't possibly bring Undyne to the shelter." but literally no one would be capable of dragging Undyne to the shelter, so using that argument against Rudy specifically obviously makes no fucking sense regardless of his health. That bitch is benching CARS in chapter 2. Therefore, it stands to reason that one of three things likely happened:
>The Knight had help
>The Knight convinced her to go willingly (unlikely in my opinion)
>The Knight had access to their powers in the light world
All of which Rudy would have been perfectly capable of. The ACTUAL good evidence against it is that Rudy and Kris can be alone together in chapter 1, but nothing suspicious is said, which would be odd if they're in cahoots, but there could be an explanation.
If it weren't for that and The Knight's sword briefly appearing as a bat, I'd 100% believe it's Rudy. It'd fit Dess more cleanly into the 'lost girl' role, and Rudy not being willing to let go of the fantasy of having his daughter back would fit the themes of Deltarune perfectly. Okay autism rant over.

>>718982821
why does your head look like a slapped ass and or a red ballsack

it isn't (you). it isn't dess. it is Kris' SOUL.

the allegory of a troubled teen fighting against their own human soul is so obviously perfect for this teen drama

if you can't see that I legitimately pity you

>>718982924
how dare kris take responsibility for his actions

>>718982924
>it isn't (you). it isn't dess. it is Kris' SOUL.
It's a DEVICE (You) control. Stop being retarded. Why would Kris rip out his own SOUL if not to avoid external influence? Why would Ralsei deliberately engineer situations in which he can tell (You) to look somewhere else while he talks to Kris?

>>718983026
>A soul is a device
You're an inhuman golem

>>718983026
Why would Kris want to hide a nefarious scheme from his own conscience? Wow that's a real conundrum.

>>718983026
i suspect hours of wiki autism has given you theoryfags brain damage

>>718982924
The SOUL was originally Kris's but we've seized control of it, like we did to Frisk in Undertale
After playing Chapter 4 if you still haven't accepted that Kris and the SOUL are different entities you're just being willfully ignorant

>>718981386
>>718981570
If the player is supposed to be the soul then what exactly is the explanation on these cases?

>>718983160
>>718982448

>King of ero-games
>Magnum opus is about (You) being nothing more than a useful grunt that is used and hated by everyone in the game and then thrown away once (You) are no longer needed and guilt-tripped about playing the game in the first place
>COC2 makes the player character nothing more than a useful grunt that is used by everyone
Bravo Toby. Dunk on those gamer chuds!

>>718982860
Third Entity or some shit when it's clearly just the fact the SOUL is both a tool and a way to interact with world for Us

>>718983190
But it's totally (you), right. I totally make important decisions that save the world automatically without lifting a finger.

>>718982924
These are the same people who haven't figured out the Vessel stuff is about body dysphormia. At this point they're unlikely to ever 'get' Deltarune

>>718983212
Playerfags unironically pray for this to be the point of the game.

>>718983242
>DUDE MY PHONE AUTOMATICALLY TURNS THE BRIGHTNESS UP WHEN IT'S IN THE SUN
>I CANT BELIEVE IT DOES EVERYTHING ON ITS OWN AND MAKES AND ANSWERS PHONECALLS FOR ME EVEN THOUGH I'M THE ONE USING IT
Retard.

>>718979194 (OP)
I have literally no idea what this is supposed to imply.

>>718983310
>Closing fountains = Autobrightness
That's dumb.

>>718983212
>(You) are no longer needed and guilt-tripped about playing the game in the first place
Not really no
>and hated by everyone in the game
Just Kris and that's only due to his circumstances he facing

>>718983297
No, it's faggots like you that are praying for that.

only two months have passed and theoryniggers have already gone completely insane

>>718983401
>No u
Why the hell would I want that? That's absolute dogshit

>>718982924
It's Kris's soul, but also you're an alien infection taking control of it via Gaster bullshit.
If it was JUST Kris rejecting his humanity/conscious/intrusive thoughts stuff like not opening the door, not imagining the Knight's face, stopping (you) from seeing the shelter code and other general fourth wall gags about the player's pov, would make zero sense because the soul would then have no in-universe reason to not already be privy to Kris's knowledge. Even full Dissociative Identity Disorder with compartmentalized off memories wouldn't explain the perspective stuff.

>>718983357
Why? It's an absence of light. In the same way your phone starts turning up the brightness in reaction to photons, why can't the DEVICE react to negative photons?

>>718983415
The people I see being insane are all the ones mad about a theory.

>>718983160
It's fucking Kris
All of the stupid shit you keep using as evidence for your third entity bullshit is just Kris using the soul

>>718983278
I'm sure this post wasn't made in earnest, and I'm the fool. But whatever anyone thinks they actually know about the vessel, aside from that it was originally intended to be a goner host for the soul that was intercepted for some reason, is just unsupported fan theories (fan fiction). The information we have just isn't there to draw any conclusions about it beyond that, symbolic or otherwise.

>>718983525
You're really stretching it to fit the narrative you want that's all I'm saying

>Um player is le bad
No not really

I want Kris to kiss Asriel

>>718983160
You mean the thing where they play the triumphant rendition of the main theme called "YOUR POWER"?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sb71Mz8Cbtw

The idea that "this thing in the game can't represent me unless I have total agency over it at all times" is an idiotic kind of autism. Nobody sincerely believes that this is a reasonable argument to be making.
Like all of Toby's game projects Deltarune is partly about exploring the relationship and role of a player within a game, and in any game where anything is supposed to happen there are going to be things that inevitably have to be done to progress. You can't refuse to seal the fountain because the story needs to progress. You can't tell Kris to side with Susie instead of Ralsei in Chapter 1 or make Kris kill Susie or refuse to go get the chalk with Susie at all because then the video game you're playing wouldn't happen. You are a character in the story which means you have a role to play in it, and while you're allowed a lot of leeway in how you do it you can't just do whatever you want, that's just not how video games work, you are inherently limited by what the game allows/requires you to do no matter what.

>>718979194 (OP)
The heart is me. Don't bother arguing with me. You won't change my opinion.

>>718983550
Damn almost like Kris wouldn't even need the soul then if he can just do that

aw sweet a schizo thread. again.

>>718979194 (OP)
the SOUL isn't a fat fucking retard so it isn't me

>Kris literally abuses the DEVICE's rudimentary "if Kris thinks about something with his eyes closed, go look at it" system to find Susie during the Fake Gerson fight
>There's a specific dialog option during the first Sans meeting in chapter 1 that Kris would literally never, ever have unless it was (You) influencing his choices through the DEVICE
>NO GUYS IT'S ACTUALLY A SEPARATE THIRD ENTITY

>>718983564
"Nobody can choose who they are born as" is a message. It's one of the core themes of the game. It's reminding the player that you don't get to choose what you look like, or what your name is, or any of that.

It's not about Gaster or Goners or whatever the fuck. You missed the point so fucking hard if you're thinking or theorizing about any of that stuff.

>>718983415
It's one dishonest faggot spamming this exact thread/post in every Deltarune thread and going "lol u mad?" when people tell him to fuck off

>>718983596
>You are a character in the story
This is where you lose it and go total theoryfag schizo mode

>>718983550
If the soul is part of Kris, then the player exerting influence over it is only a second entity.

>>718983658
If you think it's bait why are you still responding to it?

>>718983654
>"Nobody can choose who they are born as"
Anon, it's using singular They to refer to Kris. (You) don't get to make your vessel because the DEVICE is being placed in Kris, and nobody can change how Kris was born.

>It's Kris Soul
Lol lmao even

>>718983630
The soul represents your average theorynigger's brain to scale

The Vessel, The Vessel's Creator, and Kris are 3 entities

>>718983652
This whole point really doesn't matter because everyone in deltarune knows more than they let on

>>718983654
anon this game isn't about kris or his issues or his messed up family, its about ME and about GASTER!!!

>>718983671
Who was Kris talking about when they warned Noelle that what they said would "get heard?"
Who answered when Noelle asked who was going to hear?
Why does Kris look directly into the camera when they catch the SOUL?
Who did Gaster make a connection with?

If your answer is "le funny red heart with zero greater significance or context that just happens to serve as your perfect agent in the world of Deltarune, but that's not really YOU" you are making a distinction without a difference and I'm going to continue to call you a dishonest faggot

>>718983865
This but unironically for both

The Kris we're playing as isn't the real Kris.
The "Kris" we inhabit is the Vessel, having taken over the original's life during or via the Unknown Shelter Tragedy, intentionally or otherwise. This presumably happened years prior to our Connection to Deltarune, as this event is increasingly associated with Dess, who has been missing for a while by the time of the game's events - how and why we were suddenly 'disconnected,' not to mention 'reconnected' after so long is still a complete mystery to us.
In the ultimate twist on the themes of identity, "Kris"' desperate struggle to maintain his autonomy and overall 'self' will be called into question once he is forced to confront the human in the dark.

>>718983879
Deltarune has metafiction but that doesn't mean you're literally a character in the game

>>718982861
The problem with Rudy being the knight isn't that he couldn't plausibly do it
The problem is that from a writing standpoint it'd be fucking stupid, like sure Rudy COULD secretly be merely pretending or his illness is being caused by Dark World body strain or whatever, but why would the plot go in that direction? If not for cheap shock value red herring points.
The literal only reason the theory exists is because people think Dess and Carol would both be too obvious, not because there'd actually be a good narrative purpose for the dying guy of all people to secretly be the mastermind over the other more satisfying possibilities.

The player is controlling an in-universe character that is using a device to control the SOUL, which is controlling Kris.

>>718983278
This is really funny bait

>>718983432
>Why the hell would I want that?
Because it dunks on the hecking chud gamers.
>That's absolute dogshit
Well, yeah. That's my point. Toby is a hack.

Kris = fag
Soul = Based
it is simple as that

>>718983913
you should just become a janny or something if you're this desperate for virtual power that means nothing

>>718983968
>chapter 1 was literally distributed to (you) through twitter as SURVEY_PROGRAM
>NO DUDE YOU SEE THE SOUL IS ACTUALLY A SEPARATE ENTITY AND NOT YOU

>>718980905
Gimme, like, 20 minutes.

>>718983994
its funny because I have the exact opposite perspective. Rudy makes a lot of sense and is thematically appropriate. Dess being alive and hiding or a demon or w/e is fucking stupid, a completely retarded asspull that totally ruins the plot

>>718984123
Chara has a twitter account dude it's so obvious

>>718983968
>In Earthbound, you are a character with an essential role in the story because the heroes cannot defeat the final boss without praying to You for help
>"BUT YOU'RE NOT LITERALLY IN THE VIDEO GAME"
Quit being a retard

>>718984123
>Twitter is proof of anything
Literally the lowest form of outside resources possible

>>718983415
I'm starting to think Tobert might have gone too far with that whole Mike thing.

>>718984154
You aren't in the game and the fact that you want to be is a mental issue you're gonna have to work out

>>718983994
I mean, I explained why it is, in fact, plausible and works from a writing perspective. Do you disagree with any of the actual points I made?

>>718984123
>playstation version of the game has in-game ending dialogue for The Connected Voice saying "wow dude you didn't get any PSN trophies, that's crazy"

Since we were talking about the politics of UTDR characters last thread, here are some more

>Sans
Not just apolitical but will actively work with whoever has power; a true Talleyrand figure
>Papyrus
An idealistic monarchist and would be a good king himself
>Mettaton
Would establish himself as a ruthless and charismatic dictator without any qualms
>Burgerpants
Thinks he is making a big difference by voting but doesn't seriously think about who to vote for
>Gerson
Makes fun of all forms of government but has similar views to Tolkien
>Napstablook
Is focused on the single issue of abolishing IP law

And now for a round of darkners
>Ralsei
Believes government should be responsible but is all-too-willing to give complete power to a single person or group of people
>The King
What do you think?
>The Queen
Believes in benign neglect, except when she can be funny or ostentatious, in which case heaven and earth should be moved
>Tasque Manager
Would rule society with an iron whip
>Jevil
Got a copy of The Ego and its Own from Spamton and has been an egoist ever since
>Spamton
An odd combination of Max Stirner and Sergei Taboritsky from The New Order
>Tenna
Believes television media networks should have more power
>Elnina and Lanino
Respectfully disagree on the issue of climate change
>Ramb
Wants Kris to have all the freedom in the world, whether that leads to good or ill

Another characters I can think of are too immature or intellectually disabled to have a meaningful political take.

Using my going into games machine to grope Noelle's tail

>>718984224
chara is a mossad agent sent to destroy the monster goyim kingdom

>>718984136
If you only think Dess is a bad choice, then why Rudy over Carol? If every aspect of the plot has to revolve around escapism and letting go, Carol fits that a fuckton more. She's been preserving Dess's room for years, meanwhile we've seen no similar themes with Rudy.
Even when you discredit Dess, Rudy still only makes sense from a "wahhh the real options are too obvious!" viewpoint.

>>718984078
Get prepared for more.

>>718984313
Wait's got you bored as fuck

>>718984389
But it sure is fun.

>>718984359
>Mother invented breaking the fourth wall.

>>718984217
You already conceded that Deltarune is metafiction. By your own admission Deltarune is a story that makes the person experiencing it part of the story. You've already admitted to this obvious thing that anyone who has played Undertale and more than five minutes of Deltarune would be able to figure out, but you're going to continue to pretend you don't know this and haven't already admitted you were wrong because you're an obnoxious retard who has nothing better to do on a Sunday night than waste people's time with pointless arguing about a game for children.

>>718984451
It also invented breaking you

>>718984457
>nothing better to do on a Sunday night than waste people's time with pointless arguing about a game for children.
to be fair this is /v/core

>>718984457
Metanarrative and narrative are two different things

>>718983994
>cheap shock value red herring
So much of the world has normalized this kind of garbage writing that any discussion about anything leads to crack ideas that are absolutely insane with no basis or setup whatsoever. Tonnes of popular media just totally asspull conclusions from nothing and people think it's brilliant like the Eren's dad's basement in Attack on Titan.

Rudy being the Knight is just one such retarded idea because they WANT the least rational option because they just can't fucking accept that obvious clues lead to obvious conclusions. The game has so much fucking mystery about the world and these dipshits just have to focus on the shit that isn't even a mystery.

>>718984490
It's also /v/core to project your inner disgust at yourself for wasting your precious time onto another anon who knows he is wasting his time

>>718984560
That doesn't sound healthy.
:(

>>718984549
They really want Toby to fall into the same pitfalls Hussie did.

>>718984617
toby fox completely ignores his own fanbase and thats one of his greatest strengths

>>718984665
>Removes rose scene
Bit of a cope innit

>>718979194 (OP)
Clearly Gaster or Chara or some other big boss that send you(SOUL) there noticed you're in trouble and gave you a heavenly power-up to ensure you complete the mission they sent you there for.
There solved it now go to sleep.

>>718984617
It is impossible to imagine the sort of brain damaged person who witnessed Homestuck and thinks to themselves "yeah I want more people to fuck up like that".

>>718984691
I think "oh god they think the rape metaphor is literal" and "THEY FIGURED OUT MY PLOT AIIIEEEEEEE TEMMIE REDO ALL THE SPRITES I HAVE TO REWRITE MY DREAM GAME SO THE ENDING ISN'T PREDICTABLE" are two very different things but I dunno

>>718984617
>Y'all are crabs in a bucket, and I got Old Bay seasoning, Maybe even some Zatarain's, fuck it.

>>718984665
Nah you can see he picked some things up. Ralsei's chuffed dart, the whole existence of the Mike room. Fingers crossed he knows where to draw the line.

>>718984730
I don't which is true but he still removed it due to backlash

>>718984549
It's also joyless faggots seething that some people drew art of Dess as the Knight and want to make a gotcha of "lol ur gay now".

>>718984803
That would be fucking hilarious now that I think about it

>>718984730
He should have known people would interpret the scene that way. The Weird Route has rape written all over it even if it isn't literal. It was a cowardly move to backtrack.

>>718984783
There wasn't a backlash. Toby Fox just feared that there would be a backlash, so he changed it preemptively.

>>718983596
Nta but I'll state my case as to why I disagree.
>The idea that "this thing in the game can't represent me unless I have total agency over it at all times" is an idiotic kind of autism
I think if the soul is supposed to be the player in this metafiction way, it's not that good at that when it makes choices for you.

>>718984104
You seem upset

>>718984821
t. joyless faggot that's been seething for months

>>718984691
In that case there was actual danger from having the hammer come down for having a "rape" scene in a T-rated game. Even M-rated games with less severe themes have been targeted for censorship.
I am however miffed that he nerfed bosses because apparently some people found them too hard.

>>718984851
>>718984914
So he listens to his audience.

>>718982861
>literally no one would be capable of dragging Undyne to the shelter
Undyne is strong and tall but The Knight is like twice her size and obviously capable of manhandling her. We can only speculate about how The Knight appears as a Lightner (beyond them being "a large person") but even if they incapacitated Undyne in the Dark World before leaving, they were fit enough to sprint across town while carrying her with them. There aren't any really good candidates for this out of the Lightners we know, but the guy who is literally dying and doesn't have the stamina to stand in church would be pretty near the bottom of the list. Unless he's just pretending to be dying, which would be "pretty fucking stupid."
More than any argument about the physical evidence I don't consider Rudy a serious candidate because he's simply a good guy, and the idea that he's some violent edgy shithead who's attacking and deceiving people in town and putting everyone in danger, especially his beloved daughter who he wants more than anything to just get better so he can be there for her again, would be an all-time bullshit rugpull character assassination. It's completely unnecessary when Carol is so blatantly villainous and conspiratorial with Kris and Kris clearly has a mountain of unresolved issues over what happened with Dess. There is absolutely no suggestion of any kind of malice or intrigue from Rudy at all.

>>718984908
The only person seething here is (you)

>>718984914
In the Knight's case I think the "nerf" was justified because it's kinda shitty design to make an attack telegraph all the safe zones with red lines, only for the hitboxes to extend past said red lines
He should've made the red lines wider to fit the swords instead of narrowing the swords to fit the lines.

>>718979194 (OP)
>giving a shit about this visual novel
Seek medical attention.

>>718983592
Kris and Asriel should do a lot more than just kiss

>>718984885
By playing a video game you accept that you are going to be required to take certain actions predetermined by the developer to progress in the video game.

why do people even care about this shit? the meta stuff is the least interesting part of deltarune

>>718985168
Nah the shipslop is more uninteresting.

>>718985168
The meta shit is literally half of the conflict driving Kris and probably Ralsei too, retard.

>>718985168
>least interesting part of deltarune
It's really not, especially when it has Way more involvement in the story then people realize

>>718985245
ok that's the only part less interesting, you got me there but that's not saying much

>>718985168
It's one guy who's been having an autist meltdown for a week because the game didn't personally ask you if you want to shine bright light or turn yellow or whatever
By this logic, it's impossible for something to represent the player unless you don't get ANY this-or-that dialogue prompts and instead type every answer yourself, and this would be literally impossible to implement into a linear story

>>718985297
Kris makes decisions for you. I guess he's also you.

The player doesn't exist in OFF either because if the higher being giving the Batter directions was ACTUALLY me I'd be able to tell him to piss on all the ghosts and I'm not

>>718985168
>least interesting part of deltarune
Compared to what? It's like the main thing keeping the thing interesting and so many things are steaming from that

>>718985297
It is time to bring back old school RPG style dialogue for meta video game stories.

>>718985168
I happen to agree anon
Not only is it incredibly insipid and boring, it is unlikely to ever get resolved. It'll be like the gaster shit in undertale - ultimately irrelevant

>>718985249
I don't know how people think that you can separate the "meta shit" from "the story" when half of the main characters are aware that You are watching and listening to everything they say and do.
Every single interaction that Kris and Ralsei have ever has been warped by you imposing your will on Kris and Ralsei putting on a performative mask to appeal to You through Kris, it is impossible to understand either of them without acknowledging this

>>718985440
im only still here because i like the characters and all the wanking over mysterious mister gaster ass blaster and "ooooh you're not kris" is the opposite of interesting to me

>>718984958
The entire point of my post was why the argument you're using, his condition, is dumb as hell so you should probably read the post beyond the part you quoted.
I do agree, though, that The Knight being intentionally confrontational and antagonistic would be weird for someone who would just be doing all this to save his daughter.

>>718985508
>and "ooooh you're not kris"
Nigga did you just miss the entirety of the plot or what
The entire game has been screaming at you since CHAPTER FUCKING ONE that Kris knows you're there
There's an entire fucking Tom and Jerry bit at the start of Chapter 4 where he beats the shit out of you with a hockey stick
You can't "like the characters" if you're literally ignoring one of the key motivators of the main fucking protagonist

>>718985387
>Kris makes decisions for you
Does Kris make decisions for You or does Kris make decisions for Kris

>>718979194 (OP)
>This gif makes playerfags seethe. It's like magic
why would this make me seethe? i dont get it

>>718979236
>troonimai

The Mike Situation and Gaster really buckbroke peoples minds

Rudy is actually the only character it makes sense to discredit based on him being unable to carry Undyne (because he in particular is dying of super monster HIV canceraids)
The "carrying Undyne" criteria used for anyone else is literal powerscaler bullshit

>>718985595
i don't like kris as much as the other characters because it's all about his self pity party over being a game character and that's just really gay

>>718985595
not that anon but gasterfags don't have anything interesting to say

>>718985708
>it's all about his self pity party
It's not a pure pity party in normal route though. Kris toys with you and even goes out of his way to help you (i.e. helping you answer quiz questions during Ch3). That's what makes it interesting; he knows your there and has fun fucking with you, but you can fuck with him right back (i.e. making the little shit flirt with Berdley)

I agree that it would be lame if it WAS just Kris angsting about it, but that isn't the case.

>>718985708
>anon didn't actually play Deltarune and got all his information on the game from chapter 2 era fanfiction depicting Kris as a wittle innocent baby being controlled by an evil playerman (kitchen scene in chapter 4 spells it out for you that he's been planning shit from the start)
point and LAUGH

>>718985802
i still don't find the dynamic interesting

>>718985708
>it's all about his self pity party over being a game character and that's just really gay
It really isn't

>>718985595
>not posting the sequel

>>718985818
nigger kris still feels bad for himself and that's what im talking about

>>718985932
That's only ever stated on Weird Route. On Normal Route Kris's opinion on the situation hasn't been stated or implied, and if anything he seems to at least have gotten into it somewhat willingly, despite everything.

>>718985616
Kris makes decisions for you, so you're him now. That's your logic with the soul.

Not to say it isn't Dess, but I think it's a fairly important detail that people are reading in around 7 years of fan fiction speculation when they're saying it's "clearly" Dess, while also omitting that Dess is potentially the one lost in the Game's code and featured in the easter egg during chapter 3 from putting 1225 into the gachapon.
Actually just looking at the game itself it's not actually "obvious" that Dess is the knight.

>>718985708
>over being a game character
No, it's about them being possessed by a demon and having a broken family and feeling conflicted about the evil plan they signed up for because they didn't expect to like their new friends this much

>>718986089
This to me proves the player isn't the soul as well.

>>718986089
Her breasts don't look very big...

>>718986073
>Kris makes decisions for you
When?

>>718986085
>Dess is potentially the one lost in the Game's code
If that dialogue is Dess, it can't be happening at the same time as the chapters.
We know Dess has been missing for years as of the story, and in Chapter 1 the unused dialogue reads more like someone who only got into that situation recently.
>starts calmly asking where she is and if anyone can hear her
>only starts freaking out when nobody responds
That is not how someone who's been lost for years would talk.
So if Chapter 1's dialogue isn't concurrent with Chapter 1, why should it be taken for granted that ANY of them chronologically line up with the chapters taking place?

>>718986180
End of chapter 2.

>>718986073
I am Krismas Dreemurr and I am going to motorboat Susie's tits.

>>718986142
yet

Would you like Deltarune as much if it didn't have furries and HMOFA?

>>718986230
It doesn't have hmofa

>>718986230
It doesn't have HMOFA unless the H stands for Heart

>>718982852
It's funny how it makes more sense when you piece together some of the meta stuff with DR especially

>>718986257
>>718986259
krusie and kress is canon

>>718985691
It literally isn't. You're only comparing it to 'powerscaling' to discredit it because you can't come up with a good argument for the contrary. But you know that since you were a pussyboy and didn't reply. This isn't some Saitama vs Goku retarded shit where you have to dig into every little 'feat' the character has done to establish a power scale that the writers obviously didn't even think about. It's just basic understanding of what these characters should be able to do and how they're written. Undyne is consistently portrayed as being able to handle herself, her entire reputation and character is basically built on that. It wouldn't make any sense for any of the characters in hometown aside from maybe Asgore to just effortlessly drag her to the bunker.

>>718979194 (OP)
What the fuck has caused people to spam this thread the last few days?

>>718986307
You're surviving off of scraps. I need more to be satisfied

>>718986257
>>718986259
I'm not autistic reeeeing about calling Kris they/them or he, but it seems like most people including they/them maxxers agree Kris is "masc-coded" and more likely has a penis

>>718986351
I'm not saying Kris isn't a he
I'm saying he doesn't fuck anyone

>>718986230
As long as the characters look decent. The crowd it attracts wouldn't be as horrible but to a certain extent since it would still be full of gay shit.

>>718986351
It still doesn't have hmofa, people are forcing it. I say that as someone who likes hmofa but deltarune fails to deliver it

>>718986085
>while also omitting that Dess is potentially the one lost in the Game's code
If the UNUSED text is Dess then it's not current, since the speaker is reacting as if they're in a new situation and Dess must have disappeared years ago. It doesn't change anything about Dess acting as The Knight now.
>and featured in the easter egg during chapter 3 from putting 1225 into the gachapon.
This is an extremely cryptic event that just hints that Kris has some unresolved trauma over whatever happened with Dess, can't really say anything more about it than that. Again I don't see how it changes anything about Dess being The Knight, other than being another layer to the Dess-Kris connection and by extension the Knight-Kris connection.

>>718986365
Weird route has clear sexual/romantic undertones and arranged marriage symbolism. one day Noelle will be pumping out doebabies for Kris

>>718986280
Explain what you mean I never played marathon

>>718986365
true except for noelle that one time prepatch

>>718986213
?

>>718986430
You're really setting yourself up for disappointment man

>>718986435
The go no-where non-plot that he's talking about is declaring the player to exist.
Marathon is shit.

>>718986142
It isn't from the breasts.

>>718986403
I look forward to the day the outdated fan headcanon of Dess currently banging on the walls of else-if statements gets discarded in the same way Pure Innocent Kris was.

>>718986476
I'd like a genuine answer please not whatever passive aggressive /v/ seethe this is

>>718986321
>It wouldn't make any sense for any of the characters in hometown aside from maybe Asgore to just effortlessly drag her to the bunker.
Unless, of course, they were wearing magic Dark World armor made out of the same stuff that retains its stat bonuses in the light world when in the form of a weapon.

>>718986430
Weird Route is only HMOFA if the H stands for Heart
We fucked her, not Kris

there's still 16 damn months left until chapter 6

im not gonna make it bros

>>718986521
That is the answer and I fucking hate that Bungie "reviving" the IP has got retards trying to shove it into relevancy like a parasite.

This is the best Deltarune fan song / remix I've found so far. But maybe it won't be for you if you don't like this genre of music
https://youtu.be/TY0g5sCozE4

>>718986535
That was one of the points I made in my original post they were replying to
>>718982861

>>718986476
Marathon never declares the existence of the player as a separate entity. The Security Officer is more like the Eternal Champion than whatever Deltarune is going for. The only potential plot similarity I can think of from Marathon would be the protagonists usage of timeline hopping to achieve the impossible.

>>718986549
If you think the heart is you then you're a human playing the game so wouldn't it still be hmofa? Still retarded because the heart isn't you so whatever

The heart isn't You.
The Baby is You.

>>718986610
Sorry, I'm too retarded to read entire post chains.

>>718986648
The heart is a human soul so it counts even if the soul is the spirit of some random faggot who fell into the lake and drowned.

>>718986481
Where is it from?

>>718986715
Oh no, they didn't actually reply to it, so you're good based deltagamer

It's obvious the characters see the soul as a condom to be used and thrown away so why do people want the story to go in that direction? Is it a self hate thing?

>>718986435
Basically the entire meta thing with Marathon is the universal Hero and basically (You) being the driving factor of the Stories in Bungies games by basically being the soul for them. Basically Master Chiefs and many of Protagonists in Bungie games kinda mirror Kris in some way. It's kinda hard to explain into text since Marathon does a lot of meta stuff that is straight up pages worth of discoveries plus the characters outright acknowledge you in the games like Durandal.Or with Forge basically being a send off of the Marathon universe to make your own shit or the Last Passage from Durandal at the End of of Infinity.

Also is kinda BUNGIE's way of saying Thank you for playing their games

>>718986692
>the soul isn't the player but the red dot it put inside Noelle is
>in chapter 6 of the weird route, toby pulls us into the game and we physically exit Noelle's womb while a remix of The Baby is You plays

>>718986853
And then chapter 7 is fallout 3

Why does Kris turn blue?

>>718986580
>im not gonna make it bros
God I hope so. I wish death on every single faggot in these threads.

>>718986937
That seems very healthy and mentally stable

>>718986937
Seething.

>>718986846
this sounds a lot cooler than the deltarune meta stuff tbhdesu

>>718986909
>It's a they/them!

>>718979236
SEX with mahiro posters

>>718980905
>>718984125
That took way longer than 20 minutes.
Damn thing had 129 frames.

>>718987018
It's kinda hard to Rival OG Bungie they were nothing if not dedicated

>>718987098
Kek

>>718987326
It's hard to see

I've tried to come up with my own theories to what's going on, but I always end up making a bunch of assumptions since the info we have is either incomplete, a red herring, or complete bullshit and ultimately it doesn't really lead to anywhere.
It's honestly amazing how we're more than halfway through the game and we still know fuck all. And I don't expect that to change with ch5

>>718987715
I don't think there are any satisfying answers in store. It's just about the mystery which is what most theoryfags want unfortunately they don't want any closure

>>718987715
i think a lot of questions are going to finally get answers in ch5
remember, the original planned chapter batch was 2-5 way back in 2018, before toby surprised dropped ch2 and then cut 5 out of 3 & 4
we'll probably get answers to most immediate questions, but all the esoteric schizo shit is probably not until 7 or the potential 8

Considering the existence of TVDinner items and the microwave in the room next to the TV and the fact Tenna's display colors are kind of messed up makes me think that the whole Mike shit is indeed an imaginary friend, but it's also Chef Mike the microwave fucking him up. That little change in electricity when a microwave goes on and off made Tenna schizophrenic for Mike. And chances are that after the family fell aapart, so did the need for the microwave since seemingly everything Toriel cooks are pies.

So in truth, there never was any Mike. Tenna is just unhinged.

>>718987896
if there is a specific mike it's probably dess' microphone
although i doubt it'll amount to much, maybe a passing reference later on

>>718987505
Here's the least subtle I can make it.

>>718988162
Much better

>>718987773
Toby probably has satisfying storytelling answers in store.
It's just that he doesn't have satisfying FNAFtard mystery box faggotry unforeseen giga plot twist rugpull answers in store. And people confuse that with satisfying storytelling.

>>718987846
The fact that he wanted to release ch3, 4 and 5 together makes me think that ch5 will end with a big cliffhanger

>>718988515
>FNAFtard mystery box faggotry unforeseen giga plot twist rugpull answers
That's what these new chapters felt like

>>718988552
>will susie kiss noelle or not? find out in 2030!

>>718988552
Chapter 4 not ending on a shocking cliffhanger definitely makes it stick out, which is likely a consequence of the original 3/4/5 plan being changed due to unexpected development time
But then that raises the question of why Chapter 3 did have one
It was always intended to be the first of a multi-chapter bundle, so why does its ending feel more like Chapter 1 and 2's?

>>718988552
it probably will be, but it's likely the start of all the fever dream shit that caused deltarune to begin with
the only 'true' clifhangers that were planned out were the ch1 ending and probably the ch5 one, the long wait after ch2 wasn't supposed to be the way it turned out, and ch4 is much more toned down compared to the others

There's a secret chapter 8.
Just saying.

>>718988912
Maybe. If it there will probably be some time loop bullshit because 8 on it's side is infinity

>>718988984
Sounds like a Toby thing to do.

>>718989092
When I was a kid I thought I was a genius for figuring out 8 looked like infinity

>>718988984
ch4 was pretty out in the open that susie wants things to go on forever, if a time loop situation does occur it's probably going to be because of her

>>718988984
>>718988912
>deltarune Ch4's credits have the Zero Ranger and Star of Providence devs working on the game now
You're going to get CHAPTER 0 - CONNECTING... and you're going to like it
https://youtu.be/KiwHDcVcBZ4&t=2626

>>718988912
>>718988984
>>718989472
Pic related.

>>718986331
>people
It's one dude.
https://arch.b4k.dev/v/search/image/HL2FtXNOPgt1y2GXVcAtIA/
I would not be shocked to learn he's also samefagging here.

What makes you so upset about the idea of the soul being the player, in whatever fashion it may be?
Do you think it's bad writing or something like that or is it something more personal like you just really don't want the player to be represented like that or at all?

I summon the autist that accuses everyone who says Ralsei is Based on Dead Kid is the same person in Attack Mode
Because the OP autist is boring.

>>718991013
>ESL babble

>>718991057
He doesn't say that

I'm just here for the funny deltarune pics

>>718991167
I used to make them but I got banned like 6 times because the admins can't make good memes

>>718991167
Too bad, you're going to get meta shitposts about random thread schizos nobody cares about and you're gonna like it!
You're gonna watch the en/utg/ification of Deltarune /v/ threads in real time!

>>718986970
>>718986994
>The people that talk about suicide every day and how schizo they are wanna talk about anyone else’s mental health
lol. Lmao even

>>718991229
/vg/ is cancer I just like fucking with that guy.
And Shawn

>>718991229
It already happened. I see no difference in the threads. I would put money down that it’s all the same posters too.

>>718991261
What are you going to do when your parents kick you out?

>>718991330
You don't need to pretend to be a totally ordinary concerned poster, I saw you freaking out in the other thread.

>>718991348
That happened in 2008 when I was 18 like 90% of my generation. Why do you still live with your parents over the age of 18? Struggling to get a job?

>>718991393
The clock is ticking anon. Better come up with a plan soon.

>>718991384
>other thread
??? I don’t sit on /v/ all day posting in generals like you apparently do.

>>718991384
See this shit? Meta shitposts about random thread schizos nobody cares about!
Hee hee hee hEe hee!! It's happening as we speak.

>>718991439
Are you trying to tell everyone you are young? I think your bot is broken

>>718991451
I told you bro. This is my other post >>718991330

>>718991443
>>718991451
>Um you can't know about the contents of two threads that were on page one in the past hour We're masters of deception

>>718991439
>dodges the question like he dodges job applications.
lol I would expect nothing less of a deltatroon

>>718991552
>can’t keep the conversation straight
Psychosis is doing you real bad man.

>>718991632
You know the sad part is you're too stupid to appreciate that post.

>>718991884
You should be lobotomized.

>>718991958
I mean saying you're so upset you've been outwitted that you want a stranger online to have part of their brain removed so they couldn't do that that really only reinforces that you're upset about being caught.
You could just talk about a game you like or find interesting, like the people here trying to talk about shit like what they think may happen in the next chapter of the game.

>>718991632
>>718991884
>>718991958
>>718992094
JUST FUCK ALREADY

>>718991884
Yea I don’t spend enough time in general threads like a faggot to get some inside joke. Honestly every post you make just embarrasses you more and more. Just go back

>>718992134
Dude it's not even an Undertale/Deltarune joke, it's the reverse of an inside joke. Like some kind of Outside Joke.

>>718992094
> trying to talk about shit like what they think may happen in the next chapter of the game
lol 90% of the threads are just horny posts. These threads live and die on people coming in to troll them. You fall for the bait every single time too cause none of you lurk.

>>718992191
…..sure….

>>718992194
>I didn't make myself look stupid, it's bait
I really wish people online these days knew what bait was and didn't think it's a magic word that makes you not look stupid after the fact.

>>718992278
How new are you?

>>718992384
I could ask the same of you but I already have a pretty good idea.

>>718992432
Lmao. If only you knew. You can let this shit thread die now.

>>718992484
No you will see this through to the end Anonymous.

I am playing Megaman Battle Network right now, and I can't put my finger on it, but for some reason it reminds me of Deltarune.

>>718992542
I discovered 4chan in 2006 on an old yugioh forum. You discovered this place in 2020 on twitter. Inb4 “I’ve been here since 2003 and no I won’t tell you how I discovered it”

>>718992650
I will not let your thread die.

>>718992734
No but I’ll let yours.

>>718992807
Fuck

Anyway, are you fags gonna still be crying about Deltarune later? I actually wanted to talk about the game before the admins wake up with a less shit OP.

what is this samefag shitshow

>>718992935
I'm pretty sure they think it qualifies as some form of "trolling" and that it will be impossible to make a Deltarune thread later.

>>718992908
They're still crying about Undertale.

I'm Wing Gaster! The royal scientist
.

>>718993012
It's weird to think that, there's people that were 6 when Undertale came out crying on /v/ about how it's not supposed to be here.

>>718988162
thanks doc

>>718979194 (OP)
I salute you, OP, for making playertrannies seethe every single day. Godspeed, my man.

The player is not the Soul, they control the Soul. It's literally Kris's Soul. The player has no physical form in any way.

>>718981897
Playerfags unironically think they were part of the narrative in Undertale despite that breaking the game. They're too retarded to realize they're being played. Just look at this>>718981981
Playerfags always resort to saying Undertale was badly written because their headcanon is wrong. They're scum that actually hate the games.

>>718983026
This is only the case in the Vessel creation scene. Outside of that it's just referred as a heart. Is THIS the crux of your argument? Really?

>>718983160
There isn't, but playerfags don't like admitting that.
>>718983157
Frisk's SOUL wasn't being possessed by anyone.

>>718983658
NTA, but you playerfags always get mad with the mere possibility of the SOUL not literally being (you).

>>718984078
Based anti-player soldier.

...I'm starting to believe the theories about Dess being a human.
The soul we control is hers and the knight is her body resurrected through dark.

>>718984078
Weird schizo but I guess its better than the charafag or temmiefag. if only slightly.

>>718997865
okay there's some funny shit here where this dumbass basically just admitted he sees kris as a boy due to there being no actual implications of kris being "the husband" in the weird route relationship but i'm not good enough with words to convey it in a funny manner

>>718990375
No, anon, not everyone who doesn't believe the player is canon is the same person.

>>718997865
>Noelle comes onto Kris in the Weird Route without us forcing her
>lesbian
I hate the DT fanbase sometimes

>>718998407
I mean unlike the hypothetical "Ralsei Deader Guy" that one guy accuses everyone of being about it's probably the same guy at least making most of these threads.

>>718998301
Another victory for the 'Kris is male-coded' gang... heh... we literally can't stop winning.

>>718998034
>>718991229

>>718998535
This is correct, but I'm not him and I agree with most of his posts.

>>718998695
Not saying you can't, just saying it's probably the same guy making threads.

>>718999024
I agree with that, but I love how pissed he makes certain anons.

>>718998407
>dipshit doesn't understand how the archive works
This is sad. Dude's actually mentally retarded.

>>718999518
I'm not the guy spamming the image, schizo. I just agree with him.

>>718979194 (OP)
Generals belong in /vg/.

>>718979236
fpbp

>>718999731
good thing this isnt a general.

>>718998407
It feels like it with how it’s suddenly become a thing to be mention in any /v/ thread about deltarune
Like someone (or someones) is/are trying to push the newest contrarian take because there’s nothing else to talk about

>>718979236
>>718999731
These
Retarded furfag tranny general

nerf the knight

so why has there been this massive uptick of people saying that (you) arent a canon element despite
>the pacifist ending of UT establishing that soul =/= vessel
>the genocide ending of UT establishing that (you) are a canon element with chara
>the inital SURVEY_PROGRAM release, with the gaster takeover, hinging on the idea of (you) with gaster speaking directly to (you) through the twitter.
>during that twitter takeover, gaster explicitly invited (you) to the world of deltarune
>the goner maker
>the soul literally being called a DEVICE in the files, implying that its nothing more than something for (you) to use
>gaster talking to you at the end of CH4
>the whole point of the weird route being that (you) are assuming direct control and getting yourself a more willing vessel by any means possible.
the only way it could get more explicate that (you) are the soul is if toby says it directly on twitter
is it simply failed normalfags that dont want to say that they did the doe rape in chapter 4's weird route?
>inb4 MUH LIGHT! MUH YELLOW SOUL MODE!!! MUH FOUNTAIN SEALING!!!!!!
the alternative is making them "PRESS X TO AWESOME" moments. having those is bad game design. the only real option is to make them happen automatically.
>BUH THAT MEANS-
your heart beats automatically, does that mean that your heart isnt a part of you?
the soul is an extension of you in the same way your heart is.

>>718999840
Not the guy spamming OP, but this is a theory I had for a long time and I'm just supporting him because of how unpopular it is here.

>>719000220
>>the pacifist ending of UT establishing that soul =/= vessel
This doesn't happen in Undertale, at all. Pacifist ending just says Frisk isn't Chara. Flowey's true reset speech is directed to Chara, he ends it off saying "See you soon, Chara". No quotations around the name, nothing.
>the genocide ending of UT establishing that (you) are a canon element with chara
This doesn't happen in Undertale, either. Nothing in genocide ending says (you) aren't canon.
>hinging on the idea of (you) with gaster speaking directly to (you) through the twitter.
Flowey did the same thing before Undertale released. Once the game came out, it was given the context of it being him calling to Chara.
>the soul literally being called a DEVICE in the files,
Only during the VESSEL creation scene, nowhere else.

>>719000220
i'm pretty sure it's literally just one guy denying (You)r existence and samefagging to make it seem like there's more people
at the very least i feel like if there ARE multiple people, they've gotta just be doing it for the bit and don't really believe it

>>719000609
It's at least me and the OP, at the very least.

Didn't the Undertale localization book specifically mention that the Player is in a fact an element in the story?

>>719000840
The non-canon book?

>>718999637
Yeah, you just so happen to show up in every thread to argue that posts that have been empirically proven to be the same guy are all different people.
Stop talking about yourself in third person, it's embarrassing to watch.

>>719000220
>>718990375

>>719001162
>If you agree with someone then you're actually him
Sad. Playerfags are so insecure that they need to pretend it's all one guy to make them feel better.

>>719001008
I'm gonna be honest, if Toby really didn't intend the player to actually have any part in the story, then he did a terrible job at it, because if even someone who probably has interacted directly with him and his team more than any other fan also ended up getting the impression that the player is in fact an entity in the story, he clearly must have fucked up somewhere.

>>719001535
Player being part of Undertale only got popular because of Deltarune. Most casuals only thought there were Frisk and Chara in the game, you can just watch old playthroughs to see it.

I don't think the Soul is the player, I don't know about you guys, but I'm not a pixelated red heart in real life, maybe you guys are and I'm the weird one here, but I do think the player, aka me, is clearly controlling the Soul and using it as a way to interact with the world of Deltarune. I think of it as a remote control vehicle.

As for what the Soul actually is? I have no idea, maybe it's a sort of generic Soul created by someone with the express purpose of being controlled by the player, or maybe it's Kris' soul that we have hijacked, who knows.

>>719002170
How would you feel if you didn't have breakfast this morning?

>>718984167
Having their hairbrained theories mocked in a rather friendly joking fashion tends to send autists into a fit.

>>718999731
https://www.4chan.org/janitorapp

>>719001682
Even so my point still stands in regards to Deltarune, because if you make a story, and 99% of the people who read it misintepret it, then you probably have made some mistakes while writing it. Let me put it this way, let's start from the premise that Toby didn't intend for the player to have any part in the story and its world, this intention has clearly not been achieved since 99% of the people you ask will tell you that they think the Soul is the player or that the player has some kind of direct interaction with this world and story.

I mean, it's one thing to have a few people misinterpret your story, it's another matter entirely if the vast majority of people who engage with it come out of it with an understanding that's the opposite of what you actually meant.

>>719000220
Its because people want to "complete" Undertale and Deltarune and blame a third party for all of the bad shit that happens in the game even though You are the one that is pressing the buttons. So in other words, its because people are pussies even in a metafictional setting which is pathetic. You'll never see this type of argument with OFF, the mother series, or Oneshot.

>>718979194 (OP)
I'm pretty sure it's just a convenience issue, there is no way a player can figure out that they need to press a button to make their soul shine.

Only people who try to dissect the game to an autistic degree can fall for something as stupid as this.

Technically to be fully completely in control of Kris you'd need to manualy make him breathe, yet you cannot. Does that mean there is another fucking entity controlling the heart? No, you imbecile. It would simply be annoying and frustrating to constantly make Kris breathe in and breathe out.

You know what my problem with the "The player isn't part of the story in UT" thing? If that's the case, then how the fuck did Frisk manage to accomplish something that all the previous children completely failed at? Are we meant to think Frisk is special? How is Frisk special? I don't remember seeing anything in UT that established that Frisk was somehow leagues above the other children.

Having the player as part of the story gives this an easy explanation, Frisk managed to accomplish everything because of the player's help, something which the other children didn't have, but if the player isn't actually a factor in UT, then, what's the explanation?

>>719002848
>tfw you don't have to control Kris' anal sphincter directly in order to stop him from shitting himself
Toby, you fucking hack

>>718986230
slightly bigga

>>719002929
Powerscalers will tell you that Frisk is leagues above everyone else without understanding what made Frisk so powerful in the first place. So yeah, people already think Frisk is special because of what Asriel said.

>>719002998
>tfw you aren't allowed to control Kris's anal sphincter directly to make him shit himself

>>719002532
Toby clearly WANTS people to think the player is canon, so the SOUL being their own character would be a very shocking twist. It's not bad writing to lead someone to a certain direction just to rugpull them. Toby did this in Undertale.

>>719002929
>>719003042
Frisk being special is infinitely more interesting than she having no agency and being a meat puppet, and a far more interesting take for fanworks, too.

>>718985657
>shartytroon

>>718982924
Why is Kris' consciousness separate from his soul? Why does his soul have its own consciousness? Why can he live without it? Why does he bitch like he's being controlled if it's his soul? Why does the soul have a top down perspective exclusively and canonically? Why does he have to resist it if it's his?
Stupid fuck.

>>719003280
What the fuck do you mean more intersting, that's literally the most bog standard "Chosen One" bullshit except you don't actually mention the Chosen One at all so not only is it generic but it's also confusing.

>>719003448
Being a Chosen One is more interesting than being a meat puppet with no agency, yes. Especially since being a vessel for a higher entity is already a Chosen One plot, anyways.

You can tell that nobody has ever played any of the games that Toby suggested his fandom to play with Earthbound being the biggest one and live a live being the other one.

>>718991013
I prefer the handmade plushie theory

>>719003774
If you need to play other games to understand Toby's genius, then you're saying he's a bad writer.

>>719003774
That and a lot of people here having 0 fucking taste and actually enjoying some of the most dogshit explanations for the story of the games.

>>719002848
I want another mod like that one where Kris is bleeding and losing HP the whole time, but you gotta rhythmically press a button to breathe in and out or else Kris starts losing HP rapidly and dies

>>719003842
You can clearly see his inspirations in the other games he suggested but this fandom has a habit of ignoring them due to ignorance. Also, who called him a genius?

>>719003963
Inspirations don't mean as much weight as you give them. Everything has inspirations, you don't need to see every media in the world to enjoy one.

>>718989386
I'm not super convinced by the 'Susie will install a timeloop' fan theory. Like yeah, she wants to keep adventuring, but she's also the one who gets bored with Tenna's shenanigans first in Ch3 and she's usually the first one to be leaping at a problem to try and solve it. She doesn't really get stuck on meandering around in the Dark Worlds, she just likes experiencing new things with Kris and Ralsei.

I think Susie wants to keep going on new adventures, not just reliving the old ones. A loop seems really out of her nature.

Is everyone really still engaging with this tranny retard when the chapter 4 Snowgrave scene RAPED his Suselle faggot rhetoric into pieces?

>>719004771
What does Suselle have to do with anything?

test

>>718983160
the game prologue makes it abundantly clear that your choices don't fucking matter. what more is there to understand? you can't influence the outcome of the game.

>>719005734
layers...

>>719004798
This schizo's obsessive way of posting is the same as the tranny who insisted that Snowgrave was the SUPER SUSELLE ROUTE and that anyone who went down the weird route was a KEKOLD.

So if you look at the two things, you can see the resemblance.
>ACTUALLY IF YOU WANTED TO FUCK NOELLE ON THE WEIRD ROUTE YOU'RE JUST KEKING YOURSELF!!!
>ACTUALLY YOU'RE NOT THE SOUL SO YOU AREN'T THE ONE WHO RAPED NOELLE ON THE WEIRD ROUTE- AND IT WASN'T RAPE BTW!!!

It's a schizo-obsessive campaign to divorce people from a power fantasy they don't like while hiding behind something that almost sounds credible like, "You're interpreting the game wrong!"

>>719005775
layers...of P...
P...layers...

>>719005923
I always looked at it as another person that wants to completely divorce their actions from the because they want to play the evil route in the most pussy way possible but odds are that you're right.

Daily reminder that Sans is a federal agent.

>>719006106
If you look at the first post he replies to (ctrl+f "playerfag") it's some babble about how if you believe that (you) are in the game, you're going to get burnt when the game calls the soul a capital F faggot. And he says, "Yeah, this is what playerfags want to see."
Which is pretty much in-line with the previous point. It's not coming from anything even resembling "discourse". It's just trying to shame people into the same mindset by going, "Yeah if you disagree with me I drew a picture of you eating a fat cock."

>>719006052
>I saw Tony, lookin' Tricky as always. He stepped it up, though. He was plannin' some PLAYER LAYERS or somethin'.
>PLAYER LAYER PLAYER LAYER PLAYER LAYER PLAYER LAYER PLAYER LAYER

block deltaroon faggot thread immediately so as jrpgtroon

I'm surprised This Thread is still up. Had a weird fucking dream last night. Those red horns kris used to wear, he lost them when he encountered that incident in the bunker. Where dess went missing. Lost in the woods. Roots

>>719006753
Just start dumping gay porn like you usually do so you can get banned again ASAP.

>>719005923
Boy, that one image really broke you, you can't stop bringing it up in every thread.

>>719006893
nah I'm here for saving rape meme jpg but as there is none no worth at all
bye

>>719006940
Raped.

>>719005923
I am a playerdenier and I hate Suselle. Meds.
>>719005734
Gold.

>>719007013
Even if you were doing this for literally any other reason I don't think you have the footing to tell anyone else, "Meds".

>>718979194 (OP)
I'm not up-to-date with fandom retardation, what the hell do you mean by playerfag? Are you taking pride in being a filthy secondary?

>>719005734
actually it's more llike this
https://youtube.com/shorts/LqgJIEGr680?si=YLg04raWAZ5NYlUO

>>719007118
he's referring to people who think the soul = the player, because he's a special kind of retard who think that isn't the case and we're all retards for thinking it

>>719006959
Glad this guy left. He's a huge faggot. Can you believe he roleplays as Jiren.

>>719007104
I have the right, in fact, because you still think I'm OP.

>>718983160
Toby doesn’t actually know how to write a meta plot

>>719007619
>
So you replied to a post completely unrelated to you and went, "Yeah I'm on that schizo's side!"

>The prophecy as said is a tragedy that ends horribly
>The normal route is all about cool Mary Susie subverting the prophecy and saving everyone epic style
>The weird route is all about establishing the tragic prophecy as it's said which is why it's all "heteronormative" and sad

I partially control Kris, but Kris has shown independent personality and intent, ergo I am not Kris.
I partially control the SOUL, but the SOUL has not shown independent personality and intent, ergo I am the SOUL.
It is that simple. If the soul gets a dialogue box and says 'Hi, I'm Soul Deltarune and I think killing Berdly was cool.', then I will no longer be the SOUL.

>>719007761
All I said is that I'm a playerdenier. I was before the schizo started spamming threads.

>>719007895
>The prophecy as said is a tragedy that ends horribly
This is objectively wrong though. The heroes in the prophecy SAVE the world. It has one tragic sacrifice at the end, but it doesn't end horribly.

>>719007929
Okay. But the Suselle thing. That wasn't like a sweeping statement to all retards. You don't have to reply to that part personally. Don't make things confusing.

>>719008068
I thought you were implying all playerdeniers liked Suselle.

>>719008184
No. I was saying the playernigger threads lately have all been one annoying schizo.

I also think playerdeniers are fags but I am really sleepy and cannot discuss this any longer so goodbye.

>>718997526
>Frisk's SOUL wasn't being possessed by anyone.

>>719008408
Yeah. You're right that Chara's essence was attached to her SOUL. Fair enough.

Nobody says "playernigger" or "playerdenier", it's a fake term invented in a day and forced by a single schizo. I just ignore any post that has these in it.

>>718988552
The one downside of this is that I want to write a fanfic detailing the Weird Route as a written narrative, and I want to release it between Chapters 5 and 6/7. The biggest problem is writing it in a "Toby" sort of way since he always incorporates twists and turns at the very end.
>>719002848
A "Manual Samuel" version of Deltarune would be funny, not going to lie. But if a fan theory is that Kris is being inadvertently starved and exhausted throughout the game, this would be much worse. Also I think Kris is mindful of his privacy despite being possessed and deliberately never showers or goes to the bathroom while we're on screen.
>>719003954
Which mod? Sounds edgy and fun.

>>719007895
>>The normal route is all about cool Mary Susie subverting the prophecy and saving everyone epic style
Doesn't seem to be the case. Everything points to following the path normally leads to the normal sad ending. Ralsei hasn't noticed a change yet.
>>The weird route is all about establishing the tragic prophecy as it's said which is why it's all "heteronormative" and sad
Doesn't seem to be the case. Ralsei heavily implies you will indeed change the future, for the worse. You will indeed drink up that [Sweet, Sweet] [Freedom Sauce], and be left [Crying] in a [Broken Home] wishing you let your old pal Spamton [Kill You].

The correct path, it appears, is the middle path. The Twisted Sword is what will buy your happy ending. You must kill and kill lightly, and see where Trance Down leads us.

>>719008614
Just write it. Your fanfic will never be canon anyways, just have fun with it.

>>719008747
Still in the brainstorming phase. Later on I'll post updates on /vrpg/.

>>719008614
>Which mod? Sounds edgy and fun.
Just search for "Deltarune but Kris is bleeding" or something like that, it should be in GameBanana
It's a gameplay mod though, it's meant to be ball-bustingly hard because your health is constantly draining.

>>719008741
>The correct path, it appears, is the middle path. The Twisted Sword is what will buy your happy ending. You must kill and kill lightly, and see where Trance Down leads us.
I cannot accept this because this results in hurting some of the goofy scrimblos in Chapter 2, which to me is unthinkable that this will lead to a good ending in a Toby Fox game.

>>719009045
Cool!

>>719001682
Chara is understood to be the player surrogate for 99% of the game. You play as Chara, who was somehow resurrected and attached to Frisk's SOUL, and your influence on the world (such as the power to SAVE) is understood as theirs.
Deltarune does not have this middleman as part of its framing device, and the separation between the player and the player character is established immediately rather than being an endgame twist. In Deltarune, You are contacted by a meta character who is already familiar with you from your experience in Undertale and you are brought to the world of Deltarune to affect change with your Determination, with You being represented by the red SOUL. There is no suggestion of a third party involved to muddle the waters and confuse the chain of custody here, You were meant to control a (presumably) soulless vessel but instead end up controlling Kris via their SOUL.
The SOUL is how You are represented in the game, but it and you are more than that, and even the characters who are aware of You know it. When Kris stuffs you into a couch or a box, you're only physically limited as much as it serves the purpose of the game - at any time you could exploit game mechanics to simply appear somewhere else. When Kris physically grabs the SOUL, they don't stare at it - they turn over their shoulder and look directly at You, where they know you're watching them from. Kris's SOUL might be a physical thing but as an extension of You it's become more than that - even if it shatters and Kris dies, You just take it to the Game Over screen and come back.

>>719009512
They're just darkners, anon. Some pop ups and computer viruses. Nobody important..
Undertale was a story where nobody had to die.
Deltarune isn't.

>>719009512
Why do people still think Toby cares about you killing NPCs in a video game? Have we not had enough discussion about Undertale?

>>719009660
>When Kris physically grabs the SOUL, they don't stare at it - they turn over their shoulder and look directly at You, where they know you're watching them from.
Screenshot?

>>719001682
>Player being part of Undertale only got popular because of Deltarune.
Popular maybe, but I definitely remember plenty of "the player is part of the game" speculation when Undertale was released. It got drowned out because limiting everything to in-universe characters made things easier for fan content purposes, which in turn is where the "Chara did all the evil stuff, Frisk did all the good stuff" got popular.
Undertale is one of those games where the fan consensus gestalt is divorced enough from authorial intent that trying to discuss the two is a clusterfuck, and that's bled over into Deltarune as well.

>>719009706
>They're just darkners, anon. Some pop ups and computer viruses. Nobody important.
But there's several scenes in both Chapter 3 and 4 with characters establishing that darkners aren't just toys, they're real beings. Doing a 180 and just saying "no actually they're completely meaningless so killing some to achieve something is completely fine" would make no sense.

>>719009660
Assuming Deltarune characters perceive their world in a 3D space, how would Kris even find out that the SOUL is looking in from a 30º upward angle directly south, rather than through his eyes (FPV) like how possession tends to work?

>>719009971
If you haven't seen the polarity of the "darkners are real people" debate being set by the game I'm not sure I trust you to talk about it.
Susie is being set up to be crushed by some fundamental reality. Ultimately, the world will be saved by separating the light from the dark in some capacity, and Darkners simply won't matter anymore, as we'll be spending all of our time in the light world.

>>718979236
>posts a literal troon at the same time
Kill yourself.

>>719009971
>But there's several scenes in both Chapter 3 and 4 with characters establishing that darkners aren't just toys, they're real beings.
Is there? There's Susie asserting as much, nothing more. Susie is wrong about a great many things.

>>719009960
The post I was replying was saying Toby was a bad writer if he didn't intend the player to be canon because most people saw as it. I said it was the contrary, in this specific case popularity IS important.

If I hear the words "valid interpretation" in a Deltarune Youtube video again I'm going to have an aneurysm. Just state your case and move on. Youtubers are so retarded.

>>719010283
You don't get it. Susie declaring something in an emotional moment HAS to be a primary source that is objectively correct.

>>718987326
>>718988162
goodjob doctor

>>719010248
I think we're going off track here, what I am saying is that I disagree that there is some kind of hidden good ending that can somehow be achieved by murdering a few darkners here and there. How is that gonna lead us to a good end? You yourself say that there will be a separation of light worlds and dark worlds, which is, atleast from what we've seen, the path that we're currently on in the pacifist route, my problem here is that I fail to see how killing a few darkners is gonna bring us to a better ending than that.

>>719010548
Is this sarcasm, because prefacing sarcasm with "you don't get it" makes it kind of hard to parse.

>>719005734
>demiurge controls you, who's controlling (you), who's controlling an ego, who's controlling an archetype

reverse it and you get the evolution of undertale to the ending of deltarune, which will end with annoying dog killing you in real life

>>719010548
This but unironically.

>>719007227
...So he's a secondary, got it.

>>719010694
Because you're being reductive. We're not just "killing a few darkners". We are achieving a specific goal of getting the Twisted Sword.
>but why would killing some NPCs be good and other NPCs be bad?
Neither is good nor bad. They're NPCs.

>>719010694
The only darkners you have to kill are a bunch of computer viruses, ads and antivirus software. Queen won't miss them.

>>719010820
This is sarcasm. I'm still mad that everyone now thinks monsters just bleed by default in Deltarune because Susie said "everybody bleeds, right?" once, when things were incredibly awkward and she was just starting to try to be nice.

>>719010883
Ok, cool, so, we kill some darkners, get the sword macguffin, and then... and then what? What do we do with this sword? How does this sword help us get a better ending. Actually, no, forget about the sword and the discussion about darkners entirely, I have a much more important question, what would you consider a "good ending" in the first place? What does it look like to you? In what state are the world and characters left in this "good ending"?

>>718979194 (OP)
i prayed to light up the room, just like i prayed for noelle to kill spamton

>>719009806
If Kris catches the SOUL in the sequence at Noelle's house, they'll grab it and then turn to the camera before it cuts to black.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eA-RBpfcGgQ&t=1980s
see also:
>Kris doing their best Chara impression at the end of Chapter 1
>Kris and Ralsei awkwardly turning to the camera for a beat when you don't go along with his "let's close our eyes" bit in Chapter 3
>Ralsei turning toward the camera and panicking when he realizes you're controlling Susie's character in the Zelda game
>Kris looking over their shoulder when they're "used up" in the second Zelda game and when you kill Susie and Ralsei in the third Zelda game

>>719010129
It's possible that Kris can see what we see, sometimes. The most direct example of our perspective being limited is playing the kart game with Susie in the Green Room lobby, where we clearly can't see the TV screen.
At the very least Kris knows that we are not ALWAYS watching and listening, which implies that they can tell when we're present, somehow.

>>718997865
Why is the twitter user saying that like it's a bad thing?

>>719011031
But Susie herself bleeds.

>>719011031
People think monsters bled because Susie bled.

>>719011125
females tend to do that a lot actually

>>719011117
Anon. What you said doesn't happen. Kris doesn't look at the camera at all in that timestamp. Plus, this contradicts Kris playing the piano because he thinks you aren't looking.

>>719010548
>You don't get it, Ralsei declaring something to validate his desire to dehumanize himself and detach his friends from the inevitable tragedy he knows is looming over them HAS to be a primary source that is objectively correct.

>>719010548
Susie's story so far feels so strongly like a pure wish-fulfillment fantasy, that I wouldn't be surprised if something on that level would happen to her, as her Darkest Hour.

"This bully was just misunderstood" is nothing new, if a bit trite, but them being The Kindest and Nicest and Most Loving, and Most Hopeful; basically a messianic figure, feels like a bit much?

>>719011074
We don't know for sure. All we know is that acquiring the Twisted Sword requires you fulfill all the requirements for Snowgrave, that we haven't seen its other ingredient yet, and that its effect is listed as "trance down".
The fact that it requires you know how to activate another route and then pass up on it is an enormous "this is important" flag.
>what would you consider a "good ending" in the first place?
You're the one who brought up "good ending". I would consider the "golden route" to be whatever most fully explains what the fuck is going on with the game, regardless of how it leaves the characters. The final state they're left in is immaterial because I can always change that.

>>719011031
Monsters bleed in Deltarune

>>719011356
Well we have no names nor IDs so sorry if I confused you for someone else, but the post here >>719008741 explicitly says "The Twisted Sword is what will buy your happy ending", if that's not you then I just got confused. In any case I think this is gonna have to be an agree to disagree situation, there is no point in discussing this further.

>>719011356
What are you going to do when we can just get another ThornRing from the flower shop full of roses in Chapter 5 without murdering anyone?

>>719011280
>Kris doesn't look at the camera at all in that timestamp
Okay.
>this contradicts Kris playing the piano because he thinks you aren't looking.
Kris is able to play the piano because Susie encourages them to play and we relax our control over Kris in that moment to allow it
Why would Kris think we aren't still there, watching?

>>719011536
Ah, I didn't read that particular post correctly, I was really confused why you kept going back to "happy ending" and not something more general like "true route".
Still, I think it's naive to assume the happiest route will directly be the one where you do the least harm.

>>719011287
I will say one thing, I do think it would be pretty ballsy for Toby to start with Ralsei being a self deprecating character who doesn't think he has any intrinsic worth, to then actually learning he does matter, his opinions and actions do hold weight, only for this to once again be turned on its head again in the end and go back to reminding him that he is in fact a worthless imaginary creature.

>>719011714
I'm talking about when he plays the piano at the holiday household. Y'know, when you return to that room after being caught. He even drops the zombie walk.

>>719011031
If you go back to Undertale, literally the only times monsters reference blood is specifically regarding humans. It's actually incredibly consistent, they never reference blood casually at all unless they are clearly referring to a human or humans in general, and only the narrator (who may or may not be Chara) mentions blood when commenting on monsters.
Meanwhile in Deltarune there's blood references all over the place, the pizza guy talking about his blood boiling, Blood Crushers, Noelle thinking the Hearts Donut is blood, Gamer Blood Energy Drink, Lancer and Swatch both referencing blood, etc and so on. It's not just Susie. So it's reasonable to assume that Deltarune takes place in a world where blood is a thing that's actually common, unlike Undertale where only humans bleed and monsters are made of magic dust. So in other words, monsters bleed.

>>719011117
>clip
Kris could just be looking at the SOUL directly. In the Chapter 1 ending, the SOUL is at an angle where Kris plausibly might not be looking behind himself but just at the SOUL.
As for the SWORD game, I interpreted it as Kris flinching and not wanting to look at the screen during those moments. Ralsei turning toward the camera is the strongest argument for being aware of the player's perspective.
I think Kris would find out pretty fast that the SOUL can't see fine detail and relies on Kris's mental description of objects. The fact that Kris is aware of this and other limitations of the SOUL at the start of the game implies that it's been existing and active before we start playing. It's the strongest argument I can think of that the SOUL is its own character, which is perhaps why the retards have never brought it up. I do find it funny how an easy and basic way to thwart us is just to hang any important information on a southern wall. I wonder if that will ever be brought up.

Who the fuck is Gaster talking to then? You retards act so smug and never answer that shit. YOU are the soul, you coping niggers can’t handle that you manipulated Noelle and need to throw blame at other shit. Get real, retards.

>>719012567
Chara(who is also the soul), obviously :)

>>719012117
I really think this could come down to cultural cross-contamination more so than an actual biological difference. Deltarune takes place in a world where humans and monsters have cohabitated for (presumably) generations. Since blood isn't an externally visible feature, expressions regarding it wouldn't be as awkward for a monster to use as, say, an expression about hands or feet when not all monsters have those. (Have we heard a floating monster say anything like "take a walk" or "on foot"?)
Also, monsters clearly do at least at some threshold turn into dust still in Deltarune.

>>719012739
What do you think is more likely, that Susie is a super duper special monster who can bleed and all the references the monsters make as a result of, as you say, cultural cross-contamination asa result of living among humans, or that bleeding is not actually uncommon for monsters in Deltarune?

>>719012567
The SOUL. Why do people think this is a gotcha?

>>719012974
Ok so why the fuck does Gaster comment on you not getting a single achievement on the Playstation versions? Is the Soul also playing on Playstation?

>>718979194 (OP)
Look guys it's easy.
Kris is a vessel for the Soul.
(You) use your controller to control the Soul.
Your body is a vessel for a soul.
Your soul uses the Mind as a vehicle to manage the body.
The soul is a piece of the Eternal.
The Eternal is.
Pretty simple if you thing about it.

>>719013143
It's just an Easter Egg Toby added in because he was quite literally forced to. It isn't an actual plot point.

>>719012864
If bleeding isn't uncommon, what's the threshold between getting dusted and just being badly injured? Why is there a bloodstain sitting in the Dreemurr house if they're fairly simple to clean and blood is common? How would the biological systems related to bleeding work for monsters that don't seem to have biology, like the fire elementals? Where does the line sit between heavy bleeding and turning to dust? Does your blood turn into dust at some point?
I believe it's more likely that something is up with Susie.

>>719012739
In Undertale, monsters are very explicitly made of a handful of matter held together by magic, which is why they disintegrate instantly. Deltarune's light world very obviously has no magic whatsoever (don't ask me how fire elementals and other physically impossible monsters exist) yet only monsters have the ability to cast magic in the dark world. Organic-type monsters, aside from their dark world abilities, are physically similar to humans and can get sick or injured in the same way; this implies that they have blood and aren't like Undertale monsters. Susie is also far stronger than Kris which flies in the face of Undertale canon. Of course, she could be a monster/human hybrid like some have speculated, but there is nothing hinting at that instead of "monsters here work differently."
We don't know much past that. Kris and Susie's recognition of the significance of dust in a snowglobe implies that monsters all still turn into dust rather than have to be cremated, but this might not be at the point of death like in Undertale. Anything to do with monster souls is also speculative.

Asriel fucks human men

>>719013458
Why does "magic" have to mean the same thing between Undertale and Deltarune, while we're on the topic?
Like yeah sure, green sparkles that heal you are magic and you don't have those in the light world, but whatever "passive magic"(?) holds together physically impossible monsters is still clearly present. The fact that the characters don't call it magic might come down us having not had an onscreen biology class.
If one physical impossibility is already going on constantly in favor of monsters, the only reason they don't have "magic" is because they don't consider it magic that a bedsheet with eyes can talk and think.
>Of course, she could be a monster/human hybrid like some have speculated, but there is nothing hinting at that instead of "monsters here work differently."
Susie was the one who actually knew how to deal with blood to an extent that it looked like part of her normal life. Why would Toriel leave a large stain like that alone? Especially if she could see the implication to it that someone was hurt?

>>719013215
Is this gnosticism? I'd like to know what you're getting at.
>>719014105
>Like yeah sure, green sparkles that heal you are magic and you don't have those in the light world, but whatever "passive magic"(?) holds together physically impossible monsters is still clearly present. The fact that the characters don't call it magic might come down us having not had an onscreen biology class.
The Watsonian explanation is like you said, there are different kinds of magic. Ghosts exist and nobody bats an eye, but Toriel can't cast fireballs in the light world. Maybe monsters are more "attuned" to dark worlds such that they can cast magic in dark worlds while humans can't.
The Doylist explanation is that Toby came up with a new setting where he wanted to transplant characters from Undertale, and he didn't want to get rid of or change any of them despite it being a more "grounded" world. Worldbuilding was always his weakest area anyway.
>Susie was the one who actually knew how to deal with blood to an extent that it looked like part of her normal life. Why would Toriel leave a large stain like that alone? Especially if she could see the implication to it that someone was hurt?
The first implication is that Susie grew up rough and encountered violent situations and/or ones where she had to clean up blood. The second is that Toriel is grossly negligent, such that she doesn't question an empty bird cage or why Kris carries a knife everywhere (not to mention all the other signs of trauma, even though she works with children).
Even if we accept the "monsters aside from Susie don't bleed" theory, Toriel would know what blood is both from the "how to care for humans" book and from any child getting hurt at some point (especially with Kris's rough-and-tumble lifestyle growing up). It's as stupid as the "Toriel doesn't know what sex Kris despite raising him for over ten years" theory.

Goddamn this thread has been complete dogshit, the worst part is that that nigger OP will probably make another one too.

>>719015097
Not him but there is actually a very simple explanation for Toriel's actions, the explanation is that Toriel is actually drunken whore who is wholly incapable of properly raising a child and Kris should be taken in by Child Protective Services as soon as possible.

>>719016430
I didn't even notice it got autosaged

>>719016608
Oh shit yeah it did, I thought it was just getting bumped down by other threads.

>>719016608
I thought it was, too. In the end, the janny is the biggest tranny around.
>>719016430
If you dislike player discussion so much, stop replying to it.

Maybe Tobert just thought it would be kinda retarded to have a prompt say PRESS X TO SEE YOU IN THE DARK or PRESS X TO SEAL FOUNTAIN